Bev,
Thanks for the input. A2LA is well known to NIST because the
National Voluntary Laboratory Accreditation Program (NVLAP, housed at
NIST) and A2LA share the US representation to ILAC, International
Laboratory Accreditation Cooperation.
We have interactions with lead analysis labs for forensics
applications. Perhaps someone here knows of the NLLAP.
John
At 11:06 AM 5/25/2006, Bev Christian wrote:
>John,
>In a Newsletter I just got from Thermo, they mention a few organizations
>that might be good to contact about this:
>National Lead Laboratory Accreditation Program (NLLAP) (Yes, I know
>lead, but I bet quite few of these might be doing general RoHS testing)
>American Industrial Hygiene Association (VERY general, but well known)
>American Association for Laboratory Accreditation (A2LA).
>Bev
>RIM
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Leadfree [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John R. Sieber
>Sent: May 24, 2006 1:45 PM
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: [LF] PBB/PBDE GCMS calibration standards - Question
>
>Do you have any suggestions as to how we might spread the word? We
>seek all appropriate fora to publicize our efforts. That's why I
>sift through the stuff on this website and offer information when
>appropriate.
>
>Our PBB/PBDE work will be published in the scientific
>literature. Last summer, we held a workshop on BFR analysis
>http://www.cstl.nist.gov/nist839/BFR_meeting.htm. We collaborate
>with academia on method development. We made a big splash when we
>issued a press release on the BFR contents of house dust
>http://www.nist.gov/public_affairs/releases/PBDE_dust.htm and
>http://www.nist.gov/public_affairs/techbeat/tb2005_0105.htm. Our SRM
>newsletter
>http://ts.nist.gov/ts/htdocs/230/232/QUARTERLY/June%202005%20Spotlight.p
>df
>tells of new SRMs and the SRM website
>http://ts.nist.gov/ts/htdocs/230/232/QUARTERLY/June%202005%20Spotlight.p
>df
>has free copies of certificates of analysis.
>
>Test labs should make it their business to stay current with work at
>national metrology institutes because their quality systems require
>the labs to establish traceability to national standards. The
>commercial suppliers of reference materials keep track of what NIST
>has to offer. They too must establish traceability. I assume they
>are willing to share this knowledge with customers to improve their
>sales. Customers of both types of businesses must insist on this
>information.
>
>So you see, it's everyone's responsibility to seek and share this
>information. Please feel free to forward my emails and tell the labs
>that you patronize about our work.
>
>John Sieber
>
>
>At 01:05 PM 5/24/2006, you wrote:
> >John,
> >This does help quite a bit, although who really needs to read this
> >e-mail are the testing labs - who are not members of this forum. It
> >sure would be nice if NIST had some way of disseminating this info to
> >the test labs.
> >Bev
> >RIM
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: Leadfree [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John R. Sieber
> >Sent: May 24, 2006 10:13 AM
> >To: [log in to unmask]
> >Subject: Re: [LF] PBB/PBDE GCMS calibration standards - Question
> >
> >Dr. Chin,
> >
> >I asked our PBB/PBDE expert Dr. Michele Schantz about your
> >question. Dr. Schantz is the technical contact for SRM 2585, Organic
> >Contaminants in House Dust, which is certified for 15 PBDE congeners
> >with reference and information values for 9 additional congeners. I
> >believe her team is developing a solution SRM designed to contain
> >suites of PBB and PBDE congeners. I don't know the schedule, but
> >they are moving fast to be able to collaborate with IRMM on BFRs in
> >plastics.
> >
> >Regarding your question, Dr. Schantz said "It depends on the
> >ionization source being used in the MS (mass spectrometer) too. For
> >electron impact (EI) MS, one will see larger differences in the
> >response factors from the different congeners than one would see if
> >using negative chemical ionization (NCI) MS. One can use the 20
> >congeners to quantify more or total, but there will obviously be
> >smaller errors as one increases the number of congeners used (to
> >calibrate)."
> >
> >At this time, we know of one source of commercial reference
> >materials. Accustandard has 160+ PBDE congeners and 22 PBB congeners
> >available. We invite our LF participants to inform us if they know
> >of additional sources of reference materials.
> >
> >My (nonexpert) take on this is that you need to calibrate response
> >factors by either direct calibration or by estimation through
> >interpolation or extrapolation. On the uncertainty
> >considerations, you can do a reasonable job with fewer congeners,
> >but if you really want to get the lowest overall uncertainty, you
> >need more congeners in your reference material(s). Either way, the
> >lab must estimate of the uncertainty of their results in a realistic
> >manner.
> >
> >Hope this helps!
> >
> >John Sieber
> >
> >
> >At 11:58 PM 5/23/2006, Clavius Chin wrote:
> > > Recently I approached and surveyed an ISO 17025 certified
> > >commerical lab, and they told me that in their GCMS analysis of
>TOTAL
> > >concentration of PBB & PBDE, they use only 10 PBB & 10 PBDE
>Calibration
> > >Standards, instead of the full 209 PBB & 208 PBDE (Deca-BDE is
> >exempted)
> > >standards for their calibration. I'm quite shocked by their reply. I
> >think
> > >this is wrong because what this commerical lab can actually report is
> >only
> > >the concentration of these 10 PBB & 10 PBDE congeners, but not the
> >TOTAL
> > >concentration as required by the EU, right? Shouldn't this commerical
> >lab
> > >uses more calibration standards?
> > >
> > > Does anyone knows exactly how many PBB/PBDE congeners are
> > >available commerically and point me to the right source? Currently my
> >RoHS
> > >lab has already acquired some (certainly more than 10) PBB & PBDE
> > >calibration standards for my GCMS, and is still sourcing for more.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Best Regards,
> > >Clavius Chin, Ph.D.
> > >Failure Analysis & Lab Manager
> > >
> >
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> >
> >John R. Sieber, PhD
> >Research Chemist
> >
> >National Institute of Standards and Technology
> >Chemical Science and Technology Laboratory
> >Analytical Chemistry Division
> >100 Bureau Drive, Stop 8391
> >Gaithersburg, MD 20899-8391 USA
> >
> >[log in to unmask]
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> >
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> >
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