TECHNET Archives

October 2011

TechNet@IPC.ORG

Options: Use Monospaced Font
Show Text Part by Default
Condense Mail Headers

Message: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Topic: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Author: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]

Print Reply
Sender:
X-To:
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>
Date:
Thu, 13 Oct 2011 08:42:16 -0400
Reply-To:
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>, Steven Creswick <[log in to unmask]>
Message-ID:
Subject:
From:
Steven Creswick <[log in to unmask]>
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
In-Reply-To:
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
MIME-Version:
1.0
Parts/Attachments:
text/plain (285 lines)
Richard,

I do not wish to appear that I disagree with you and Dave.  Yes, cavity
packages can be safely cleaned with the right equipment and the right
process.

I also happen to feel that Crest makes about the best equipment out there,
but not everyone has sweep frequency equipment in their shop.

It appears that some individuals have 'tunnel vision' with respect to
reading articles on ultrasonic cleaning and simply see, "IT IS SAFE TO
ULTRASONICALLY CLEAN CAVITY PACKAGES", and then go place their parts in an
old, fixed-frequency ultrasonic cleaner, only to then find their parts don't
work afterwards...  dah!

In a general conversation, I always treat cavity packages in the context of,
"You need to do your homework first!"

PEMs are black and white on this issue.

      Final ten cents  :-)

Steve C

-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Stadem, Richard D.
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 10:06 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Wire soldering question - Utrasonics discussion

I totally agree with Dave. Ultrasonics CAN be used safely, both for
soldering and for cleaning, provided you use equipment from electronic-savvy
vendors who understand the cavitation mechanics and can set the frequency in
such a way as to be somewhat non-resonant.

Crest Ultrasonics
http://www.crest-ultrasonics.com/aqueous-industrial-cleaning-systems.html is
one such vendor. They manufacture US cleaning systems just for electronics,
and there is little or no danger of damage to wirebond components. If you
have questions regarding this, ask Dr. Sami Awad at Crest. Nobody knows more
about the subject than Dr. Awad. I do not have any monetary interest in
Crest, just some very, very good experience with their products.

Again, echoing Dave's words, you need to qualify the process. 

There are also ultrasonic solder pots and ultrasonic solder stations. I have
a client who actually "solders" copper wire to glass using an ultrasonic
soldering process that I set up for them. No intermetallic formation occurs
with the glass, but a really good mechanical/electrical bond does occur,
using solder as the bonding medium.

-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of David D. Hillman
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 7:14 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Wire soldering question - Utrasonics discussion

Hi Amol - you can call it a myth or just old tribal knowledge but for many 
years there was (and still is in some segments) the idea that ultrasonics 
- either soldering or cleaning - will damage the die or the wirebonds in 
components. There are a number of good industry publish investigations 
that show ultrasonics can be applied for in both the cleaning and 
soldering applications safely without causing component damage provided 
you do sufficient process qualification. I am not a fan of ultrasonic 
soldering as I can ultrasonically solder a toothpick - the solder sticks 
mechanically and not because I made a metallurgical interface. But, 
ultrasonic soldering is a viable process provided attention is paid to 
making metallurgically sound solder joints. Ultrasonics have wide 
application in cleaning processes. Other TechNetters can provide better 
information on that aspect than I.

Dave Hillman
Rockwell Collins
[log in to unmask]




Amol Kane <[log in to unmask]> 
Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
10/12/2011 06:29 AM
Please respond to
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to
Amol Kane <[log in to unmask]>


To
<[log in to unmask]>
cc

Subject
Re: [TN] Wire soldering question






Inge, this method would only be suitable for tinning wires... yes?

Or is this fair game for leads of active components since only the leads 
are inserted in the solder pot (unlike an ultrasonic stencil cleaner for 
cleaning misprinted boards with one side populated where the entire 
assembly is exposed to ultrasonic energy?)

Thanks!


Amol Kane | Process Engineer
Catalyst Manufacturing Services, Inc.
941 Route 38, Owego NY 13827
Phone: (607) 687-7669 Extn 349 | Website: www.catalystems.com

-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Inge
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 6:27 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Wire soldering question

Keith,

soldering to Nickel is not difficult. Soldering to Nickel oxide is 
difficult. There is the solution to your problem: removal of oxide.

I had exactly same problem as you many  years back. I solved the problem 
by 
dipping the dismantled end of the wires in a ultrasonic solder pot. You 
need 
just a small one. I demonstrated the efficiency of that method by picking 
som old and dirty nickel coins from my pocket and dip them directly 
without 
any cleaning. People marvelled by the good solder wetting. How come? The 
ultrasonic shock waves break the oxides and expose fresh nickel.

Example on a small U/S soldering pot: 
http://www.advancedsonics.com/newpage5%20USP.htm

My two nickels

Inge


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Keith Calhoun" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 9:55 PM
Subject: [TN] Wire soldering question



We are building a small assembly for one of our customers using
M22759/12-24 wires, (nickel plated copper, Teflon insulated).  We are
using Multicore HMP solder, (Sn5, Pb93.5, Ag1.5) for this assembly.

Do any of you have a recommendation for a flux that may help in getting
this wire to wet?  The other solder joints are acceptable, we just can't
get the wire to wet.  I know that I am trying something difficult, as
soldering to nickel is difficult at best.  I would be most greatful for
any suggestions that anyone has for this.

Thanks for the excellent resource!

Keith S. Calhoun
Manufacturing Engineering Manager
SoPark Corporation
3300 South Park Avenue
Buffalo. New York 14218
Phone: 716-822-0434 ext. 237
Fax: 716-822-5062
[log in to unmask]
Thank you for helping SoPark reach our 30th year as a Premier
Electronics Manufacturing Service Provider!
ISO 9001:2008 & AS9100B Certified


______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask]
______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------
Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 16.0
To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in
the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet
To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL)
To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest
Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives
For additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 

847-615-7100 ext.2815
----------------------------------------------------- 


______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] 
______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------
Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 16.0
To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in
the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet
To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL)
To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest
Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives
For additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 
847-615-7100 ext.2815
-----------------------------------------------------

______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] 
______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------
Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 16.0
To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in
the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet
To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL)
To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest
Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives
For additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 
847-615-7100 ext.2815
-----------------------------------------------------



______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] 
______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------
Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 16.0
To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in
the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet
To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL)
To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest
Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives
For additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or
847-615-7100 ext.2815
-----------------------------------------------------

______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] 
______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------
Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 16.0
To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in
the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet
To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL)
To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest
Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives
For additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or
847-615-7100 ext.2815
-----------------------------------------------------


______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] 
______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------
Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 16.0
To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in
the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet
To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL)
To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest
Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives
For additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815
-----------------------------------------------------

ATOM RSS1 RSS2