Chris,
People in my country are suffering of Islam suicide terror almost on daily
base.
Technet is not a place for political discussions, but I really have to
emphasise, that the basic background of suicide bombers is their Islam
origin. For Muslems those murders are "Saint" ( Shahid ) fighting the "Holy
War" ( Jihad) against Jews ( not against Israelis ). They definitly are not
fighting "warrior to warrior" but they are killing children, women , etc.
How many US warriors were killed in WTC in NY , 11/09/2000 by those gentle
Islam warriors ?
Edward
Edward Szpruch
Eltek Ltd
P.O.Box 159 ; 49101 Petah Tikva Israel
Tel ++972 3 9395050 , Fax ++972 3 9309581
e-mail [log in to unmask]
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Chris Almeras [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: ד נובמבר 13 2002 15:35
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] NTC...Iraq.... Really OT
>
> I hate to jump in on a political or religious topic, but I wanted to point
> out that Islam teaches to carry out the war against other religions
> warrior to warrior, not by killing women and children. Those books you
> mentioned may provide very good insight into the underlying issues, but
> authors can place their own spin on a topic just as much as the media can.
>
> Just my 2 cents
>
> Chris Almeras
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: JaMi Smith [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 4:59 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] NTC...Iraq.... Really OT
>
>
> Brian and Steve,
>
> With all due respect, this is hardly the place for this type of
> discussion,
> since it is way way off topic, but since you have brought up the subject,
> one foundational error in both of your understandings needs to be pointed
> out and corrected.
>
> The one thing that the secular world as a whole, and the secular press in
> particular, simply refuses to comprehend and understand, is that the
> fundamental problem in the Middle East in general, and Iraq in particular,
> and indeed, in the world today, is a question of religion, and in
> particular, the religion of Islam.
>
> You, and anyone else that tries, will never even begin to understand the
> problems until you examine the true teachings of Islam, as found in the
> Quran and the Hadith.
>
> For example, contrary to what you will find at the web sites that you
> referenced, the real problem between Iran and Iraq can be traced to the
> differences between the Islamic Sunni and Shite factions and also between
> the Fundamentalest who want to take the whole world back into the 7th
> century under Islamic Law (Sharia), and those who want to live in the
> twentieth century (or make that the twenty first). Add to this, the fact
> that Saddam has proclaimed himself to be the modern day Nebuchadnezzar who
> is the saviour of the entire Middle Eastern Peoples, and you can begin to
> understand the complexities of the problem.
>
> A couple of very simple and well proven facts of history are all that is
> really needed to put Saddam into a proper perspective, the first being the
> invasion and distruction of the Country of Kuwait, and the second being
> the
> massive whosale slaughter and genocide of the Kurds. Add to this his
> proven
> connections to Al-Quadia training camps inside Iraq, and the ties between
> the Iraqui Secret Service and the Oklahoma City Bombing, and what more do
> you need.
>
> George W. Bush was totally out to lunch when he declared Islam to be a
> religion of Peace, and with Christian leaders around the world speaking
> out
> and setting the record straight, such as Franklin Grahm, the son of
> evangelest Billy Grahm, and a host of others, people are beginning to see
> the true face of Islam.
>
> Open your eyes, and look at the wholesale slaughter, yes genocide, of
> Christians by Muslims today, yes today, in the Sudan, Indonesia, and the
> Phillipenes. It is rarely reported by the secular US press, but go do a
> search of a site like BBC World News and see what is really going on in
> the
> world around you.
>
> Islam, and all of its various factions, teach that anyone who is not a
> Muslim, is a second class person (actually much worse than that), that has
> absolutely no rights or standing whatsoever, and that Jihad and Terrorism
> are the sole legitimate avenue to converting the entire world, yes, the
> entire world, to Islam. That is after they kill all of the Jews and
> Christians (which teaching, oddly enough, comes directly from the Quran).
>
> Radical? Yes!
>
> True? Also yes!
>
> Anyone who really wants to understand the problem should look a t a few
> books that will give you some real insight into the problem, without the
> "spin" that you get from the secular press on the 11:00 News or Time
> Magazine or Frontline or things like the "Islam, Empire of Faith" series
> on
> PBS.
>
> Some of these books are fairly controversial, but then the truth usually
> is.
>
> 1. Jihad and Terrorism, by Dr. Mark Gabriel (assumed name), who has a
> Doctorate in Islamic History and was a Professor of Islamic History at
> Al-Azar in Cario for over 15 years, which is the premiere university in
> the
> Muslim World. This is an expose on the Islamic Doctrine of Jihad as taught
> in the Quran and the Hadith by a former Muslim.
>
> 2. Islamic Invasion, by Dr. Robert Morey, who has a Doctorate in Islamic
> Studies. This book is hard hitting and fact based. A good place to begin
> to
> get a realistic grasp of the problem. Irrespective of what you may end up
> thinking of the book, you will really begin to have a grasp of the problem
> when you finish reading it.
>
> 3. Winning the War Against Radical Islam, also by Dr. Morey. This book was
> circulated inside the Pentegon a few months back and is responsible for
> the
> Pentegon statements underlying Saudi Arabias recent complaints about a
> month
> and a half ago regarding the Pentegon wanting to attack religious shrines
> in
> their country.
>
> 4. American Jihad, by Steve Emerson (I hope I got that correct).
>
> Any of these will get you started on really understanding what is really
> going on in Iraq and the rest of the Middle East, and the "War on
> Terrorism".
>
> Brian, it will take a lot more than praying for peace, and if you read any
> one of the first three books above, you will understand why.
>
> My apologies to anyone in the forum who may have been offended by my post,
> but sometimes you just have to speak up and set the record straight.
>
> JaMi
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Brian Ellis" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 12:25 AM
> Subject: Re: [TN] NTC...Iraq.
>
>
> > Steve
> >
> > I'm not getting into a political argument, but following your links to
> > the CNN site to see what they really have. I see "Iraq is believed...",
> > "It is cosidered that Iraq may...", "The site was destroyed by UNSCOM in
> > 1996..." and other such vague phrases.
> >
> > As far as I'm aware, there is no proof that any WMDs exist has been
> > presented to the public, only speculation. The Blair document was sheer
> > waffle without an ounce of proof. If this were presented in a court of
> > law as evidence, the judge would split his sides laughing.
> >
> > I sincerely hope that Saddam lets in the inspectors and they find egg on
> > the face of the pro-war factions, rather than serious weapons, other
> > than their prehistoric Scuds which are more likely to explode on their
> > launch pads than on a target.
> >
> > As for the Iraqi parliamentary decision, I believe that nothing can be
> > taken at its face value. It is probably simple political manoeuvering a)
> > to cover their backsides and b) to jockey for position. I think I'm not
> > alone in this: the stock markets didn't react, for example, and they
> > have plenty of political analysts.
> >
> > The best thing you or I can do is to pray for peace.
> >
> > Brian
> >
> > Steve Gregory wrote:
> > > Hi all ya'll...
> > >
> > > Looks like things are starting to come to a head with Iraq. Not trying
> > > to be political at all, but I've searched and tried to understand what
> > > all this is about. Found a link that traces back to why this is
> happening...
> > >
> > > Granted, this is something from the 'Net, and it could be anything the
> > > authors want it to be, but there are reputable sources for this
> > > information...
> > >
> > > This link initially details out carrier battle groups that are
> deployed
> > > at this time, some serious stuff!!!
> > >
> > >
> http://www.efreedomnews.com/News%20Archive/Iraq/SpecialReportWaronIraq/W26
> US
> SConstellation.htm
> > >
> > > But when you get to the page, there will be a link titled at the top
> of
> > > the page;
> > >
> > > SPECIAL REPORT War on Iraq: Background
> > >
> > > The actual link is:
> > >
> > >
> http://www.efreedomnews.com/News%20Archive/Iraq/SpecialReportWaronIraq/SR1
> .h
> tm
> > >
> > > Which will take you to a series of articles about why we're where we
> are
> > > at...
> > >
> > > This is some serious stuff in my opinion, and I hope and pray that
> we'll
> > > all get through it...
> > >
> > > We need to think and live as one...maybe someday....soon.
> > >
> > > -Steve Gregory-
> > >
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