Focus, focus!
Jowan, you are stalking my question ;-)
Are you successfully doing lead-free soldering on ImAg boards? SMT double sided with TH, or not what complexity? What is your successful recipe?
Thanks,
Ioan Tempea, ing.
Ingénieur Principal de Fabrication / Senior Manufacturing Engineer
T | 450.967.7100 ext.244
E | [log in to unmask]
W | www.digico.cc
N’imprimer que si nécessaire – Print only if you must
-----Message d'origine-----
De : Iven, Jowan [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Envoyé : February-18-10 8:09 AM
À : [log in to unmask]
Objet : Re: [TN] Lead-free soldering on ImAg
Mike,
Finding the paste or boards is no problem.
Just wondering if anyone had very good reasons for using nitrogen in reflow. Reasons that can justify the costs. Not just a gut feeling.
Jowan
-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Fenner [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 1:22 PM
To: Iven, Jowan; [log in to unmask]
Subject: RE: Lead-free soldering on ImAg
I would say not.
1) YOu should be able to find a paste that works double sided. It's a
standard new paste evaluation test by customers in this part of the world
and one that we do in developing pastes.
2) the board solderability comes into this also of course. Yu could consider
spending a few hundred dollars in time finding a supplier who can supply
solderable boards!
Regards
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: Iven, Jowan [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 10:01 AM
To: [log in to unmask]; [log in to unmask]
Subject: RE: Lead-free soldering on ImAg
Mike,
Reflow investment (the nitrogen option) and operational costs for Nitrogen
(10 years) can add up to 135000 $.
Is this worth the investment in a nitrogen reflow oven?
Jowan
-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Mike Fenner
Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 10:11 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Lead-free soldering on ImAg
Inerting does reduce oxidation and make life easier for the flux, but apart
from the hourly material cost you also alter the effective surface tension
of the solder leading to higher tombstoning tendency (esp. in Pb-)
Most people second side solder in nitrogen, but very low grade - typically
<80% nitrogen, (balance oxygen, 1% other) :) and that is a reasonable
expectation.
Regards
Mike Fenner,
Indium Corporation
Europe
-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bob Landman
Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 9:31 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Lead-free soldering on ImAg
Kevin,
I would think that, while it costs more, the use of nitrogen when doing ImAg
would help alleviate the problems you mention? I understand it costs more
but I wonder, isn't it worth the difference in the end results? I recall a
recent article in SMT on the use of nitrogen and one of the factors that
significantly improved was the reduction in oxidation so the flux didn't
have to be so aggressive? How significant a difference in cost is the use
of nitrogen?
Bob Landman
H&L Instruments, LLC
-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Glidden, Kevin
Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 1:20 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Lead-free soldering on ImAg
Dave, Did your investigations utilize double sided reflow as well as single
sided, plus secondary soldering? Do you see degradation to solderability
after multiple soldering processes?
We utilize ImAg finish in a traditional SnPb process, and we DO sometimes
see solderability issues. Even normal SnPb reflow temperatures can
accelerate the oxidation on the second side pads before they are printed and
placed. The two reflow passes required for double sided SMT can make any
post-SMT soldering (such as for hand soldering components or wire
attachment) even more difficult.
Your materials used (flux types & activity levels) can drastically effect
whether or not surface oxidation can be overcome to allow proper wetting.
Just as important (if not more) is controlling the exposure of the PCB to
sulfur compounds or moisture, both of which can begin and accelerate the
oxidation. Putting controls in place to ensure proper packaging and
moisture resistance can go a long way in preventing the PCBs hitting the
line right-off-the-bat with minor oxidation already started. This too is
included in the 4553....
You also mentioned silver thickness, and I have found more favorable results
utilizing the "thick" designation, not the "thin", both of which are allowed
in 4553....
-----Original Message-----
From: David D. Hillman [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 11:20 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Lead-free soldering on ImAg
Hi Ioan! I have conducted a number of leadfree soldering investigations with
SAC405 and SAC305 solder paste using Immersion silver pwbs in accordance
with the IPC-4553 specification and have had no issues. The higher leadfree
processing temperatures tend to degrade all printed wiring board surface
finishes a bit faster than in tin/lead processing. I recommend you
investigate to see if the Immersion silver meets the IPC
4553 requirements.
Dave Hillman
Rockwell Collins
[log in to unmask]
Ioan Tempea <[log in to unmask]>
Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
02/15/2010 10:06 AM
Please respond to
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to Ioan Tempea
<[log in to unmask]>
To
[log in to unmask]
cc
Subject
[TN] Lead-free soldering on ImAg
Dear Technos,
I know the ImAg has been discussed over and over and with the same
results, very good and reliable finish.
My little something now is all the proponents were mainly in high-rel
applications (so SnPb solder most likely) and I do not remember if RoHS on
Ag was discussed. I know it wouldn't make sense for this finish not to
work with SAC305 pastes, but I just want to make sure.
We have, guess what, wetting issues on two different boards, from the
same supplier. We have tried playing with the reflow recipe, no
improvement. The batch finished, but now we are attacking a few more
different models
from the same PCB fab.
So, did anybody have issues with ImAg because they were on lead-free? Any
particular parameters that are not a happy ingredient, like specific types
of paste, specific solder recipe milestones?
If it were the PCBs, what could be wrong except for the Ag thickness? I
mean XRF analysis would be cheaper than x-sectioning...
Thanks,
Ioan Tempea, ing.
Ingénieur Principal de Fabrication / Senior Manufacturing Engineer
T | 450.967.7100 ext.244
E | [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
W | www.digico.cc <http://www.digico.cc/>
N'imprimer que si nécessaire - Print only if you must
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