I feel compelled to throw in just a couple more comments. There was a point in my career as a board fabricator when I felt the assembly and design industries were about five years behind the chip people, us board builders were about five years behind the assembly and design people and the suppliers to the board industry were about five years behind us. Part of what caused that thinking was talking with people like we have on the technet, attending IPC and ITRI planning sessions and reading everything I could related to technology and product development. I encountered people trying to use the latest chip but having trouble getting their design software to lay out the circuit. Once they managed that we'd do everything we could to figure out how to process it and usually could. Once, sometimes more. We can all do anything once, repeating it can be a killer. We frequently did it doing things that our suppliers didn't think possible. We did things to and with their products that they weren't designed to do. Which is why it frequently didn't work a second time. I think the gaps between the members of the food chain have gotten closer together but we're not all looking at the same big picture yet. Of course, it's tough to see the big picture when your little part of the world is so crowded or collapsing under the strain of too many things to do, too many fires, etc. Most days it's easier to come up with more questions that it is a single answer. And regarding state-of-the-art: some days the state is confusion and the art is abstract. It's obvious, based on some of the topics on the technet, that many of the food groups on the chain are represented. This is obviously a good way for us to work together and keep our parts of the chain alive. It's easy enough to maintain our non-profit status. If we work together , even a little, to make sure we're all seeing the same big picture we should have a decent chance of surviving. Or at least participating. Thanks for all of the comments and discussion. It's been a good one. Bill Anderson Kinetic Circuits ############################################################## TechNet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8c ############################################################## To subscribe/unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the body: To subscribe: SUBSCRIBE TECHNET <your full name> To unsubscribe: SIGNOFF TECHNET ############################################################## Please visit IPC web site (http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm) for additional information. If you need assistance - contact Gayatri Sardeshpande at [log in to unmask] or 847-509-9700 ext.5365 ##############################################################