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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 16:43:46 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Lisa Williams <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Lisa Williams <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Legend Location Tolerance
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
The closest IPC comes to saying anything on the location tolerance on legends and
markings is from IPC-2221 (newly released):
para 4.6 "Liquid screened markings require clearances that are typically 0.4 - 0.5
mm from solderable surfaces."
Lisa Williams
IPC
2215 Sanders Road
Northbrook, IL 60062
URL: www.ipc.org
>>> Don Vischulis <[log in to unmask]> 05/07/98 09:32PM >>>
John:
This is a subject that IPC has avoided. The last specification that I can remember
was in the
+/-0.020" area, which is not adequate for today's designs. You must decide what you
want for
your legend. Conventional, screened legend can maintain somewhere between +/-0.015
to 0.010 inch
(optimum conditions). If you are willing to pay for LPI legend, you should
experience +/-0.005".
The real question is why do you need tight registration tolerances? Automated
assembly equipment
doesn't use legend to assemble the boards, and once the parts are on the boards most
modern
designs can't be read. IMO, legends on modern designs should only be used for
warnings, assembly
identification, test points, and similar designations. Assembly drawings (scaled
larger than
1:1) should be used for component identification.
Don Vischulis
[log in to unmask]
John Bauer wrote:
> Is there a specification that specifies the registration tolerance of the
> silkscreen legend to the PWB?
snip --------------------------------------
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Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 17:08:35 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: TN Photoresist stripping costs
X-To: "G. SIDNEY COX (919) 248-5024" <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I can't answer all of your question but I do have info
on machine costs, and stripper costs. Alot of this is dependent
on the resist you are attempting to strip and the thickness,
also is it inner or outers (Outerlayer films are much more difficult
to strip and also more expensive.)
Machine around $250K-300K footprint 3.5'x15'
Stripper cost (depending on volume) expect to
pay anywhere from $8/gallon to $15/gallon as I
said before this is dependent on the film you
are looking at.
Waste treatment costs will depend on your requirements.
It could be expensive if you have a low COD limit. Make
sure your equipment has a good filtration system and you
should be able to remove a large percentage of the skins
from solution.
At 01:18 PM 5/8/98 -0400, you wrote:
>
>Message-headers:
>Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 13:14:00 EDT
>From: "G. SIDNEY COX"@mr-gw1.email.dupont.com
>Posting-date: Fri, 8 May 1998 00:00:00 EDT
>A1-type: DOCUMENT
>I am trying to gather data on the cost of the stripping
>operation for primary imaging photoresists? I would like to get $/board
square
>foot for:
>
>A. Cost of operator(s) including benefits
>B. Cost of equipment and depreciation amounts
>C. Cost of power and cost of equipment footprint (space taken up by
equipment)
>D. Cost of actual stripper chemistry, either caustic or proprietary
>E. Cost of rinse water
>F. Cost to waste treat both spent stripper (including skins waste) and rinse
>water.
>
>I would appreciate any information you are willing to share. Thanks for your
>help.
>
>Regards,
>
>David R. McGregor
>DuPont Electronics
>
Josh Moody
Materials Quality Engineer
Hewlett-Packard - Richardson (HPSD)
ph# (972) 497-4617
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 17:28:40 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: PWB Test Coupons
X-To: Gabriela Bogdan <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Gaby,
This was a good question and deserves a response. Basically we section =
coupons to monitor our process. For the most part the most effective =
method of checking copper thickness is the use of non destructive copper =
thickness meter that can be used on the actual parts. However, even this =
is not 100%. The actual parts can only be visually inspected ( typically =
under a 4x holo lamp) for obvious issues such as noticeable break out of =
pads on both internal and external lands. Typically you can get a =
fairly good view of the internal pads on 4 layers and some 6 layers. =
Once you get into the 8 layer designs it becomes impossible to see the =
internal pads. So at this point you basically look thru the part to see =
if there is any obvious misregistration of the hole to the pwr/ground =
planes. You then review can review the coupons for layer to layer =
registration and determine if you have a potential issue with break out =
on the pads of the signal layers.=20
I should point out that I did not mean to imply that coupons are not =
useful. I find them very useful in verifying the process / panel with =
regard hole wall quality, layer to layer registration and a indication =
of annular ring. I do not feel the placement of the coupons with regards =
to it being 1 inch from the actual part or 1 inch from the rail would =
have any impact on the items mentioned and I do not feel they are an =
absolute as to the acceptance of a board due to copper thickness.=20
Ed Cosper=20
----------
From: Gabriela Bogdan[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Friday, May 08, 1998 3:55 PM
To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.; Ed Cosper
Subject: Re: [TN] PWB Test Coupons
Ed Cosper wrote:
> Hmmmm..... another coupon dilemma. You know Ralph, this always seems
> to be an ongoing issue. Frankly I feel way too much emphases is placed
> on these dang coupons.
> Coupons are a good if used as a process indicator. They don't by any
> stretch of the imagination ( in my opinion ) mean the board is good. I
> don't care where you place them.
> I wonder just how many of us can tell stories of countless dollars
> lost due to coupons.
> Some customer will section a board regardless of what your coupons
> look like and if the board shows a non-compliant condition ... guess
> what? Typically there would be a push to scrap the entire lot. After
> all, if your coupon is acceptable and the holes sectioned from the
> board is not.... well then.... You coupons obviously have no bearing
> on acceptability. Now on the other hand, if the coupons shows
> unacceptable, there is a tendency by many to scrap the lot regardless
> if the board sections good
>
>
>
> Just my two cents.
>
> Ed Cosper
>
> ----------
> From: Vaughan, Ralph H[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Friday, May 08, 1998 8:44 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] PWB Test Coupons
>
> Greets
>
> How about a relatively non-technical arguement to chew on?
> For years we have procured pwb's to the mil- or ipc-d 275 rules from
> several very reputable suppliers. All the boards are delivered with a
> 1
> to 2 inch wide manufacturing panel surrounding the board, which is
> routed off after we complete assembly. In all cases, the shops have
> regarded this panelized board as "the board" and have placed the test
> coupons one-half inch from the"the board", as the spec requires. We
> have always concurred with this, as we didn't particularly want our
> manufacturing panel cut up to remove coupons, and we understand that
> this is pretty much industry practice, and also feel that having the
> coupon one inch closer to the circuitry makes no real dif. Now,
> another faction of my company with a more purist attitude tells me
> none
> of my boards are spec compliant because of coupon placement. We have
> already gone to the needless trouble and expense of modifying drawing
> notes to allow this condition, so I'm not in a panic, but I'd still
> like the decision from the jury.
>
> Thoughts?
>
> Thanks
>
> Ralph
>
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Ed and everyone!
It's true,of course,that customers prefer to check a board from the
batch, we are doing so too.
But, I would like to give our board suppliers confidence too, so,
please tell me how they
inspect the goodies before sending those boards which are scrapped by
the customer later?
Are we expecting some relevant changes in the future-standards for
example?
And the boards we check cost money too.Sometimes a big lot.
Thank you,
Gaby
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 15:06:38 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mark Simmons <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Manufacturer @ exporter...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Does anyone have the adress for the Taiwan SpanNet? I have a couple of
brochures to download, because delivery is our good point.
mark
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Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 17:55:30 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Michael Carano <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Michael Carano <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: ec
Subject: Re: Solder balls
X-To: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
John Waite wrote:
>
> Hi Bill,
> A solderball is basically a "glob" of solder that is either stuck to the surface or
> entrenched in a material where it should not be (sorry, as generic as I can put it). There are
> different types of solderballs (depending on how and where they are stuck) and caused by
> different issues. Some examples and causes are: 1) solderball stuck on the surface of the
> soldermask- Many causes including, flux density or preheat too high, undercured soldermask
> (typically more entrenched). soldermask tooooo Thinnnnn. Poor postclean. 2) solderball stuck
> on the edge of a mask clearance- Exposed circuit from excessive undercut, cleaning, mask curing,
> etc, etc. Instead of boring you with all the history, It is possible that a poorly aligned
> solderpaste stencil can cause a solderball, but Look at the placement of the solderball, Webbing
> characteristics between the SMT pads, and cross section the area to find out where it is attached
> to. This may give you a clue as to the cause. Sounds like they may also be depositing a heavy
> amount of paste and possibly using a noclean environment? There are other causes on SMT
> technology also to include the profile of the smt reflow unit, solderpaste itself, cleanliness of
> the board, etc. I am not an assembly guru (far from it), but have seen some "interesting"
> solderballs. (No jokes please, I was being good about it). JOHN WAITE
>
> [log in to unmask] wrote:
>
> > Hi all I have what I am sure amounts to a dumb question but I have to
> > know.I have a customer that I talked to and they told me that they
> > thought that the stencil step was off from the panel step and it was
> > causing solder balls.I have read in the past on this site a little about
> > solder balls but paid no mind to them (silly me) but now I have to.
> > My question is what is a solder ball? And does or can an off step cause
> > them.
> >
> > Thank you Bill Dworak
> >
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>
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> ################################################################Bill,
One area to look at is the soldermask itself. Is it properly cured?
Try a littke longer on the post cure or extend the UV bump.
Also, some masks are more prone to solderballs than others.
John Waite covered many of the other causes very well. Yes, it is a lot
of things to look at.
Good luck
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=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 9 May 1998 01:28:19 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: PWB Test Coupons
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Ed has made some good points about coupons and the misconceptions about
their significance. I agree that a good coupon does not necessarily mean a
good PCB because there are many other important parameters which can only be
checked on the PCB itself.
However, I consider they are very important because we do a whole raft of
tests which are not specific to the PCB design but to the process. These
include daily sections checking for side to side and through hole
distribution from our direct plate and pattern plate processes, and these
sections include test pieces which have been soldered and thermal shocked.
There are solderability tests before and after accelerated ageing, and a
severe test of thermal shock for 5 or 10 cycles to test integrity of inner
layer connections looking at change in resistance through a series of
interconnects. There are also controlled impedance traces to test
consistency across the batch, and a contamination test coupon which has to
be put in a humidity chamber with constant voltage applied looking for
breakdown in resistance over 21 days. These tests could not be carried out
on samples from the variety of PCB's being processed day to day because they
require a standard design for function and comparison.
Plating thickness must be checked on the PCB's because coupons on the edge
of the panel will have higher readings than coupons at the centre of the
panel and the important consideration is the max and min values which have
to be measured with a gauge non-destructively. X-Ray inspection of
registration, AOI of circuit patterns, final Electrical Test, and hole size
and dimensional checks are all carried out on the PCB itself to determine
quality, not on coupons. I like to define the Quality Assurance laboratory
as checking the process quality with coupons sampled from each days
production, and production inspection operations checking the PCB quality of
each and every batch. This division of responsibility is important to keep
clear.
On the original question about placement of coupons, I see no reason for the
scrap biscuit panel border not to be used for positioning coupons which
could then be used by the customer for pre-production tests. However, I
would question the economics of having so much scrap in a biscuit panel and
try to persuade them to reduce their borders as much as possible. I have
seen some incredibly wasteful biscuit panels because the customer wanted to
have a standard panel regardless of the shape and size of the individual
pcb. Basically, the cost per panel square inch is pretty much the same for a
process whether it has a pcb on it or is scrap material so keep it tight as
possible. Big bare laminate borders are also bad news for plating
distribution over the panel.
Cheers
Paul Gould
Teknacron Circuits Ltd
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=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 9 May 1998 13:42:32 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Poh Kong Hui <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Poh Kong Hui <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: selective soldering
X-To: Francisco Rios <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Francisco,
You may try look at Ersa multi-functional selective soldering
systems, known as ERSA Versaflow Soldering system for selective
nitrogen technology.
Thw website is http://www.ersa.de/emach_e.htm
Good Luck..
Poh
=====================================================================
At 04:50 PM 5/4/98 -0700, you wrote:
>I would like to get some comments from anyone who is working with
>selective soldering for through-hole components. My current process
>involves a wave solder machine, with a lot of tooling in pallets to
>protect bottom side SMT parts, and I am looking into alternatives such
>as selective soldering (point to point, nozzles, or fixtures) or robotic
>soldering cells, or perhaps another wave solder machine.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Francisco Rios
>Process Engineer
>
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>
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=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 13:45:35 +0800
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Hanjianfa <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: looking for cooperation
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Dear sir,
I have an aluminum stuff factory which produces aluminum basins, frying
pan, pot etc.
My factory has about 200 workers with an area of about 10000 square
meters of which about
5000 square-meter area is not fully used for I have just bought this
factory. My factory is of a
complete production line from raw material processing to finished
products. At present, in order
to enlarge its scale and to make full use of this factory area, I am
looking for cooperation in either
NEW TECHNOLOGY OR LANDUSING. This factory has very good geographical
environment. It is located on the side of the express way(Weifang Exit)
from Jinan to Qingdao and it is about four miles from the center of
Weifang city,which is famous for the international kite festival. This
area is prosperous with many hotels and restaurants.
Sincerely looking for cooperation, if you are interested please contact.
We could talk more on this subject.
All the best! Han jianfa
WEIFANG ALUMINUM FACTORY
Weifang, Shandong, China
Tele: 0086-536-8235115
01385366576
PS. I have already bought the land for 50 years' use at least!
In China, the consumption rate and labor cost are comparatively low!
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=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 14:10:26 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: TN Photoresist stripping costs
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
David:
You gave a great paper at the PCMI, and now you have asked one of the more
fascinating, and difficult to answer questions to appear on Technet, and since
we like to think of ourselves as experts in exactly this field, I am going to
reply, with more detail than you likely want.
First, an easy part of of the question, about rinse water.
It turns out that resist strippers pickup Copper during stripping, and in
most, but not all, cases, it tops out at around 250 PPM. With a stripper
containing 250 PPM of Copper, the rinse waters are going to have more than an
allowable level of Copper, thus they must be waste treated, and this is
expensive, especially since the strippers are usually chelated.
Some stripper chemistry vendors are getting around this matter by using feed
and bleed, and feeding enough stripper chemistry through the system to keep
the Copper levels down, thus keeping the rinse waters legal to dump. This is
simply a keep-the- --stripper-chemistry-rich concept, but there are some folks
who buy into it.
It is possible, by using the proper inhibitors in the stripper chemistry, to
keep the Copper levels down to less than 50 PPM, no matter how deeply you go
into the chemistry, but of course, I am too modest to tell you those suppliers
that can supply this kind of chemistry.
Now about actual stripping costs.
First, understand that because of overplating issues, the outerlayer strippers
have to be real high performance, compared to innerlayer strippers, and this
high performance can cost a whole lot, or not so much more, depending on the
chemistry in the stripper.
To be specific, the cost of stripping can vary from a low of around US$0.006
per square foot (and this is for a fully formulated proprietary stripper) to
as high as US$0.12 per square foot, for folks using really badly formulated
strippers in a feed and bleed mode.
Some facts to remember about costs of stripping:
1.) The faster you want to strip at, the higher the cost of stripping, this
means that the longer the strip chemistry is in contact with the resist, the
deeper into the chemistry you can go. Thus the longer the strip chamber, the
lower the chemistry costs, because the longer the chamber, the longer the time
the chemistry is in contact with the resist, for a given throughput.
2.) The higher the temperature you strip at, the faster the stripping, thus,
this really means that the higher the temperature you strip at, the lower the
cost, as long as the stripper does not tarnish the Copper because it is being
used so hot.
3.) The issue of tarnishing the Copper is crucial, especially in the
innerlayer line, as in the US, most innerlayers go to AOI after stripping, and
for most AOI, any tarnish slows the AOI dramatically. This is so important,
that some people throw out stripper chemistry when it starts to tarnish. And
the propensity to tarnish increases as the Copper level in the stripper
increases, unless you have a properly designed anti-tarnish system in the
stripper chemistry.
4.) Feed and Bleed generally increases the cost of stripping by a factor of
2+, because good chemistry is thrown out with the bad.
I think that I have given you more than you asked for, but if you have further
questions, get back in touch.
Regards,
Rudy Sedlak
RD Chemical Company
Mountain View CA
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Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 18:56:00 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Samuel Flores <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Samuel Flores <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Leakage paths through soft solder joints
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Is anyone familiar with gas leakage paths through soft soldered joints?
Part of a vacuum electron device which I am working with has a puzzling
leak. It occurrs only when the device is at a temp of 85C or above. The
joint is between a cold-rolled steel piece and a Carpenter-42 piece. We
suspect it is either in the solder itself or in the interface between the
solder and the cold rolled steel. Appreciate all input.
Thanks,
Sam
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Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 22:18:48 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Miscantor <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Miscantor <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: TN Photoresist stripping costs
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Stripping costs - eventually lead to how well your supplier understands the
chemistry he is supplying and the issue of resist polymer in contact with the
chemistry along with understanding functional chemistry performance with
contact of the resist in the stripping chambers .......... exact costs ......
as Mr. Sedlak stipulated ....... varies .... based on all the items above
Regards
Richard Fudalewski
Atotech Canada Ltd
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 11:36:39 +0900
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"M. C. Chu" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "M. C. Chu" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Drill Room Vibration
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Dear Technetters:
We have tried to check the vibration level of a drill room. We used FFT
Analyzer made by AFK Condition Monitoring System. We checked the vibration
level on a work table of a drill machine. It was around 0.5 to 2.5 micron
meters when the machine and the surrounding ones were off, and it was around
3.5 to 7 micron meters in plane direction and 1.5 to 3 micron meters in Z
direction when all the machine were running.
However I am not sure whether the vibration level observed is to be improved
or not. Please do advise me on the recommended maximum level of
vibration for small hole drilling.
Thanks and regards,
CSS Asia Co., Ltd.
Tel: 82-2-523-8810
Fax: 82-2-523-1483
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 11:17:03 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
JB <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: JB <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: STOP TECHNET!
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all,
no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes too
active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days and get
a few 100 messages.
I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub lists
such as:
IPC standard related
wet processes
multilayer
photoimaging
laminate
etc......
Any comments?
Jens Behrens
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 10:33:21 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: TN Photoresist stripping costs
X-To: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Rudi,
Let me add my two cents to Your message :
Rinse water quality :
I am in doubt , that stripping solution contain so high levels of copper (
250 ppm ) , especially the systems , that are operating on feed and bleed
base .
To my opinion , there is basic difference between stripping photoresist used
as etch resist and used as plating resist :
1 ) etch resist : photoresist is above surface of the copper . Quality of
the copper depends not only on stripping chemistry , but also on quality of
the copper under the photoresist ( e.g. - if photorists is laminated on
oxidised copper , with the best stripper the copper after striping will be
oxidised ) . A lot depends on rinse water quality and efficiency of the dryer .
2 ) plate resist . In most of the cases the problem are related to
oveplating and to potential damage to etch resist ( tin or tin lead ) . The
spent stripper is contaminated by tin or tin-lead .
Decision regarding feed and bleed or batch-wise operation depends not only
on the direct costs of the chemistry but on process considerations : feed
and bleed is steady state process ( constant operation parameters ) while in
batch wise mode operation parameters must be adjusted as the chemistry is
loaded . For plate resist stripping oxidation is also crucial for the next
process , which is normally alkaline etching .
Regarding costs considerations :
Apart of the choise of mode of operation , stripping machine is of the most
importance , especially skin removal capacity .This is important for
propertiary strippers : if chemistry is working on dissolution of removed
skin instead on stripping , this is the best way to loose money .
At 14:10 10/05/98 EDT, you wrote:
>David:
>
>You gave a great paper at the PCMI, and now you have asked one of the more
>fascinating, and difficult to answer questions to appear on Technet, and since
>we like to think of ourselves as experts in exactly this field, I am going to
>reply, with more detail than you likely want.
>
>First, an easy part of of the question, about rinse water.
>
>It turns out that resist strippers pickup Copper during stripping, and in
>most, but not all, cases, it tops out at around 250 PPM. With a stripper
>containing 250 PPM of Copper, the rinse waters are going to have more than an
>allowable level of Copper, thus they must be waste treated, and this is
>expensive, especially since the strippers are usually chelated.
>
>Some stripper chemistry vendors are getting around this matter by using feed
>and bleed, and feeding enough stripper chemistry through the system to keep
>the Copper levels down, thus keeping the rinse waters legal to dump. This is
>simply a keep-the- --stripper-chemistry-rich concept, but there are some folks
>who buy into it.
>
>It is possible, by using the proper inhibitors in the stripper chemistry, to
>keep the Copper levels down to less than 50 PPM, no matter how deeply you go
>into the chemistry, but of course, I am too modest to tell you those suppliers
>that can supply this kind of chemistry.
>
>Now about actual stripping costs.
>
>First, understand that because of overplating issues, the outerlayer strippers
>have to be real high performance, compared to innerlayer strippers, and this
>high performance can cost a whole lot, or not so much more, depending on the
>chemistry in the stripper.
>
>To be specific, the cost of stripping can vary from a low of around US$0.006
>per square foot (and this is for a fully formulated proprietary stripper) to
>as high as US$0.12 per square foot, for folks using really badly formulated
>strippers in a feed and bleed mode.
>
>Some facts to remember about costs of stripping:
>
>1.) The faster you want to strip at, the higher the cost of stripping, this
>means that the longer the strip chemistry is in contact with the resist, the
>deeper into the chemistry you can go. Thus the longer the strip chamber, the
>lower the chemistry costs, because the longer the chamber, the longer the time
>the chemistry is in contact with the resist, for a given throughput.
>
>2.) The higher the temperature you strip at, the faster the stripping, thus,
>this really means that the higher the temperature you strip at, the lower the
>cost, as long as the stripper does not tarnish the Copper because it is being
>used so hot.
>
>3.) The issue of tarnishing the Copper is crucial, especially in the
>innerlayer line, as in the US, most innerlayers go to AOI after stripping, and
>for most AOI, any tarnish slows the AOI dramatically. This is so important,
>that some people throw out stripper chemistry when it starts to tarnish. And
>the propensity to tarnish increases as the Copper level in the stripper
>increases, unless you have a properly designed anti-tarnish system in the
>stripper chemistry.
>
>4.) Feed and Bleed generally increases the cost of stripping by a factor of
>2+, because good chemistry is thrown out with the bad.
>
>I think that I have given you more than you asked for, but if you have further
>questions, get back in touch.
>
>Regards,
>Rudy Sedlak
>RD Chemical Company
>Mountain View CA
>
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>
>
Shalev Shabtay
Eltek Ltd - Israel
Tel 972 3 9395050
Fax 972 3 9309581
E-mail : [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 10:48:06 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Johannes Sivula <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Johannes Sivula <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Taiwan SpanNet
Hi,
Try: http://www.asiansources.com/
(Embedded
image moved [log in to unmask]
to file: 05/09/98 01:06 AM
PIC11053.PCX)
Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Johannes Sivula/MARTIS)
Subject: Taiwan SpanNet
Does anyone have the adress for the Taiwan SpanNet? I have a couple of
brochures to download, because delivery is our good point.
mark [log in to unmask]
(UUEncoded file named: PIC11053.PCX follows)
begin 644 PIC11053.PCX
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`
end
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 14:17:28 +0530
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Guru Prasad Raghanna <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Gerber Viewer
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi
I am looking for a gerber viewer for RS274X format.
Also I want know if it supports Windows NT and Win 95.
Can I get a ps file from the gerber viewer?
Your help will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Best Regards
Guru
**********************************************************************
GuruPrasad R
Texas Instruments(India) Ltd., Phone : 91-80-5269451
Golf View Homes, Fax : 91-80-5269456/5278776
Wind Tunnel Road, Email : [log in to unmask]
MurugeshPallya, Bangalore-560017 [log in to unmask]
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 04:34:48 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Doug Jeffery <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Doug Jeffery <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: tents
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Ernie,
Over the years we have not been able to tent holes unless we are able
to keep .012"-.015" of film around each hole. If we have a constant
tent breaking problem it is usually because the design does not give us
this clearance. With the proper amount of clearance I haven't had a
problem.
Doug Jeffery
Electrotek, Inc.
You wrote:
>
> We seem to have an issue with tents breaking on
large
> holes ( .180 to .250 dia. ) as well as slots, typically .118 x
.250.
> No matter whose film we have tried, the tents break. It is not
always
> every panel, nor every lot. We have an idea that it may be being
> caused by the developer. Has anyone out there wrestled with this
> problem, and if so how was it resolved. To switch to secondary
drill
> would just impact that departments output Any help will be deeply
> appreciated.
>
> Ernie Smith
> Electropac Co. Inc.
>
> e-mail to [log in to unmask]
>
> or on the technet
>
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 11:24:13 +0200
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Axel Isensee <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Axel Isensee <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Bosch Telecom GmbH
Subject: Re: Gerber Viewer
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Valor offers a free "Valor Universal Viewer (VUV)" on their homepage
http://www.valor.com/vuv.html
--=20
Mit freundlichen Gr=FC=DFen / Best regards
Axel Isensee
_______________________________________________________________ =20
=20
Bosch Telecom GmbH Tel: +49-5341-28-5470
UC-EG/ECT1 Fax: +49-5341-28-5124 =20
mailto:[log in to unmask] =20
_______________________________________________________________
Guru Prasad Raghanna wrote:
>=20
> Hi
>=20
> I am looking for a gerber viewer for RS274X format.
>=20
> Also I want know if it supports Windows NT and Win 95.
>=20
> Can I get a ps file from the gerber viewer?
>=20
> Your help will be greatly appreciated.
>=20
> Thanks
>=20
> Best Regards
>=20
> Guru
>=20
> **********************************************************************
> GuruPrasad R
> Texas Instruments(India) Ltd., Phone : 91-80-5269451
> Golf View Homes, Fax : 91-80-5269456/5278776
> Wind Tunnel Road, Email : [log in to unmask]
> MurugeshPallya, Bangalore-560017 [log in to unmask]
>=20
> **********************************************************************
--=20
Mit freundlichen Gr=FC=DFen
Axel Isensee
_______________________________________________________________ =20
=20
Bosch Telecom GmbH Tel: +49-5341-28-5470
UC-EG/ECT1 Fax: +49-5341-28-5124 =20
mailto:[log in to unmask] =20
_______________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 10:25:38 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Gareth Jones>" <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: University of Salford
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET!
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Read your e-mail more frequently !!!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi all,
no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes too
active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days and get
a few 100 messages.
I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub lists
such as:
IPC standard related
wet processes
multilayer
photoimaging
laminate
etc......
Any comments?
Jens Behrens
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 18:19:16 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Eddy <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Eddy <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: RE : [TN] Taiwan SpanNet
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD7D09.7B784860"
------ =_NextPart_000_01BD7D09.7B784860
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
HI,
TRY FOLLOWING SEARCH:
EDDY CHEN
EVERGREEN HITECH CONSULTANTS LTD.
TEL:886-2-27667722 FAX:886-2-27630734
E-MAIL: [log in to unmask]
http://www.asiansources.com/evhitech.co
http://taiwan.iis.sinica.edu.tw/
QNet <?I$u: [Big5]>
GoNET <?I$u: [Big5]>
Network building, bussiness data processing=20
IsNet <?I$u: [Big5]>
A site about Salty strip, Tainan county.=20
A-Net <?I$u: [Big5]>
services on internet related items, homepage design, advertising on line =
Innet <?I$u: [Big5]>
GLNet <?I$u: [Big5]>
Dialup service, internet, intranet consultant service, virtual hosting, =
webmarketing.=20
XeNet=20
C-Net <?I$u: [Big5]>
Powerful Computer Company Limited is the distributor of Twinhead =
notebook computers in the Tainan are and offers quick repair service on =
all types of computer related problems. We have a special distribution =
arrangement with Lemel that gives us access to all computer equipment =
produced by them. Also available: computer classes, on-line product =
list.=20
E-Net <?I$u: [Big5]>
E-Net, top fashion site in both living and apparel industry, not only =
broadcasting worldwide current fashion messages for fashion designers =
and publics. But also collecting information about global exhibitions =
and investigating environment for garment industry. Of course, you can =
use GYP (Garment Yellow Page) search to find yellow pages of textiles =
factories and machinery.=20
APNet <?I$u: [Big5]>
KSnet <?I$u: [Big5]>
CDnet <?I$u: [Big5]>
Yunet <?I$u: [Big5]>
X NET <?I$u: [Big5]>
Anonet <?I$u: [Big5]>
------i?l?l?o-----
?H?oaI: Johannes Sivula [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
?C?e?E??: 1998|~5$e11$e PM 03:48
|??oaI: [log in to unmask]
?D|?: Re: [TN] Taiwan SpanNet
<< AE??: PIC11053.PCX >> Hi,
Try: http://www.asiansources.com/
(Embedded
image moved [log in to unmask]
to file: 05/09/98 01:06 AM
PIC11053.PCX)
Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Johannes Sivula/MARTIS)
Subject: Taiwan SpanNet
Does anyone have the adress for the Taiwan SpanNet? I have a couple of
brochures to download, because delivery is our good point.
mark [log in to unmask]
(UUEncoded file named: PIC11053.PCX follows)
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1.8c
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################################################################
Please visit IPC web site (http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm) for =
additional information.
For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at [log in to unmask] or =
847-509-9700 ext.311
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 04:04:21 PDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Hal Winslow <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Hal Winslow <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber Viewer
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Content-Type: text/plain
Hello Guru,
GraphiCode offers a shareware gerber viewer called GCPrevue, which
runs in either Windows NT or Win 95. It will load RS274X data, and
can checkplot files to various plotters, including postscript.
Check www.graphicode.com
I've been using varrious versions of this shareware since 1990, and
have always been quite happy with it.
Hal Winslow
Cadent Medical Corp
Bedford, MA
>Hi
> I am looking for a gerber viewer for RS274X format.
>Also I want know if it supports Windows NT and Win 95.
>Can I get a ps file from the gerber viewer?
>Your help will be greatly appreciated.
>Thanks
>Best Regards
>Guru
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 07:31:00 PDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Kasprzak, Bill (esd) US" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Kasprzak, Bill (esd) US" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: : Stop Technet
JB:
Think of technet as reading the newspaper, hundreds of articles dealing with
current events. If you forget to read a couple of days worth of papers, it
can overwhelming to try and read all the papers to catch up.
It is funny though, the kinds of messages that seem to be popping up on the
'net. The latest ones about the excess space in the pots and pans factory,
someone looking for seal-a-meal boilable replacement bags etc. just makes
for some fun reading at times.
I think you just need to come up with a way to blow through a whole list of
articles by just deleting the messages based on what the "Subject;" reads. I
would not want the Technet to sort the messages for me. I can do that myself
!
Good Luck,
Bill K.
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 07:45:17 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: TN Photoresist stripping costs
X-To: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi rudy,
thanks for the resist stripping summary. I've heard many numbers thrown around and had
difficulty getting a straight answer. Your outline was very informative and gave me a better
understanding of the whole picture. I was especially surprised at the level of Cu. I always
thought it was less than that. I did however had a question about tin/tinlead. I was under the
assumption (not THAT word!!) that some tin/tinlead was also removed and in turn generated a
potential for a Hazardous material. Where is the industry on this situation? JOHN WAITE
RSedlak wrote:
> David:
>
> You gave a great paper at the PCMI, and now you have asked one of the more
> fascinating, and difficult to answer questions to appear on Technet, and since
> we like to think of ourselves as experts in exactly this field, I am going to
> reply, with more detail than you likely want.
>
> First, an easy part of of the question, about rinse water.
>
> It turns out that resist strippers pickup Copper during stripping, and in
> most, but not all, cases, it tops out at around 250 PPM. With a stripper
> containing 250 PPM of Copper, the rinse waters are going to have more than an
> allowable level of Copper, thus they must be waste treated, and this is
> expensive, especially since the strippers are usually chelated.
>
> Some stripper chemistry vendors are getting around this matter by using feed
> and bleed, and feeding enough stripper chemistry through the system to keep
> the Copper levels down, thus keeping the rinse waters legal to dump. This is
> simply a keep-the- --stripper-chemistry-rich concept, but there are some folks
> who buy into it.
>
> It is possible, by using the proper inhibitors in the stripper chemistry, to
> keep the Copper levels down to less than 50 PPM, no matter how deeply you go
> into the chemistry, but of course, I am too modest to tell you those suppliers
> that can supply this kind of chemistry.
>
> Now about actual stripping costs.
>
> First, understand that because of overplating issues, the outerlayer strippers
> have to be real high performance, compared to innerlayer strippers, and this
> high performance can cost a whole lot, or not so much more, depending on the
> chemistry in the stripper.
>
> To be specific, the cost of stripping can vary from a low of around US$0.006
> per square foot (and this is for a fully formulated proprietary stripper) to
> as high as US$0.12 per square foot, for folks using really badly formulated
> strippers in a feed and bleed mode.
>
> Some facts to remember about costs of stripping:
>
> 1.) The faster you want to strip at, the higher the cost of stripping, this
> means that the longer the strip chemistry is in contact with the resist, the
> deeper into the chemistry you can go. Thus the longer the strip chamber, the
> lower the chemistry costs, because the longer the chamber, the longer the time
> the chemistry is in contact with the resist, for a given throughput.
>
> 2.) The higher the temperature you strip at, the faster the stripping, thus,
> this really means that the higher the temperature you strip at, the lower the
> cost, as long as the stripper does not tarnish the Copper because it is being
> used so hot.
>
> 3.) The issue of tarnishing the Copper is crucial, especially in the
> innerlayer line, as in the US, most innerlayers go to AOI after stripping, and
> for most AOI, any tarnish slows the AOI dramatically. This is so important,
> that some people throw out stripper chemistry when it starts to tarnish. And
> the propensity to tarnish increases as the Copper level in the stripper
> increases, unless you have a properly designed anti-tarnish system in the
> stripper chemistry.
>
> 4.) Feed and Bleed generally increases the cost of stripping by a factor of
> 2+, because good chemistry is thrown out with the bad.
>
> I think that I have given you more than you asked for, but if you have further
> questions, get back in touch.
>
> Regards,
> Rudy Sedlak
> RD Chemical Company
> Mountain View CA
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 07:51:13 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber Viewer
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Try Lavenir... PH# 510-680-7400
Guru Prasad Raghanna wrote:
> Hi
>
> I am looking for a gerber viewer for RS274X format.
>
> Also I want know if it supports Windows NT and Win 95.
>
> Can I get a ps file from the gerber viewer?
>
> Your help will be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks
>
> Best Regards
>
> Guru
>
> **********************************************************************
> GuruPrasad R
> Texas Instruments(India) Ltd., Phone : 91-80-5269451
> Golf View Homes, Fax : 91-80-5269456/5278776
> Wind Tunnel Road, Email : [log in to unmask]
> MurugeshPallya, Bangalore-560017 [log in to unmask]
>
> **********************************************************************
>
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 07:59:16 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Brian L Guidi <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Brian L Guidi <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Laminates
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Thank you for the assistance.
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 08:12:12 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET!
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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In a message dated 05/11/98 2:56:20 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
Jens Behrens writes:
> Hi all,
>
> no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes t=
oo
> active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days and=
get
> a few 100 messages.
>
> I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub l=
ists
> such as:
>
> IPC standard related
> wet processes
> multilayer
> photoimaging
> laminate
> etc......
>
> Any comments?
>
> Jens Behrens
Hi Jens,
There was a discussion about this not too long ago as a matter of fa=
ct. I=0Afor one don't want to see anything changed with the way the forum=
is now, it's=0Abeen in this format for years and I think does the job we=
ll.
I'm suprized that I do see people wanting to change the format,=0Aes=
pecially since how one gets their messages is all up to the individual.
I think sometimes people forget that this list is nothing but a dumb comp=
uter=0Aprogram (but it IS moderated), and all you have to do is modify ho=
w you want=0Athe dumb computer to send your messages to you. I don't know=
how many people=0Aactually keep the FAQ that is sent when you subscribe,=
but all the commands=0Aare there to set-up how you want your messages se=
nt...and yes, there is a way=0Ato set-up things so that your mailbox hasn=
't overwhelmed your hard-drive when=0Ayou go on vacation, it takes all of=
30-seconds to do.
I'll post the commands from the FAQ for those that may have trashed them.=
You=0Acan get this same list by sending a message to
[log in to unmask]
In the body of the message type: FAQ
-Steve Gregory-
Administering your subscription status:
All commands (such as subscribe and signoff) must be sent to
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Also, please note that no other text, such as electronic signature, etc.,=
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Example for subscribing:
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NOTE: You must send messages to the forum address ONLY from the e-mail ad=
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The available options are as follows:
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This command returns your subscriber options. To be executed correctly, t=
he=0Amessage must be sent from the address about which you are making a q=
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The syntax is:
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Mail/Nomail=A0
Setting the NOMail option stops mail from the forum to you, but leaves yo=
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Setting the Mail option is the complementary command that restarts mail=
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For example, to temporarily disable mail delivery from TechNet to your=0A=
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Please note, if you use an auto-responder while on vacation without setti=
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Digest/Nodigest
Setting the Digest option causes the subscriber to receive one e-mail pos=
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as they are=0Aprocessed by the mail list. Digest negates Index delivery =
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Setting the NODigest option causes individual messages to be sent to the=
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For example, to start receiving the TechNet messages in digest form, send=
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ponds,=0A"You're welcome!".
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 07:25:51 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Sam Mollet <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Sam Mollet <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Maximum FR4 operating temperature
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0006_01BD7CAE.06EB9CA0"
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I have an application with a maximum ambient temperature of 70 =B0C. I =
am using copper planes on FR4 to help cool some power resistor leads. =
The copper planes can hit 115 =B0C. Is this a problem? Is there a rule =
of thumb on how hot FR4 can continuously be operated at?=20
------=_NextPart_000_0006_01BD7CAE.06EB9CA0
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charset="iso-8859-1"
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<HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.2106.6"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>I have an application with a maximum =
ambient=20
temperature of 70 °C. I am using copper planes on FR4 to help =
cool=20
some power resistor leads. The copper planes can hit 115 =
°C. Is=20
this a problem? Is there a rule of thumb on how hot FR4 can =
continuously=20
be operated at? </FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 08:47:16 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Maximum FR4 operating temperature
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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I've always used a max temp of 110 C as a topside board temp.
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to
[log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Jason Smith)
bcc: Jason Smith
Subject: [TN] Maximum FR4 operating temperature
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I have an application with a maximum ambient temperature of 70 =B0C. I=
am
using copper planes on FR4 to help cool some power resistor leads. The=
copper planes can hit 115 =B0C. Is this a problem? Is there a rule of=
thumb
on how hot FR4 can continuously be operated at?
=
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 05:48:41 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Wolfgang Schenke <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Wolfgang Schenke <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber Viewer
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
And there is of course CAMCAD - a free Gerber, HPGL and DXF viewer.
Download from http://www.rsi-inc.com
Wolfgang
-----Original Message-----
From: Guru Prasad Raghanna <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Monday, May 11, 1998 1:57 AM
Subject: [TN] Gerber Viewer
>Hi
>
> I am looking for a gerber viewer for RS274X format.
>
>Also I want know if it supports Windows NT and Win 95.
>
>Can I get a ps file from the gerber viewer?
>
>Your help will be greatly appreciated.
>
>Thanks
>
>Best Regards
>
>Guru
>
>**********************************************************************
>GuruPrasad R
>Texas Instruments(India) Ltd., Phone : 91-80-5269451
>Golf View Homes, Fax : 91-80-5269456/5278776
>Wind Tunnel Road, Email : [log in to unmask]
>MurugeshPallya, Bangalore-560017 [log in to unmask]
>
>**********************************************************************
>
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 15:02:06 +-200
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Dieter Beisiegel <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Dieter Beisiegel <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Maximum FR4 operating temperature
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Sam,
according to UL746 (?) the temperature limit for FR4 is 130 =BAC.
Kind regards,
Dieter
----------
From: Sam Mollet[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Monday, 11 May, 1998 14:25
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Maximum FR4 operating temperature
I have an application with a maximum ambient temperature of 70 =B0C. I =
am using copper planes on FR4 to help cool some power resistor leads. =
The copper planes can hit 115 =B0C. Is this a problem? Is there a rule =
of thumb on how hot FR4 can continuously be operated at?=20
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 09:04:59 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Brad Kendall <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber Viewer
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
I recently started using CAM350 software. It is a shareware package that
you can add options to for a cost. But if you just want to view the
gerbers it works fine.
***** The CAM350 Family README File *****
Our ADDRESS and PHONE NUMBERS:
Advanced CAM Technologies
16450 Los Gatos Blvd. #110
Los Gatos, CA 95032
Phone: 408-358-4680
Fax: 408-358-4691
BBS: 408-358-4696 (All BBS lines are now 28.8 K)
WE'RE ON THE NET!!
Web Address: http://www.ecam.com
FTP Address: ftp://ftp.ecam.com
Email: first NAME letter,last [log in to unmask]
For Example: [log in to unmask] or [log in to unmask]
Good luck,
Brad Kendall
Hella Electronics.
[log in to unmask] on 05/11/98 04:47:28 AM
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Brad Kendall/Hella North America Inc.)
Subject: [TN] Gerber Viewer
Hi
I am looking for a gerber viewer for RS274X format.
Also I want know if it supports Windows NT and Win 95.
Can I get a ps file from the gerber viewer?
Your help will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Best Regards
Guru
**********************************************************************
GuruPrasad R
Texas Instruments(India) Ltd., Phone : 91-80-5269451
Golf View Homes, Fax : 91-80-5269456/5278776
Wind Tunnel Road, Email : [log in to unmask]
MurugeshPallya, Bangalore-560017 [log in to unmask]
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 09:09:49 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [FAB] Need Gold density
X-To: Gabriela Bogdan <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hello Gaby and Technet
Gabriela Bogdan wrote in response to my Technet message asking for gold
density values for Hard and soft
golds:
Gerry,
I am also interested. Please resend any information to me too. I think
that
I could use it in my XRF applications . But, what do you think about the
problem of different
suppliers with different bath
formulations and processes?
Bye,
Gaby
Gaby
I only received two responses. One response was from a chemical supplier
who did not supply any information other than urging caution with
interpreting values I would receive. The other response was from an old
friend in the plating chemistry field. He supplied the values of 17.5
g/cc for the hard gold plate and 19.3 g/cc for the pure gold (i.e.
immersion and soft gold plate). The purpose for my question was to
obtain data to get a baseline for help in determining the correct gold
thickness for a special board I'm designing which will have gold for
multiple purposes (connector contact AND solderable).
If you recall a rather lengthy post I made on the subject of gold and
gold thickness, I forgot to mention an item that had a major impact on
thickness. I called this item "density correction". I remember measuring
gold thickness by beta backscatter and XRF techniques and had noticed
(via hi mag SEM) that we always were plating more gold than that
reported by these techniques. The funny thing is that it was always off
by a constant value! It turned out that the constant was the ratio of
the gold density of the calibration standard (pure gold at 19.3 g/cc) to
the density of the "as plated" deposit (hard gold at approx. 17 g/cc).
At that time it was difficult to obtain calibration standards prepared
from "as plated" deposits as a solution to this issue, so we merely
applied the correction factor to the readings. I'm sure that things are
radically different today with the more modern equipment and
calibration techniques.
To your second question. In my own opinion (and I could be wrong) I
don't think the variation in plating density between board shops will be
significant enough to worry about. I would be more concerned with
deposit thickness AND quality.
Regards
Gerry
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 09:14:04 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Maximum FR4 operating temperature
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi All
We use 130C for SS/DS PWBs and 105C for ML PWBs. These are the most
common UL parameters from our supply base. I believe with some laminate
formulations it is possible for the laminate to get higher ratings but
it is the value that the board shop receives that is important to the
end user.
Also keep in mind that no matter what, even at 105C the resin system
will oxidize and become severely discolored after awhile in the field.
Regards
Gerry
-----Original Message-----
From: LOGISTIC_0/JANINE'S_P/dieterb On Behalf Of Dieter Beisiegel
Sent: Monday, May 11, 1998 9:02 AM
To: 'TechNet E-Mail Forum.'
Subject: RE: [TN] Maximum FR4 operating temperature
Hi Sam,
according to UL746 (?) the temperature limit for FR4 is 130 =BAC.
Kind regards,
Dieter
----------
From: Sam Mollet[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Monday, 11 May, 1998 14:25
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Maximum FR4 operating temperature
I have an application with a maximum ambient temperature of 70
=B0C. I am using copper planes on FR4 to help cool some power resistor
leads. The copper planes can hit 115 =B0C. Is this a problem? Is =
there
a rule of thumb on how hot FR4 can continuously be operated at?=20
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 09:33:20 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, QRICKQ <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: QRICKQ <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber Viewer
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Hello Technet,
For a free Gerber viewer go to http://www.lavenir.com
Ri(k
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 10:06:34 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kelly Kovalovsky <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kelly Kovalovsky <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET!
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
My vote is to leave it as is. I can sort through the subjects and delete all my
unwanted mail in a matter of seconds. Long live technet.
Kelly Kovalovsky
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 10:23:00 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Terranova <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Terranova <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Leakage paths through soft solder joints
X-To: Samuel Flores <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Have you ruled out the possibility of it being outgassing, rather than a
real leak? Have the materials in this location been used with success
before or are the materials new? A couple things to try to help figure
this out is to use a Helium leak detector or even a bakeout (in case the
source is from residue that's outgassing). Good luck.
Regards,
Paul Terranova
Analytical and Environmental Test Services Lab
Digital Equipment Corporation
200 Forest Street
Mail Stop: MRO3-1/D2
Marlboro, MA 01752-3085
' Phone: (508)467-3109
* Fax: (508)467-6796
* Email: [log in to unmask]
WebSite: http://www.digital.com/lab-services
-----Original Message-----
From: Samuel Flores [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 1998 7:56 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Leakage paths through soft solder
joints
Is anyone familiar with gas leakage paths through soft
soldered joints?
Part of a vacuum electron device which I am working with
has a puzzling
leak. It occurrs only when the device is at a temp of
85C or above. The
joint is between a cold-rolled steel piece and a
Carpenter-42 piece. We
suspect it is either in the solder itself or in the
interface between the
solder and the cold rolled steel. Appreciate all input.
Thanks,
Sam
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 09:28:10 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET!
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
My Vote:
I think that each person you ask would give a different sub list. If we co=
uld=20
all do a good job in describing the subject, then it would make 'weeding'=20
through all the Technet mail a little easier.
There are times that I get some interesting tidbits from an off subject. F=
or=20
instance: I am more interested in the assembly manufacturing stuff, but=20
sometimes I find something interesting in a PWB manufacturing subject.
I agree that there are days when a bunch of extra e-mail is the last thing=20=
I=20
need, and it all gets dumped unless the subject gets my attention. I also=20=
rely=20
on the Technet Archives and it's search capability to find the information=20=
I=20
need.
Steve McBride
______________________________ Reply Separator ____________________________=
_____
Subject: [TN] STOP TECHNET!
Author: MIME:[log in to unmask] at INTERNET
Date: 5/10/98 10:24 PM
Hi all,
no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes too=20
active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days and get=20
a few 100 messages.
I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub lists=20
such as:
IPC standard related
wet processes
multilayer
photoimaging
laminate
etc......
Any comments?
Jens Behrens
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=20
text in the body:
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To unsubscribe: SIGNOFF TechNet=20
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Please visit IPC web site (http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm) for additional=20
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For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at [log in to unmask] or=20
847-509-9700 ext.311
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 09:20:57 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Samuel Flores <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Samuel Flores <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Leakage paths through soft solder joints
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Thanks for the input. We've used a helium leak detector.. A good
technician spent an hour checking the tube and pretty well pinpointed the
leak - it's through a soft soldered joint. We're fairly sure it's not
outgassing, the needle on the vac-ion pump goes up 15 seconds after we pass
the probe over the suspected leak area. We're not sure whether it's a
porosity problem, an adhesion problem or even a leakage through the cold
rolled steel. This tube has always been produced before with no problems
of this type. That's what makes this leak puzzling. Right now I'm
wondering if it's an adhesion problem, and if I could heat up the joint
inside of a bell jar (in vacuum) to get the adhesion voids to bubble out.
All input welcome.
Thanks,
Sam
>Have you ruled out the possibility of it being outgassing, rather than a
>real leak? Have the materials in this location been used with success
>before or are the materials new? A couple things to try to help figure
>this out is to use a Helium leak detector or even a bakeout (in case the
>source is from residue that's outgassing). Good luck.
>
>Regards,
>
>Paul Terranova
>Analytical and Environmental Test Services Lab
>
> Digital Equipment Corporation
> 200 Forest Street
> Mail Stop: MRO3-1/D2
> Marlboro, MA 01752-3085
>
>' Phone: (508)467-3109
>* Fax: (508)467-6796
>* Email: [log in to unmask]
>WebSite: http://www.digital.com/lab-services
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Samuel Flores [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 1998 7:56 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Leakage paths through soft solder
>joints
>
> Is anyone familiar with gas leakage paths through soft
>soldered joints?
> Part of a vacuum electron device which I am working with
>has a puzzling
> leak. It occurrs only when the device is at a temp of
>85C or above. The
> joint is between a cold-rolled steel piece and a
>Carpenter-42 piece. We
> suspect it is either in the solder itself or in the
>interface between the
> solder and the cold rolled steel. Appreciate all input.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Sam
>
>
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 17:35:20 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET!
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi ,
This is a price of participating such forum .
From my own point of view , Technet is one of the ways to be updated . I
believe , that most of participants of Technet are active in lot of fields
of PCB manufacturing and I am convinced , that most of the subscibers will
ask to participate all ( or almost ) lists .
Just look on the row , that define the the subject . I takes couple of
seconds to delete unwanted message without reading it .
Regards
At 10:25 11/05/98 +0000, you wrote:
>Read your e-mail more frequently !!!
>
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Hi all,
>
>no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes too
>active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days and get
>a few 100 messages.
>
>I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub lists
>such as:
>
>IPC standard related
>wet processes
>multilayer
>photoimaging
>laminate
>etc......
>
>Any comments?
>
>Jens Behrens
>
Edward Szpruch
Eltek Ltd - Israel
Tel 972 3 9395050
Fax 972 3 9309581
E-mail : [log in to unmask]
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 09:43:18 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Dave Pick -\"process engineer\"" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Dave Pick -\"process engineer\"" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: stop TECHNET
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
One thing that would make weeding out TECHNET emails easier:
Some of the posted questions show as from "[log in to unmask]" and some show that
they are from the individual's email address that posted the question. Why is
this?
If they were all from "TECHNET", it would be much easier to pull out my more
urgent work related emails. Often I don't read all the TECHNET emails right
away, but I need to read other messages sooner.
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 07:59:13 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Darrel Therriault <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Darrel Therriault <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET!
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Technet,
I understand JB's dilemma, we all have it, but there are several times I
see something come across Technet that I find interesting, so I find its
worth hitting the "trash" button a few hundred times.
DT
At 11:17 AM 5/11/98 +0800, you wrote:
>Hi all,
>
>no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes too
>active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days and get
>a few 100 messages.
>
>I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub lists
>such as:
>
>IPC standard related
>wet processes
>multilayer
>photoimaging
>laminate
>etc......
>
>Any comments?
>
>Jens Behrens
>
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847-509-9700 ext.311
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>
>
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 07:55:12 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Douglas Mckean <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Auspex Systems
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET!
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
My vote is to leave it as it is also. But, if you really want
something to consider, I'm on another listserver that has taken
care of this type of thing.
They offer two options.
One is called "non-Digest format" where each email to the group
is forwarded out as a single post.
The other is called "Digest format" where a certain number of
emails get grouped together and sent out as one email to the group.
They have maybe 100 people as subscribers. Here on TechNet we have
approx 1,400 members. Our good people at IPC taking care of all
this are already a little overworked. In other words, one post a day
produces 1,400 copies. 40 posts a day produces over 56,000 copies a
day.
That's 2,300 copies an hour. Keep in mind that adding additional
operations for filtering emails means additional cpu time which
means a slowing down for us.
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 09:46:02 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET (NO vote)
I vote NO .
Mitch Morey
>>> JB <[log in to unmask]> 05/10/98 07:17pm >>>
(snip)
I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub lists
such as:
IPC standard related
wet processes
multilayer
photoimaging
laminate
etc......
Any comments?
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 11:52:33 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Sadley, Dan" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Sadley, Dan" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET (NO vote)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----
=_NextPart_001_01BD7CF4.D4C119F2"
This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.
------ =_NextPart_001_01BD7CF4.D4C119F2
Content-Type: text/plain
What does this mean? What the hell are you voting for?? Nobody called a
vote!
And as for technet, if you don't use it, don't subscribe!
Now stop clogging up my mailbox with garbage!
This is a technical forum. Thank You!
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mitch Morey [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Monday, May 11, 1998 12:46 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] STOP TECHNET (NO vote)
>
> I vote NO .
>
> Mitch Morey
>
> >>> JB <[log in to unmask]> 05/10/98 07:17pm >>>
> (snip)
>
> I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub
> lists
> such as:
>
> IPC standard related
> wet processes
> multilayer
> photoimaging
> laminate
> etc......
>
> Any comments?
>
> ################################################################
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> 1.8c
> ################################################################
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> additional information.
> For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at [log in to unmask] or
> 847-509-9700 ext.311
> ################################################################
------ =_NextPart_001_01BD7CF4.D4C119F2
Content-Type: text/html
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dus-ascii">
<META NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server version =
5.5.1960.3">
<TITLE>RE: [TN] STOP TECHNET (NO vote)</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
<P><FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">What does this mean? =
What the hell are you voting for?? Nobody called a vote! </FONT>
<BR><FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">And as for technet, =
if you don't use it, don't subscribe!</FONT>
<BR><FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">Now stop clogging =
up my mailbox with garbage! </FONT>
<BR><FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">This is a technical =
forum. Thank You!</FONT>
</P>
<BR>
<UL>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D1 FACE=3D"Arial">-----Original Message-----</FONT>
<BR><B><FONT SIZE=3D1 FACE=3D"Arial">From: </FONT></B> <FONT =
SIZE=3D1 FACE=3D"Arial">Mitch Morey [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]</FONT>
<BR><B><FONT SIZE=3D1 FACE=3D"Arial">Sent: </FONT></B> <FONT =
SIZE=3D1 FACE=3D"Arial">Monday, May 11, 1998 12:46 PM</FONT>
<BR><B><FONT SIZE=3D1 =
FACE=3D"Arial">To: </FONT></B> <FONT SIZE=3D1 =
FACE=3D"Arial">[log in to unmask]</FONT>
<BR><B><FONT SIZE=3D1 =
FACE=3D"Arial">Subject: </FONT>=
</B> <FONT SIZE=3D1 FACE=3D"Arial">Re: [TN] STOP TECHNET (NO =
vote)</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">I vote NO =
.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">Mitch Morey</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">>>> JB =
<[log in to unmask]> 05/10/98 07:17pm >>></FONT>
<BR><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">(snip)</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">I think it would =
make sense to split the mailing list in several sub lists</FONT>
<BR><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">such as:</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">IPC standard =
related</FONT>
<BR><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">wet =
processes</FONT>
<BR><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">multilayer</FONT>
<BR><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">photoimaging</FONT>
<BR><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">laminate</FONT>
<BR><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">etc......</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">Any comments?</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Arial">#########################################################=
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<BR><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">TechNet E-Mail =
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TARGET=3D"_blank">http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm</A></FONT></U><FONT =
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 10:04:03 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ted Stern <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Circuit Research
Subject: Re: TN Photoresist stripping costs
X-To: "G. SIDNEY COX (919) 248-5024" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear Mr. McGregor:
I would like to submit a rebuttal and supporting data regarding the
benefits and cost of "feed and bleed" maintenence of the resist
stripping process, as they pertain to your questions D. and F..
STRIPPING
The "feed and bleed" mode of operation can be applied to both
proprietary and caustic chemistries. Based upon the dry film employed,
it is possible to measure, relatively accurately, the volume of
chemistry consumed per square foot of dry film being stripped. Once
determined, the stripper chemistry and the proper volume of water to
dilute the chemistry to within the operating range, can be added based
upon panel count. We have had success making frequent, low volume
additions of diluted resist stripper chemistry, on the order of 0.5
gallons of diluted chemistry (stripper at 5% v/v in water) every 20 - 25
panels. And I am assuming 18" x 24" panels with 70% resist coverage at
this rate of addition.
This type of feed and bleed system has been in use for more than 3 years
and successfully implemented with DuPONTS TM and PM series, ENTERECS
7200 series, and DYNACHEMS HG, GA, FL, and AX series. (I am sure others
have found "feed and bleed" processing applicable to other films as
well.)
Similar to operating developer on an automated "feed and bleed" basis,
there are several advantages including:
a) consistant speed of processing while maintaining stripping
performance;
b) reduced batch dump frequency and heat-up times; and
c) simplified waste treatment.
I will cite specific examples to clarify.
1. DYNACHEM FL, 1.3 mil
- conveyor length, 8 feet
- speed 51 ipm
- breakpoint 40%
- dump frequency, once per month
- surface square feet processed between dumps, @144,000
- COST (assuming 70% resist coverage) $0.0118/square foot
2. DuPONT PM Series
- conveyor length, 6 feet
- speed, 34 ipm
- breakpoint, 50%
- dump frequency, once per month
- square feet processed between dumps, @112,000
- cost (assuming 70% resist coverage), $0.141/square foot
3. DYNACHEM GA
- conveyor length, 8 feet
- speed, 60 ipm
- breakpoint, 55%
- dump frequency, once/two weeks
- square feet processed between dumps, @96,000
- cost (assuming 65% resist coverage) $0.0124
Each of the above systems employed continuous resist particulate
filtration during processing. Filtration is required to successfully
employ "feed and bleed" processing and is the MAIN FACTOR in lowering
the operating cost of stripping, and is also the primary factor driving
the frequency of dumping. Additionally, the copper concentration of the
resist stripper "bleed" was measured in each of the above systems and
never exceeded 14 mg/L.
We have also assited in the installtion of "feed and bleed" stripping
employing 50% w/w sodium hydroxide employed at 1.2 - 2% by volume. As
previously addressed in other responses, it was necessary to address
copper oxidation when stripping sodium hydroxide. While I do not have
the exact operating costs of this system, it was obviously less
expensive than using a proprietary stripper, as 50% w/w sodium hydroxide
is about $2.00 gallon. However, when employing caustic the rates of
addition must be increased.
WASTE TREATMENT
All of the proprietary strippers I am aware of contain monoethanolamine
(MEA) as a component. This material is defined as a complexing agent
(containing a single donor atom - "monodentate ligand") versus a
chelating agent (containing more than one donor atom - "polydentate
ligand" such as EDTA which contains 6 donor atoms). It is inherently
easier to waste treat complexing agents because they typically form
weaker bonds with metal ions. Depending upon regulatory requirements,
the bleed from a feed and bleed system can often be treated by primary
pH adjust. Factors determining if this is an applicable waste treatment
method included COD (Chemical Oxygen Demand) and copper regulatory
levels in your waste stream. Depending upon the gpm of effluent one
generates, it is possible to determine if the bleed can be treated
solely by pH adjust.
If it is necessary to treat the bleed separately, it is often possible
to combine this effluent with other alkaline wastewater streams due to
the low volume periodically generated. I am aware of one situation
where the bleed is combined with high copper (greater than 10 mg/L)
rinse water effluent and treated by membrane ultra-filtration. Because
the resist particulate is dosed into the system at low levels, the
resist particulate does not appear to adversely affect the holding
capacity or life of the filter.
I apologize for the long winded reply. Yet, because most pcb
manufacturers have unique and different requirements for resist
stripping, it is difficult to cover all possibilities. If you have
additional questions, please feel free to contact me.
Regards,
Ted Stern
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 12:40:39 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SGriggsy <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SGriggsy <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: tents
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Ernie,
Broken tents can be caused by the developer, but it may not be your root
cause. First check to see if the lamination pressure has been cranked up. It
has been while, so I don't remember the recommended pressure settings, but you
resist rep. should have that number. If you have white rings around the holes
after lamination, this is an indicator the lamination could be contributing to
the problem. Additionally, check how long it has been since you recoated the
rollers.
With that said, you need to look at the quality of the spray inside the
developer. If you have a Chemcut (with oscillation) then make sure the cone
nozzles all have the spinners inside so they don't shoot. If you have a ASI
(non-oscillating) then it is critical that the fan nozzles are clean and are
producing the correct angle of spray. For either type of equipment, be sure
the nozzles are clean, sized correctly (all the same flow rate), and do not
show wear. Additionally, if the equipment has a build-up of photo scum, it
can retard the spray angles, so be sure the equipment is cleaned regularly.
For all equipment a range of 25-30 psi should be plenty of pressure. High
temp. or/and high concentration can add to the problem.
Feel free to contact me with further questions at (612) 825-6113, or at
[log in to unmask]
Scott Griggs
Senior Applications Engineer
RBP Chemical Corp.
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 10:21:21 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET!
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I am against to change TECHNET as I am getting valuable information from
other areas which do not affect directly but has impact on my product quality.
re,
ken patel
At 11:17 AM 5/11/98 +0800, you wrote:
>Hi all,
>
>no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes too
>active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days and get
>a few 100 messages.
>
>I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub lists
>such as:
>
>IPC standard related
>wet processes
>multilayer
>photoimaging
>laminate
>etc......
>
>Any comments?
>
>Jens Behrens
>
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>
>
>
______________________________________________________
Ken Patel Phone: (408) 490-6804
1708 McCarthy Blvd. Fax: (408) 490-6859
Milpitas, CA 95035 Beeper: (888) 769-1808
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 21:56:56 +0530
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"S.L.N.MURTHY" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "S.L.N.MURTHY" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber Viewer
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear Mr. Guruprasad
I had this feedback from this morning. I suggested that we give you to
install the latest VIEWMATE viewer which we have with us. I have a CD and I
will try to get it across to you. You can load in as many systems as u want
and then return the CD.
The advantage of this viewer is that I can give u the designs we do for TI
in a format suitable for viewing the same on this as we use the high end of
the same software.
Trust this is okay with u
Regards
S.L.N.Murthy
ECAD Technologies Pvt.Ltd.
373/1a. 11th cros,, 2nd Block
Jayanagar
Bangalore 560 011
-----Original Message-----
From: Guru Prasad Raghanna <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: 11 May 1998 14:35
Subject: [TN] Gerber Viewer
>Hi
>
> I am looking for a gerber viewer for RS274X format.
>
>Also I want know if it supports Windows NT and Win 95.
>
>Can I get a ps file from the gerber viewer?
>
>Your help will be greatly appreciated.
>
>Thanks
>
>Best Regards
>
>Guru
>
>**********************************************************************
>GuruPrasad R
>Texas Instruments(India) Ltd., Phone : 91-80-5269451
>Golf View Homes, Fax : 91-80-5269456/5278776
>Wind Tunnel Road, Email : [log in to unmask]
>MurugeshPallya, Bangalore-560017 [log in to unmask]
>
>**********************************************************************
>
>################################################################
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>
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 14:18:00 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Charles Busa <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Coupon Req'mts.
We are a PWB design house with product to be built to
IPC-6012, class 3 req'mts. My question is.. are we
REQUIRED to include coupons on the master artwork ?
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 13:39:27 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Blake, Dave" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Blake, Dave" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Mentor Graphics Interconnectix Tool
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
> I am interested if anyone has had experience with the Mentor Graphics
> Interconnectix Synthesis tool within their PCB design flow for high speed
> applications. I am interested in feedback on the tool for its PCB layout
> capabilities, interactive editing and synthesis (autorouting
> capabilities)..as well as integrating the tool with Viewlogic schematic
> capture and Cadence Allegro layout tools.
>
> Dave Blake
>
> Mgr ECAE Physical Tools Compaq Computer Corp
> 281-514-9965 20555 SH 249
> Fax 281-514-9541 Houston Texas 77070
> [log in to unmask]
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 14:24:09 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Laur <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: CTE conversion
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
All,
Regarding CTE of laminate in the x and y. What is the conversion from
_value_x10 exp5 in/in/Deg C to PPM/Deg C ?
Does anyone use the PPM/Deg C values to spec thermal expansion properties?
Thanks,
John Laur
Rockwell Automation
Milwaukee, Wi.
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 15:17:46 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
S D T <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: S D T <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: epc show
Hello Technet
Looking for any information on the EPC printed circuit show in Weisbaden
Germany this September.
How many exhibitors are expected to attend?
Any comparison to IPC show or Productronica?
Is there a web site of all general information?
Thanks
-Scott
_____________________________________________________________________
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 12:26:13 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Brian Geijsbeek <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Paste Deposit Parameters
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
TechNet,
I am currently inspecting solder paste deposits using a 3D inspection system. I
am in the process of setting control limits for the boards, but I have had
conflicting inputs.
I have recently heard that deposits should be 20% of target for warning limits
and 40% of target for failure limits. Should the target be the size of the
aperture or should it be less? Is there an industry standard on paste deposit
parameters? Thanks for any input you can provide.
Sincerely,
Brian Geijsbeek
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 16:16:48 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Joe Reichert <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Joe Reichert <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: [CAD]PCB/SCH package under $10K
X-To: IPC Designer Council <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hello All,
I need to evaluate PCB/SCH packages with a price tag under $10k.
Any suggestions or recommendations are appreciated.
Thanks,
Joe
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
:::::
Joe Reichert
Lake Shore Cryotronics, Inc.
575 McCorkle Boulevard
Westerville, OH 43082
Voice: 614-891-2243 x238 Fax: 614-818-1605
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
Check out our web site @ http://www.lakeshore.com
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 13:24:48 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Crystals/Oscillators failure
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
We are seeing more and more Crystal/Oscillators failures and it's failure
analysis report done by manufacturer blames to handling. My questions are ...
(1) Does any one has similar crystal failure attributed to improper
dropped shipment during transit/ mishandling on floor and how the problem
was over come?
(2) Is there any reliability study done to evaluate g-force impact on the
crystal? Are those kind of data available from crystal suppliers? (well,
I am going to ask them but before that)
(3) I am getting crystal in tube and also in loose in bag. What is the most
secure way of packaging and handling of crystals/oscillators?
I will really appreciate any help in getting to the bottom of the problem.
re,
ken patel
______________________________________________________
Ken Patel Phone: (408) 490-6804
1708 McCarthy Blvd. Fax: (408) 490-6859
Milpitas, CA 95035 Beeper: (888) 769-1808
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 13:26:49 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: PCB Solder Sample: Solderability Test
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all,
I was talking about PCB solder sample which I am getting with every lot of
PCBs. Someone mentioned that it's for solderability test then I have these
basic questions -
1) Whose responsibility is to do the solderability test, fab house or
assembly house. Assembly house do not want to do solderability test as
they thinks that they should be getting solderable PCBs. And not being
turn-key supplier, my assembly house resist from doing solderability
test.
2) Why one should do solderability test and how often?
3) Is IPC recommend PCB solderability test to be done prior to assembly
process?
re,
ken patel
______________________________________________________
Ken Patel Phone: (408) 490-6804
1708 McCarthy Blvd. Fax: (408) 490-6859
Milpitas, CA 95035 Beeper: (888) 769-1808
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 16:28:40 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, BA754 <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: BA754 <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [CAD]PCB/SCH package under $10K
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Hey J.
You can try Protel, Accell EDA, or Pads Power PCB. All have basic entry
packages at under 10 K. There are some almost free packages, such as eagle,
that are in the 2 to 3 k range, but they lack some fundemental abailities.
Try to get a copy of Printed Circuit Design, there are many ads in that
publication.
Regards
David Ciufo
Nationwide Circuits
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 13:40:25 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ray Klein <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ray Klein <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: [Tn] Oscillator failures
X-To: "[log in to unmask]"@class.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Ken
I recently saw an issue with oscillator reliability that had nothing to do
with handling. Certain FOX oscillators have a MINIMUM power rise time of
about 15 milliseconds. Power supplies that came up faster than that caused
uncertain results. Has someone switched suppliers in an otherwise mature
product?
Ray Klein
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 17:10:11 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, QRICKQ <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: QRICKQ <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber Viewer
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Hi,
The Lavenir Gerber viewer has updates posted on the website
http://www.lavenir.com. For best results update your viewer after installing.
Ri(k
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 17:13:51 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Gagrani, Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Gagrani, Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Crystals/Oscillators failure
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
I have had crystal failure problem in our lines in past which finally
ended-up with crystal harmonics problem (wrong part mix-up from
supplier),. I had to dig a hard before reaching on to the conclusion.
You might want to get few of the parts tested for all their
specifications (specifically oscillations and harmonic disorder)
before mounting on to the board.
-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Patel [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Monday, May 11, 1998 4:25 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Crystals/Oscillators failure
We are seeing more and more Crystal/Oscillators failures and it's
failure
analysis report done by manufacturer blames to handling. My questions
are ...
(1) Does any one has similar crystal failure attributed to improper
dropped shipment during transit/ mishandling on floor and how the
problem
was over come?
(2) Is there any reliability study done to evaluate g-force impact on
the
crystal? Are those kind of data available from crystal suppliers?
(well,
I am going to ask them but before that)
(3) I am getting crystal in tube and also in loose in bag. What is the
most
secure way of packaging and handling of crystals/oscillators?
I will really appreciate any help in getting to the bottom of the
problem.
re,
ken patel
______________________________________________________
Ken Patel Phone: (408) 490-6804
1708 McCarthy Blvd. Fax: (408) 490-6859
Milpitas, CA 95035 Beeper: (888) 769-1808
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 10:34:27 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Lenny Kurup <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Lenny Kurup <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: SUPPLIER INFORMATION.
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SCO.3.95.980501112921.9620A-100000@emxmain>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Anyone with information on Versatech Imaging, please provide address, phone
numbers, etc..
Gratefully,
Lenny Kurup
EMX Enterprises Ltd.
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 17:30:46 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
JSSallo <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: JSSallo <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Colight
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hi All
Does anyone know what became of Colight.
Who aquired them. How can I contact them.
Thanks for your help
Jerry Sallo
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 16:55:17 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: FAB: CMI hand held copper thickness checker
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Hi all,
Just a question. I have been having problems getting my CMI unit to read =
copper thickness consistently. It has typically been reading low. For =
instance, the meter will show .0005 to .0006 of copper on a standard =
.042 thru hole but a section of the same hole shows .0012. The meter =
reads fine to the provided standard. Has anyone else experienced this =
problem. I should note that the meter was just calibrated a few weeks =
ago so calibration should not be an issue.
Ed Cosper
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 14:35:05 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"William E. Johnson" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "William E. Johnson" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: SUPPLIER INFORMATION.
X-To: Lenny Kurup <[log in to unmask]>
Try: Versatech Image
1039 N Main St
Orange, CA 92667-5404
714-538-9353
-----Original Message-----
From: Lenny Kurup <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Monday, May 11, 1998 2:18 PM
Subject: [TN] SUPPLIER INFORMATION.
>Anyone with information on Versatech Imaging, please provide address, phone
>numbers, etc..
>
>
>Gratefully,
>
>Lenny Kurup
>EMX Enterprises Ltd.
>
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 16:32:02 -0500
Reply-To: Boyd Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Boyd Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Crashing copper
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-version: 1.0
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Chris,
Great Western Chemical has a process called MRA-D that works very well at
droping out copper in solution. The copper comes out as copper metal. The
benefits are that generates very little sludge and is a very simple
treatment.
Please give me a call at (612) 688-8533
Boyd Anderson
Great Western Chemical Co.
Eagan, MN
-----Original Message-----
From: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Thursday, May 07, 1998 11:26 AM
Subject: [TN] Crashing copper
>I have a question about copper. I have a solution of copper nitrate and I
>want to crash all of the copper out of this solution. How would I go about
>doing this?
>
>Chris Coon
>Borden Chemical
>Kent, WA
>
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 00:06:48 +0100
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <[log in to unmask]>
From: Matthias Mansfeld <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
Subject: Re: Crystals/Oscillators failure
In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980511202448.00748acc@kms>
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On 11 May 98 at 13:24, Ken Patel wrote:
> We are seeing more and more Crystal/Oscillators failures and it's
> failure analysis report done by manufacturer blames to handling. My
> questions are ...
> (1) Does any one has similar crystal failure attributed to improper
> dropped shipment during transit/ mishandling on floor and how the
> problem was over come?
Please describe the failures: Won't work, frequencies shifted... ?
> (2) Is there any reliability study done to evaluate g-force impact
> on the crystal? Are those kind of data available from crystal
> suppliers? (well, I am going to ask them but before that)
Consider possible damage by ultrasonic cleaning. The crystal
suppliers should be able to specify allowed cleaning procedures.
Regards
Matthias Mansfeld
-----------------------------------------------
Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
* Leiterplattenlayout, Bestueckung
Am Langhoelzl 11, D-85540 Haar
Postfach 1143, D-85529 Haar
Tel.: 089/4620 0937, Fax: 089/4620 0938
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
Internet: http://home.t-online.de/home/matthias.mansfeld
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 18:30:56 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Tuan300859 <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Tuan300859 <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Crystals/Oscillators failure
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Ken,
I have experienced this failure before. The root cause is definitely due to
handling. The crystal/oscillator is a fragile component. It can get damaged
even in tube. The crystal will crack when drop from a distance of 5 inches
to a hard surface. My recommendation is to transport these crystal parts in
a foam pads , not in tube and definitely not in bag. And lastly, all
operators from shipping, stockroom, hand load, and PC need to be awared of
handling issue of the crystals/oscillators.
I hope this helps!
Tuan
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 18:38:08 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: PCB Solder Sample: Solderability Test
X-To: Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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--------------0B55E1B687CB3D21778381E0
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Hi Ken,
I would suspect that somewhere in your purchasing requirements (print, PO, memo, etc.) that a
solder sample is requested/required. Usually, a board shop does not automatically send a
solderability sample unless requested. I would find this out first.
As far as who "owns" the solderability processing, I would say that your assembly shop should
process it if they requested it. The sample sent from the PWB manufacturer is a "scrap" or
"extra" (Alright you board guys, quit your chuckling) piece from the lot that was built (should
be of the same date code). The reason it was sent is as a first article inspection tool by the
assembly operation. In the event that they wanted to profile their operation, check
solderability, or as a non costed piece for destructive testing, etc. It would do no good for
the board manufacturer to process the board at their facility since it may not be representative
of the assembly operation (flux, solder line, etc.)
I agree with your assembly vendor that all boards should be solderable, but being a board
manufacturer (in my past, honest life), Many accounts placed such a requirement on us for many
reasons.
If your assembly house does not want the sample, a discussion should take place with the
board vendor and delete this requirement. I think that If you talked with both parties, you
would find out why and if this sample is necessary.
JOHN WAITE
Ken Patel wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I was talking about PCB solder sample which I am getting with every lot of
> PCBs. Someone mentioned that it's for solderability test then I have these
> basic questions -
> 1) Whose responsibility is to do the solderability test, fab house or
> assembly house. Assembly house do not want to do solderability test as
> they thinks that they should be getting solderable PCBs. And not being
> turn-key supplier, my assembly house resist from doing solderability
> test.
>
> 2) Why one should do solderability test and how often?
>
> 3) Is IPC recommend PCB solderability test to be done prior to assembly
> process?
>
> re,
> ken patel
> ______________________________________________________
> Ken Patel Phone: (408) 490-6804
> 1708 McCarthy Blvd. Fax: (408) 490-6859
> Milpitas, CA 95035 Beeper: (888) 769-1808
>
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> ################################################################
--------------0B55E1B687CB3D21778381E0
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
<HTML>
Hi Ken,
<BR> I would suspect that somewhere in your purchasing
requirements (print, PO, memo, etc.) that a solder sample is requested/required.
Usually, a board shop does not automatically send a solderability sample
unless requested. I would find this out first.
<BR> As far as who "owns" the solderability processing,
I would say that your assembly shop should process it if they requested
it. The sample sent from the PWB manufacturer is a "scrap" or "<I>extra</I>"
(Alright you board guys, quit your chuckling) piece from the lot that was
built (should be of the same date code). The reason it was sent is
as a first article inspection tool by the assembly operation. In
the event that they wanted to profile their operation, check solderability,
or as a non costed piece for destructive testing, etc. It would do
no good for the board manufacturer to process the board at their facility
since it may not be representative of the assembly operation (flux, solder
line, etc.)
<BR> I agree with your assembly vendor that all boards
should be solderable, but being a board manufacturer (in my past, honest
life), Many accounts placed such a requirement on us for many reasons.
<BR> If your assembly house does not want the sample,
a discussion should take place with the board vendor and delete this requirement.
I think that If you talked with both parties, you would find out why and
if this sample is necessary.
<BR> JOHN WAITE
<P>Ken Patel wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>Hi all,
<P>I was talking about PCB solder sample which I am getting with every
lot of
<BR>PCBs. Someone mentioned that it's for solderability test then I have
these
<BR>basic questions -
<BR>1) Whose responsibility is to do the solderability test, fab house
or
<BR>assembly house. Assembly house do not want to do solderability test
as
<BR>they thinks that they should be getting solderable PCBs. And not being
<BR>turn-key supplier, my assembly house resist from doing solderability
<BR>test.
<P>2) Why one should do solderability test and how often?
<P>3) Is IPC recommend PCB solderability test to be done prior to assembly
<BR>process?
<P>re,
<BR>ken patel
<BR>______________________________________________________
<BR>Ken Patel
Phone: (408) 490-6804
<BR>1708 McCarthy Blvd.
Fax: (408) 490-6859
<BR>Milpitas, CA 95035
Beeper: (888) 769-1808
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--------------0B55E1B687CB3D21778381E0--
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 18:40:33 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Colight
X-To: JSSallo <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Hi Jerry,
They are still around and their exposure units are still as good as ever!!!
Try calling Etchomatic (Tony O'Rourke) in Massachusetts. If you can't get hold of them,
email me and I should have the number somewhere. JOHN WAITe
JSSallo wrote:
> Hi All
> Does anyone know what became of Colight.
> Who aquired them. How can I contact them.
> Thanks for your help
> Jerry Sallo
>
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 16:20:52 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Gregory S Bartlett <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Gregory S Bartlett <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Quick Check of TDR Impedance Accuracy
X-To: [log in to unmask]
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On a related note, does anyone know of a lab that can evaluate dielectric
constants of various materials to help determine how accurate our Impedance
formulae are?
Thanks,
Greg Bartlett
Teledyne Electronic Technology
Hudson, NH
603-889-6191
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 19:59:14 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Quick Check of TDR Impedance Accuracy
X-To: Gregory S Bartlett <[log in to unmask]>
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Greg,
Try Polyonics in Newburyport, Ma.. Ask for Fred Hoover. I believe he has the equipment for
Er testing. If you only have a couple of samples, he might do them as a favor. JOHN WAITE
Gregory S Bartlett wrote:
> On a related note, does anyone know of a lab that can evaluate dielectric
> constants of various materials to help determine how accurate our Impedance
> formulae are?
>
> Thanks,
> Greg Bartlett
> Teledyne Electronic Technology
> Hudson, NH
> 603-889-6191
> [log in to unmask]
>
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 20:04:44 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
W D Stewart <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: W D Stewart <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Trace Widths for PCB's
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BD7D18.0A9620E0"
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BD7D18.0A9620E0
Content-Type: text/plain;
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I'm looking for design information on the width and thickness of traces =
for a printed circuit board I am trying to design. It will be carrying =
220VAC at 8, 5, 2, and 1 amps and 120VAC at 4 and 1 amps. Is there any =
general reference guide that gives 'rule-of-thumb' guidelines re this?
------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BD7D18.0A9620E0
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.71.1712.3"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>I'm looking for design information =
on the width=20
and thickness of traces for a printed circuit board I am trying to =
design. =20
It will be carrying 220VAC at 8, 5, 2, and 1 amps and 120VAC at 4 and 1=20
amps. Is there any general reference guide that gives =
'rule-of-thumb'=20
guidelines re this?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2></FONT> </DIV></BODY></HTML>
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 20:36:43 -0400
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: ryan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET!
X-To: JB <[log in to unmask]>
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Jens:
Nay.
Ron
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 10:14:19 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
JB <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: JB <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Multilayer press - how thick unclad FR4 can be pressed?
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi,
I want to do some FR4 unclad pressing with a multilayer press.
How thick unclad FR4 can be pressed? We might need up to 50mm thick. Is
that possible?
regards
Jens Behrens
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 10:14:17 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
JB <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: JB <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET 2 - another point of view
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi,
wow - large response.
Conclusion seem to be 'too much too read - but leave it as it is anyway'
I might would participate more (and delete less) with more messages related
to my interest/knowledge. I really like to help - but once you are in the
'delete mode' most messages go without reading.
...but on the other hand a very precise header/subject helps a lot too. I
will keep that in mind.
I think IPC should consider ADDITIONAL mailing lists for certain sub
interests which are very specialized. I.e. I guess CAD is mainly read by
designers and pre production people....
Don't get me wrong - it's good to have a 'technet' in the first place and I
got some very good responses to some very technical question.
Jens Behrens
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 20:35:56 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ralph Hersey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ralph Hersey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Trace Widths for PCB's
X-To: W D Stewart <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
W D Stewart wrote:
>
> I'm looking for design information on the width and thickness of
> traces for a printed circuit board I am trying to design. It will be
> carrying 220VAC at 8, 5, 2, and 1 amps and 120VAC at 4 and 1 amps. Is
> there any general reference guide that gives 'rule-of-thumb'
> guidelines re this?
>
The conductor's cross-sectional area requirements can be obtained from
IPC-D-275, Table 3-4, or IPC-2221, Table 6-4. Or better yet, visit the
website of UltraCAD Design Inc, <http:\\ultracad.com>, Doug Brooks has
done an excellent job in developing and making available a model for
calculating the conductor cross-sectional area requirements for limiting
the thermal rise above ambient. These models will replicate the above
referenced IPC charts and have been extended (by some addition
referenced technical papers) or get ahold of the latest copy of Printed
Circuits Design magazine, his technical paper and model is in his
column.
The other concern you've got is voltage, simply stated, you can use the
IPC design conductor spacing tables ---- but I suspect for the above
application they may not be suitable. This is because the voltage 220 &
120 Vac are electrical "primary power", and are subject to regulatory
requirements (UL, CSA, VDE, IEC, etc) and they have different conductor
spacing requirements for "exposed" conductor spacing. In the USA, 220
and 120 Vac are the same voltage with respect to neutral and ground (120
Vac). As I recall, for USA the requirement was 1.5 kV + twice the
applied voltage (1.5 + 2 * 120) or 1750 Vac test voltage and spacing.
If you want/need, I can dig in my files and come up with the spec.
requirements. I seem to recall the Eurpoean requirements were like
about 2.5 kV.
Hope this helps, if you need more info. (if other technetters don't
respond with addition a info.) drop me an e-mail
Ralph Hersey
Ralph Hersey & Associates
3885 Mills Way
Livermore, CA 94550-3319
PHN/FAX: 925.454.9805
e-mail: [log in to unmask]
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 23:54:20 -0400
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Andy Magee <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: CTE Conversion
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
John,
1 ppm/C = 0.000001 in/in/C = 0.000001 mm/mm/C
If you're going to spec. the laminate CTE make sure you also specify the
required temperature range. My experience with flex circuit materials is
that the standard deviation of CTE measurements for any given sample is
large. Specifying CTE could be practically meaningless, so make sure you
work out the procedure with your suppliers, and do a measurement
capability study first.
Andy Magee
Unemployed Flex Guru
[log in to unmask]
(937) 435-3629
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 21:03:07 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ralph Hersey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ralph Hersey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: stop TECHNET
X-To: "Dave Pick -\"process engineer\"" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Dave Pick -"process engineer" wrote:
>
Snipped all--
Thanks Dave for such a stimulating subject--
I'm with the majority- IMO, technet as a "combined" group provides the
type of cross-communication of requirements, problems, problem solving,
and concerns that we need in our industry. I believe that in today's
work environment, we can't limit our focus to only one or two areas of
technology. If a person is a designer, there is more to it than
generating product definition data; if a printed board manufacturer some
knowledge of design, materials and assembly is needed; and if a printed
board assembler, all down- and up-stream information/requirements will
aid in assembing a better product.
I believe the reason technet is so successful is because we've got a
bunch of people willing to freely share and cross-pollinate us with
information in all of our inter-related disciplines, such as materials,
design, manufacturing, assembly, test, reliability, to identify a few.
Yes, it is a lot of stuff to read or delete, but some of it (even the
subject titles) may "rub-off" in our personal memory data file; and
someday, you may be able to say, "Ah!!! yes, I seem to remember
something about this sometime ago on technet"
Ralph
Ralph Hersey & Associates
3885 Mills Way
Livermore, CA 94550-3319
PHN/FAX: 925.454.9805
e-mail: [log in to unmask]
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 23:57:11 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mark Ross <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mark Ross <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [CAD]PCB/SCH package under $10K
X-To: Joe Reichert <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Joe,
Accel Technologies, Protel, ORCAD, and PADS all have packages under 10k. Pick up not only a copy
of pcb design, but also think about attending their fall conference/trade show in Boston in the
September/October timeframe. Also find the user group list servers for those products and
subscribe to see not only the good point but more importantly the bad point. All of the major
vendors have web sites that will lead you to their list server.
Mark Ross
Joe Reichert wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> I need to evaluate PCB/SCH packages with a price tag under $10k.
> Any suggestions or recommendations are appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
> Joe
> ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
> :::::
> Joe Reichert
> Lake Shore Cryotronics, Inc.
> 575 McCorkle Boulevard
> Westerville, OH 43082
> Voice: 614-891-2243 x238 Fax: 614-818-1605
> E-mail: [log in to unmask]
> Check out our web site @ http://www.lakeshore.com
>
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 17:25:12 PST
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Clive Ffitch <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Maximum FR4 operating temperature
Sam,
you wrote:
>I have an application with a maximum ambient temperature of 70C. I am
>using copper planes on FR4 to help cool some power resistor leads.
>The copper planes can hit 115C. Is this a problem? Is there a rule of
>thumb on how hot FR4 can continuously be operated at?
How about specifying a higher Tg (glass transition temperature) epoxy
glass eg 135C? Our suppliers tell us this is commonly available at
similar cost, and Tg is one of the best ways to specify epoxy glass
boards these days - after all, not all epoxy glass is FR4. We would
not want to design 120C/125C Tg epoxy glass for anything over 110C
operating temp.
Hope this helps,
Clive ffitch
MBUK
Stevenage, England
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 10:02:44 +0200
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "[log in to unmask]"
<[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Ericsson Radio Systems AB Kumla
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET!
X-To: JB <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
JB wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes too
> active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days and get
> a few 100 messages.
>
> I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub lists
> such as:
>
> IPC standard related
> wet processes
> multilayer
> photoimaging
> laminate
> etc......
>
> Any comments?
>
> Jens Behrens
>
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Hi Jens
I agree with you totally.
Peter
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 16:01:57 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Eddy <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Eddy <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: advice/recommendations FOR TRAINING PCB TECHNICIAN
MIME-Version: 1.0
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HI,
WE NEED TO HAVE STAFF TRAINING FOR OUR NEW FACTORY,PLEASE advice OR recommendations FOR TRAINING PCB TECHNICIAN .
THANKS IN ADVANCE
EDDY CHEN
EVERGREEN HITECH CONSULTANTS LTD.
TEL:886-2-27667722 FAX:886-2-27630734
E-MAIL: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 08:50:50 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Philip Stoten <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Philip Stoten <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: EPCmail
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
EPCmail - Electronic Newsletter - May issue
European PCB Convention - Wiesbaden - Germany - September 29th to =
October 1st
Along with the tens of thousands of =B3Convention News=B2 being sent =
out, the EPC Event Management team will now be producing a more =
regular update of progress on the show to be distributed digitally. =
This document will provide up to the minute data and will be =
circulated to anyone wishing to receive it. We would be grateful if =
you could also forward it to anyone you feel may benefit.
If you received this and wish to forward it to any other parties =
please do so, if you received this forwarded and would like to ensure =
that you get future issues please drop us an Email with your details =
so we can add your name to the recipient list.
------------------------------ EVENT UPDATE =
-----------------------------------
This year sees the inaugural European PCB Convention, the most talked =
about event in this year=B9s PCB calendar. The event seems assured =
of success with well over 150 companies represented at the exhibition =
and the entire 6000 square metres of stand space sold out.
Encouraging indeed is the high level of commitment shown by the =
exhibitors with many companies booking large stands rather than =
adopting a wait and see approach. This is testament to the fact that =
the show has been set up by the industry for the industry. This =
edict is the foundation of the show planning with many factors =
driving towards producing an event that not only offers the visitor =
the best possible value for his time but also offers the exhibitor =
the best value for his money.
Exhibitor List - May 98
ACS Industries
Adam Pill
Aismalibar SA
Alfachimici
Alphamat
AOI International
Argon
Arlon Inc
August Krempel Soehne
B Bacher
Barco
Bieffebi SPA
Bipiemme
BLT Circuit Services
BMS H Haller
C A Picard
CAB EL
Camtek
Cedal
CCI Eurolam
CEMA Group
Chemring
Ching Kuang Chemical
CIBA Speciality Chemicals
Cimatec
Cimnet Information
Cirgraphics
CMI International
Coates
Cugher
Depeltronik
Dexter
Dimensione Circuiti
Ditron
DuPont
EIE Systems GmbH
Electra Polymers
Electro Scientific
Elektrotech Services
Elga Ronal
Elkem
Enthone OMI
ETEC
Excellon Europa
Fastek
FLG Gr=FCnewald
FSL Deutschland
Gabriel Benmajor
Gerber Systems
GSPK Engineering
GTB
G=FCnther Stracker
Heart
Holders Technology
Imaro GmbH
Integritest
International Supplies
Isola
ITC Intercircuit
KSM International
Lamitel
Lea Ronal
Lippert
Lloyd Doyle
Lumonics
M D Test Systems
MacDermid
Mania
Maschinfabrik La=FCffer
MEC Europe
Morton International
Multiline Europe LP
Nan Ya
Nelco International
New Systems
Nubal Electronics
Occleppo
Orbotech
Orc Electronic Products
Orc Manufacturing
Ormecon
Program Data International
Peter Jordon
PIAD
Piergiacomi
Pluritec Italia
Pola e Massa
Posalux SA
PMD (UK)
Polar Instruments
Polyclad Europe
Probetest Systems
Process Automation
Process Equipment
Ramasa
Resco
Robert B=FCrkle
Rogers
Romar Technologies
R=F6ntgenanalytik
Schmoll Maschinen
Seica
Serfilco
Shipley Europe
Sobreca International
Softwires
Stork GmbH
Systronic
T Tech
TCI Sarl
Technofor
Technolam
Teknek
Temec
Univertical Corporation
Valor Computer Systems
Vantage Circuit Products
Vertos
Von Roll Isola
Viking Test Services
Vitech International
Westwind
W H Brady
Yamauchi
The combination of exhibition, conference and workshops is what makes =
EPC 98 an event that just cannot be missed.
The conference programme is also shaping up well with exciting papers =
being offered by a number of companies and individuals from around =
the world. Papers offered so far include many at the leading edge of =
technology as well as those offering an insight into the management =
and commercial drivers that are bound to affect the PCB industry over =
the coming months and years. EPC believe that a strong conference is =
one of the cornerstones of the convention=B9s success and expect to =
field a first class programme when it is announced in early June.
The quality of the papers already received is exceptional and it =
seems clear that the event will be a must for any professional =
wanting to get a view of the industry as it stands in 1998 and as it =
will be in the future. Papers will be presented on the technologies =
of today and those planned for the future. With developments like =
microvia and laser drilling entering the industry at such a high =
speed, many of these papers will be essential listening.
As well as excellent technical papers a number of papers will be =
presented that cover the commercial and ever more corporate world in =
which the PCB industry finds itself. Against the backdrop of a year =
where acquisitions have been rife, EPC=B9s conference papers will =
seek to answer some of the burning questions with presentations at =
the highest level.
Clearly management, commercial and technical drivers are all on the =
agenda at EPC 98.
The third corner to the EPC triangle is the workshops. EPC is =
committied to offering an event that not only tells you about the =
industry, not only shows you what is going on in the industry but =
also asks your opinion on the industry and asks you to take part in =
shaping the future of the industry.
By providing innovative workshops with well respected and skilled =
chairpersons, EPC will be an event that not only reflects the =
industry but also affects the industry. The only way to ensure that =
you do not miss the opportunity to be heard, is to take part in the =
workshops provided in Wiesbaden this year. Subject matters will =
again be drawn from technology, commerce and management with many =
subjects ripped open and dissected in detail amongst the people who =
will bring the future closer to the present.
------------------------------ PRESS RELEASES =
-----------------------------------
Press Releases - 5th May 98
1. EPC 98 - A sell out exhibition
At the end of April 1998 EFIP (European Federation for Interconnect =
and Packaging) was pleased to announce that demand for exhibition =
space at Wiesbaden has been considerable and the show is now sold =
out. This years inaugural European PCB Convention (EPC 98) has over =
6000 square metres of stand space and following a couple of months of =
concentrated effort the halls are now full and the show is assured of =
success.
The European PCB Convention will occupy five halls at the Rhein Main =
Hallen in Wiesbaden Germany. As the primary European event in the =
PCB industry in 98, it will prove an essential choice for any =
professional keen to keep in touch with developments in this fast =
moving market.
As well as the ability to see Europe=B9s industry gathered in one =
spot and the clear networking opportunity that will present, EPC will =
have a three day conference programme and workshops that will allow =
delegates to gain an insight into the technological and business =
developments driving the industry today.
EPC will be at the Rhein Main Hallen in Wiesbaden, Germany from =
September 29th to October 1st. To receive more information contact =
the Event Manager, Philip Stoten.
Tel: +44 1223 423308
Fax: +44 1223 423371
Email: [log in to unmask]
2. EPC Event Manager apologises for dates clashing with =B3Yom =
Kippur=B2
Philip Stoten, Event Manager for this years inaugural European PCB =
Convention would like to formally apologise on behalf of EFIP, the =
event owners for arranging the event over this years Yom Kippur.
This was clearly an oversight on the part of the event organisers and =
should not have happened. The PCB industry is clearly now =
international and consideration must be given to the needs of all =
peoples and cultures.
EPC have undertaken to identify a synagogue appropriate to the area =
and will be meeting with members of the Jewish community to see what =
can be done to make it possible for this problem to be resolved. EPC =
will also ensure that future events do not clash with any religious =
festivals.
Philip Stoten said =B3We must learn from this mistake and move =
forward with proper consideration to the needs of all of the members =
of our international industry. I am truly sorry that this oversight =
occurred and will do everything within my power to: firstly, ensure =
that future dates are selected with more care; and secondly, to try =
and make it possible for those within the Jewish community to attend =
the event.=B2
EPC will be at the Rhein Main Hallen in Wiesbaden, Germany from =
September 29th to October 1st. To receive more information contact =
the Event Manager, Philip Stoten.
Tel: +44 1223 423308
Fax: +44 1223 423371
Email: [log in to unmask]
------------------------------ CONVENTION FACTS =
-----------------------------------
Hotels in Wiesbaden
EPC has negotiated discounted rates at a number of hotels within a =
convenient distance of the Rhein Main Hallen in Wiesbaden. These =
rates represent a substantial saving on the normal rates and as a =
result of this are not higher just because an event is in town.
To get a form for hotel booking simply contact the EIPC offices in =
Switzerland:
Tel: +41 61 482 3900 - Fax: +41 61 482 3910 - Email [log in to unmask]
or contact the Event Manager. Exhibitors will find these forms in =
their exhibitor packs.
Hotels are filling up fast so do not delay in making your application.
Travel Packages to be released at the end of May
EPC are currently in negotiation with a number of companies =
throughout Europe to offer a full package for easy attendance at the =
event. These packages will include Transport (air, train, coach =
etc.), Accommodation, Local Transport and entry to the convention. =
If you have already booked your hotel when these packages are =
released don=B9t worry, you will still be able to take advantage of =
the excellent offers on travel and convention tickets.
These services are designed to make visiting EPC as easy and =
comfortable as possible.
------------------------------ LATE PAPERS =
-----------------------------------
If you have not as yet been able to send an abstract for a paper for =
this exciting event then please hurry. Abstracts are best sent by =
Email to either the EIPC offices ([log in to unmask]) or to the event =
manager ([log in to unmask])
------------------------------ FOR MORE INFORMATION =
-----------------------------------
If you would like more information or just a chat about the European =
PCB Convention please feel free to call, fax, or Email Philip Stoten, =
the Event Manager:
Philip Stoten, Event Manger, European PCB Convention
4 Winship Road, Milton, Cambridge, CB4 6BQ, United Kingdom
Tel: +44 1223 423308 - Fax: +44 1223 423371 - Email: =
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 17:08:34 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
JB <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: JB <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FAB: CMI hand held copper thickness checker
X-To: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Ed,
a wild guess:
Is your board gold plated? Under the gold there is usually nickel which
will influence any eddy current measuring (such as CMI or FISCHER).
Hole and board thickness also plays a role...
Jens
>Hi all,
>
>Just a question. I have been having problems getting my CMI unit to read
copper thickness consistently. It has typically been reading low. For
instance, the meter will show .0005 to .0006 of copper on a standard .042
thru hole but a section of the same hole shows .0012. The meter reads fine
to the provided standard. Has anyone else experienced this problem. I
should note that the meter was just calibrated a few weeks ago so
calibration should not be an issue.
>
>Ed Cosper
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 13:04:41 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Reichart Arieh <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Reichart Arieh <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET!
X-To: JB <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi Jens.
You've read my thoughts. If aplicable, your idea is wonderful.
Arieh Reichart, Eltek Ltd.
JB wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes
> too
> active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days and
> get
> a few 100 messages.
>
> I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub
> lists
> such as:
>
> IPC standard related
> wet processes
> multilayer
> photoimaging
> laminate
> etc......
>
> Any comments?
>
> Jens Behrens
>
> ################################################################
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> following text in the body:
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> ################################################################
> Please visit IPC web site (http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm) for
> additional information.
> For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at [log in to unmask] or
> 847-509-9700 ext.311
> ################################################################
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 11:49:13 PST
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Clive Ffitch <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET (KEEP IT!)
Hi all,
I vote KEEP TechNet as it is, and agree with the sentiments below.
Speaking from an Electronics Packaging viewpoint, it is excellent as
it is - I'm interested in all subjects, although some of course are
more relevant than others; I copy messages to others where I work, and
they find them useful; and I also have no trouble with the delete key
- I'd rather have it and delete it than not know about it at all!
Clive ffitch
MBUK
Stevenage, England
______________________________ Forward Header __________________________________
Subject: Re: [TN] STOP TECHNET!
Author: "\"TechNet E-Mail Forum.\" <[log in to unmask]>, \"Eltek Ltd. -
Process Engineering\"" <[log in to unmask]> at INTERNET
Date: 11-05-98 16:01
Hi ,
This is a price of participating such forum .
From my own point of view , Technet is one of the ways to be updated . I
believe , that most of participants of Technet are active in lot of fields
of PCB manufacturing and I am convinced , that most of the subscibers will
ask to participate all ( or almost ) lists .
Just look on the row , that define the the subject . I takes couple of
seconds to delete unwanted message without reading it .
Regards
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 07:19:29 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Aric parr <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Paste Deposit Parameters
X-To: [log in to unmask]
The actual requirements vary with paste, aperture, pad, component, reflow
profile......
Try this experiment:
Modify screen printer (or use oversize stencils) so that you get 20%
and evaluate the yield
Repeat this at 40% and evaluate the yield.
Do a life cycle test on the solder joints and see if anything changes.
The data should indicate whether these parameters are accepable.
-------------
Original Text
From: C=US/A=INTERNET/DDA=ID/geezer(a)tc.fluke.com, on 5/11/98 3:39 PM:
TechNet,
I am currently inspecting solder paste deposits using a 3D inspection
system. I
am in the process of setting control limits for the boards, but I have had
conflicting inputs.
I have recently heard that deposits should be 20% of target for warning
limits
and 40% of target for failure limits. Should the target be the size of the
aperture or should it be less? Is there an industry standard on paste
deposit
parameters? Thanks for any input you can provide.
Sincerely,
Brian Geijsbeek
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 04:26:13 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mike Wilson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mike Wilson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Mentor Graphics Interconnectix Tool
X-To: "Blake, Dave" <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Dave, go to www.mentorug.org and post your message to one of the pcbsig
or other newsgroup. You have a better chance of getting a response.
Mike Wilson ( [log in to unmask] )
Design Account Executive
Praegitzer Design
1777 Sentry Parkway West
Dublin Hall Suite 407
Blue Bell, Pa 19422
Ph: 215-646-7710 Fx: 215-646-7753
Check out our Web site @ http://www.pii.com
-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [SMTP:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Blake, Dave
Sent: Monday, May 11, 1998 2:39 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Mentor Graphics Interconnectix Tool
> I am interested if anyone has had experience with the Mentor
Graphics
> Interconnectix Synthesis tool within their PCB design flow for
high speed
> applications. I am interested in feedback on the tool for its
PCB layout
> capabilities, interactive editing and synthesis (autorouting
> capabilities)..as well as integrating the tool with Viewlogic
schematic
> capture and Cadence Allegro layout tools.
>
> Dave Blake
>
> Mgr ECAE Physical Tools Compaq Computer Corp
> 281-514-9965 20555 SH 249
> Fax 281-514-9541 Houston Texas
77070
> [log in to unmask]
>
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 08:15:11 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Gagrani, Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Gagrani, Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET 2 - advice
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
A bit of advice for them who feel it is "too active",
Whenever you are passive , put a rule under your e-mail viewer so that
mails coming from Technet should automatically get deleted (or
filtered out), once you become active browse the archived Technet
mails to know the past.
Kishore
-----Original Message-----
From: JB [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Monday, May 11, 1998 10:14 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] STOP TECHNET 2 - another point of view
Hi,
wow - large response.
Conclusion seem to be 'too much too read - but leave it as it is
anyway'
I might would participate more (and delete less) with more messages
related
to my interest/knowledge. I really like to help - but once you are in
the
'delete mode' most messages go without reading.
...but on the other hand a very precise header/subject helps a lot
too. I
will keep that in mind.
I think IPC should consider ADDITIONAL mailing lists for certain sub
interests which are very specialized. I.e. I guess CAD is mainly read
by
designers and pre production people....
Don't get me wrong - it's good to have a 'technet' in the first place
and I
got some very good responses to some very technical question.
Jens Behrens
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 07:38:46 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Alex Neussendorfer <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Alex Neussendorfer <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Aperture Wheel ? P/N ?
X-To: Johannes Sivula <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Going on the assumption that you are supplying Gerber format data to the
PWB supplier, all this can be simplified by using Gerber 274X format, whi=
ch
has all aperture data included in the data file. In addition, the PWB
supplier has less chance for error.
Alex
----------
> From: Johannes Sivula <[log in to unmask]>
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Aperture Wheel ? P/N ?
> Date: Friday, May 08, 1998 9:06 AM
>=20
> Hi,
>=20
> Perhaps there is someone who knows what this is about:
>=20
> We tried out a new pcb supplier. The first protos were fine, and we
> purchased a bigger batch.
> Even these pcb=B4s looked fine, with an exception; All the pads were
rounded,
> so they haven`t
> used our apertures at all !!
> Rounded apertures are for my part OK, but question remains, how this
could
> possible happen.
> I asked this question and I got this as an answer:
>=20
>=20
> "The reason of the problem is human error. For any new P/N we loa=
d
> the Aperture
> Wheel in our Cad system in this case the operator made a mistake =
(
> didn't consider
> the shape 1-2).
> To avoid this problem on the future production, we propose:
> -Aperture wheel standard
> -Specific program-script to load the aperture wheel in automatic
way
> in our Cad system"
>=20
> Forgive my ignorance, but I don`t know what is:
>=20
> -P/N
> -Aperture Wheel
> -Which kind program-script is he/she referring to ?
>=20
> I am asking this because so far I haven`t got the answer from the
> supplier. I am just curious.
>=20
> Brs, JoSi
>=20
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>=20
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 09:12:26 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Miscantor <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Miscantor <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FAB: CMI hand held copper thickness checker
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
have done a great deal of work with customers the last month using these hand
held gauges - it seems in straight DC copper plating - readings between cross
section and actual reading can be off about 0.2 to 0.3 - on the other hand -
when dealing with pulse plated copper - gauge is not even close. I think this
could be the result of a different copper foil being deposited all together
and no reference standard.
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 09:16:56 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Steves <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <steves@[192.9.200.45]>
From: Steves <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: IPC-D-275 VS. MIL STD-275
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Can anyone sight the main differences in configuring coupons for pcb
fabrication between MIL STD-275 and the more current IPC-D-275? Any
feedback on this question would be greatly appreciated.
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 09:20:23 -0400
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Andy Magee <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Trace Widths for PCB's
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Ralph Hersey's reference to Doug Brooks (UltraCAD) program is excellent.
A few years ago I did a similar calculator for flex circuits (the heat
transfer is slightly different). I believe it's still available for
download at www.rogers-corp.com/cmu. If not I can send it to anyone that
might be interested.
Andy Magee
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 21:25:33 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Poh Kong Hui <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Poh Kong Hui <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber Viewer
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Try Website: http://www.graphicode.com/
Good Luck..
Poh
=====================================================================
At 02:17 PM 5/11/98 +0530, you wrote:
>Hi
>
> I am looking for a gerber viewer for RS274X format.
>
>Also I want know if it supports Windows NT and Win 95.
>
>Can I get a ps file from the gerber viewer?
>
>Your help will be greatly appreciated.
>
>Thanks
>
>Best Regards
>
>Guru
>
>**********************************************************************
>GuruPrasad R
>Texas Instruments(India) Ltd., Phone : 91-80-5269451
>Golf View Homes, Fax : 91-80-5269456/5278776
>Wind Tunnel Road, Email : [log in to unmask]
>MurugeshPallya, Bangalore-560017 [log in to unmask]
>
>**********************************************************************
>
>################################################################
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>################################################################
>
>
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 09:10:21 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ken Bridges <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ken Bridges <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: tents -Reply
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Scott has the right approach. I also find that proper nozzle maintenance
is essential to make sure streams are not formed from worn or abused
nozzles.
I alway recommend to switch to full cone nozzles in developing and
rinse, whenever possible, to reduce the pressure per surface sq in of
developed area. Even though cones may produce the same pressure in
the manifold as does fans, there is a difference on the actual resist
surface.
Ken Bridges
Morton Electronic Materials.
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 06:57:41 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Cash, Alan" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Cash, Alan" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: PCB Solder Sample: Solderability Test
X-To: Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
The assembly house should know what it is buying from the supplier. The
performance requirements should be spelled out in the purchase contract.
Solderability testing frequencies should be determined by the assembly house
based upon the historical performance of the suppliers. the testing should
be done as an audit function, not a 100% test.
The solderability test is usually done before the board is assembled. What
good does it do to assemble non-solderable pwb's? Using your soldering
operation for your solderabillity test is not recommended.
Al Cash
> ----------
> From: Ken Patel[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Ken Patel
> Sent: Monday, May 11, 1998 3:26 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] PCB Solder Sample: Solderability Test
>
> Hi all,
>
> I was talking about PCB solder sample which I am getting with every lot of
> PCBs. Someone mentioned that it's for solderability test then I have these
> basic questions -
> 1) Whose responsibility is to do the solderability test, fab house or
> assembly house. Assembly house do not want to do solderability test as
> they thinks that they should be getting solderable PCBs. And not being
> turn-key supplier, my assembly house resist from doing solderability
> test.
>
> 2) Why one should do solderability test and how often?
>
> 3) Is IPC recommend PCB solderability test to be done prior to assembly
> process?
>
> re,
> ken patel
> ______________________________________________________
> Ken Patel Phone: (408) 490-6804
> 1708 McCarthy Blvd. Fax: (408) 490-6859
> Milpitas, CA 95035 Beeper: (888) 769-1808
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 15:39:37 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Stewart, Dougal" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Stewart, Dougal" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: 300um capillary film for stencil making
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Could anyone supply us with Murikami 300um capillary stencil film or an
alternative. This is for use in making stencils for peelable soldermask.
Dougal
Dougal Stewart
Product Development Manager
Viasystems Selkirk Ltd
Selkirk, Scotland, TD7 5EJ
Tel: +44 1750 21601
Fax:+44 1750 22513
email [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 08:41:23 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
sahmad <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: sahmad <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Stop TechNet
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
IPC already has more than one forum. Many of the messages belonging to other
forums get posted on TecNet. Design related messages are one good example.
It will help reduce traffic on this forum if the messages related to other
forums are posted in the proper forum.
Syed.
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 10:43:05 -0400
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Richard W. Boerdner" <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: EJE Research
Subject: interfacial separation
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
howdy folks!
can anyone explain the possible causes in a manufacturing process that
would result in interfacial separation after thermal stressing of a PCB?
the temperature profile parameters are -40 C to +55 C with a 6 degree
per minute rate of rise and an hour dwell time at each extreme for a
period of 12 hours. the laminate has a glass transition temperature
rating of 170-180.
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 08:28:21 PDT
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Glenn Pelkey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Maximum FR4 operating temperature-related question
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Just thinking about your situation and some of the responses, I was wondering
how some of these limits have been established?
In relation to environmental testing, has anyone determined the acceleration
due to temperature? And, what is considered a failure? I was thinking this
should include below and above the glass transition temperature, even if it's
not a typical use environment.
Then one more twist, what about the influence of humidity?
Thanks is advance for any response.
Glenn Pelkey
Maxtek Components Corp.
| ----------
| From: Sam Mollet[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
| Sent: Monday, 11 May, 1998 14:25
| To: [log in to unmask]
| Subject: [TN] Maximum FR4 operating temperature
|
|
| I have an application with a maximum ambient temperature of 70
| =B0C. I am using copper planes on FR4 to help cool some power resistor
| leads. The copper planes can hit 115 =B0C. Is this a problem? Is there
| a rule of thumb on how hot FR4 can continuously be operated at?
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 11:39:22 +0000
Reply-To: Mcgarry <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <MCGARRY@[192.9.200.45]>
From: Robert McGarry <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: FAB,micro-via plating
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Can someone enlighten me on the requirements for plating a
micro-via? Are the requirements the same as for blind and buried vias
(type 4 pwb) IAW IPC-6012 table 3-2, or is there another spec.
governing this?
Any reply would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Bob McGarry
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 11:56:24 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Sherry Warner <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Sherry Warner <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Polyimid vs FR4
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Question:
Does the temp. profiles used to reflow double sided pcb's through a IR oven
on FR4 board material have to be re-established if it is changed to
polyimid? Boards will be baked out prior to assembly.
Thanks,
Sherry
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 11:27:25 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Ubl, Scott" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Ubl, Scott" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Stepanfoam A-206
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Hello,
Does anybody have familiarity with the above potting compound and how it
should be processed? Any details would be greatly appreciated.
I am currently looking for external sources who can process this
material. We have several electronic assemblies that must be potted
with the above material and we do not posess the capabilities
internally. A source that is in Wisconsin or a surrounding state would
be preferred.
Thank you,
Scott Ubl
Plexus
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 12:58:45 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
TOSTEVIN_BC <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: TOSTEVIN_BC <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re[2]: [TN] Crystals/Oscillators failure
X-To: Tuan300859 <[log in to unmask]>
Ken,
If you have access to some small grinding tools, i.e. a variable speed
Dremel tool or better yet, cross-sectioning equipment, carefully grind
down three of the four sides of the perimeter of the lid. If you know
which end of the package the crystal is in, leave that edge alone;
grind the other three. Once you just start to break through, use a new
X-acto, with minimum penetration of the blade into the case, to pry
and slice open the unit. Fold back the lid along the unground edge,
and use it to hold the part. If you watch your grinding speed, and
don't use water, you won't introduce any foreign matter into the
package, or damage the crystal.
Once you're inside, you can examine the crystal under a normal 30X
microscope and check for cracks and chips in the crystal. Sometimes,
the conductive epoxy used to cement them to the spring mounts, fills
the mounts - making them solid, which makes the part very vulnerable
to shock damage. Sometimes they're built just fine and as Tuan says
below, they're just too roughly handled. I've also seen solder shorts,
unsoldered pins, etc., which were manufacturing defects.
This delidding technique works well; I've done it many times. Try it
out first on a few parts that you don't care much about before going
after one you want to seriously investigate. Careful of the sharp
edges on the lid & package.
Bruce Tostevin
Benchmark Electronics
Hudson, NH
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: [TN] Crystals/Oscillators failure
Author: Tuan300859 <[log in to unmask]> at 0UTG0ING
Date: 5/11/98 6:30 PM
Ken,
I have experienced this failure before. The root cause is definitely due to
handling. The crystal/oscillator is a fragile component. It can get damaged
even in tube. The crystal will crack when drop from a distance of 5 inches
to a hard surface. My recommendation is to transport these crystal parts in
a foam pads , not in tube and definitely not in bag. And lastly, all
operators from shipping, stockroom, hand load, and PC need to be awared of
handling issue of the crystals/oscillators.
I hope this helps!
Tuan
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 13:06:32 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Graszl, Gerry (FL51)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Graszl, Gerry (FL51)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Stepanfoam A-206
X-To: "Ubl, Scott" <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Scott,
Have you tried asking the manufacture, maybe they can supply you a name
of a local company using the product. I believe it is made by :
STEPAN CO
22 WEST FRONTAGE RD
NORTHFIELD, IL 60093 USA
Phone: 847/446-7500, 800/457-7673
Fax: 847/501-2100, 847/501-2464
CAGE: 87570
SIC: 2843
Classification: HN - Nonmetallic Materials / Chemicals
Good luck
Gerry
> ----------
> From: Ubl, Scott[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 1998 12:27 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Stepanfoam A-206
>
> Hello,
>
> Does anybody have familiarity with the above potting compound and how
> it
> should be processed? Any details would be greatly appreciated.
>
> I am currently looking for external sources who can process this
> material. We have several electronic assemblies that must be potted
> with the above material and we do not posess the capabilities
> internally. A source that is in Wisconsin or a surrounding state
> would
> be preferred.
>
> Thank you,
>
> Scott Ubl
> Plexus
>
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 10:35:46 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: [TN] Crystals/Oscillators failure
X-To: TOSTEVIN_BC <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Thanks Bruce. May be I should try myself.
re,
ken patel
At 12:58 PM 5/12/98 -0400, you wrote:
> Ken,
>
> If you have access to some small grinding tools, i.e. a variable speed
> Dremel tool or better yet, cross-sectioning equipment, carefully grind
> down three of the four sides of the perimeter of the lid. If you know
> which end of the package the crystal is in, leave that edge alone;
> grind the other three. Once you just start to break through, use a new
> X-acto, with minimum penetration of the blade into the case, to pry
> and slice open the unit. Fold back the lid along the unground edge,
> and use it to hold the part. If you watch your grinding speed, and
> don't use water, you won't introduce any foreign matter into the
> package, or damage the crystal.
>
> Once you're inside, you can examine the crystal under a normal 30X
> microscope and check for cracks and chips in the crystal. Sometimes,
> the conductive epoxy used to cement them to the spring mounts, fills
> the mounts - making them solid, which makes the part very vulnerable
> to shock damage. Sometimes they're built just fine and as Tuan says
> below, they're just too roughly handled. I've also seen solder shorts,
> unsoldered pins, etc., which were manufacturing defects.
>
> This delidding technique works well; I've done it many times. Try it
> out first on a few parts that you don't care much about before going
> after one you want to seriously investigate. Careful of the sharp
> edges on the lid & package.
>
> Bruce Tostevin
> Benchmark Electronics
> Hudson, NH
>
>
>______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________
>Subject: Re: [TN] Crystals/Oscillators failure
>Author: Tuan300859 <[log in to unmask]> at 0UTG0ING
>Date: 5/11/98 6:30 PM
>
>
>Ken,
>
>I have experienced this failure before. The root cause is definitely due to
>handling. The crystal/oscillator is a fragile component. It can get damaged
>even in tube. The crystal will crack when drop from a distance of 5 inches
>to a hard surface. My recommendation is to transport these crystal parts in
>a foam pads , not in tube and definitely not in bag. And lastly, all
>operators from shipping, stockroom, hand load, and PC need to be awared of
>handling issue of the crystals/oscillators.
>
>I hope this helps!
>
>Tuan
>
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>
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>
>
>
______________________________________________________
Ken Patel Phone: (408) 490-6804
1708 McCarthy Blvd. Fax: (408) 490-6859
Milpitas, CA 95035 Beeper: (888) 769-1808
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 12:28:55 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David D Sullivan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David D Sullivan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Stepanfoam A-206
X-To: "Ubl, Scott" <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Scott,
Call Stepan @(800) 745-7837 or call Jay Harris @(847) 501-2349. That is
what my potting guy said to do. As for me, the only Stepan I know is
Stepanwolf (get your motor runnin'...)
Regards,
Dave Sullivan
Rockwell Collins
"Ubl, Scott" <[log in to unmask]> on 05/12/98 11:27:25 AM
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond
to "Ubl, Scott" <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: David D Sullivan/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
Subject: [TN] Stepanfoam A-206
Hello,
Does anybody have familiarity with the above potting compound and how it
should be processed? Any details would be greatly appreciated.
I am currently looking for external sources who can process this
material. We have several electronic assemblies that must be potted
with the above material and we do not posess the capabilities
internally. A source that is in Wisconsin or a surrounding state would
be preferred.
Thank you,
Scott Ubl
Plexus
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 11:01:34 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Joel Fillion <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Joel Fillion <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: interfacial separation
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Richard,
Interfacial separation can be caused by a number of things. First of all,
you must identify if the separation is occurring between the electroless
copper and the post or the electroplated copper and the electroless copper.
In case one, some possible causes could be:
1. If the rinse following your cleaner on the electroless line is not
adequate, you can carry surfactants into your micro-etch creating a
micro-polish. The polished surface of the interlayer post can not offer
the mechanical interlock of a micr-etched post. When thermal cycling a
PCB, depending on the cure level of the laminate, you will introduce
Z-axis expansion. In the case of under-cured "green" laminate, Z-axis
expansion can be excessive. Thus, introducing increased stress on the
interfacial bond.
2. If the aspect ratio is high for the holes that are experiencing
interfacial separation, there may not be adequate turbulence in the process
baths for the chemicals/rinses to do their jobs. Make sure there is good
mechanical agitation and the rinses are arranged to create a vortex flow in
the tank. If you are employing counter-flow rinses, from my experience,
the industry standard for flow is 2-3 gallons per minute.
3. Depending on the mechanism used for electroless copper bonding, the
"catalyst" for the system may not be performing properly. Check chemical
concentrations and bath lifes.
In case 2:
1. From my experience, the main cause for post separation where
electrolytic copper separates from the electroless is high organic levels
in the acid copper bath. Check for total organic content. Contact your
chemical vendor for recommended organic levels. From memory, I believe
anything above 1000 ppm can cause problems. If this is the case, organics
can easily be removed by "carbon treating".
There are other possibilities, but I think I covered the main ones.
I hope this helps,
Joel Fillion
Process Engineer
Matsushita Electronic Materials
At 10:43 AM 5/12/98 -0400, Richard W. Boerdner wrote:
>howdy folks!
>
>can anyone explain the possible causes in a manufacturing process that
>would result in interfacial separation after thermal stressing of a PCB?
>the temperature profile parameters are -40 C to +55 C with a 6 degree
>per minute rate of rise and an hour dwell time at each extreme for a
>period of 12 hours. the laminate has a glass transition temperature
>rating of 170-180.
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 10:56:28 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: IPC-A-600
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Does anyone know when the IPC -A-600 Trainer Certification class will be
ready?
How about the approved IPC JST-001 Trainer Certification class?
Thanks in advance!
Kathy Palumbo
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 13:20:39 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Admin Note: STOP TECHNET and other forum information
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Just a reminder that there are multiple forums hosted by IPC (DesignerCouncil gets a
lot of traffic related to CAD etc. and has a more focused audience.
Additionally, all eight of our forums offer THREE methods of subscribing and
receiving the information. The standard way is to receive each posting as a separate
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(1,000 lines is the low side of message size limit for MOST e-mail systems, but there
are SOME companies, free and smaller service providers that have tighter limits. The
Digest method won't work in that case because content will be truncated [cut off].)
2nd alternate is to receive a daily digest method with only the subject lines. If
the user wants to see something, they have to have to able to access the IPC web site
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if you can't access the world wide web for whatever reason.
Our web site has information on subscribing in these alternate methods. If you can't
access the www, e-mail to me directly OFFNET for additional info. Steve Gregory
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The MOST IMPORTANT THING FOR USERS IS TO PUT A PROPERLY DESCRIPTIVE SUBJECT LINE ON
THEIR MESSAGE. "Need Help" doesn't say much and the msg probably won't be read by
everyone. "Need help w/inert wave process" will get you lots of support from our
great troup of supporters.
We are proposing having a "Legends of the Technet" at the IPC/SMTA Electronics
Assembly Expo in Providence RI this October. This will probably be done in a "panel"
format like we did the first time. We'll be inviting some of the regular (verbose?)
technet posters/supporters to sit on the panel. Anyone interested reply back to me
OFFNET. (Electronics Assembly Expo replaces the IPCWorks fall technical committee
meetings/conference and the SMTA Technology In The Park conference and will include
assembly related exhibits. Reply back to me OFFLINE for more info.) Jack
Jack Crawford, IPC Project Manger - Assembly
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 13:15:54 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"LAMBERT.K.A-" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "LAMBERT.K.A-" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: tombstoning & unsoldered connections
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi all,
We've been working at getting an automated line up and running. We're
making one sided ceramic substrates. The substrates are both low
temperature cofired ceramic and thick film copper. Both have a 63/37
solder coating on the tracks. The substrates have passed
solderability testing with ease. The pads have been designed
appropriately to minimize tombstoning. Our components are solderable.
We stencil print solder paste onto the substrates. A robot places the
components. Reflow soldering happens in a Nitrogen convection oven.
We are using RMA solder paste (still!)
Now for the question. Why do we get unsoldered connections? Most are
chip components where one end solders beautifully, the other end is
sitting on a rounded mound of solder. The distribution across the
substrate and from one substrate to the next appears to be random.
To detect unsoldered connections, we are doing the old brute force
method of having manufacturing personnel looking for them after
reflow.
What are other folks out there doing to:
1. Solve the unsoldered connection problem
2. Detect the unsoldered connections
Thank you,
Kathie Lambert
Process Engineer
Northrop Grumman
Baltimore, MD
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 11:10:51 PST
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: FAB: CMI hand held copper thickness checker
We use a CMI PTH-100 unit. We found that on average the unit reads
0.3 mils lower than the microsection thickness as the panels come
off the line. However, if the same holes are measured a day later,
the unit measures very close to the true thickness. Right or wrong
we have attributed this effect to the room temp annealing process
that changes the crystal structure of electrodeposited copper. We
assumed that the resistance changes slightly when the crystal
structure changes and thereby changes the CMI readings. When we
"calibrate" we adjust the unit to add 0.3 mil to the reading.
Other observations with our unit: We created special "CMI coupons"
on our multilayer panels that have no internal pads. We felt that
the copper added by varying numbers of internal layers and varying
copper weights of those layers produced erratic readings (i.e. the
CMI unit would get much different readings on a 42 mil hole, 62 mil
thick, 10 layer M/L w/ 2 oz. copper internal pads, vs. a 42 mil,
62 mil thick, 4 layer M/L with 1 oz. internal pads provided they
were plated with the same amount of copper. I realize that it
would be better to measure the parts, but it is more important to
get a number can be trusted.
Also readings on panels less than 40-45 mils thick become highly
dependent on the parameters entered, whereas panels above this are
more insensitive to them. Ed, you didn't state how thick the
panels were that you were measuring. Also I wasn't sure if you
meant the errors you were getting have been happening all along or
it was a recent problem.
Randy Lyle
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: [TN] FAB: CMI hand held copper thickness checker
Author: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, at CCGATE
Date: 5/11/98 2:41 PM
Hi all,
Just a question. I have been having problems getting my CMI unit to read =
copper thickness consistently. It has typically been reading low. For =
instance, the meter will show .0005 to .0006 of copper on a standard =
.042 thru hole but a section of the same hole shows .0012. The meter =
reads fine to the provided standard. Has anyone else experienced this =
problem. I should note that the meter was just calibrated a few weeks =
ago so calibration should not be an issue.
Ed Cosper
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M,3@@9F]R(%1E8VA.971`25!#+D]21SL@36]N+"`Q,2!-87D@,3DY."`Q-CHR
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M("`@("`@('8Q+C%A*2!W:71H(%--5%`@:[log in to unmask]:F5F<GDN
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M($UA>2`Q.3DX(#$V.C,Q.C,T("TP-S`P#0I296-E:79E9#H@9G)O;2!G871E
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M($UA>2`Q.3DX(#$V.C,W.C$Y("TP-3`P#0I296-E:79E9#H@8GD@9V%T97=A
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M871E=V%Y/CL@36]N+`T*("`@("`@("`@(#$Q($UA>2`Q.3DX(#$V.C4U.C(P
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M,2!-87D@,3DY."`Q-CHU-3HQ-R`M,#4P,`T*4F5P;'DM5&\Z(")496-H3F5T
M($4M36%I;"!&;W)U;2XB(#Q496-H3F5T0$E00RY/4D<^+"`@("`@("`@("!%
M9"!#;W-P97(@/&5D0$=%24-)4D-52513+D-/33X-"E-E;F1E<CH@5&5C:$YE
M="`\5&5C:$YE=$!)4$,N3U)'/@T*1G)O;3H@160@0V]S<&5R(#QE9$!'14E#
M25)#54E44RY#3TT^#0I3=6)J96-T.B`@("`@(%M43ET@1D%".B`@0TU)(&AA
M;F0@:&5L9"!C;W!P97(@=&AI8VMN97-S(&-H96-K97(-"E1O.B!496-H3F5T
*0$E00RY/4D<-"@``
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 12:25:34 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
R Weaver <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: R Weaver <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: IPC-A-600
X-To: Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Kathy,
Contact EPTAC at 1-800-64-EPTAC. There are other training classes out
there. We used this one and are
satisfied with it.
Rich Weaver
---Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
> Does anyone know when the IPC -A-600 Trainer Certification class
will be
> ready?
>
> How about the approved IPC JST-001 Trainer Certification
class?
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Kathy Palumbo
>
>
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 12:32:39 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Curtis Lustig <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Curtis Lustig <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Admin Note: STOP TECHNET and other forum information -Reply
Jack,
Where will the Fall technical committee meetings be held this year, if
there is no IPC Works meeting?
Thanks.
Curt Lustig
Morton Electronic Materials
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 15:39:59 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Koleszar <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Koleszar <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: bga standards
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Does anyone know of an IPC standard for acceptability of
bga joints? These packages are not covered in 610, and I
was curious if there was a seperate standard covering them
or not.
thanks,
John Koleszar
k-byte
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 16:25:11 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
PBlokhuis <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: PBlokhuis <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FAB: CMI hand held copper thickness checker
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
In a message dated 98-05-11 17:41:39 EDT, you write:
<< Just a question. I have been having problems getting my CMI unit to read
copper thickness consistently. It has typically been reading low. For
instance, the meter will show .0005 to .0006 of copper on a standard .042 thru
hole but a section of the same hole shows .0012. The meter reads fine to the
provided standard. Has anyone else experienced this problem. I should note
that the meter was just calibrated a few weeks ago so calibration should not
be an issue.
>>
We have been using a CMI PTX-200 for years and have never seen the deviation
you are talking about. We do see some drift (on the order of 0.03 mils
typically but sometimes as much as 0.010 mils) and therefore we calibrate our
PTX-200 unit every shift.
Sources of deviation:
1. There is a setting on the unit to compensate for different copper
thicknesses, but these only affect the reading by perhaps 0.05 mil.
2. Cold temperature can decrease the reading by roughly 0.15 mils.
3. The large inaccuracy you're talking about would make me suspect the cross
section technique. Is this done in-house? If so, a sample submitted to a
testing lab might show that the problem isn't with the CMI at all, but with
the cross section technique. Which of the 2 numbers would you expect to get
based on your plating times?
Peter Blokhuis
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 16:25:46 -0400
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Richard W. Boerdner" <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: EJE Research
Subject: interplane separation
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
howdy folks!
can anyone explain the possible causes in a manufacturing process that
would result in interplane separation when the boards are thermal
stressed??
the glass transition rating of the laminate material is 170-180 (FR4-06)
and the temperature cycle parameters are: -40 C to +50 C with a 6 degree
/min rate of rise, on hour dwell at the extremes, and 12 hour total
cycle time.
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 15:50:07 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: IPC-A-600
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Kathy, the Official IPC Sanctioned J-STD-001B Certification Program is moving along
pretty much on schedule with a projected roll-out to be late summer. The Technical
Review Committee got a good look at it at IPC Printed Circuits Expo two weeks ago,
and offered appropriate enhancements to the developers.
John Riley, IPC's Director of Eduction, advises that the IPC-A-600 Certification
Program is on a similar track, and will probably be available a little before the
J-STD-001 program. Jack
---Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
> Does anyone know when the IPC -A-600 Trainer Certification class
will be
> ready?
>
> How about the approved IPC JST-001 Trainer Certification
class?
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Kathy Palumbo
>
>
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
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Jack Crawford, IPC Project Manger - Assembly
2215 Sanders Road, Northbrook IL 60062-6135
[log in to unmask] http://www.ipc.org
847-509-9700 x 393
fax 847-509-9798
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 15:47:10 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Copper Plugging Vias
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Address,
How many suppliers are copper plugging .008 finish vias, provided the
surface finish is OSP. Provide your answer(s) on finished board
thicknesses of .062 and .028, std tolerances. If so, what percentage,
nominal, are you able to plug shut. Through cross-sectioning do you
have the following conditions.
From my past experience the plugging of vias is not feasible using an
electroless and electrolytic plating combination process.
Cross-sectioning would later show a dog-bone effect. Does this still
hold true today.
Thanks,
John Gulley
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 16:28:26 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
scott <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: scott <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Colight
X-To: JSSallo <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Here you go Jerry:
Colight
825 Lehigh Avenue
Union NJ 07083
Tel: (908)688-0050
Fax:(908)686-3790
Email: [log in to unmask]
Give us a call and we'll let you know who your area representative is, as
well as answer any questions for you.
Scott Thompson
Colight Engineering
-----Original Message-----
From: JSSallo <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Monday, May 11, 1998 5:26 PM
Subject: [TN] Colight
>Hi All
>Does anyone know what became of Colight.
>Who aquired them. How can I contact them.
>Thanks for your help
>Jerry Sallo
>
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>################################################################
>
>
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 16:13:11 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ted Stern <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Circuit Research
Subject: Re: TN Photoresist stripping costs
X-To: "G. SIDNEY COX (919) 248-5024" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear Mr. McGregor:
I was informed of an error in my response to your question regarding
resist stripping costs. First, the cost of stripping DuPONT PM in a
feed and bleed application was misreported as $0.141/square foot. The
actual value is $0.0140/square foot. Second, the costs reported ARE per
board square foot as you requested, AND NOT per surface square foot. I
apologize for not clearly indicating the units earlier.
Regards,
Ted Stern
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 17:14:09 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FAB: CMI hand held copper thickness checker
Ed,
Are you using a handheld device (eddy current?) or a benchtop unit (x-ray
fluorescence). I have very limited experience with a handheld unit, but we
used to have a CMI x-ray fluorescence benchtop unit for measuring metal
thicknesses. Most of our errors used to be due to what (copper, no copper)
was in the layers underneath the area that we were measuring. We had to be
fairly specific where a measurement was taking place. We also would see
errors due to metal density fluctuations.
Are you sure that the copper isn't smearing during the cross-sectioning
process? Is it nickel gold plated? Do you etch the copper after
polishing? The differences that you are seeing seem to be large for
smearing, but I thought I would ask.
As an aside, one of the responses mentioned room-temperature annealing of
copper. At a past employer, this was mentioned quite a few times as well.
Does copper really anneal at room temperature? I was always taught that
annealing was an elevated temperature operation (deformed, stressed grains
are consumed and regrown). As a rule of thumb, recrystallization occurs at
0.3 to 0.5 times the melting point of the material (on the order of 325 -
525 C for copper).
There was a process called "Recovery" in my textbooks which occurs from
room temperature to ~300 C for copper. It involves the annihilation of
dislocations, reducing the internal stresses. Is this what's causing the
shift in electrical properties? I didn't mean to veer from the original
question, but this room temperature annealing thing has been bothering me
for some time. Can anyone explain the phenomenon?
I haven't been much help to Ed, but maybe I can learn something.
Dave Anderson
Medtronic, Inc.
Reply
separator------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi all,
Just a question. I have been having problems getting my CMI unit to read =
copper thickness consistently. It has typically been reading low. For =
instance, the meter will show .0005 to .0006 of copper on a standard =
.042 thru hole but a section of the same hole shows .0012. The meter =
reads fine to the provided standard. Has anyone else experienced this =
problem. I should note that the meter was just calibrated a few weeks =
ago so calibration should not be an issue.
Ed Cosper
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 00:04:51 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Graham Naisbitt <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Graham Naisbitt <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Stop TechNet
PLEASE can we stop this?
If you don't like to receive all the e-mails, then why oh why don't you
unsubscribe and check out the forum archives when it suites you? This forum
is probably the greatest location for information and help in the entire
electronics industry - don't spoil it!
Regards, Graham Naisbitt
__________________________________________________________________________
[log in to unmask]
Concoat Ltd
Alasan House, Albany Park
Camberley GU15 2PL UK http://www.concoat.co.uk
-----Original Message-----
From: sahmad <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: 12 May 1998 15:43
Subject: [TN] Stop TechNet
>IPC already has more than one forum. Many of the messages belonging to
other
>forums get posted on TecNet. Design related messages are one good example.
>It will help reduce traffic on this forum if the messages related to other
>forums are posted in the proper forum.
>
>Syed.
>
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>
>
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 17:10:27 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
john maxwell <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: john maxwell <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: tombstoning & unsoldered connections
X-To: "LAMBERT.K.A-" <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> Now for the question. Why do we get unsoldered connections? Most are
> chip components where one end solders beautifully, the other end is
> sitting on a rounded mound of solder. The distribution across the
> substrate and from one substrate to the next appears to be random.
Look for masking material between pads acting as a fulcrum.Once masking
material is about 3 mils above the pad metal i've seen the onset of
drawbridges which is what you may have.
Regards,
John Maxwell
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 16:26:35 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Joel Fillion <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Joel Fillion <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: interfacial separation
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hi Richard,
Interfacial separation can be caused by a number of things. First of all,
you must identify if the separation is occurring between the electroless
copper and the post or the electroplated copper and the electroless copper.
In case one, some possible causes could be:
1. If the rinse following your cleaner on the electroless line is not
adequate, you can carry surfactants into your micro-etch creating a
micro-polish. The polished surface of the interlayer post can not offer
the mechanical interlock of a micr-etched post. When thermal cycling a
PCB, depending on the cure level of the laminate, you will introduce
Z-axis expansion. In the case of under-cured "green" laminate, Z-axis
expansion can be excessive. Thus, introducing increased stress on the
interfacial bond.
2. If the aspect ratio is high for the holes that are experiencing
interfacial separation, there may not be adequate turbulence in the process
baths for the chemicals/rinses to do their jobs. Make sure there is good
mechanical agitation and the rinses are arranged to create a vortex flow in
the tank. If you are employing counter-flow rinses, from my experience,
the industry standard for flow is 2-3 gallons per minute.
3. Depending on the mechanism used for electroless copper bonding, the
"catalyst" for the system may not be performing properly. Check chemical
concentrations and bath lifes.
In case 2:
1. From my experience, the main cause for post separation where
electrolytic copper separates from the electroless is high organic levels
in the acid copper bath. Check for total organic content. Contact your
chemical vendor for recommended organic levels. From memory, I believe
anything above 1000 ppm can cause problems. If this is the case, organics
can easily be removed by "carbon treating".
There are other possibilities, but I think I covered the main ones.
I hope this helps,
Joel Fillion
Process Engineer
Matsushita Electronic Materials
At 10:43 AM 5/12/98 -0400, Richard W. Boerdner wrote:
>howdy folks!
>
>can anyone explain the possible causes in a manufacturing process that
>would result in interfacial separation after thermal stressing of a PCB?
>the temperature profile parameters are -40 C to +55 C with a 6 degree
>per minute rate of rise and an hour dwell time at each extreme for a
>period of 12 hours. the laminate has a glass transition temperature
>rating of 170-180.
>
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 09:28:03 +1000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Michael Yarrow <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Michael Yarrow <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [TN} Hybrid Circuit Pins - Thanks
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear All,
Thanks for all for your help !
Michael Yarrow
Design Engineer
Techniplan International Pty Ltd
[log in to unmask]
-----Original Message-----
From: Glenn Pelkey [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Saturday, 9 May 1998 1:13
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] [TN} Hybrid Circuit Pins
One more for your search:
Die-Tech, Inc.
(717) 938-6771
York Haven, PA
Good Luck,
Glenn
"Matthias Mansfeld" <[log in to unmask]> Wrote:
|
| On 8 May 98 at 9:29, Michael Yarrow wrote:
| > ...
| > My question is: Does anyone know where I can obtain strips of hybrid
| > pins (that I can supply to a hybrid circuit assembler as part of a
| > kit of parts for manufacture) similar to that described, but with a
| > wider section (1.4mm wide) that is 8mm to 8.5mm of the total length
| > (11mm) ?
| > ....
| NAS Interplex
| Flushing, NY 11354, phone (718) 961-6757, fax 539-9115
| http://www.nasinterplex.com,
|
| Proner Comatel, a French company
| US office in Danbury, CT 06810, phone (203) 791 9445, fax 790 9298
| http://www.pronercomatel.com
|
| I don't know whether all phone numbers are right, because I had
| contact always over the German subsidiaries.
|
| Regards
| Matthias
|
| -----------------------------------------------
| Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
| * Printed Circuit Board Design and Assembly
| Am Langhoelzl 11, D-85540 Haar, GERMANY
| P.O.B. 1143, D-85529 Haar, GERMANY
| Phone: +49-89-4620 0937, Fax: +49-89-4620 0938
| E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
| Internet: http://home.t-online.de/home/matthias.mansfeld
|
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 19:33:49 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Don Vischulis <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Don Vischulis <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Trace Widths for PCB's
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Just a couple of points from another viewpoint:
In my experience, the voltage drop (the product of current and resistance) through the conductor
becomes a limiting factor before the temperature rise above ambient. IMO both factors should be
evaluated. The IR (voltage) drop can be estimated several ways including taking measurements
from an existing design.
The other point concerns the regulatory agencies when dealing with higher voltage circuits. UL
has standards that deal with the application of the finished product. The particulars regarding
separation of high voltage circuits will vary somewhat with the standard. For example the
requirements for medical devices are different than those for office equipment. The governing
regulatory agencies should be contacted for guidance on this issue before committing the minimum
spacing on a board design.
Don Vischulis
Ralph Hersey wrote:
> W D Stewart wrote:
> >
> > I'm looking for design information on the width and thickness of
> > traces for a printed circuit board I am trying to design. It will be
> > carrying 220VAC at 8, 5, 2, and 1 amps and 120VAC at 4 and 1 amps. Is
> > there any general reference guide that gives 'rule-of-thumb'
> > guidelines re this?
> >
>
> The conductor's cross-sectional area requirements can be obtained from
> IPC-D-275, Table 3-4, or IPC-2221, Table 6-4. Or better yet, visit the
> website of UltraCAD Design Inc, <http:\\ultracad.com>, Doug Brooks has
> done an excellent job in developing and making available a model for
> calculating the conductor cross-sectional area requirements for limiting
> the thermal rise above ambient. These models will replicate the above
> referenced IPC charts and have been extended (by some addition
> referenced technical papers) or get ahold of the latest copy of Printed
> Circuits Design magazine, his technical paper and model is in his
> column.
>
> The other concern you've got is voltage, simply stated, you can use the
> IPC design conductor spacing tables ---- but I suspect for the above
> application they may not be suitable. This is because the voltage 220 &
> 120 Vac are electrical "primary power", and are subject to regulatory
> requirements (UL, CSA, VDE, IEC, etc) and they have different conductor
> spacing requirements for "exposed" conductor spacing. In the USA, 220
> and 120 Vac are the same voltage with respect to neutral and ground (120
> Vac). As I recall, for USA the requirement was 1.5 kV + twice the
> applied voltage (1.5 + 2 * 120) or 1750 Vac test voltage and spacing.
> If you want/need, I can dig in my files and come up with the spec.
> requirements. I seem to recall the Eurpoean requirements were like
> about 2.5 kV.
>
> Hope this helps, if you need more info. (if other technetters don't
> respond with addition a info.) drop me an e-mail
>
> Ralph Hersey
>
> Ralph Hersey & Associates
> 3885 Mills Way
> Livermore, CA 94550-3319
> PHN/FAX: 925.454.9805
> e-mail: [log in to unmask]
> snip the rest -------------------------------------------------
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 19:37:39 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Don Vischulis <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Don Vischulis <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FAB: CMI hand held copper thickness checker
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Check with CMI, they're usually very helpful. I'm writing this from home, but I recall that a correction for innerlayer copper thickness is also required on these instruments. Have you included that in your set-up?
Don Vischulis
[log in to unmask]
Ed Cosper wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Just a question. I have been having problems getting my CMI unit to read copper thickness consistently. It has typically been reading low. For instance, the meter will show .0005 to .0006 of copper on a standard .042 thru hole but a section of the same hole shows .0012. The meter reads fine to the provided standard. Has anyone else experienced this problem. I should note that the meter was just calibrated a few weeks ago so calibration should not be an issue.
>
> Ed Cosper
> snip ---------------------------------
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 20:39:42 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Fulton Feng <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Fulton Feng <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
X-To: Joel Fillion <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Hi
Has anyboy done any reliability study on Gold Immersion PCB finish?
Thanks
Fulton Feng
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 19:54:34 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: IPC Fall Technical Committee Meetings and EXPO
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
IPC's Fall Technical Committee Meetings will be held in conjunction with IPC/SMTA
Electronics Assembly Expo October 24-29 in Providence RI. We look forward to
technical committee support from member attendees of the Surface Mount Technology
Association that may not have been previously involved with the development of IPC's
Industry Consensus Standards.
Hotel rooms have already been blocked and additional information is available on the
IPC web site at http://www.ipc.org. Check the site regularly for new information.
With the coordinated efforts of IPC and the Surface Mount Technology Association, the
Tutorials, Workshops and Technical Conference are already shaping up to be a great
opportunity for professional development. The Exhibit Area is already being reserved
by some of the leaders in the board fabrication, assembly, supplier, rework and
training communities. Contact me OFFNET for additional information.
>>> Curtis Lustig <[log in to unmask]> 05/12/98 02:32PM >>>
Jack,
Where will the Fall technical committee meetings be held this year, if
there is no IPC Works meeting?
Thanks.
Curt Lustig
Morton Electronic Materials
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:06:23 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Motoyo Wajima <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Motoyo Wajima <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Stop TechNet
X-To: Graham Naisbitt <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <009101bd7dfa$f3663660$de40c0c1@z0002819>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-2022-jp
I agree with you.
Regards,Motoyo Wajima,Hitachi Ltd.(Japan)
Graham Naisbitt $B$5$s$O=q$-$^$7$? (B:
>PLEASE can we stop this?
>
>If you don't like to receive all the e-mails, then why oh why don't
you
>unsubscribe and check out the forum archives when it suites you? This
forum
>is probably the greatest location for information and help in the
entire
>electronics industry - don't spoil it!
>
>Regards, Graham Naisbitt
>_____________________________________________________________________
_____
>
>[log in to unmask]
>
>Concoat Ltd
>Alasan House, Albany Park
>Camberley GU15 2PL UK http://www.concoat.co.uk
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: sahmad <[log in to unmask]>
>To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
>Date: 12 May 1998 15:43
>Subject: [TN] Stop TechNet
>
>
>>IPC already has more than one forum. Many of the messages belonging
to
>other
>>forums get posted on TecNet. Design related messages are one good
example.
>>It will help reduce traffic on this forum if the messages related to
other
>>forums are posted in the proper forum.
>>
>>Syed.
>>
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>information.
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or
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>>
>>
>
>################################################################
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>
>
***********************************************
Motoyo Wajima
General Purpose Computer Division,Hitachi,Ltd.
1 Horiyamashita
Hadano-shi,Kanagawa-ken,259-13 Japan
E-mail:[log in to unmask]
Fax:+81-463-88-2935
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 22:37:54 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: ASSY: Reflow, Wave, and Cleaner Exhaust Issues...(again!)
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Hi Folks!
I hate to keep beating a dead horse so to speak, but I've still got a few
issues with the exhaust system I'm trying to set-up in our start-up facility.
I should say it's not me that has the issue, but others that seem a little
hesitant with what I want to do.
I did get some more quotes, and was able to cut that $11,000 one almost
in half...the latest one was for $5,960, and the gentleman that came out and
did the quote said that there shouldn't be any problems with the exhaust fan I
have...
BUT, I guess since this is one of the first times I've actually dealt
with the "nuts and bolts" of this stuff, a few other people that don't know
anymore than I do about these things, have gotten involved with this
project...talk about too many cooks in the kitchen! SHEESH!
If you remember, I have a Dayton 5,700 CFM 2-hp, belt-driven, centrifugal
ventilator fan up on the roof (that's less than 2-years old) that was left by
the previous tenants. They also left a large portion of the ducting inside the
building as well. We're going to have 4 pieces of equipment to exhaust; a
Heller reflow oven (500 cfm req.), a Soltec wave solder (700 cfm req.), a Trek
Triton IV cleaner (1800 cfm req.), and a Roilguard water evaporator (has it's
own blower @ 1600 cfm) coming off a ultrasonic stencil cleaner.
The evaporator is going to have it's own duct to the roof because it has
it's own blower. One of the "Guru's" here on the TechNet pointed out to me to
exhaust the evaporator by itself as it would lower my main fan efficiency if I
tried to plumb it in with the main duct, and that makes sense, so that's what
I'm a doin'...
But what seems to be not setting well with others, is that I want to use
one fan to exhaust the other three machines. They seem to feel that because
I'm going to plumb the cleaner into the same duct system that will be
exhausting the reflow oven and wave, the moisture in the air that will be
coming from the cleaner is going to somehow work it's way against the flow of
air, backwards, and fill the reflow and wave ducts full of water.
I know about the condensation that could occur, and how you need to
orient and position the duct run to prevent a problem like that from
occurring. That's exactly why I'm placing the cleaner right beneath the
exhaust fan, so that the exhaust duct will be making a shot straight-up thru
the roof (which is only about 12-feet).
The exhaust fan has a rectangular plenum beneath it which is around 2-ft
X 2-ft X 4-ft. The cleaners exhaust duct will tap into the bottom of the
plenum, and there will be one duct that will tap into the side of the plenum
and run horizontally with a very slight downward angle towards the plenum to
keep any water (if it should happen to condense in the duct) away from the
ovens...I really don't think that'll happen though.
This horizontal duct will run above the wave and reflow, and each machine
will have one duct with a volume damper that will tap into that.
Right now, I'm just trying to use my common sense with this project, and
I've worked at companies before where we've had multiple machines (reflow and
cleaners) sharing an exhaust system without any sort of problems. I will
readily admit that I'm not a HVAC engineer, but I'm trying to learn fast
though, I went and bought a book called; "Elements of Thermal/Fluid System
Design" and been studying that for the past few days and have learned more
about different fan types and figuring loss coefficients for duct elbows and
such, than I ever thought I would need to know. But I guess I haven't come to
the chapter yet that talks specifically about setting-up an exhaust system for
a printed circuit manufacturing floor.
Every book I've looked at talks mostly about air conditioning. I haven't
been able to find a book that was recommended to me by a Technetter called;
"Industrial Ventilation; A Manual of Recommended Practices" from the American
Association of Industrial Hygenists...
Oh, another curve was tossed at me today too. Someone had said that they
had heard that is was very detrimental to mix the exhaust from a cleaner with
exhaust from reflow or wave because the moisture in the cleaner exhaust would
react with the vapors coming from reflow and wave and then make some sort of
toxic substance...I know better than that, but trying to find something
published that says "It's okay to exhaust a aqueous cleaner, reflow oven, and
wave solder together in the same duct system." Is pretty tough if ya' know
what I mean...
I'm sorry I'm going on and on about this, but does it sound like I'm
doing things logically? Or am I way off base? I've called Trek by the way, and
sorry to say they've not been much help at all...
I know that if it were a perfect world and we had a lot of money I
would've said to pay the $11,000 and be done with it, but we're just starting
out and you all know how that is.
I would appreciate any feedback at all...and don't be shy, if I'm
screwing up let me know please!
Thanks in advance!!
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 23:29:49 -0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ruben Irizarry <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ASSY: Reflow, Wave, and Cleaner Exhaust Issues...(again!)
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Hi there Stve I am an HVAC/Mechanical Engineer I will appreciate to help
you if you will.
Ruben E. Irizarry
Mechanical Engineer
[log in to unmask] on 05/12/98 11:37:54 PM
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Ruben Irizarry)
Subject: [TN] ASSY: Reflow, Wave, and Cleaner Exhaust Issues...(again!)
Hi Folks!
I hate to keep beating a dead horse so to speak, but I've still got a
few issues with the exhaust system I'm trying to set-up in our start-up
facility. I should say it's not me that has the issue, but others that seem
a little hesitant with what I want to do.
I did get some more quotes, and was able to cut that $11,000 one
almost in half...the latest one was for $5,960, and the gentleman that came
out and did the quote said that there shouldn't be any problems with the
exhaust fan I have...
BUT, I guess since this is one of the first times I've actually dealt
with the "nuts and bolts" of this stuff, a few other people that don't know
anymore than I do about these things, have gotten involved with this
project...talk about too many cooks in the kitchen! SHEESH!
If you remember, I have a Dayton 5,700 CFM 2-hp, belt-driven,
centrifugal ventilator fan up on the roof (that's less than 2-years old)
that was left by the previous tenants. They also left a large portion of
the ducting inside the building as well. We're going to have 4 pieces of
equipment to exhaust; a Heller reflow oven (500 cfm req.), a Soltec wave
solder (700 cfm req.), a Trek Triton IV cleaner (1800 cfm req.), and a
Roilguard water evaporator (has it's own blower @ 1600 cfm) coming off a
ultrasonic stencil cleaner.
The evaporator is going to have it's own duct to the roof because it
has it's own blower. One of the "Guru's" here on the TechNet pointed out
to me to exhaust the evaporator by itself as it would lower my main fan
efficiency if I tried to plumb it in with the main duct, and that makes
sense, so that's what I'm a doin'...
But what seems to be not setting well with others, is that I want to
use one fan to exhaust the other three machines. They seem to feel that
because I'm going to plumb the cleaner into the same duct system that will
be exhausting the reflow oven and wave, the moisture in the air that will
be coming from the cleaner is going to somehow work it's way against the
flow of air, backwards, and fill the reflow and wave ducts full of water.
I know about the condensation that could occur, and how you need to
orient and position the duct run to prevent a problem like that from
occurring. That's exactly why I'm placing the cleaner right beneath the
exhaust fan, so that the exhaust duct will be making a shot straight-up
thru the roof (which is only about 12-feet).
The exhaust fan has a rectangular plenum beneath it which is around
2-ft X 2-ft X 4-ft. The cleaners exhaust duct will tap into the bottom of
the plenum, and there will be one duct that will tap into the side of the
plenum and run horizontally with a very slight downward angle towards the
plenum to keep any water (if it should happen to condense in the duct) away
from the ovens...I really don't think that'll happen though.
This horizontal duct will run above the wave and reflow, and each
machine will have one duct with a volume damper that will tap into that.
Right now, I'm just trying to use my common sense with this project,
and I've worked at companies before where we've had multiple machines
(reflow and cleaners) sharing an exhaust system without any sort of
problems. I will readily admit that I'm not a HVAC engineer, but I'm trying
to learn fast though, I went and bought a book called; "Elements of
Thermal/Fluid System Design" and been studying that for the past few days
and have learned more about different fan types and figuring loss
coefficients for duct elbows and such, than I ever thought I would need to
know. But I guess I haven't come to the chapter yet that talks specifically
about setting-up an exhaust system for a printed circuit manufacturing
floor.
Every book I've looked at talks mostly about air conditioning. I
haven't been able to find a book that was recommended to me by a Technetter
called; "Industrial Ventilation; A Manual of Recommended Practices" from
the American Association of Industrial Hygenists...
Oh, another curve was tossed at me today too. Someone had said that
they had heard that is was very detrimental to mix the exhaust from a
cleaner with exhaust from reflow or wave because the moisture in the
cleaner exhaust would react with the vapors coming from reflow and wave and
then make some sort of toxic substance...I know better than that, but
trying to find something published that says "It's okay to exhaust a
aqueous cleaner, reflow oven, and wave solder together in the same duct
system." Is pretty tough if ya' know what I mean...
I'm sorry I'm going on and on about this, but does it sound like I'm
doing things logically? Or am I way off base? I've called Trek by the way,
and sorry to say they've not been much help at all...
I know that if it were a perfect world and we had a lot of money I
would've said to pay the $11,000 and be done with it, but we're just
starting out and you all know how that is.
I would appreciate any feedback at all...and don't be shy, if I'm
screwing up let me know please!
Thanks in advance!!
-Steve Gregory-
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 08:00:56 -0000
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»¶ÓÄúʹÓùãÖÝÊÓ´°Ãâ·Ñµç×ÓÓÊÏähttp://www.163.net
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 16:02:34 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]P>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Photo tools
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Hi
Does anyone have an idea about photo tool production? I want to use DuPont
photo tools with KODAK chemistry, is it ok?
Appreciate any info,
Marco
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:21:00 +0200
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "[log in to unmask]"
<[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Ericsson Radio Systems AB Kumla
Subject: Re: FAB: CMI hand held copper thickness checker
X-To: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-version: 1.0
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Ed Cosper wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> Just a question. I have been having problems getting my CMI unit to read copper thickness consistently. It has typically been reading low. For instance, the meter will show .0005 to .0006 of copper on a standard .042 thru hole but a section of the same hole shows .0012. The meter reads fine to the provided standard. Has anyone else experienced this problem. I should note that the meter was just calibrated a few weeks ago so calibration should not be an issue.
>
> Ed Cosper
>
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Hi
The resistance is different between different kinds of copper deposit.
I have a UPA hand held instrument. I plate a board and punch out two
holes next to each other.One gets cross sectioned and measured. The
other one is used as a standard. I feed the UPA with the measured values
and calibrate.It gives me very accurate results.
Regards
Peter
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 08:18:17 -0400
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Andy Magee <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ASSY: Reflow, Wave, and Cleaner Exhaust Issues...(again!)
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Sorry, I'm no HVAC expert, but in the many flex shops I've worked with
I've run into a few of the issues you've been warned about.
Moisture (high humidity levels) can migrate upwind at a surprising rate.
Without a physical barrier it will reach into all parts of the exhaust
system.
Condensation can occur where you didn't plan for it to (usually at
joints in the ductwork), and after reacting with other chemicals in the
air flow, leak out over time.
We had one mixed exhaust system made of epoxy/glass that literally
disintigrated (poof!) when persulfate/water condensed inside and etched
away the glass. The replacement was PVC.
In another case, flux fumes from a roll solder machine, combined with
moisture in a common exhaust system to make a mild acid solution that
condensed and dripped out one of the velocity probe ports in the duct.
One system, installed in a clean room, was not interlocked properly, and
when the HEPA blowers shut down for whatever reason it would draw dirty
air in from the HEPA returns. There was also a problem with the power
exhausts on the photo-imagers pushing too much hot air into the common
exhaust duct, causing the fan to trip off.
A little less directly related to your question, we had one exhaust on a
hot oil refold that seemed to be slowly losing draw (over a few years).
When we finally decided to check it out, we found that the fan blades
were literally corroded down to the hub.
Good Luck,
Andy Magee
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 08:17:52 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: bga standards
X-To: John Koleszar <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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John,
Being work on by at least one IPC committee, one headed by Les Hymes. In
Washington we were looking at % joint voiding, among other things. I didn't
make Tempe and was at other technical meetings in Long Beach so missed
Les's. How far have we got, anyone out there?
regards,
Bev Christian
Nortel
> ----------
> From: John Koleszar[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 1998 3:39 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] bga standards
>
> Does anyone know of an IPC standard for acceptability of
> bga joints? These packages are not covered in 610, and I
> was curious if there was a seperate standard covering them
> or not.
>
> thanks,
>
> John Koleszar
> k-byte
> [log in to unmask]
>
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>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 08:27:08 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Karl Sweitzer <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Karl Sweitzer <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Image Acquisition Systems http://www.kodak.com/cgsHome/ias.shtml
Subject: Nonfunctional Lands: Do they improve PTH reliability?
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We typically use nonfunctional lands to improve PTH reliability for
our polyimide boards. This is based on NHB 5300 section 3K703 and
IPC-D-275 section 5.3.2.5
On a current design, our board vendor is asking to remove them based
on some recommendations he has heard in the industry. We are hesitant
to do this based on the above quoted specification.
What do you all think?
--
Karl Sweitzer voice: 716.47.77546
Eastman Kodak Company pager: 716.25.33681
800 Lee Road fax: 716.47.77293
Rochester, NY 14650-3118 mailto:[log in to unmask]
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 07:42:52 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jim Gryga <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ASSY: Reflow, Wave, and Cleaner Exhaust Issues...(again!)
X-To: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Steve,
I'd look at it this way. If you exhaust three of the four machines through
the same blower, and the blower goes down for some reason, now you've
essentially shut down your plant.
Blowers are a whole lot cheaper than lost production time.
Jim Gryga
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]> on 05/12/98 09:37:54 PM
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond
to SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: James A Gryga/Mequon/RA/Rockwell)
Subject: [TN] ASSY: Reflow, Wave, and Cleaner Exhaust Issues...(again!)
Hi Folks!
I hate to keep beating a dead horse so to speak, but I've still got a
few
issues with the exhaust system I'm trying to set-up in our start-up
facility.
I should say it's not me that has the issue, but others that seem a little
hesitant with what I want to do.
I did get some more quotes, and was able to cut that $11,000 one
almost
in half...the latest one was for $5,960, and the gentleman that came out
and
did the quote said that there shouldn't be any problems with the exhaust
fan I
have...
BUT, I guess since this is one of the first times I've actually dealt
with the "nuts and bolts" of this stuff, a few other people that don't know
anymore than I do about these things, have gotten involved with this
project...talk about too many cooks in the kitchen! SHEESH!
If you remember, I have a Dayton 5,700 CFM 2-hp, belt-driven,
centrifugal
ventilator fan up on the roof (that's less than 2-years old) that was left
by
the previous tenants. They also left a large portion of the ducting inside
the
building as well. We're going to have 4 pieces of equipment to exhaust; a
Heller reflow oven (500 cfm req.), a Soltec wave solder (700 cfm req.), a
Trek
Triton IV cleaner (1800 cfm req.), and a Roilguard water evaporator (has
it's
own blower @ 1600 cfm) coming off a ultrasonic stencil cleaner.
The evaporator is going to have it's own duct to the roof because it
has
it's own blower. One of the "Guru's" here on the TechNet pointed out to me
to
exhaust the evaporator by itself as it would lower my main fan efficiency
if I
tried to plumb it in with the main duct, and that makes sense, so that's
what
I'm a doin'...
But what seems to be not setting well with others, is that I want to
use
one fan to exhaust the other three machines. They seem to feel that because
I'm going to plumb the cleaner into the same duct system that will be
exhausting the reflow oven and wave, the moisture in the air that will be
coming from the cleaner is going to somehow work it's way against the flow
of
air, backwards, and fill the reflow and wave ducts full of water.
I know about the condensation that could occur, and how you need to
orient and position the duct run to prevent a problem like that from
occurring. That's exactly why I'm placing the cleaner right beneath the
exhaust fan, so that the exhaust duct will be making a shot straight-up
thru
the roof (which is only about 12-feet).
The exhaust fan has a rectangular plenum beneath it which is around
2-ft
X 2-ft X 4-ft. The cleaners exhaust duct will tap into the bottom of the
plenum, and there will be one duct that will tap into the side of the
plenum
and run horizontally with a very slight downward angle towards the plenum
to
keep any water (if it should happen to condense in the duct) away from the
ovens...I really don't think that'll happen though.
This horizontal duct will run above the wave and reflow, and each
machine
will have one duct with a volume damper that will tap into that.
Right now, I'm just trying to use my common sense with this project,
and
I've worked at companies before where we've had multiple machines (reflow
and
cleaners) sharing an exhaust system without any sort of problems. I will
readily admit that I'm not a HVAC engineer, but I'm trying to learn fast
though, I went and bought a book called; "Elements of Thermal/Fluid System
Design" and been studying that for the past few days and have learned more
about different fan types and figuring loss coefficients for duct elbows
and
such, than I ever thought I would need to know. But I guess I haven't come
to
the chapter yet that talks specifically about setting-up an exhaust system
for
a printed circuit manufacturing floor.
Every book I've looked at talks mostly about air conditioning. I
haven't
been able to find a book that was recommended to me by a Technetter called;
"Industrial Ventilation; A Manual of Recommended Practices" from the
American
Association of Industrial Hygenists...
Oh, another curve was tossed at me today too. Someone had said that
they
had heard that is was very detrimental to mix the exhaust from a cleaner
with
exhaust from reflow or wave because the moisture in the cleaner exhaust
would
react with the vapors coming from reflow and wave and then make some sort
of
toxic substance...I know better than that, but trying to find something
published that says "It's okay to exhaust a aqueous cleaner, reflow oven,
and
wave solder together in the same duct system." Is pretty tough if ya' know
what I mean...
I'm sorry I'm going on and on about this, but does it sound like I'm
doing things logically? Or am I way off base? I've called Trek by the way,
and
sorry to say they've not been much help at all...
I know that if it were a perfect world and we had a lot of money I
would've said to pay the $11,000 and be done with it, but we're just
starting
out and you all know how that is.
I would appreciate any feedback at all...and don't be shy, if I'm
screwing up let me know please!
Thanks in advance!!
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 09:02:34 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SIRGuru <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SIRGuru <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: STOP TECHNET
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I've been wondering when this would happen. This type of request happens
quite frequently in the larger newsgroups. After the usual flame wars die
down, the arguments come down to two camps: ones who don't want to handle or
sort through the large volume of e-mails each day; and those who like the
diversity and the cross-polination that it represents. I am an active
participant in a woodworking newsgroup (rec.woodworking) and that averages
400-500 posts per day, far more than TechNet and has over 30,000 subscribers.
The Split the Newsgroup suggestion comes up 6-8 times every year, usually by
people who are new to the group. Suggested actions include:
1. Get a better newsgroup reader that allows you to use filters or kill files
to screen out those things you don't want, or to allow only those things you
do want.
2. Subscribe only to the digest portion of the group
3. Unsubscribe to the group and check out the newsgroup archives when you are
interested in historical information.
All of these would be applicable to TechNet as well.
For now, the headings are sufficiently descriptive for me to go through and
quickly delete those message not of interest to me.
Doug Pauls
CSL
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 09:20:14 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: dual stropline
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I am looking to see if anyone has the calculations for " Dual
Stripline " controlled impedance in a spreadsheet type of formula. I
have all the others, but this particular type has just reared it's
ugly head, and we haven't done this board type before. I am just
trying to make sure that my calculations, and lay-ups are accurate.
Keep in mind I'm not a Math Wizard, hence the need for the spreadsheet
type of format. Any help will be deeply appreciated. If what you have
is not proprietary e-mail to [log in to unmask] with any help or
files. Again, thanks in advance.
Ernie Smith
Electropac Co. Inc.
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 09:27:50 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: HASL alternatives
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To All,
We are now making a comparison between different alternatives to HASL. The
chosen alternative will have to meet the following criterias criterias.
- flat coating
- compatible with No-clean process and mixed technology
- resistant to 2-3 reflow (multiple heat cycle)
-and MINIMUM 1 year shelf life (storage before assembly)
These are the alternatives we think can meet our needs:
* OSP
- Benzimidazole (?)
* IMMERSION
- Silver
- Bismuth
- Au-Ni
- Palladium
Q: Wich one do you think could be the best meet to our criterias ?
Q: And what would be its advantage(s) compared to the others ?
Q: OTHERS ? (is anyone using other coating alternative )
Thanks for all for your help
Nicolas van der Heyden
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 22:10:14 +0800
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Alvin Leong <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: NatSteel Electronics (M)
Subject: Solder Ball?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi Technetee,
Anyone experience the solder ball appearing in the no-clean process?
What is the contributor? I forseen a misprinted PCB on the solder paste
station is one of it.
1. What is the recommendation on the smear board cleaning procedure?
2. Ultra-sonic cleaner?
3. What type of chemical?
4. If an ultra-sonic is the solution, then what is the side impact to
the package on double-sided process?
Hope anyone can share the info.
Thks.
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 09:15:14 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Lolmaugh, Scott (AZ15)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Lolmaugh, Scott (AZ15)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternatives
All,
There was an interesting article in the February issue of SMT Magazine
(IHS Publishing Group) on page 56, entitled: "End Paste Defects with
Solid Solder Deposits". This is a technique where the PWB Manufacturer
applies solder to the board, then runs the boards through polished
rollers to flatten the solder coating into a flat surface roughly the
same height as the soldermask. Then a tacky flux is applied and finally
an easy peel cover sheet. They claim the boards retain solderability
well and the paste stencil process is eliminated.
There have been similar / identical techniques touted in the past, known
as:
"Sipad" (R) Siemens AG, (solderpaste application method)
"Optipad" (R) Viele Circuits Inc. and Burkle USA, (liquid solder
application method) and
"Precision Pad Technology or PPT (R) Mask Technology Inc. (solderpaste
application w/ textured finish)
If anyone knows of domestic (USA) Manufacturers offering this technology,
I'd like to hear who they are.
Thanks
Best Regards,
Scott Lolmaugh
SMT Production Engineering
Honeywell IAC, Inc.
602.313.3551 /FAX: 3402 (Please call first)
-----Original Message-----
From: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 8:39 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] HASL alternatives
To All,
We are now making a comparison between different alternatives to HASL.
The
chosen alternative will have to meet the following criterias criterias.
- flat coating
- compatible with No-clean process and mixed technology
- resistant to 2-3 reflow (multiple heat cycle)
-and MINIMUM 1 year shelf life (storage before assembly)
These are the alternatives we think can meet our needs:
* OSP
- Benzimidazole (?)
* IMMERSION
- Silver
- Bismuth
- Au-Ni
- Palladium
Q: Wich one do you think could be the best meet to our criterias ?
Q: And what would be its advantage(s) compared to the others ?
Q: OTHERS ? (is anyone using other coating alternative )
Thanks for all for your help
Nicolas van der Heyden
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 09:45:11 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Steve Collins <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Steve Collins <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternatives
X-To: "Lolmaugh, Scott (AZ15)" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Check out Mask Technology, Inc. They were at the recent IPC Expo. they have
a video that is available their number is 714-557-3383 or 407 857-1876.
Their process is called PPT Precision Pad Technology. . Their email is
[log in to unmask]
Steve Collins
----------
> From: Lolmaugh, Scott (AZ15) <[log in to unmask]>
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternatives
> Date: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 8:15 AM
>
> All,
> There was an interesting article in the February issue of SMT Magazine
> (IHS Publishing Group) on page 56, entitled: "End Paste Defects with
> Solid Solder Deposits". This is a technique where the PWB Manufacturer
> applies solder to the board, then runs the boards through polished
> rollers to flatten the solder coating into a flat surface roughly the
> same height as the soldermask. Then a tacky flux is applied and finally
> an easy peel cover sheet. They claim the boards retain solderability
> well and the paste stencil process is eliminated.
>
> There have been similar / identical techniques touted in the past, known
> as:
> "Sipad" (R) Siemens AG, (solderpaste application method)
> "Optipad" (R) Viele Circuits Inc. and Burkle USA, (liquid solder
> application method) and
> "Precision Pad Technology or PPT (R) Mask Technology Inc. (solderpaste
> application w/ textured finish)
>
> If anyone knows of domestic (USA) Manufacturers offering this technology,
> I'd like to hear who they are.
> Thanks
> Best Regards,
> Scott Lolmaugh
> SMT Production Engineering
> Honeywell IAC, Inc.
> 602.313.3551 /FAX: 3402 (Please call first)
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [log in to unmask]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 8:39 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] HASL alternatives
>
> To All,
> We are now making a comparison between different alternatives to HASL.
> The
> chosen alternative will have to meet the following criterias criterias.
>
> - flat coating
> - compatible with No-clean process and mixed technology
> - resistant to 2-3 reflow (multiple heat cycle)
> -and MINIMUM 1 year shelf life (storage before assembly)
>
> These are the alternatives we think can meet our needs:
>
> * OSP
> - Benzimidazole (?)
>
> * IMMERSION
> - Silver
> - Bismuth
> - Au-Ni
> - Palladium
>
>
> Q: Wich one do you think could be the best meet to our criterias ?
>
> Q: And what would be its advantage(s) compared to the others ?
>
> Q: OTHERS ? (is anyone using other coating alternative )
>
>
> Thanks for all for your help
>
>
> Nicolas van der Heyden
>
> ################################################################
> TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV
> 1.8c
> ################################################################
> To subscribe/unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with
> following
> text in the body:
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> information.
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> 847-509-9700 ext.311
> ################################################################
>
> ################################################################
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> ################################################################
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 06:55:55 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mark Simmons <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Stop TechNet
X-To: Graham Naisbitt <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
go get em Graham. its a little like someone who moves in by the airport
and then complains about the noise.
mark
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 09:48:00 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Perez, Raul" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Perez, Raul" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber Viewer
X-To: Poh Kong Hui <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
You can also try these websites:
Web pages for gerber viewers - software demos
Valor
http://www.valor-us.com
Advanced Cam Solutions http://www.ecam.com
Router Solutions Inc., http://www.rsi-inc.com
Lavenir
http://www.lavenir.com
Web page for drill to gerber - software demo
DynaCad
http://www.aranet.com/~dynacad
Web page for board panelization - software demo
Micromeg
http://www.micromeg.com
good luck
rperezjr
<><
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Poh Kong Hui [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 1998 8:26 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Gerber Viewer
>
> Try Website: http://www.graphicode.com/
>
>
> Good Luck..
>
>
>
> Poh
>
> =====================================================================
>
>
> At 02:17 PM 5/11/98 +0530, you wrote:
> >Hi
> >
> > I am looking for a gerber viewer for RS274X format.
> >
> >Also I want know if it supports Windows NT and Win 95.
> >
> >Can I get a ps file from the gerber viewer?
> >
> >Your help will be greatly appreciated.
> >
> >Thanks
> >
> >Best Regards
> >
> >Guru
> >
> >**********************************************************************
> >GuruPrasad R
> >Texas Instruments(India) Ltd., Phone : 91-80-5269451
> >Golf View Homes, Fax : 91-80-5269456/5278776
> >Wind Tunnel Road, Email : [log in to unmask]
> >MurugeshPallya, Bangalore-560017 [log in to unmask]
> >
> >**********************************************************************
> >
> >################################################################
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> information.
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> 847-509-9700 ext.311
> >################################################################
> >
> >
>
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 10:58:50 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Karen Tellefsen <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Karen Tellefsen <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: dual stropline
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Try Polar Instruments.
----------
> From: [log in to unmask]
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] dual stropline
> Date: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 10:20 AM
>
> I am looking to see if anyone has the calculations for " Dual
> Stripline " controlled impedance in a spreadsheet type of formula. I
> have all the others, but this particular type has just reared it's
> ugly head, and we haven't done this board type before. I am just
> trying to make sure that my calculations, and lay-ups are accurate.
> Keep in mind I'm not a Math Wizard, hence the need for the
spreadsheet
> type of format. Any help will be deeply appreciated. If what you
have
> is not proprietary e-mail to [log in to unmask] with any help or
> files. Again, thanks in advance.
>
>
> Ernie Smith
>
> Electropac Co. Inc.
>
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:09:00 PDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Kasprzak, Bill (esd) US" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Kasprzak, Bill (esd) US" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: : Flux qualification on J-Std-001B
Greetings:
I am curious whether or not someone has ever qualified a water soluble flux
for wavesoldering in accordance with J-Std-001B, Appendix D. I have
previously qualified Kester HF-1189A flux in accordance with J-Std-001A,
appendix D. At that time I was able to select a flux that was QPL listed
under Mil-F-14256, type WSF, and qualified our process according to the
appendix at level 2. Since then, J-Std-001 is now Rev B, Mil-f-14256 is a
thing of the past, etc etc.
So......
Are there any Class 3 producers out there who have gone through the
qualification of water soluble fluxes according to the provisions of
Appendix D ?? I'm just curious as to whether or not someone was able to
qualify either Alpha 857 or Kester 2331ZX to the J-Std.
I'm interested in changing water soluble fluxes from the water based HF1189A
to an alcohol based water soluble flux. I'd like to know if anyone out there
has been sucessful in passing the Appendix D requirements for class 3
activity.
Thanks,
Bill Kasprzak
Moog Inc.
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:06:20 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ellsworth Berkowitz <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ellsworth Berkowitz <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Paradyne Corporation
Subject: Component - PCB-Mounted RJ11 Plug Source
MIME-Version: 1.0
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------C09BCFBFAD1D38EDFBC8F58B
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
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I need a PCB-mountable RJ11 plug (male) connector for a new product. My application requires a
small PCBA to connect directly into a standard RJ11 wall jack. As it is a low cost product, I
want to avoid the (believed) higher cost of a PCB mounted jack and plug-to-plug cable
combination. I’ve searched the major connector manufacturer's (AMP, Molex, Berg, etc.) WWW sites
without success. Does anyone know of the existence of such a part? Can anyone provide a lead to
a reliable source for this product? Thank you in advance for your assistance.
Ellsworth D. Berkowitz, P.E.
Member of Technical Staff
Paradyne Corporation
Largo, FL, USA 33773
****************************************************************
The opinions expressed herein are solely those of the writer and
do not necessarily reflect the views of Paradyne Corporation.
****************************************************************
--------------C09BCFBFAD1D38EDFBC8F58B
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email;internet: [log in to unmask]
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:22:05 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Furrow, Robert Gordon (Robert)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Furrow, Robert Gordon (Robert)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternatives
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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Are these Solid Solder Deposit systems compatible with double sided
reflow processes? I would imagine that the second side would form a
meniscus and all the flux would be used up during the first reflow
operation. Is there a manageable way around this?
Robert Furrow
>----------
>From: Steve Collins[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>Reply To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,Steve Collins
>Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 11:45 AM
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternatives
>
>Check out Mask Technology, Inc. They were at the recent IPC Expo. they have
>a video that is available their number is 714-557-3383 or 407 857-1876.
>Their process is called PPT Precision Pad Technology. . Their email is
>[log in to unmask]
>
>Steve Collins
>
>----------
>> From: Lolmaugh, Scott (AZ15) <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternatives
>> Date: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 8:15 AM
>>
>> All,
>> There was an interesting article in the February issue of SMT Magazine
>> (IHS Publishing Group) on page 56, entitled: "End Paste Defects with
>> Solid Solder Deposits". This is a technique where the PWB Manufacturer
>> applies solder to the board, then runs the boards through polished
>> rollers to flatten the solder coating into a flat surface roughly the
>> same height as the soldermask. Then a tacky flux is applied and finally
>> an easy peel cover sheet. They claim the boards retain solderability
>> well and the paste stencil process is eliminated.
>>
>> There have been similar / identical techniques touted in the past, known
>> as:
>> "Sipad" (R) Siemens AG, (solderpaste application method)
>> "Optipad" (R) Viele Circuits Inc. and Burkle USA, (liquid solder
>> application method) and
>> "Precision Pad Technology or PPT (R) Mask Technology Inc. (solderpaste
>> application w/ textured finish)
>>
>> If anyone knows of domestic (USA) Manufacturers offering this technology,
>> I'd like to hear who they are.
>> Thanks
>> Best Regards,
>> Scott Lolmaugh
>> SMT Production Engineering
>> Honeywell IAC, Inc.
>> 602.313.3551 /FAX: 3402 (Please call first)
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: [log in to unmask]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 8:39 AM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: [TN] HASL alternatives
>>
>> To All,
>> We are now making a comparison between different alternatives to HASL.
>> The
>> chosen alternative will have to meet the following criterias criterias.
>>
>> - flat coating
>> - compatible with No-clean process and mixed technology
>> - resistant to 2-3 reflow (multiple heat cycle)
>> -and MINIMUM 1 year shelf life (storage before assembly)
>>
>> These are the alternatives we think can meet our needs:
>>
>> * OSP
>> - Benzimidazole (?)
>>
>> * IMMERSION
>> - Silver
>> - Bismuth
>> - Au-Ni
>> - Palladium
>>
>>
>> Q: Wich one do you think could be the best meet to our criterias ?
>>
>> Q: And what would be its advantage(s) compared to the others ?
>>
>> Q: OTHERS ? (is anyone using other coating alternative )
>>
>>
>> Thanks for all for your help
>>
>>
>> Nicolas van der Heyden
>>
>> ################################################################
>> TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV
>> 1.8c
>> ################################################################
>> To subscribe/unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with
>> following
>> text in the body:
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 10:29:10 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: dual stropline
X-To: Karen Tellefsen <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Try the automata website:
http://www.automata.com/capblity/spectech/z0/z0.htm
This page describes each type of construction and there
is also a modeling package that allows you to input data
and get impedance values.
good luck,
At 10:58 AM 5/13/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Try Polar Instruments.
>
>----------
>> From: [log in to unmask]
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: [TN] dual stropline
>> Date: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 10:20 AM
>>
>> I am looking to see if anyone has the calculations for " Dual
>> Stripline " controlled impedance in a spreadsheet type of formula. I
>> have all the others, but this particular type has just reared it's
>> ugly head, and we haven't done this board type before. I am just
>> trying to make sure that my calculations, and lay-ups are accurate.
>> Keep in mind I'm not a Math Wizard, hence the need for the
>spreadsheet
>> type of format. Any help will be deeply appreciated. If what you
>have
>> is not proprietary e-mail to [log in to unmask] with any help or
>> files. Again, thanks in advance.
>>
>>
>> Ernie Smith
>>
>> Electropac Co. Inc.
>>
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>
Josh Moody
Materials Quality Engineer
Hewlett-Packard - Richardson (HPSD)
ph# (972) 497-4617
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 09:46:52 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: [DES] Quick reminder, IPC meeting, San Diego
X-To: [log in to unmask]
X-cc: [log in to unmask]
Reminder: ITS FREE!
(ALSO, There will be a raffle for a 56K modem!)
IPC Designer Council, San Diego Chapter
May 13, 1998 - 6:30 PM to 8:30 PM
Wyndam Garden Hotel (LOCATION CHANGE *******)
5975 Lusk Blvd
Mira Mesa (Sorrento Valley, San Diego) California
Guest Speaker:
Jerry Partida, CAM Engineer
Presentation: " The data you send and what MEI/ Typical board
shops do when they recieve the data"
---------------------------------------------
Meeting/presentation plan:
6:00 Welcome and eats (free)
6:30-8:30 Intros, Presentation, and group discussions
8:30- ? Hang out and talk
Contact Mitch Morey (619)657-5338 for directions.
(P.S. Sorry for "clogging" the airways, but this has been interrupted off
and on, and I need to make sure it gets to everyone interested.)
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 15:27:33 PST
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Chris Evans <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re[2]: [TN] STOP TECHNET!
Hi
I'm just ploughing through the situation you describe but I think its worth it.
You never know what you don't know until you find out about it !!
Keep Technet as it is
Thanks
Chris Evans
Matra BAe
Lostock
England
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: [TN] STOP TECHNET!
Author: "\"TechNet E-Mail Forum.\" <[log in to unmask]>, Reichart Arieh"
<[log in to unmask]> at INTERNET
Date: 12/05/98 11:26
Hi Jens.
You've read my thoughts. If aplicable, your idea is wonderful.
Arieh Reichart, Eltek Ltd.
JB wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes
> too
> active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days and
> get
> a few 100 messages.
>
> I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub
> lists
> such as:
>
> IPC standard related
> wet processes
> multilayer
> photoimaging
> laminate
> etc......
>
> Any comments?
>
> Jens Behrens
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 09:11:52 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternatives
X-To: Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Nicolas,
I have been doing the same exact analysis. I have already looked at the
Gold Immersion, and the OSP coating, and am now analyzing the Silver
Immersion coating.
For our application we found that the Gold Immersion coating would not be
acceptable due to our suppliers not being able to hold the thickness of the
gold deposit to our requirement of 5u" to 7u" consistently. We would like
to see the deposit at this thickness to prevent gold embrittlement, and
oxidation of the nickel plate under coat.
When the gold deposits were above the 7u" thickness our solder joints failed
lead pull tests. When the gold deposit thickness was under 5u" the boards
failed solderability testing after steam age.
Then we analyzed the OSP coating. For our application the coating was not
acceptable due to the copper ring that was left around every solder joint
that was not printed one to one. We have more 2500 stencils that would have
to have the apertures opened up in order to print one to one at a cost of
about $500K. This was not feasible for us. We also had problems with the
special storage and handling that was required.
Currently, we are now looking at the Silver Immersion coating. We ran a lot
of 250 pieces of our most difficult double sided product. We experienced an
increase in our first pass yield from 95% to 99.3%. We then ran another lot
sample of 2500 pieces of the same product, and had the same exact results.
There was excellent wetting characteristics on every solder joint. There
were no special handling or storage requirements needed. The stencils did
not have to be changed, and the boards could be treated exactly as if they
were hot air solder leveled. I sent two completed samples out for
Temperature cycling (-20 degrees C to +80 degrees C for 20 cycles), and then
retested them. They both passed test. Both samples are now being shock
tested and Vibration tested. They will then be retested. Then a lead pull
test will be done, and then cross sectioning of various solder joints.
A lot of people love the OSP coating, and a lot love the gold immersion
coating. I think everyone has a unique process and product and what may
work for me may not work for you. I think everyone should go through their
own qualification process when making a major change like this. I can
provide you with my lab reports if you want for reference, but you should
really try all the different coatings out yourself. Anyway, hope this
helps, and good luck!
Thanks,
Kathy Palumbo
> ----------
> From: Nicolas van der Heyden[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 6:27 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] HASL alternatives
>
> To All,
> We are now making a comparison between different alternatives to HASL. The
> chosen alternative will have to meet the following criterias criterias.
>
> - flat coating
> - compatible with No-clean process and mixed technology
> - resistant to 2-3 reflow (multiple heat cycle)
> -and MINIMUM 1 year shelf life (storage before assembly)
>
> These are the alternatives we think can meet our needs:
>
> * OSP
> - Benzimidazole (?)
>
> * IMMERSION
> - Silver
> - Bismuth
> - Au-Ni
> - Palladium
>
>
> Q: Wich one do you think could be the best meet to our criterias ?
>
> Q: And what would be its advantage(s) compared to the others ?
>
> Q: OTHERS ? (is anyone using other coating alternative )
>
>
> Thanks for all for your help
>
>
> Nicolas van der Heyden
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 09:27:22 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
ETS <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: ETS <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ASSY: Reflow, Wave, and Cleaner Exhaust Issues...(again!)
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Steve,
With three machines all running on the same exhausting make sure that you
have an exhaust controller at the reflow to regulate your exhausting to
exactly 500cfm. Too much exhaust can pull the heat right out of your oven.
I think the moisture should be o.k. in the ducting. Airflow should carry the
moisture out and heat should evaporate. You should make sure you have a T
duct at the machines (assuming your ovens connect to the exhaust duct at the
back of the machine and not the top) with a 1 foot section below the
connection to the ovens and cleaner. This will allow the condensed water to
drip into a "drippan" rather than into the ovens.
Brian
>Hi there Stve I am an HVAC/Mechanical Engineer I will appreciate to help
>you if you will.
>Ruben E. Irizarry
>Mechanical Engineer
>
>
>
>
>[log in to unmask] on 05/12/98 11:37:54 PM
>
>Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to [log in to unmask]
>
>To: [log in to unmask]
>cc: (bcc: Ruben Irizarry)
>Subject: [TN] ASSY: Reflow, Wave, and Cleaner Exhaust Issues...(again!)
>
>
>
>
>Hi Folks!
>
> I hate to keep beating a dead horse so to speak, but I've still got a
>few issues with the exhaust system I'm trying to set-up in our start-up
>facility. I should say it's not me that has the issue, but others that seem
>a little hesitant with what I want to do.
>
> I did get some more quotes, and was able to cut that $11,000 one
>almost in half...the latest one was for $5,960, and the gentleman that came
>out and did the quote said that there shouldn't be any problems with the
>exhaust fan I have...
>
> BUT, I guess since this is one of the first times I've actually dealt
>with the "nuts and bolts" of this stuff, a few other people that don't know
>anymore than I do about these things, have gotten involved with this
>project...talk about too many cooks in the kitchen! SHEESH!
>
> If you remember, I have a Dayton 5,700 CFM 2-hp, belt-driven,
>centrifugal ventilator fan up on the roof (that's less than 2-years old)
>that was left by the previous tenants. They also left a large portion of
>the ducting inside the building as well. We're going to have 4 pieces of
>equipment to exhaust; a Heller reflow oven (500 cfm req.), a Soltec wave
>solder (700 cfm req.), a Trek Triton IV cleaner (1800 cfm req.), and a
>Roilguard water evaporator (has it's own blower @ 1600 cfm) coming off a
>ultrasonic stencil cleaner.
>
> The evaporator is going to have it's own duct to the roof because it
>has it's own blower. One of the "Guru's" here on the TechNet pointed out
>to me to exhaust the evaporator by itself as it would lower my main fan
>efficiency if I tried to plumb it in with the main duct, and that makes
>sense, so that's what I'm a doin'...
>
> But what seems to be not setting well with others, is that I want to
>use one fan to exhaust the other three machines. They seem to feel that
>because I'm going to plumb the cleaner into the same duct system that will
>be exhausting the reflow oven and wave, the moisture in the air that will
>be coming from the cleaner is going to somehow work it's way against the
>flow of air, backwards, and fill the reflow and wave ducts full of water.
>
> I know about the condensation that could occur, and how you need to
>orient and position the duct run to prevent a problem like that from
>occurring. That's exactly why I'm placing the cleaner right beneath the
>exhaust fan, so that the exhaust duct will be making a shot straight-up
>thru the roof (which is only about 12-feet).
>
> The exhaust fan has a rectangular plenum beneath it which is around
>2-ft X 2-ft X 4-ft. The cleaners exhaust duct will tap into the bottom of
>the plenum, and there will be one duct that will tap into the side of the
>plenum and run horizontally with a very slight downward angle towards the
>plenum to keep any water (if it should happen to condense in the duct) away
>from the ovens...I really don't think that'll happen though.
>
> This horizontal duct will run above the wave and reflow, and each
>machine will have one duct with a volume damper that will tap into that.
>
> Right now, I'm just trying to use my common sense with this project,
>and I've worked at companies before where we've had multiple machines
>(reflow and cleaners) sharing an exhaust system without any sort of
>problems. I will readily admit that I'm not a HVAC engineer, but I'm trying
>to learn fast though, I went and bought a book called; "Elements of
>Thermal/Fluid System Design" and been studying that for the past few days
>and have learned more about different fan types and figuring loss
>coefficients for duct elbows and such, than I ever thought I would need to
>know. But I guess I haven't come to the chapter yet that talks specifically
>about setting-up an exhaust system for a printed circuit manufacturing
>floor.
>
> Every book I've looked at talks mostly about air conditioning. I
>haven't been able to find a book that was recommended to me by a Technetter
>called; "Industrial Ventilation; A Manual of Recommended Practices" from
>the American Association of Industrial Hygenists...
>
> Oh, another curve was tossed at me today too. Someone had said that
>they had heard that is was very detrimental to mix the exhaust from a
>cleaner with exhaust from reflow or wave because the moisture in the
>cleaner exhaust would react with the vapors coming from reflow and wave and
>then make some sort of toxic substance...I know better than that, but
>trying to find something published that says "It's okay to exhaust a
>aqueous cleaner, reflow oven, and wave solder together in the same duct
>system." Is pretty tough if ya' know what I mean...
>
> I'm sorry I'm going on and on about this, but does it sound like I'm
>doing things logically? Or am I way off base? I've called Trek by the way,
>and sorry to say they've not been much help at all...
>
> I know that if it were a perfect world and we had a lot of money I
>would've said to pay the $11,000 and be done with it, but we're just
>starting out and you all know how that is.
>
> I would appreciate any feedback at all...and don't be shy, if I'm
>screwing up let me know please!
>
>Thanks in advance!!
>
>-Steve Gregory-
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 12:25:01 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Steve Keith <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Steve Keith <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Steve's Personal Mail
Subject: Esd Standard
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hello - please forgive me if I am breaking any rules sending this. It is
my first communication through TechNet. My company recently went through
an ISO9002 pre-assessment, and one of the points I got hit on was not
having a method in place to make sure I have current copies of externally
generated documents or specifications.
My response was to try and find a web site that has the latest information
posted.
Can anyone tell me if there is a web site where I can obtain the latest
specification regarding ESD precautions?
Also, although slightly off-topic, I am looking for the same thing for the
ISO9000 standard.
Thank you for any help.
Steve Keith
Daisy Disc Corporation
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 12:54:54 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternatives
X-To: Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Kathy:
Was the thickness of the silver deposit the same as required of the gold immersion process?
And if so, did it meet your requirements of consistent 5u to 7u thickness?
Palumbo wrote:
> Nicolas,
>
> I have been doing the same exact analysis. I have already looked at the
> Gold Immersion, and the OSP coating, and am now analyzing the Silver
> Immersion coating.
>
> For our application we found that the Gold Immersion coating would not be
> acceptable due to our suppliers not being able to hold the thickness of the
> gold deposit to our requirement of 5u" to 7u" consistently. We would like
> to see the deposit at this thickness to prevent gold embrittlement, and
> oxidation of the nickel plate under coat.
> When the gold deposits were above the 7u" thickness our solder joints failed
> lead pull tests. When the gold deposit thickness was under 5u" the boards
> failed solderability testing after steam age.
>
> Then we analyzed the OSP coating. For our application the coating was not
> acceptable due to the copper ring that was left around every solder joint
> that was not printed one to one. We have more 2500 stencils that would have
> to have the apertures opened up in order to print one to one at a cost of
> about $500K. This was not feasible for us. We also had problems with the
> special storage and handling that was required.
>
> Currently, we are now looking at the Silver Immersion coating. We ran a lot
> of 250 pieces of our most difficult double sided product. We experienced an
> increase in our first pass yield from 95% to 99.3%. We then ran another lot
> sample of 2500 pieces of the same product, and had the same exact results.
> There was excellent wetting characteristics on every solder joint. There
> were no special handling or storage requirements needed. The stencils did
> not have to be changed, and the boards could be treated exactly as if they
> were hot air solder leveled. I sent two completed samples out for
> Temperature cycling (-20 degrees C to +80 degrees C for 20 cycles), and then
> retested them. They both passed test. Both samples are now being shock
> tested and Vibration tested. They will then be retested. Then a lead pull
> test will be done, and then cross sectioning of various solder joints.
>
> A lot of people love the OSP coating, and a lot love the gold immersion
> coating. I think everyone has a unique process and product and what may
> work for me may not work for you. I think everyone should go through their
> own qualification process when making a major change like this. I can
> provide you with my lab reports if you want for reference, but you should
> really try all the different coatings out yourself. Anyway, hope this
> helps, and good luck!
>
> Thanks,
>
> Kathy Palumbo
> > ----------
> > From: Nicolas van der Heyden[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 6:27 AM
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: [TN] HASL alternatives
> >
> > To All,
> > We are now making a comparison between different alternatives to HASL. The
> > chosen alternative will have to meet the following criterias criterias.
> >
> > - flat coating
> > - compatible with No-clean process and mixed technology
> > - resistant to 2-3 reflow (multiple heat cycle)
> > -and MINIMUM 1 year shelf life (storage before assembly)
> >
> > These are the alternatives we think can meet our needs:
> >
> > * OSP
> > - Benzimidazole (?)
> >
> > * IMMERSION
> > - Silver
> > - Bismuth
> > - Au-Ni
> > - Palladium
> >
> >
> > Q: Wich one do you think could be the best meet to our criterias ?
> >
> > Q: And what would be its advantage(s) compared to the others ?
> >
> > Q: OTHERS ? (is anyone using other coating alternative )
> >
> >
> > Thanks for all for your help
> >
> >
> > Nicolas van der Heyden
> >
> > ################################################################
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> > ################################################################
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> > information.
> > For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at [log in to unmask] or
> > 847-509-9700 ext.311
> > ################################################################
> >
>
> ################################################################
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--
Have a Golden Day,
Paul Anderson
Amherst Systems Inc
[log in to unmask]
716-631-0610 x190
716-631-0629 (fax)
http://www.amherst.com/
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 13:10:56 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Gagrani, Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Gagrani, Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Esd Standard
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Best place to visit would be EOS/ESD (Rome (USA) based ) Standards .
You may search the site through Yahoo (or other search engines).
Kishore
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Keith [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 12:25 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Esd Standard
Hello - please forgive me if I am breaking any rules sending this. It
is
my first communication through TechNet. My company recently went
through
an ISO9002 pre-assessment, and one of the points I got hit on was not
having a method in place to make sure I have current copies of
externally
generated documents or specifications.
My response was to try and find a web site that has the latest
information
posted.
Can anyone tell me if there is a web site where I can obtain the
latest
specification regarding ESD precautions?
Also, although slightly off-topic, I am looking for the same thing for
the
ISO9000 standard.
Thank you for any help.
Steve Keith
Daisy Disc Corporation
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 10:01:38 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
X-To: [log in to unmask]
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
What do you want to know??
Raw Board Reliability (solderability)
Contact Resistance Reliability?
Solder Joint Reliability
With regards to Solder Joint Reliability, the solder interface of the
nickel to solder forms tin intermetallics which will not be as strong
as solder to solder. These joints will still be acceptable for most
smt components but immersion gold and BGA's should be avoided.
Regards:
Steve O'Hara HP
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: [TN] Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
Author: Non-HP-Fulton.Feng.ffeng ([log in to unmask]) at
HP-Vancouver,mimegw10
Date: 5/12/98 5:39 PM
Hi
Has anyboy done any reliability study on Gold Immersion PCB finish?
Thanks
Fulton Feng
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:23:56 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ESD info
X-To: [log in to unmask]
>>> Steve Keith <[log in to unmask]> 05/13/98 08:25am >>>
(snip)
Can anyone tell me if there is a web site where I can obtain the latest
specification regarding ESD precautions?
----------------------------------------------------------
Steve,
This might be helpful. Good luck.
Below is a listing from www.amazon.com on EMC for your refer:
* Introduction to Electromagnetic Compatibility (Wiley Series in Microwave
and Optical Engineering) - Clayton R. Paul; Paperback
* Principles and Techniques of Electromagnetic Compatibility (Electronic
Engineering Systems Series) - Christos Christopoulos; Hardcover
* Emc for Product Designers - Tim Williams; Paperback
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Full Results: 44 items are shown below.
Electromagnetic Compatibility in Medical Equipment : A Guide for
Designers and Installers ~ Ships in 2-3 days
William D. Kimmel, Daryl D. Gerke / Hardcover / Published 1995
Our Price: $89.95
Read more about this title...
Electromagnetic Compatibility in Power Electronics
Laszlo Tihanyi / Hardcover / Published 1995
Our Price: $89.95
Read more about this title...
Emc for Product Designers ~ Ships in 2-3 days
Tim Williams / Paperback / Published 1996
Our Price: $49.95
Read more about this title...
EMC: Electromagnetic Theory to Practical Design ~ Ships in 2-3 days
Paul A. Chatterton, Michael A. Houlden / Paperback / Published 1992
Our Price: $120.00
Read more about this title...
Engineering Electromagnetic Compatibility : Principles, Measurements, and
Technologies ~ Ships in 2-3 days
V. Prasad Kodali / Hardcover / Published 1996
Our Price: $79.95
Read more about this title...
Handbook of Antennas for Emc (Artech House Antenna and Propagation
Library) ~ Ships in 2-3 days
Thereza M. MacNamara / Hardcover / Published 1995
Our Price: $89.00
Read more about this title...
Handbook of Electromagnetic Compatibility ~ Ships in 2-3 days
Reinaldo Perez (Editor) / Hardcover / Published 1995
Our Price: $158.00
Read more about this title...
High-Frequency Electromagnetic Techniques : Recent Advances and
Applications (Wiley Series in Microwave and Optical Engineering) ~ Ships
in 2-3 days
Asoke K. Bhattacharyya / Paperback / Published 1995
Our Price: $125.00
Read more about this title...
Introduction to Electromagnetic Compatibility (Wiley Series in Microwave
and Optical Engineering) ~ Ships in 2-3 days
Clayton R. Paul / Paperback / Published 1992
Our Price: $94.95
Read more about this title...
Introduction to Emc ~ Ships in 2-3 days
John S. Scott, et al / Paperback / Published 1997
Our Price: $32.95
Noise and Other Interfering Signals ~ Ships in 2-3 days
Ralph Morrison / Paperback / Published 1991
Our Price: $78.95
Read more about this title...
Principles and Techniques of Electromagnetic Compatibility (Electronic
Engineering Systems Series) ~ Ships in 2-3 days
Christos Christopoulos / Hardcover / Published 1995
Our Price: $94.95
Read more about this title...
Principles of Electromagnetic Compatibility ~ Ships in 2-3 days
Bernhard E. Keiser, B. J. Keiser / Hardcover / Published 1987
Our Price: $45.00
Printed Circuit Board Design Techniques for Emc Compliance (IEEE Press
Series on Electronics Technology)
Mark I. Montrose / Hardcover / Published 1995
Our Price: $64.95
Read more about this title...
Electromagnetic Compatibility (Lingua Franca Language)
Pierre Degauque, et al / Hardcover / Published 1993
Our Price: $98.00 (Special Order)
Read more about this title...
Electromagnetic Compatibility : Principles and Applications (Electrical
Engineering and Electronics Series, No 73)
David A. Weston / Hardcover / Published 1991
Our Price: $165.00 (Special Order)
Electromagnetic Compatibility in Medical Equipment : A Guide for
Designers and Installers
William D. Kimmel, Daryl D. Gerke / Hardcover / Published 1995
Our Price: $169.00 (Special Order)
Read more about this title...
Electromagnetic Compatibility in Telecommunications Vol 7
Hardcover / Published 1988
(Special Order)
Electromagnetic Compatibility in Telecommunications Vol 7
W. Duff / Hardcover / Published 1988
Our Price: $95.00 (Special Order)
Electromagnetic Compatibility in Underground Mining : Selected Problems
(Advances in Mining Science and Technology, 7)
Florian Krasucki, et al / Hardcover / Published 1993
Our Price: $203.25 (Special Order)
Read more about this title...
Electromagnetic Compossibility : Applied Principles of Cost-Effective
Control of Electromagnetic Interference and Hazards
Heinz M Schlicke / Hardcover / Published 1982
Our Price: $99.75 (Special Order)
Emc Analysis Methods and Computational Models
Frederick M. Tesche, et al / VHS Tape / Published 1996
Our Price: $94.95 (Special Order)
Read more about this title...
Emc for Product Designers
Hardcover / Published 1992
(Special Order)
Read more about this title...
Emi/Emc Computational Modeling Handbook
Bruce Archambeault, et al / Hardcover / Published 1998
Our Price: $79.95 (Not Yet Published)
Interference Analysis of Communication Systems
P. Stavroulakis (Editor) / Hardcover / Published 1980
Our Price: $57.90 (Special Order)
Interference Suppression Techniques for Microwave Antennas and
Transmitters
Ernest R Freeman / Hardcover / Published 1983
Our Price: $70.00 (Special Order)
International Conference on Electromagnetic Compatibility (Iee
Conference Publication, No 362)
Paperback / Published 1992
Our Price: $116.00 (Special Order)
Read more about this title...
Principles of Electromagnetic Compatibility
Hardcover / Published 1987
(Special Order)
Solid-State Power Conversion Handbook
Ralph E. Tarter, Ralph E. Tartar / Paperback / Published 1993
Our Price: $127.00 (Back Ordered)
Read more about this title...
Zzaap : Taming Esd, Rfi, and Emi
M. Bruce Corp / Hardcover / Published 1990
Our Price: $51.00 (Special Order)
1995 International Conference on Electromagnetic Interference and
Compatibility (INCEMIC) : conference proceedings, Park Sheraton Hotel
and Towers, Madras, India, December 6-8, 1995
Controlling Conducted Emissions by Design
John C. Fluke / Published 1991
Read more about this title...
Coupling of External Electromagnetic Fields to Transmission Lines
Albert A., Smith / Published 1977
Electro-Magnetic Interference Reduction in Electronic Systems
Jeffrey P. Mills / Published 1993
Read more about this title...
Electromagnetic Compatibility
Jasper J. Goedbloed / Published 1993
Read more about this title...
Electromagnetic Compatibility (Iee Conference Publications, No 326)
Published 1990
Read more about this title...
Electromagnetic Compatibility Design Guide for Avionics and Related
Ground Support Equipment
Ernest R Freeman / Published 1982
Electromagnetic Compatibility Handbook
J.L. Norman Violette / Published 1991
Electromagnetic Compatibility Handbook
J.L. Norman Violette / Published 1987
Electromagnetic Compatibility in Radio Engineering
Wilhelm R. Rotkiewicz (Editor) / Published 1982
EMC 92, designing EMC into your product : conference proceedings,
12-13 February, 1992, London
The European Market for electromagnetic compatibility
Proceedings of the Conference on Electromagnetic Compatibility,
Tuesday 4th to Friday 7th April 1978, University of Surrey, Guildford ;
organized by the Institution of Electronic and Radio Engineers, with the
association of ... [others]
Topics in intersystem electromagnetic compatibility
Woodrow W. Everett
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 12:43:28 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ASSY: Reflow, Wave, and Cleaner Exhaust Issues...(again!)
Steve,
In a past job, we used to tie multiple reflow ovens to the same blower
without too many problems. Balancing the flows for everything is the
biggest pain. Another reply made a point about if your blower goes down,
it shuts down your operation. Perhaps having more than one blower would
make sense for that reason. Some of the blowers we had were pretty long
lead time items.
For horizontal ducting, we used to put a drain tube with a sight glass at
the lowest spot on the slope. This would allow us to see if there was any
liquid build-up, and periodically drain the ducts if necessary.
As for the toxic substances... From my plating days, I know it is probably
not a good idea to mix an acid cleaning bath exhaust with a gold cyanide
plating bath exhaust, but I haven't heard of any deadly reactions from
soldering and cleaning exhaust mixing. Most of the time with water
condensation, I think it is probably concentration of acids, bases, or
explosive substances (solvents, etc.) that is worrisome from a corrosion or
maintenance safety standpoint. Perhaps your solder/flux supplier can
provide some insight / references.
Good Luck,
Dave Anderson
Medtronic, Inc.
Opinions are my own, worth what you pay for them, and do not necessarily
reflect those of my employer.
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 12:51:04 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Charles Barker <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Esd Standard
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Charles Barker@I-O INC
05/13/98 12:51 PM
I recently set up our ESD procedures. EIA-625 was the reference document
used as a guideline. I got my copy of EIA-625 from Global Engineering
Documents. If you search on EIA-625 or some version of that, you will be
able to find references on the 'net.
[log in to unmask] on 05/13/98 11:25:01 AM
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Charles Barker/US/I-O INC)
Subject: [TN] Esd Standard
Hello - please forgive me if I am breaking any rules sending this. It is
my first communication through TechNet. My company recently went through
an ISO9002 pre-assessment, and one of the points I got hit on was not
having a method in place to make sure I have current copies of externally
generated documents or specifications.
My response was to try and find a web site that has the latest information
posted.
Can anyone tell me if there is a web site where I can obtain the latest
specification regarding ESD precautions?
Also, although slightly off-topic, I am looking for the same thing for the
ISO9000 standard.
Thank you for any help.
Steve Keith
Daisy Disc Corporation
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 19:01:16 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Greenman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Greenman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Esd Standard
X-To: Steve Keith <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
To keep up to date on ISO9000, other ISO and IEC standards visit
www.bsi.org.uk
You will also find standards for ESD CECC 000/15 & EN100015 of help.
Best Regards
David Greenman
Concoat Ltd
www.concoat.co.uk
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Keith <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: 13 May 1998 17:50
Subject: [TN] Esd Standard
>Hello - please forgive me if I am breaking any rules sending this. It is
>my first communication through TechNet. My company recently went through
>an ISO9002 pre-assessment, and one of the points I got hit on was not
>having a method in place to make sure I have current copies of externally
>generated documents or specifications.
>
>My response was to try and find a web site that has the latest information
>posted.
>
>Can anyone tell me if there is a web site where I can obtain the latest
>specification regarding ESD precautions?
>
>Also, although slightly off-topic, I am looking for the same thing for the
>ISO9000 standard.
>
>Thank you for any help.
>
>Steve Keith
>Daisy Disc Corporation
>
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>
>
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 14:08:22 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Larry Campbell <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Larry Campbell <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Nonfunctional Lands: Do they improve PTH reliability? -Reply
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Where were you 8 weeks ago? This same question came up
and answers lasted over a week! It seems the lastest
consensus is, there is no consensus. For as many reasons as
there were to include them, there were an equal number not too.
I've had vendors want them removed for manufacturing reasons
and stackup reasons. (You don't have annular ring problems
and you don't get the additional copper stackup on multilayer
boards vs. the stackup of reduced copper areas over the other
board. On the other hand, the internal pads may (read that MAY)
aid in the hole plating adhesion. We have done it both ways,
both with our knowledge and when the board vendor didn't
bother to tell us what they were doing. We haven't seen a
difference as far as reliability is concerned. There may be a
difference however, on the type of board you are designing (high
speed). I think I saw once that there was an archive of this site
somewhere but I've never looked for it. Good luck.
Larry Campbell
Supervisor, PWB
BFGoodrich, Avionics Systems
>>> Karl Sweitzer <[log in to unmask]> 05/13/98 08:27am
>>>
We typically use nonfunctional lands to improve PTH reliability for
our polyimide boards. This is based on NHB 5300 section
3K703 and
IPC-D-275 section 5.3.2.5
On a current design, our board vendor is asking to remove them
based
on some recommendations he has heard in the industry. We
are hesitant
to do this based on the above quoted specification.
What do you all think?
--
Karl Sweitzer voice: 716.47.77546
Eastman Kodak Company pager: 716.25.33681
800 Lee Road fax: 716.47.77293
Rochester, NY 14650-3118 mailto:[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 13:30:04 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Fulton Feng <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Fulton Feng <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
X-To: "\"STEVE_O\\\\'HARA\"@HP-Vancouver-om10.om.hp.com"
<"STEVE_O\\'HARA"@HP-Vancouver-om10.om.hp.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Hi Steve, thank you for your comment! What I really want to know is the
reliability of the product by using immersion gold PCB, including solder
joint reliablity and integrity of the PCB after process. Do you know whether
IPC has any standard or publication on this topic? Is it Bellcore compliant?
What is the issue with BGA for immersion gold?
Thanks again!
Fulton Feng
> ----------
> From:
> "STEVE_O\\'HARA"@HP-Vancouver-om10.om.hp.com[SMTP:"STEVE_O\\'HARA"@HP-Vanc
> ouver-om10.om.hp.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 10:01 AM
> To: Feng, Fulton [MPK:5221:EXCH]
> Cc: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
>
> What do you want to know??
>
> Raw Board Reliability (solderability)
> Contact Resistance Reliability?
> Solder Joint Reliability
>
> With regards to Solder Joint Reliability, the solder interface of the
>
> nickel to solder forms tin intermetallics which will not be as strong
>
> as solder to solder. These joints will still be acceptable for most
> smt components but immersion gold and BGA's should be avoided.
>
> Regards:
>
> Steve O'Hara HP
>
>
> ______________________________ Reply Separator
> _________________________________
> Subject: [TN] Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
> Author: Non-HP-Fulton.Feng.ffeng ([log in to unmask]) at
> HP-Vancouver,mimegw10
> Date: 5/12/98 5:39 PM
>
>
> Hi
> Has anyboy done any reliability study on Gold Immersion PCB finish?
>
> Thanks
> Fulton Feng
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 13:45:05 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Lolmaugh, Scott (AZ15)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Lolmaugh, Scott (AZ15)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternatives
X-To: "[log in to unmask] (IPM Return requested)"
<[log in to unmask]>
Kathy,
Did you have any concern about survival in corrosive atmosphere? We
spec. "no exposed silver" for our PWAs to allow them to survive any high
level corrosive atmospheres. I'd imagine the % silver is probably too
low to matter, but I just wondered if it was a consideration.
Best Regards,
Scott Lolmaugh
SMT Production Engineering
Honeywell IAC, Inc.
602.313.3551 /FAX: 3402 (Please call first)
-----Original Message-----
From: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 11:26 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternatives
Nicolas,
I have been doing the same exact analysis. I have already looked at the
Gold Immersion, and the OSP coating, and am now analyzing the Silver
Immersion coating.
For our application we found that the Gold Immersion coating would not be
acceptable due to our suppliers not being able to hold the thickness of
the
gold deposit to our requirement of 5u" to 7u" consistently. We would
like
to see the deposit at this thickness to prevent gold embrittlement, and
oxidation of the nickel plate under coat.
When the gold deposits were above the 7u" thickness our solder joints
failed
lead pull tests. When the gold deposit thickness was under 5u" the
boards
failed solderability testing after steam age.
Then we analyzed the OSP coating. For our application the coating was
not
acceptable due to the copper ring that was left around every solder joint
that was not printed one to one. We have more 2500 stencils that would
have
to have the apertures opened up in order to print one to one at a cost of
about $500K. This was not feasible for us. We also had problems with
the
special storage and handling that was required.
Currently, we are now looking at the Silver Immersion coating. We ran a
lot
of 250 pieces of our most difficult double sided product. We experienced
an
increase in our first pass yield from 95% to 99.3%. We then ran another
lot
sample of 2500 pieces of the same product, and had the same exact
results.
There was excellent wetting characteristics on every solder joint. There
were no special handling or storage requirements needed. The stencils
did
not have to be changed, and the boards could be treated exactly as if
they
were hot air solder leveled. I sent two completed samples out for
Temperature cycling (-20 degrees C to +80 degrees C for 20 cycles), and
then
retested them. They both passed test. Both samples are now being shock
tested and Vibration tested. They will then be retested. Then a lead
pull
test will be done, and then cross sectioning of various solder joints.
A lot of people love the OSP coating, and a lot love the gold immersion
coating. I think everyone has a unique process and product and what may
work for me may not work for you. I think everyone should go through
their
own qualification process when making a major change like this. I can
provide you with my lab reports if you want for reference, but you should
really try all the different coatings out yourself. Anyway, hope this
helps, and good luck!
Thanks,
Kathy Palumbo
> ----------
> From: Nicolas van der Heyden[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 6:27 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] HASL alternatives
>
> To All,
> We are now making a comparison between different alternatives to HASL.
The
> chosen alternative will have to meet the following criterias criterias.
>
> - flat coating
> - compatible with No-clean process and mixed technology
> - resistant to 2-3 reflow (multiple heat cycle)
> -and MINIMUM 1 year shelf life (storage before assembly)
>
> These are the alternatives we think can meet our needs:
>
> * OSP
> - Benzimidazole (?)
>
> * IMMERSION
> - Silver
> - Bismuth
> - Au-Ni
> - Palladium
>
>
> Q: Wich one do you think could be the best meet to our criterias ?
>
> Q: And what would be its advantage(s) compared to the others ?
>
> Q: OTHERS ? (is anyone using other coating alternative )
>
>
> Thanks for all for your help
>
>
> Nicolas van der Heyden
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:42:19 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Cash, Alan" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Cash, Alan" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Esd Standard
X-To: Steve Keith <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Sorry to disapoint you but the free ride is over. You must purchase the ESD
Association test methods from the ESD Association.
The EIA 625 standard must be purchased as well as the ISO 9000
documents. IHS and Globe both have these specifications. Be aware of the
fact that these haave copyrights and are subject to the copyright laws.
To meet the requirements of ISO 9002 you must have a file of the latest
external documents that you use and a means of proving that they are the
latest revision or the revision specified in your documentation. By the way
MIL-STD's are $0.09 per printed page, but can be freely reproduced as they
are public domain..
Al Cash
> ----------
> From: Steve Keith[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Steve Keith
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 11:25 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Esd Standard
>
> Hello - please forgive me if I am breaking any rules sending this. It is
> my first communication through TechNet. My company recently went through
> an ISO9002 pre-assessment, and one of the points I got hit on was not
> having a method in place to make sure I have current copies of externally
> generated documents or specifications.
>
> My response was to try and find a web site that has the latest information
> posted.
>
> Can anyone tell me if there is a web site where I can obtain the latest
> specification regarding ESD precautions?
>
> Also, although slightly off-topic, I am looking for the same thing for the
> ISO9000 standard.
>
> Thank you for any help.
>
> Steve Keith
> Daisy Disc Corporation
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:48:48 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Cash, Alan" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Cash, Alan" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ESD info
X-To: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
EMI is not ESD!! ESD can generate an EMI field. The control of ESD is a
separate subject.
> ----------Al Cash
> From: Mitch Morey[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Mitch Morey
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 1:23 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] ESD info
>
> >>> Steve Keith <[log in to unmask]> 05/13/98 08:25am >>>
> (snip)
> Can anyone tell me if there is a web site where I can obtain the latest
> specification regarding ESD precautions?
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Steve,
>
> This might be helpful. Good luck.
>
> Below is a listing from www.amazon.com on EMC for your refer:
>
> * Introduction to Electromagnetic Compatibility (Wiley Series in Microwave
> and Optical Engineering) - Clayton R. Paul; Paperback
> * Principles and Techniques of Electromagnetic Compatibility (Electronic
> Engineering Systems Series) - Christos Christopoulos; Hardcover
> * Emc for Product Designers - Tim Williams; Paperback
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Full Results: 44 items are shown below.
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility in Medical Equipment : A Guide for
> Designers and Installers ~ Ships in 2-3 days
>
> William D. Kimmel, Daryl D. Gerke / Hardcover / Published 1995
> Our Price: $89.95
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility in Power Electronics
>
> Laszlo Tihanyi / Hardcover / Published 1995
> Our Price: $89.95
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Emc for Product Designers ~ Ships in 2-3 days
>
> Tim Williams / Paperback / Published 1996
> Our Price: $49.95
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> EMC: Electromagnetic Theory to Practical Design ~ Ships in 2-3 days
>
> Paul A. Chatterton, Michael A. Houlden / Paperback / Published 1992
> Our Price: $120.00
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Engineering Electromagnetic Compatibility : Principles, Measurements, and
> Technologies ~ Ships in 2-3 days
>
> V. Prasad Kodali / Hardcover / Published 1996
> Our Price: $79.95
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Handbook of Antennas for Emc (Artech House Antenna and Propagation
> Library) ~ Ships in 2-3 days
>
> Thereza M. MacNamara / Hardcover / Published 1995
> Our Price: $89.00
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Handbook of Electromagnetic Compatibility ~ Ships in 2-3 days
>
> Reinaldo Perez (Editor) / Hardcover / Published 1995
> Our Price: $158.00
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> High-Frequency Electromagnetic Techniques : Recent Advances and
> Applications (Wiley Series in Microwave and Optical Engineering) ~ Ships
> in 2-3 days
>
> Asoke K. Bhattacharyya / Paperback / Published 1995
> Our Price: $125.00
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Introduction to Electromagnetic Compatibility (Wiley Series in Microwave
> and Optical Engineering) ~ Ships in 2-3 days
>
> Clayton R. Paul / Paperback / Published 1992
> Our Price: $94.95
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Introduction to Emc ~ Ships in 2-3 days
>
> John S. Scott, et al / Paperback / Published 1997
> Our Price: $32.95
>
>
>
> Noise and Other Interfering Signals ~ Ships in 2-3 days
>
> Ralph Morrison / Paperback / Published 1991
> Our Price: $78.95
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Principles and Techniques of Electromagnetic Compatibility (Electronic
> Engineering Systems Series) ~ Ships in 2-3 days
>
> Christos Christopoulos / Hardcover / Published 1995
> Our Price: $94.95
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Principles of Electromagnetic Compatibility ~ Ships in 2-3 days
>
> Bernhard E. Keiser, B. J. Keiser / Hardcover / Published 1987
> Our Price: $45.00
>
>
>
> Printed Circuit Board Design Techniques for Emc Compliance (IEEE Press
> Series on Electronics Technology)
>
> Mark I. Montrose / Hardcover / Published 1995
> Our Price: $64.95
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility (Lingua Franca Language)
>
> Pierre Degauque, et al / Hardcover / Published 1993
> Our Price: $98.00 (Special Order)
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility : Principles and Applications (Electrical
> Engineering and Electronics Series, No 73)
>
> David A. Weston / Hardcover / Published 1991
> Our Price: $165.00 (Special Order)
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility in Medical Equipment : A Guide for
> Designers and Installers
>
> William D. Kimmel, Daryl D. Gerke / Hardcover / Published 1995
> Our Price: $169.00 (Special Order)
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility in Telecommunications Vol 7
>
> Hardcover / Published 1988
> (Special Order)
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility in Telecommunications Vol 7
>
> W. Duff / Hardcover / Published 1988
> Our Price: $95.00 (Special Order)
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility in Underground Mining : Selected Problems
> (Advances in Mining Science and Technology, 7)
>
> Florian Krasucki, et al / Hardcover / Published 1993
> Our Price: $203.25 (Special Order)
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compossibility : Applied Principles of Cost-Effective
> Control of Electromagnetic Interference and Hazards
>
> Heinz M Schlicke / Hardcover / Published 1982
> Our Price: $99.75 (Special Order)
>
>
>
> Emc Analysis Methods and Computational Models
>
> Frederick M. Tesche, et al / VHS Tape / Published 1996
> Our Price: $94.95 (Special Order)
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Emc for Product Designers
>
> Hardcover / Published 1992
> (Special Order)
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Emi/Emc Computational Modeling Handbook
>
> Bruce Archambeault, et al / Hardcover / Published 1998
> Our Price: $79.95 (Not Yet Published)
>
>
>
> Interference Analysis of Communication Systems
>
> P. Stavroulakis (Editor) / Hardcover / Published 1980
> Our Price: $57.90 (Special Order)
>
>
>
> Interference Suppression Techniques for Microwave Antennas and
> Transmitters
>
> Ernest R Freeman / Hardcover / Published 1983
> Our Price: $70.00 (Special Order)
>
>
>
> International Conference on Electromagnetic Compatibility (Iee
> Conference Publication, No 362)
>
> Paperback / Published 1992
> Our Price: $116.00 (Special Order)
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Principles of Electromagnetic Compatibility
>
> Hardcover / Published 1987
> (Special Order)
>
>
>
> Solid-State Power Conversion Handbook
>
> Ralph E. Tarter, Ralph E. Tartar / Paperback / Published 1993
> Our Price: $127.00 (Back Ordered)
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Zzaap : Taming Esd, Rfi, and Emi
>
> M. Bruce Corp / Hardcover / Published 1990
> Our Price: $51.00 (Special Order)
>
>
>
> 1995 International Conference on Electromagnetic Interference and
> Compatibility (INCEMIC) : conference proceedings, Park Sheraton Hotel
> and Towers, Madras, India, December 6-8, 1995
>
>
>
>
>
> Controlling Conducted Emissions by Design
>
> John C. Fluke / Published 1991
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Coupling of External Electromagnetic Fields to Transmission Lines
>
> Albert A., Smith / Published 1977
>
>
>
> Electro-Magnetic Interference Reduction in Electronic Systems
>
> Jeffrey P. Mills / Published 1993
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility
>
> Jasper J. Goedbloed / Published 1993
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility (Iee Conference Publications, No 326)
>
> Published 1990
> Read more about this title...
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility Design Guide for Avionics and Related
> Ground Support Equipment
>
> Ernest R Freeman / Published 1982
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility Handbook
>
> J.L. Norman Violette / Published 1991
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility Handbook
>
> J.L. Norman Violette / Published 1987
>
>
>
> Electromagnetic Compatibility in Radio Engineering
>
> Wilhelm R. Rotkiewicz (Editor) / Published 1982
>
>
>
> EMC 92, designing EMC into your product : conference proceedings,
> 12-13 February, 1992, London
>
>
>
>
>
> The European Market for electromagnetic compatibility
>
>
>
>
>
> Proceedings of the Conference on Electromagnetic Compatibility,
> Tuesday 4th to Friday 7th April 1978, University of Surrey, Guildford ;
> organized by the Institution of Electronic and Radio Engineers, with the
> association of ... [others]
>
>
>
>
>
> Topics in intersystem electromagnetic compatibility
>
> Woodrow W. Everett
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:59:12 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Eldon Sanders <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Eldon Sanders <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Esd Standard
X-To: Steve Keith <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Steve,
Our solution was to release all external specs through our document
control system. This gives us our own part number to reference. We are
then locked into a rev of the external spec, say rev a of J-STD-001.
When rev b is available, we make sure we are meeting all the
requirements in it before we change our internal copy to rev b. We are
not working to the latest revision of the external specs until we make
the change in our document control system. Remember, ISO requires you
to meet all the requirements of a spec and control it, internal or
external. We decided to make all external specs that we wanted to say
we meet internal specs. This also forces you to review all new
revisions for compliance before saying you meet all its changes.
Hope this helps.
Regards
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Steve Keith [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 9:25 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Esd Standard
>
> Hello - please forgive me if I am breaking any rules sending this. It
> is
> my first communication through TechNet. My company recently went
> through
> an ISO9002 pre-assessment, and one of the points I got hit on was not
> having a method in place to make sure I have current copies of
> externally
> generated documents or specifications.
>
> My response was to try and find a web site that has the latest
> information
> posted.
>
> Can anyone tell me if there is a web site where I can obtain the
> latest
> specification regarding ESD precautions?
>
> Also, although slightly off-topic, I am looking for the same thing for
> the
> ISO9000 standard.
>
> Thank you for any help.
>
> Steve Keith
> Daisy Disc Corporation
>
> ################################################################
> TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV
> 1.8c
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> following text in the body:
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> Please visit IPC web site (http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm) for
> additional information.
> For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at [log in to unmask] or
> 847-509-9700 ext.311
> ################################################################
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################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 14:33:44 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
X-To: Fulton Feng <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask] com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
If you would like a paper look into the proceedings
that occurred last Sept at IPC Surface Finish Summit in St. Paul,MN.
There was a paper presented there that discusses the issues
behind electroless Ni/ immersion gold and why it is not compatible
with soldered BGA's.
Good luck,
At 01:30 PM 5/13/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Hi Steve, thank you for your comment! What I really want to know is the
>reliability of the product by using immersion gold PCB, including solder
>joint reliablity and integrity of the PCB after process. Do you know whether
>IPC has any standard or publication on this topic? Is it Bellcore compliant?
>What is the issue with BGA for immersion gold?
>
>Thanks again!
>
>Fulton Feng
>
>> ----------
>> From:
>> "STEVE_O\\'HARA"@HP-Vancouver-om10.om.hp.com[SMTP:"STEVE_O\\'HARA"@HP-Vanc
>> ouver-om10.om.hp.com]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 10:01 AM
>> To: Feng, Fulton [MPK:5221:EXCH]
>> Cc: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [TN] Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
>>
>> What do you want to know??
>>
>> Raw Board Reliability (solderability)
>> Contact Resistance Reliability?
>> Solder Joint Reliability
>>
>> With regards to Solder Joint Reliability, the solder interface of the
>>
>> nickel to solder forms tin intermetallics which will not be as strong
>>
>> as solder to solder. These joints will still be acceptable for most
>> smt components but immersion gold and BGA's should be avoided.
>>
>> Regards:
>>
>> Steve O'Hara HP
>>
>>
>> ______________________________ Reply Separator
>> _________________________________
>> Subject: [TN] Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
>> Author: Non-HP-Fulton.Feng.ffeng ([log in to unmask]) at
>> HP-Vancouver,mimegw10
>> Date: 5/12/98 5:39 PM
>>
>>
>> Hi
>> Has anyboy done any reliability study on Gold Immersion PCB finish?
>>
>> Thanks
>> Fulton Feng
>>
>> ################################################################
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>> following text
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>> ation.
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>> 847-509-97
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>
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Josh Moody
Materials Quality Engineer
Hewlett-Packard - Richardson (HPSD)
ph# (972) 497-4617
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 15:58:19 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Greg Finlay <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Greg Finlay <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
X-To: Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Yikees! Electroless Ni/ immersion gold is not compatible with soldered
BGA's? We need more than luck!
The only Proceedings listing I see on the IPC web page and in their
Publications 98 is was released in June 97. Do you have a document
number or other source for these 'allegations'?
Cheers,
Greg
-----Original Message-----
From: Josh Moody [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 3:34 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
If you would like a paper look into the proceedings
that occurred last Sept at IPC Surface Finish Summit in St.
Paul,MN.
There was a paper presented there that discusses the issues
behind electroless Ni/ immersion gold and why it is not
compatible
with soldered BGA's.
Good luck,
At 01:30 PM 5/13/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Hi Steve, thank you for your comment! What I really want to
know is the
>reliability of the product by using immersion gold PCB,
including solder
>joint reliablity and integrity of the PCB after process. Do you
know whether
>IPC has any standard or publication on this topic? Is it
Bellcore compliant?
>What is the issue with BGA for immersion gold?
>
>Thanks again!
>
>Fulton Feng
>
>> ----------
>> From:
>>
"STEVE_O\\'HARA"@HP-Vancouver-om10.om.hp.com[SMTP:"STEVE_O\\'HARA"@HP-Va
nc
>> ouver-om10.om.hp.com]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 10:01 AM
>> To: Feng, Fulton [MPK:5221:EXCH]
>> Cc: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [TN] Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
>>
>> What do you want to know??
>>
>> Raw Board Reliability (solderability)
>> Contact Resistance Reliability?
>> Solder Joint Reliability
>>
>> With regards to Solder Joint Reliability, the solder
interface of the
>>
>> nickel to solder forms tin intermetallics which will not
be as strong
>>
>> as solder to solder. These joints will still be
acceptable for most
>> smt components but immersion gold and BGA's should be
avoided.
>>
>> Regards:
>>
>> Steve O'Hara HP
>>
>>
>> ______________________________ Reply Separator
>> _________________________________
>> Subject: [TN] Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
>> Author: Non-HP-Fulton.Feng.ffeng ([log in to unmask])
at
>> HP-Vancouver,mimegw10
>> Date: 5/12/98 5:39 PM
>>
>>
>> Hi
>> Has anyboy done any reliability study on Gold Immersion PCB
finish?
>>
>> Thanks
>> Fulton Feng
>>
>>
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>> ation.
>> For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at
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>> 847-509-97
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>>
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>>
>
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Josh Moody
Materials Quality Engineer
Hewlett-Packard - Richardson (HPSD)
ph# (972) 497-4617
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 16:01:15 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ellsworth Berkowitz <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ellsworth Berkowitz <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Paradyne Corporation
Subject: Re: tombstoning & unsoldered connections
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Possible causes: Based on your description, I suspect that the solder is
solidifying at different rates, possibly due to different thermal masses inherent in the circuit
layout, a thereby causing the tombstone phenomenon. Are the suspect termination pads attached
directly to or totally part of a large copper plane, without thermal reliefs? These pads would
solidify more slowly, allowing the termination to lift out of the liquid solder. Perhaps the
paste printing process is depositing different paste volumes on the pads? There may be thermal
shadowing from adjacent
components, but that's probably an unlikely scenario with convection
reflow.
I've experienced reflow tombstoning similar to yours with a specific type
of chip component. The parts are EMI filter-capacitors (also called three-terminal capacitors).
They're available in standard package sizes, however, have terminations on all four sides (for
example, check the
Murata Electronics page <http://www.iijnet.or.jp/murata/products/english/catalog/k01eemi.pdf>
using part type NFM40P for a photo and technical specifications). BTW, I'm
not affiliated with this company. Are you dealing with this type of device? Completed
assemblies are in-circuit tested (shorts & opens, values, orientation, etc.) which is certainly a
more consistent process
than visual inspection, once equipment and programs are in place.
Hope this helps solve the problem. Contact me directly if you want to
discuss this further.
Ellsworth D. Berkowitz, P.E.
Member of Technical Staff
Paradyne Corporation
phone:813-530-8121
****************************************************************
The opinions expressed herein are solely those of the writer and
do not necessarily reflect the views of Paradyne Corporation.
****************************************************************
LAMBERT.K.A- wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> We've been working at getting an automated line up and running. We're
> making one sided ceramic substrates. The substrates are both low
> temperature cofired ceramic and thick film copper. Both have a 63/37
> solder coating on the tracks. The substrates have passed
> solderability testing with ease. The pads have been designed
> appropriately to minimize tombstoning. Our components are solderable.
> We stencil print solder paste onto the substrates. A robot places the
> components. Reflow soldering happens in a Nitrogen convection oven.
> We are using RMA solder paste (still!)
>
> Now for the question. Why do we get unsoldered connections? Most are
> chip components where one end solders beautifully, the other end is
> sitting on a rounded mound of solder. The distribution across the
> substrate and from one substrate to the next appears to be random.
>
> To detect unsoldered connections, we are doing the old brute force
> method of having manufacturing personnel looking for them after
> reflow.
>
> What are other folks out there doing to:
> 1. Solve the unsoldered connection problem
> 2. Detect the unsoldered connections
>
> Thank you,
>
> Kathie Lambert
> Process Engineer
> Northrop Grumman
> Baltimore, MD
> [log in to unmask]
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 16:25:54 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bill Garbis <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bill Garbis <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternatives
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Scott,
There's a board house in Houston with a patent on it. I couldn't find =
his card, but I believe Todd Cook, Space Electronics Corp (214-251-3636) =
was his rep and could point you in the right direction.
Bill Garbis
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 15:21:31 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Darrel Therriault <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Darrel Therriault <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: OSP and EMI
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Technet,
My Mechanical Engineers just brought something to my attention that I would
like to get some opinions/advise/info from the TechNet expertise.
We have recently switched from HASL to OSP (Entek 106 I believe) finish for
our boards. We run a ground plane around the perimeter of boards and
backplanes to help with EMI shielding and grounding in general.
Their concern is with the change to OSP finish, we are seeing bare copper
now that is tarnishing/oxidizing and is this still an acceptable grounding
contact where it bolts to the chassis or contacts a cardcage?
Other Questions :
1. When the board is processed (IR) does the OSP get removed or does it
remain, and
is it conductive or an insulator?
2. What are the options for having the ground perimeter copper finished
so it won't
oxidize and will provide a conductive surface for acceptable
ground/EMI contact?
I would appreciate any comments/opinions/advise.
Thanks..........DT
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 15:19:44 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Frequency Response of PCB materials
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I need frequency characterization data of PCB materials including FR-4, =
Polyimide, Cynate Ester, BT resin etc. for Dielectric constant and =
dissipation factor. Does anyone know what resources there are and how I =
can collect this data?
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 08:44:51 +1000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternatives
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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Scott
The PPT is formed with a mesh process ; leaving the checkered imprint on
the surface ; supposedly keeping the flux in place .
You still pay for the stencil ; only shift the process to bare board .
The polished rollers process sounds intriguing .
I've send a reply to this topic few moths back ; it'll be in files ,
incl. the contacts .
From cost , no clean , double sided application , ( you do need a reflow
with chiller of bottom side ), etc. , it is impractical for most of the
assy spectrum . Very limiting and complex on the mix TH & SMD as well .
There are better and cheaper ways how eliminate stencil process ,
pending the application .
See you paul ; ResMed
>----------
>From: Lolmaugh, Scott (AZ15)[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>Sent: Thursday, 14 May 1998 0:15
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternatives
>
>All,
>There was an interesting article in the February issue of SMT Magazine
>(IHS Publishing Group) on page 56, entitled: "End Paste Defects with
>Solid Solder Deposits". This is a technique where the PWB Manufacturer
>applies solder to the board, then runs the boards through polished
>rollers to flatten the solder coating into a flat surface roughly the
>same height as the soldermask. Then a tacky flux is applied and finally
>an easy peel cover sheet. They claim the boards retain solderability
>well and the paste stencil process is eliminated.
>
>There have been similar / identical techniques touted in the past, known
>as:
>"Sipad" (R) Siemens AG, (solderpaste application method)
>"Optipad" (R) Viele Circuits Inc. and Burkle USA, (liquid solder
>application method) and
>"Precision Pad Technology or PPT (R) Mask Technology Inc. (solderpaste
>application w/ textured finish)
>
>If anyone knows of domestic (USA) Manufacturers offering this technology,
>I'd like to hear who they are.
>Thanks
>Best Regards,
>Scott Lolmaugh
>SMT Production Engineering
>Honeywell IAC, Inc.
>602.313.3551 /FAX: 3402 (Please call first)
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>From: [log in to unmask]
>Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 8:39 AM
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: [TN] HASL alternatives
>
>To All,
>We are now making a comparison between different alternatives to HASL.
>The
>chosen alternative will have to meet the following criterias criterias.
>
> - flat coating
> - compatible with No-clean process and mixed technology
> - resistant to 2-3 reflow (multiple heat cycle)
> -and MINIMUM 1 year shelf life (storage before assembly)
>
>These are the alternatives we think can meet our needs:
>
>* OSP
> - Benzimidazole (?)
>
>* IMMERSION
> - Silver
> - Bismuth
> - Au-Ni
> - Palladium
>
>
>Q: Wich one do you think could be the best meet to our criterias ?
>
>Q: And what would be its advantage(s) compared to the others ?
>
>Q: OTHERS ? (is anyone using other coating alternative )
>
>
>Thanks for all for your help
>
>
>Nicolas van der Heyden
>
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 09:20:17 +1000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Michael Yarrow <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Michael Yarrow <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Leaded Vs SMD PWAs
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear TechNetters
I have a question about PCBs using leaded components versus PCBs using SMD
components.
Can anyone direct me to information that answers the following questions ?
(My application involves development of products for a commercial
environment. However, it is a requirement that we achieve long MTBFs over
the standard commercial temperature range).
1. What are the criteria that should be used when deciding at the beginning
of a product development cycle whether to use SMD components or leaded
components on PCBs ?
2. I know, for example, one such criterion is mechanical stress and
acceleration of the completed board and assembly. Above what value of g's
is SMD-based PWAs yield unacceptable short- and long-term reliability ?
(This is why, I believe, that the aviation industry continues to use leaded
component assembly methods).
3. Any other important criteria that must be considered.
Thanks in advance
Michael Yarrow
Techniplan International Pty Ltd
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 16:37:03 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Wally Doeling (wallyd)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Wally Doeling (wallyd)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternatives
X-To: Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
The PPT process is very useful for controlling solder deposits
especially on fine pitch and micro-BGA parts as well as on very fine designs
used for direct chip attach using a CC-4 approach.
This process provides a very defined volume of solder which cannot be
accomplished by normal stencil printing and if that is your goal, I think
that the economics work out very well. The cost is a lot less than you will
get with other
solder deposit methods I have looked at!
Contact: JoAnne DeBlis
714-557-3383
[log in to unmask]
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Klasek [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 3:45 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternatives
Scott
The PPT is formed with a mesh process ; leaving the checkered imprint
on
the surface ; supposedly keeping the flux in place .
You still pay for the stencil ; only shift the process to bare board
.
The polished rollers process sounds intriguing .
I've send a reply to this topic few moths back ; it'll be in files ,
incl. the contacts .
From cost , no clean , double sided application , ( you do need a
reflow
with chiller of bottom side ), etc. , it is impractical for most of
the
assy spectrum . Very limiting and complex on the mix TH & SMD as well
.
There are better and cheaper ways how eliminate stencil process ,
pending the application .
See you paul ; ResMed
>----------
>From: Lolmaugh, Scott (AZ15)[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>Sent: Thursday, 14 May 1998 0:15
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternatives
>
>All,
>There was an interesting article in the February issue of SMT
Magazine
>(IHS Publishing Group) on page 56, entitled: "End Paste Defects with
>Solid Solder Deposits". This is a technique where the PWB
Manufacturer
>applies solder to the board, then runs the boards through polished
>rollers to flatten the solder coating into a flat surface roughly
the
>same height as the soldermask. Then a tacky flux is applied and
finally
>an easy peel cover sheet. They claim the boards retain
solderability
>well and the paste stencil process is eliminated.
>
>There have been similar / identical techniques touted in the past,
known
>as:
>"Sipad" (R) Siemens AG, (solderpaste application method)
>"Optipad" (R) Viele Circuits Inc. and Burkle USA, (liquid solder
>application method) and
>"Precision Pad Technology or PPT (R) Mask Technology Inc.
(solderpaste
>application w/ textured finish)
>
>If anyone knows of domestic (USA) Manufacturers offering this
technology,
>I'd like to hear who they are.
>Thanks
>Best Regards,
>Scott Lolmaugh
>SMT Production Engineering
>Honeywell IAC, Inc.
>602.313.3551 /FAX: 3402 (Please call first)
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>From: [log in to unmask]
>Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 8:39 AM
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: [TN] HASL alternatives
>
>To All,
>We are now making a comparison between different alternatives to
HASL.
>The
>chosen alternative will have to meet the following criterias
criterias.
>
> - flat coating
> - compatible with No-clean process and mixed technology
> - resistant to 2-3 reflow (multiple heat cycle)
> -and MINIMUM 1 year shelf life (storage before assembly)
>
>These are the alternatives we think can meet our needs:
>
>* OSP
> - Benzimidazole (?)
>
>* IMMERSION
> - Silver
> - Bismuth
> - Au-Ni
> - Palladium
>
>
>Q: Wich one do you think could be the best meet to our criterias ?
>
>Q: And what would be its advantage(s) compared to the others ?
>
>Q: OTHERS ? (is anyone using other coating alternative )
>
>
>Thanks for all for your help
>
>
>Nicolas van der Heyden
>
>################################################################
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 17:25:01 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Douglas Mckean <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Auspex Systems
Subject: Re: OSP and EMI
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi Darrel,
Think of any oxide layer as an insulator - poor carrier of current.
As long as the bolts use a star washer that punches through the
oxide when turned down, you're *probably* okey. Depends upon alot
of things though - how thick the oxide layer is, if the bolts
are going into floating pems (not the best connection to ground
anyway), torque on the bolts, etc ...
Don't know about OSP or other options for copper finishing.
Darrel Therriault wrote:
>
> Technet,
>
> My Mechanical Engineers just brought something to my attention that I would
> like to get some opinions/advise/info from the TechNet expertise.
>
> We have recently switched from HASL to OSP (Entek 106 I believe) finish for
> our boards. We run a ground plane around the perimeter of boards and
> backplanes to help with EMI shielding and grounding in general.
>
> Their concern is with the change to OSP finish, we are seeing bare copper
> now that is tarnishing/oxidizing and is this still an acceptable grounding
> contact where it bolts to the chassis or contacts a cardcage?
>
> Other Questions :
>
> 1. When the board is processed (IR) does the OSP get removed or does it
> remain, and
> is it conductive or an insulator?
>
> 2. What are the options for having the ground perimeter copper finished
> so it won't
> oxidize and will provide a conductive surface for acceptable
> ground/EMI contact?
>
> I would appreciate any comments/opinions/advise.
>
> Thanks..........DT
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 20:41:29 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Michael Carano <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Michael Carano <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: ec
Subject: Re: Solder Ball?
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Alvin Leong wrote:
>
> Hi Technetee,
> Anyone experience the solder ball appearing in the no-clean process?
> What is the contributor? I forseen a misprinted PCB on the solder paste
> station is one of it.
> 1. What is the recommendation on the smear board cleaning procedure?
> 2. Ultra-sonic cleaner?
> 3. What type of chemical?
> 4. If an ultra-sonic is the solution, then what is the side impact to
> the package on double-sided process?
>
> Hope anyone can share the info.
>
> Thks.
>
> ################################################################
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> ################################################################Generally,in the no clean process, as I understand, solder balls are more
prevalent.
You can try the following to see if it helps:
1. Lower preheat temperature
2. Is there sufficient flux on the board?(wave solder)
3. Soldermask: glossy or matte? The matte masks are less [prone to
solder balls.
4. Is mask properly cured? Try an extended UV cycle to harden the
mask.
Good luck
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 12:03:45 +1000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternatives
X-To: "Wally Doeling (wallyd)" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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I would not say that there are no dearer deposit methods Wally .
And you're right on fine control on high first pass yields demands it
does justify itself .
But we'd have it uphill to convince Kathy with 99.3 on silver on first
go to switch over .
We just passed 50K on switch pad (carbon pill) life cycle ; this silver
is even versatile on contact .
Steam to follow . That is AlphaLevel .
It is interesting the top organic coat does have little effect on
resistance .
>----------
>From: Wally Doeling (wallyd)[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>Sent: Thursday, 14 May 1998 9:37
>To: Paul Klasek; 'TechNet E-Mail Forum.'
>Cc: Wally Doeling (wallyd)
>Subject: RE: [TN] HASL alternatives
>
> The PPT process is very useful for controlling solder deposits
>especially on fine pitch and micro-BGA parts as well as on very fine designs
>used for direct chip attach using a CC-4 approach.
> This process provides a very defined volume of solder which cannot be
>accomplished by normal stencil printing and if that is your goal, I think
>that the economics work out very well. The cost is a lot less than you will
>get with other
>solder deposit methods I have looked at!
>
> Contact: JoAnne DeBlis
> 714-557-3383
>
> [log in to unmask]
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Paul Klasek [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 3:45 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternatives
>
> Scott
> The PPT is formed with a mesh process ; leaving the checkered imprint
>on
> the surface ; supposedly keeping the flux in place .
> You still pay for the stencil ; only shift the process to bare board
>.
> The polished rollers process sounds intriguing .
> I've send a reply to this topic few moths back ; it'll be in files ,
> incl. the contacts .
> From cost , no clean , double sided application , ( you do need a
>reflow
> with chiller of bottom side ), etc. , it is impractical for most of
>the
> assy spectrum . Very limiting and complex on the mix TH & SMD as well
>.
> There are better and cheaper ways how eliminate stencil process ,
> pending the application .
>
> See you paul ; ResMed
>
> >----------
> >From: Lolmaugh, Scott (AZ15)[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> >Sent: Thursday, 14 May 1998 0:15
> >To: [log in to unmask]
> >Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternatives
> >
> >All,
> >There was an interesting article in the February issue of SMT
>Magazine
> >(IHS Publishing Group) on page 56, entitled: "End Paste Defects with
> >Solid Solder Deposits". This is a technique where the PWB
>Manufacturer
> >applies solder to the board, then runs the boards through polished
> >rollers to flatten the solder coating into a flat surface roughly
>the
> >same height as the soldermask. Then a tacky flux is applied and
>finally
> >an easy peel cover sheet. They claim the boards retain
>solderability
> >well and the paste stencil process is eliminated.
> >
> >There have been similar / identical techniques touted in the past,
>known
> >as:
> >"Sipad" (R) Siemens AG, (solderpaste application method)
> >"Optipad" (R) Viele Circuits Inc. and Burkle USA, (liquid solder
> >application method) and
> >"Precision Pad Technology or PPT (R) Mask Technology Inc.
>(solderpaste
> >application w/ textured finish)
> >
> >If anyone knows of domestic (USA) Manufacturers offering this
>technology,
> >I'd like to hear who they are.
> >Thanks
> >Best Regards,
> >Scott Lolmaugh
> >SMT Production Engineering
> >Honeywell IAC, Inc.
> >602.313.3551 /FAX: 3402 (Please call first)
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> >From: [log in to unmask]
> >Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 8:39 AM
> >To: [log in to unmask]
> >Subject: [TN] HASL alternatives
> >
> >To All,
> >We are now making a comparison between different alternatives to
>HASL.
> >The
> >chosen alternative will have to meet the following criterias
>criterias.
> >
> > - flat coating
> > - compatible with No-clean process and mixed technology
> > - resistant to 2-3 reflow (multiple heat cycle)
> > -and MINIMUM 1 year shelf life (storage before assembly)
> >
> >These are the alternatives we think can meet our needs:
> >
> >* OSP
> > - Benzimidazole (?)
> >
> >* IMMERSION
> > - Silver
> > - Bismuth
> > - Au-Ni
> > - Palladium
> >
> >
> >Q: Wich one do you think could be the best meet to our criterias ?
> >
> >Q: And what would be its advantage(s) compared to the others ?
> >
> >Q: OTHERS ? (is anyone using other coating alternative )
> >
> >
> >Thanks for all for your help
> >
> >
> >Nicolas van der Heyden
> >
> >################################################################
> >TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using
>LISTSERV
> >1.8c
> >################################################################
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>additional
> > information.
> >For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at [log in to unmask]
>or
> > 847-509-9700 ext.311
> >################################################################
> >
> >################################################################
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 00:06:02 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
GuitarBud <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: GuitarBud <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: stop TECHNET
X-To: [log in to unmask]
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The Technet has shown me where consensus lies and where varying opinion rules.
The cross-pollination and variety of subjects have been extraordinarily
useful.
I would hope the format doesn't change.
Frank
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 00:14:37 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
GuitarBud <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: GuitarBud <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency Response of PCB materials
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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I have had good luck in going right to the manufacturers for this information.
GE's GETEK, among others, have done a thorough job with characterizing their
material. Sometimes their websites have the necessary data.
Frank
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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 23:19:34 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Gwen Merchant <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Gwen Merchant <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: dual stropline
X-To: Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii"
You can download a free calculator from our website www.polar.co.uk we will also release an enhanced calculator in
around 6 to 8 weeks
Best Regards
At 10:29 13/05/98 -0500, you wrote:
>Try the automata website:
>http://www.automata.com/capblity/spectech/z0/z0.htm
>
>This page describes each type of construction and there
>is also a modeling package that allows you to input data
>and get impedance values.
>
>good luck,
>
>
>
>At 10:58 AM 5/13/98 -0400, you wrote:
>>Try Polar Instruments.
>>
>>----------
>>> From: [log in to unmask]
>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>> Subject: [TN] dual stropline
>>> Date: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 10:20 AM
>>>
>>> I am looking to see if anyone has the calculations for " Dual
>>> Stripline " controlled impedance in a spreadsheet type of formula. I
>>> have all the others, but this particular type has just reared it's
>>> ugly head, and we haven't done this board type before. I am just
>>> trying to make sure that my calculations, and lay-ups are accurate.
>>> Keep in mind I'm not a Math Wizard, hence the need for the
>>spreadsheet
>>> type of format. Any help will be deeply appreciated. If what you
>>have
>>> is not proprietary e-mail to [log in to unmask] with any help or
>>> files. Again, thanks in advance.
>>>
>>>
>>> Ernie Smith
>>>
>>> Electropac Co. Inc.
>>>
>>> ################################################################
>>> TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV
>>1.8c
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>>information.
>>> For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at [log in to unmask] or
>>847-509-9700 ext.311
>>> ################################################################
>>>
>>
>>################################################################
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>>################################################################
>>
>>
>Josh Moody
>Materials Quality Engineer
>Hewlett-Packard - Richardson (HPSD)
>ph# (972) 497-4617
>[log in to unmask]
>
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>
>
Best Regards
Gwen Merchant - Marketing Secretary
Polar Instruments Ltd.
Tel: +44 1481 53081
Fax: +44 1481 52476
http://www.polar.co.uk
<color><param>0000,0000,8080</param>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
</color>World Leaders in PCB Faultfinding
and
Controlled Impedance Measurement
<color><param>0000,0000,8080</param>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++</color>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 05:30:32 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David D Sullivan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David D Sullivan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Fab/Assy:Process (Philosophy Question)
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hi TechNet!
In a former life, I met the late Jim Bryan and was treated to several
lectures on "What a 'process' is". He also wrote a series of articles on
this subject for PC Fab which I no longer have (sometimes you just have to
clean house).
Does anyone still have a copy of these articles they could fax to me?
Please reply offline. Also, I WILL contact PC Fab myself.
Also, I would like to have the TechNet's opinion of what a 'process' is to
them. I am about to enter into this discussion with a bunch of assembly
folks (I'm just a board guy, you know) who think I ought to be able to spec
in the boards so they can go through all of their 'processes' no matter how
they control them, several sites, one material.
As I recall, (and, trust me, I used to be able to recite this in my sleep)
Jim said that the process window had to be large enough so that a variety
of materials can run through without a change in process parameters, and
all of these materials will acquire the desired characteristics of the
outcome of the process. In other words, you shouldn't have to change your
process every time something different comes along and you should be able
to run a lot of different materials through your process. A robust process
has a window you could drive a truck through.
Anyone care to continue this discussion? My apologies to those who don't
like this sort of thing on TechNet.
Regards,
Dave Sullivan
Rockwell Collins
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 07:55:21 -0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Collins, Graham" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Collins, Graham" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: OSP and EMI
X-To: Darrel Therriault <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Hi Darrel
Definitely use a star washer or some washer type that will bite through the
oxidisation layer. Another option, if you are doing SMT on the boards, is
to screen solder paste on the ground plane in a pattern that will contact
the bolt head. Have seen this done on a board that needed a good ground
path, 150k produced with no ill effects.
regards,
Graham Collins
Process Engineer
Litton Systems Canada
(902) 873-2000 extension 215
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Darrel Therriault [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 7:22 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] OSP and EMI
>
> Technet,
>
> My Mechanical Engineers just brought something to my attention that I
> would
> like to get some opinions/advise/info from the TechNet expertise.
>
> We have recently switched from HASL to OSP (Entek 106 I believe) finish
> for
> our boards. We run a ground plane around the perimeter of boards and
> backplanes to help with EMI shielding and grounding in general.
>
> Their concern is with the change to OSP finish, we are seeing bare copper
> now that is tarnishing/oxidizing and is this still an acceptable grounding
> contact where it bolts to the chassis or contacts a cardcage?
>
> Other Questions :
>
> 1. When the board is processed (IR) does the OSP get removed or does it
> remain, and
> is it conductive or an insulator?
>
> 2. What are the options for having the ground perimeter copper finished
> so it won't
> oxidize and will provide a conductive surface for acceptable
> ground/EMI contact?
>
> I would appreciate any comments/opinions/advise.
>
> Thanks..........DT
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 11:57:39 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Eddie Brunker <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Eddie Brunker <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Fab/Assy:Process (Philosophy Question)
X-To: David D Sullivan <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
A wide process window is essential. I beleive that design for
manufacturability is the key to generating a wide process window. The PCB
finish will help marginally but ultimately it's down to good design
processes. At the design / layout stage of an assembly it's important to
consider the process flow for the assembly and that means taking the
capabilities of the materials and equipment into account, when designing the
pad geometries, clearances, component positions etc..
You need to know what materials/machines are going to be used, if many and
varied you still need to know what they are.
If you don't design manufacturability for a given process set up at the
outset then you can forget it you will never have a wide process window.
Regards
At 05:30 14/05/98 -0500, you wrote:
>Hi TechNet!
>
>In a former life, I met the late Jim Bryan and was treated to several
>lectures on "What a 'process' is". He also wrote a series of articles on
>this subject for PC Fab which I no longer have (sometimes you just have to
>clean house).
>
>Does anyone still have a copy of these articles they could fax to me?
>Please reply offline. Also, I WILL contact PC Fab myself.
>
>Also, I would like to have the TechNet's opinion of what a 'process' is to
>them. I am about to enter into this discussion with a bunch of assembly
>folks (I'm just a board guy, you know) who think I ought to be able to spec
>in the boards so they can go through all of their 'processes' no matter how
>they control them, several sites, one material.
>
>As I recall, (and, trust me, I used to be able to recite this in my sleep)
>Jim said that the process window had to be large enough so that a variety
>of materials can run through without a change in process parameters, and
>all of these materials will acquire the desired characteristics of the
>outcome of the process. In other words, you shouldn't have to change your
>process every time something different comes along and you should be able
>to run a lot of different materials through your process. A robust process
>has a window you could drive a truck through.
>
>Anyone care to continue this discussion? My apologies to those who don't
>like this sort of thing on TechNet.
>
>Regards,
>
>Dave Sullivan
>Rockwell Collins
>
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 08:55:16 -0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Collins, Graham" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Collins, Graham" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistors
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD7F2F.2958E8C8"
This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.
------ =_NextPart_000_01BD7F2F.2958E8C8
Content-Type: text/plain
Good day Technet.
I'm currently battling with our parts guys over inventory control of
components. For the big stuff like ICs it is fairly easy to count them, but
for chip caps / resistors it is more difficult to count them 'cause they are
on tape and reel. I've suggested the technique of measuring the length of
tape and dividing by the pitch, but our inventory guys want something
automated.
I'm sure such a thing exists, but have no idea where to begin looking. Can
a Technet guru point me in the direction of an automated counting machine
for counting parts on tape and reel? Please reply off the Technet if it
sounds like an advert.
Thanks,
Graham Collins
Process Engineer
Litton Systems Canada
(902) 873-2000 extension 215
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 08:08:34 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Lustig, Steven K.." <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Lustig, Steven K.." <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistors
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Graham,
We have a V-tek PC-2500 Motorized SMD Taped Parts Counter which we have
given to our stockroom for those same inventory purposes. They are
happy with it and find it easy to use. Basically, you place the reel on
one spindle, feed the tape through the counting sprocket and into a
second reel. It is motorized so it counts fairly quickly and you can
then quickly rewind the reel to get the tape back the way it started and
double-check your count at the same time. Note that this equipment,
like others I am aware of, counts the holes on the tape adjacent to the
component pockets rather than the components themselves. So, if you are
missing parts somewhere in the middle of the of the tape, it will not
tell you this.
Hope this helps
-Steve
Steven K. Lustig
Process Engineer
EMS Technologies, Inc.
Norcross, GA
(770) 263-9200 x4714
[log in to unmask]
>----------
>From: Collins, Graham[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 7:55 AM
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistors
>
>Good day Technet.
>I'm currently battling with our parts guys over inventory control of
>components. For the big stuff like ICs it is fairly easy to count them, but
>for chip caps / resistors it is more difficult to count them 'cause they are
>on tape and reel. I've suggested the technique of measuring the length of
>tape and dividing by the pitch, but our inventory guys want something
>automated.
>I'm sure such a thing exists, but have no idea where to begin looking. Can a
>Technet guru point me in the direction of an automated counting machine for
>counting parts on tape and reel? Please reply off the Technet if it sounds
>like an advert.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Graham Collins
>Process Engineer
>Litton Systems Canada
>(902) 873-2000 extension 215
>
>
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 06:31:02 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Dave Willhard <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Dave P Willhard <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistors
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 06:10:20 PDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Milind Rao <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Milind Rao <[log in to unmask]>
Content-Type: text/plain
Hi
We are getting particles in both component holes / via holes on and off
and in double sided / multilayer boards. This is observed after pattern
plating
We use High build copper and Pattern plating.
In some holes the particles are severe and reduce the hole size
considerably. The problem is occuring very randomly.
Has anybody got remedy for this ?
Thanks in advance for the help
Milind
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 09:23:56 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Fab/Assy:Process (Philosophy Question)
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Dr. Dave:
I think that you are one of the industries bright lights, but sometimes you
can advance some of the wierdest questions.
Dave, at the end of the day, we all want processes that have as wide a window
as is possible, but with some processes, it is simply not possible, and with
others, it may cost something, either economic, or from a quality point of
view, and simply is not worth it.
A classic example is the etcher, who would ever try to set up an etch process
that could handle any weight of Copper, from 1/4 oz to 3 oz???
Clearly this is a question that must address not only the particular process,
but also the variation in materials that it is possible/likely to see.
Rudy Sedlak
RD Chemical Company
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 08:31:23 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Peggi Blakley <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Peggi Blakley <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistors
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 06:31:24 PDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Milind Rao <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Milind Rao <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Particles in holes
Content-Type: text/plain
Sorry for my earlier mail without subject
------------
Hi
We are getting particles in both component holes / via holes on and off
and in double sided / multilayer boards. This is observed after pattern
plating
We use High build copper and Pattern plating.
In some holes the particles are severe and reduce the hole size
considerably. The problem is occuring very randomly.
Has anybody got remedy for this ?
Thanks in advance for the help
Milind
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 23:53:13 +1000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Nicholas Kane <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Nicholas Kane <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Storing PCB's
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I am confused.
For years, I have understood that the best way to store pcb's prior to
assembly is in a heated, relatively dry environment. I am sure that the
general consensus amongst most manufactureres is that this works best.
Well, just recently I was told by a company setting up a new facility that
they had been advised by a well known consultant to use a cold dry
environment. They are planning a 12-14 degree Celsius storeroom, once
again relatively dry.
Is there new thinking on this, or have they been badly advised?
[Nicholas Kane]
[Axion Australasia]
[Suite 3, 651 Canterbury Road]
[Surrey Hills]
[Victoria 3127 Australia]
[tel: 613 9899 3511 fax: 613 9899 3811]
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 09:30:40 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kevin Coggins <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kevin Coggins <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistors
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 10:09:00 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Goldman, Patricia J." <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Goldman, Patricia J." <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / re
sistors
X-To: Peggi Blakley <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Please do not send attachments over TechNet. They clog up the system.
----------
From: Peggi Blakley
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors /
resistors
Date: Thursday, May 14, 1998 9:31AM
<<File Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT>>
<<File Attachment: winmail.dat>>
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 09:06:25 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
X-To: Fulton Feng <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Hi Fulton! There has been some industry issues with BGA's and immersion
gold/electroless nickel finishes (there was a very good paper given at the
IPC PWB Surface Finishes Summit by Z. Mei of HP). The problem is/has been
solder joint failure of large BGA packages at the nickel/solder interface
after assembly. There is a team of folks lead by Bruce Houghten of
Celestica looking into the issues and they will be reporting their
investigation results periodically. Also, because of the BGA's finite
solder volume the issue of gold embrittlement has sometimes been discussed.
Most problems surrounding the gold embrittlement of BGA solder joints were
due to insufficient reflow time to allow the dissolution of the gold into
the solder joint. Good Luck.
Dave Hillman
Rockwell Collins
[log in to unmask]
Fulton Feng <[log in to unmask]> on 05/13/98 12:30:04 PM
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond
to Fulton Feng <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: David D Hillman/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
Subject: Re: [TN] Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
Hi Steve, thank you for your comment! What I really want to know is the
reliability of the product by using immersion gold PCB, including solder
joint reliablity and integrity of the PCB after process. Do you know
whether
IPC has any standard or publication on this topic? Is it Bellcore
compliant?
What is the issue with BGA for immersion gold?
Thanks again!
Fulton Feng
> ----------
> From:
>
"STEVE_O\\'HARA"@HP-Vancouver-om10.om.hp.com[SMTP:"STEVE_O\\'HARA"@HP-Vanc
> ouver-om10.om.hp.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 10:01 AM
> To: Feng, Fulton [MPK:5221:EXCH]
> Cc: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
>
> What do you want to know??
>
> Raw Board Reliability (solderability)
> Contact Resistance Reliability?
> Solder Joint Reliability
>
> With regards to Solder Joint Reliability, the solder interface of
the
>
> nickel to solder forms tin intermetallics which will not be as
strong
>
> as solder to solder. These joints will still be acceptable for most
> smt components but immersion gold and BGA's should be avoided.
>
> Regards:
>
> Steve O'Hara HP
>
>
> ______________________________ Reply Separator
> _________________________________
> Subject: [TN] Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
> Author: Non-HP-Fulton.Feng.ffeng ([log in to unmask]) at
> HP-Vancouver,mimegw10
> Date: 5/12/98 5:39 PM
>
>
> Hi
> Has anyboy done any reliability study on Gold Immersion PCB finish?
>
> Thanks
> Fulton Feng
>
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 09:46:30 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Lisa Williams <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Lisa Williams <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: DES/FAB: New machine??
X-To: [log in to unmask]
X-cc: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
We received the following inquiry off our webpage.
Any ideas out there?
Lisa Williams
IPC Staff
Northbrook, IL
www.ipc.org
IPC Internet Feedback Form
Name: Iosif
Company: blank
E-Mail: i [log in to unmask]
Comments:
The company I work for designs brand new stuff
(in the electronic field). But there's a little
problem which seems to be greater than just
a little one. When we finaly have our designed
(multiple-layered) board (in a computer file)
ready, we have to stay idle for about a month
until it is handled to us. So, what we are
looking for is the following : A device (a whole
machine maybe) attached to a PC, which can produce
our board in (lets say) a couple of days,
and which communicates with the most common
designer's sofware. If you think you can be
helpful in any way, please answer straight to the
address given. Thank you for your time.
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 07:58:37 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kenny Bloomquist <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kenny Bloomquist <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Gold Solder Pot
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Fellow TechNeters,
We manufacture hardware for DOD per ANSI J-STD-001 and I have a couple of
questions regarding solder pots for removing gold from components prior to
tinning and soldering.
We send out solder samples for testing from our tinning and gold stripping
solder pots every thirty days. To answer the question of "what do you do
with parts that were tinned while the solder pot is being tested (and the
test fails)" we shut the pot down until the test results come back. The
problem is we only have one gold pot and don't want to shut it down during
testing. How does your companies address this issue? Is it fair to assume
that since there is a secondary tinning operation that the small amount of
gold that may remain on the parts will not be a problem? Do you dump the
pot every thirty days?
My second question is, what is the maximum amount of gold that can be plated
on a terminal and still be soldered into an assembly with only tinning and
not cleaning? Is there a specification that allows this?
Thanks in advance for all responses.
Ken Bloomquist
Sr. Principal Process Eng.
PRIMEX Aerospace Company
[log in to unmask]
(425) 881-8990 ext. 6645
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 11:04:02 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Karl Sweitzer <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Karl Sweitzer <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Image Acquisition Systems http://www.kodak.com/cgsHome/ias.shtml
Subject: Re: Leaded Vs SMD PWAs
X-cc: Michael Yarrow <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Michael,
Here are some answers IMHO to your questions. These are sensitive
topics for some people but here goes:
Michael Yarrow wrote:
>
> Dear TechNetters
>
> I have a question about PCBs using leaded components versus PCBs using SMD
> components...snip...
> (My application involves development of products for a commercial
> environment. However, it is a requirement that we achieve long MTBFs over
> the standard commercial temperature range).
>
> 1. What are the criteria that should be used when deciding at the beginning
> of a product development cycle whether to use SMD components or leaded
> components on PCBs ?
I believe in a life cycle approach to determining fatigue life
(reliability) of electronic assemblies. The clock starts after the
board has been assembled (soldered one or both sides). Any rework or
testing that occurs will start to accumulate damage and reduce life.
Some testing (e.g. Environmental Stress Screening (ESS)) is designed
to induce enough damage to weed out latent defects but not a
significant amount to drastically reduce the life of good parts. One
rule I have been taught is that ESS damage should be 1% of the total
life cycle.
>
> 2. I know, for example, one such criterion is mechanical stress and
> acceleration of the completed board and assembly. Above what value of g's
> is SMD-based PWAs yield unacceptable short- and long-term reliability ?
> (This is why, I believe, that the aviation industry continues to use leaded
> component assembly methods).
Most of the avionic industry is going away from through hole parts for
a number of reasons: part obsolescence, increased I/O count & density,
smaller size and weight to name a few. Engineers have found ways to
make surface mount (SMT) components (leaded, leadless, BGA, COB and
chip scale) work for extreme environments. One common method is to
mount 2 single sided SMT assemblies to a common heatsink core (6"x6" ~
SEM-E size). This assembly can be made very rigid (with natural
frequencies above 500 Hz) and can have low thermal resistances. The
advanced composites heatsink materials such as Aluminum Silicon
Carbide (AlSiC), Beryllium Beryllium Oxide (BeBeO) have high
stiffness, low CTE, and good thermal conductivity.
My point here is that with enough time, money and engineering
resources, SMT can and is used very reliably for avionics. In fact,
some of the latest designs would not be possible without SMT!
Your questions about a specific g level depend on the type of dynamic
event. I have seen random vibration inputs for aircraft avionic boxes
over 25 grms and pyroshock (SRS) inputs for spacecraft boxes over 3000
g. In both cases the boxes used SMT assemblies. I am sure others out
there have seen higher levels.
The main criteria to consider is to minimize strains and stress
(thermal and dynamic) in the component connections and the PWBs
themselves. David Steinberg's two books "Cooling Techniques for
Electronic Equipment" and "Vibration Analysis for Electronic
Equipment" are two of the best (but sometimes very conservative) books
in this area.
>
> 3. Any other important criteria that must be considered.
>
One very important step in doing any analysis is to have a good
understanding of the environments that your products will see. Think
life cycle: everything from in house testing through transportation to
market and finally in service conditions should be considered.
> Thanks in advance
>
> Michael Yarrow
> Techniplan International Pty Ltd
> [log in to unmask]
--
Karl Sweitzer voice: 716.47.77546
Eastman Kodak Company pager: 716.25.33681
800 Lee Road fax: 716.47.77293
Rochester, NY 14650-3118 mailto:[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 16:22:48 PDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ian Squires <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ian Squires <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gold Solder Pot
X-To: Kenny Bloomquist <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Fellow TechNeters,
We manufacture hardware for DOD per ANSI J-STD-001 and I have a couple =
of
questions regarding solder pots for removing gold from components prior =
to
tinning and soldering.
We send out solder samples for testing from our tinning and gold strippin=
g
solder pots every thirty days. To answer the question of "what do you =
do
with parts that were tinned while the solder pot is being tested (and the
test fails)" we shut the pot down until the test results come back. The
problem is we only have one gold pot and don't want to shut it down durin=
g
testing. How does your companies address this issue? Is it fair to assu=
me
that since there is a secondary tinning operation that the small amount =
of
gold that may remain on the parts will not be a problem? Do you dump the
pot every thirty days?
The answer to this one is based on the criteria you are basing your solde=
r analysis on.
If you have a limit of x amount of gold in your solder sample and you can=
show that after thirty days you accumulate y
amount of gold in your solder pot then the decision is based on what 'saf=
e' limit you decide to set.
eg
limit =3D 100
30 days gives a reading of 20
then it follows
1) if your production is 'steady' then no way will your pot rise to 100 =
in less than say 60 more days
and any production going through during this period is 'safe'
2)think about changing the frequency of solder analysis to more accuratel=
y reflect your throughput (you
should always receive test results giving you the ok if you tighten up =
on this)
My second question is, what is the maximum amount of gold that can be pla=
ted
on a terminal and still be soldered into an assembly with only tinning =
and
not cleaning? Is there a specification that allows this?
we work to an internal spec that allows up to 1.3% gold in
a solder joint (excess of this and ductility will be impaired and the
joint will become brittle). Other opinions state as low as 0.4% (by volum=
e)
of gold in a joint
Thanks in advance for all responses.
Hope this advances your search
Ken Bloomquist
Sr. Principal Process Eng.
PRIMEX Aerospace Company
[log in to unmask]
(425) 881-8990 ext. 6645
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Regards
Ian Squires
Senior Production Engineer
-------------------------------------------------------
Graseby Dynamics Ltd
Park Avenue, Bushey, Watford, Herts, WD2 2BW
Web Site: www.gradyn.co.uk
Phone: 01923-228566 xt 295
Fax: 01923-221361
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
Registered in England no. 480992
Registered office:
765 Finchley Road, London, NW11 8DS
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 11:33:52 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Kane, Joseph" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Kane, Joseph" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Capacitor Damage At Wave Solder
X-cc: "Sines, John G" <[log in to unmask]>,
"Hartford Jr, Theodore R" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain
We are experiencing failures of .25% film capacitors, presumably from heat
damage during wave solder. Top side preheat temperatures measured 210F,
within the process range we like. Tried cooling it down to 163F topside,
got more solder defects, and some caps still going out of tolerance. We
suspect that parts can't take thermal transfer during transit through the
wave, where topside gets about 100F warmer (of course part bodies see less).
Manufacturer says no, it's our preheat, still too high at 163F, even though
they claim that the film can withstand 284F in the preheat zone. Boards are
at least 10 layers with planes, and soldering cooler than 163 will mean lots
of defects, especially where the RMA doesn't dry out or activate properly.
Speeding up the conveyor results in lots of top side insufficients. Hand
soldering works, but is expensive. Can't live with these parts, can't flush
them. Should we consider cooler preheat, or are there other wave solder
tricks we can try?
Joe Kane
Lockheed Martin Control Systems
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 08:45:43 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Joseph Fjelstad <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Joseph Fjelstad <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: DES/FAB: New machine??
X-To: Lisa Williams <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Why would you not use a quick turn prototype fabricator?
At 07:46 AM 5/14/98 -0700, you wrote:
>We received the following inquiry off our webpage.
>
>Any ideas out there?
>
>Lisa Williams
>IPC Staff
>Northbrook, IL
>www.ipc.org
>
>IPC Internet Feedback Form
>Name: Iosif
>Company: blank
>E-Mail: i [log in to unmask]
>
>Comments:
>
> The company I work for designs brand new stuff
>(in the electronic field). But there's a little
>problem which seems to be greater than just
>a little one. When we finaly have our designed
>(multiple-layered) board (in a computer file)
>ready, we have to stay idle for about a month
>until it is handled to us. So, what we are
>looking for is the following : A device (a whole
>machine maybe) attached to a PC, which can produce
>our board in (lets say) a couple of days,
>and which communicates with the most common
>designer's sofware. If you think you can be
>helpful in any way, please answer straight to the
>address given. Thank you for your time.
>
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>For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at [log in to unmask] or
847-509-9700 ext.311
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>
>
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 10:44:04 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jerry Cupples <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jerry Cupples <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Fellow TN'ers,
My Eudora Pro 3.1 is not dealing with certain email attachment files on
postings to TechNet the past few days.
These are ususally named something like:
rfc822.txt 6
vcard.vcf 29
ATTRIBS.BND
att1.unk 9
It seems that these attachments are sometimes uuencoded, and that in some
cases th result is that my mail program stops downloading messages, or even
hangs up.
It has been suggested by TechNet insiders that my software is to blame, and
that I "contact my system administrator for a software upgrade". Since I of
course know I have the best computer in the world with the latest software,
and would never let anyone from MIS touch my treasured 20th Anniversary
Mac, this is not the desired answer.
So I put this question to you...
Why not change the mailserver software to strip all email attachments
before remailing postings to the list?
It seems to me that most of these are some sort of bell and whistle thing
for email display which some new mail programs generate. I don't need that,
myself, it just bloats the hard drive further.
The effect would be that it would prevent the attachment of resumes, GIF's
and other such stuff going out to the list, but my thought is that this
might be a good thing. I cannot recall the distribution of a useful
attachment via this listserver.
Is this good thinking, or bad?
regards,
Jerry Cupples
Interphase Corporation
Dallas, TX USA (now a hockey town, too)
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 08:56:06 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Steve Hawn <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Steve Hawn <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
Excellent idea! But may be hard to implement.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jerry Cupples [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 8:44 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
Fellow TN'ers,
My Eudora Pro 3.1 is not dealing with certain email attachment files on
postings to TechNet the past few days.
These are ususally named something like:
rfc822.txt 6
vcard.vcf 29
ATTRIBS.BND
att1.unk 9
It seems that these attachments are sometimes uuencoded, and that in some
cases th result is that my mail program stops downloading messages, or even
hangs up.
It has been suggested by TechNet insiders that my software is to blame, and
that I "contact my system administrator for a software upgrade". Since I of
course know I have the best computer in the world with the latest software,
and would never let anyone from MIS touch my treasured 20th Anniversary
Mac, this is not the desired answer.
So I put this question to you...
Why not change the mailserver software to strip all email attachments
before remailing postings to the list?
It seems to me that most of these are some sort of bell and whistle thing
for email display which some new mail programs generate. I don't need that,
myself, it just bloats the hard drive further.
The effect would be that it would prevent the attachment of resumes, GIF's
and other such stuff going out to the list, but my thought is that this
might be a good thing. I cannot recall the distribution of a useful
attachment via this listserver.
Is this good thinking, or bad?
regards,
Jerry Cupples
Interphase Corporation
Dallas, TX USA (now a hockey town, too)
################################################################
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To subscribe/unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the body:
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################################################################
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`
end
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 12:06:31 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jean Cortjens <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jean Cortjens <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD7F30.BBE5CFC0"
------ =_NextPart_000_01BD7F30.BBE5CFC0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Good thinking. I have the same problem.
----------
From: Jerry Cupples
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 11:44 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
Fellow TN'ers,
My Eudora Pro 3.1 is not dealing with certain email attachment files on
postings to TechNet the past few days.
These are ususally named something like:
rfc822.txt 6
vcard.vcf 29
ATTRIBS.BND
att1.unk 9
It seems that these attachments are sometimes uuencoded, and that in some
cases th result is that my mail program stops downloading messages, or even
hangs up.
It has been suggested by TechNet insiders that my software is to blame, and
that I "contact my system administrator for a software upgrade". Since I of
course know I have the best computer in the world with the latest software,
and would never let anyone from MIS touch my treasured 20th Anniversary
Mac, this is not the desired answer.
So I put this question to you...
Why not change the mailserver software to strip all email attachments
before remailing postings to the list?
It seems to me that most of these are some sort of bell and whistle thing
for email display which some new mail programs generate. I don't need that,
myself, it just bloats the hard drive further.
The effect would be that it would prevent the attachment of resumes, GIF's
and other such stuff going out to the list, but my thought is that this
might be a good thing. I cannot recall the distribution of a useful
attachment via this listserver.
Is this good thinking, or bad?
regards,
Jerry Cupples
Interphase Corporation
Dallas, TX USA (now a hockey town, too)
################################################################
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 12:05:07 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Capacitor Damage At Wave Solder
X-To: "Kane, Joseph" <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Aha, someone else with the same problem. Maybe it is a aqueous problem.
You may have moisture getting up inside the component thru the lead egress.
We had this problem years ago. I am assuming the component is a through
hole leaded device? We cooled down the components prior to aqueous
cleaning.
I think it was 10 to 15 min. Painful but effective. Try this: run
some product through
the process then dry them out in an oven for a few hours at 85deg C, then
retest.
If they test good it is moisture. Why hav you not sent parts to the
manufacturer for
a formal F/A? Do it-put them on the carpet.
Good luck.
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 11:58:37 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Scott Holthausen <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Scott Holthausen <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Gerber format question
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hello TechNet,
Can someone explain the difference between the RS-274-D and RS-274-X gerber
formats?
As a secondary problem, I had a vendor ask me to send him a gerber file in
RS-274-X format and when I looked at it with my gerber viewer, it looked
different than the same file that was in RS-274-D format? Is this a
problem with my design package (PADS PowerPCB) or my gerber viewer (Lavenir
ViewMate)?
Any and all info is appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Scott Holthausen
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 09:28:39 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Kimmey, Frank" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Kimmey, Frank" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber format question
X-To: Scott Holthausen <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Scott,
The difference between 274D and 274X is embedded apertures.
The advantage of 274X is the vendor does not have to manually enter
D-codes (less room for error).
The down side is you might have difficulty with 274X and PADS.
Call me and we can discuss workarounds (there's that nasty word again).
Hope I can help
FNK
Frank N Kimmey
EM Designer
C&K Systems, Inc
916-353-5366
[log in to unmask]
> ----------
> From: Scott Holthausen[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Scott Holthausen
> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 8:58 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Gerber format question
>
> Hello TechNet,
>
> Can someone explain the difference between the RS-274-D and RS-274-X
> gerber
> formats?
>
> As a secondary problem, I had a vendor ask me to send him a gerber
> file in
> RS-274-X format and when I looked at it with my gerber viewer, it
> looked
> different than the same file that was in RS-274-D format? Is this a
> problem with my design package (PADS PowerPCB) or my gerber viewer
> (Lavenir
> ViewMate)?
>
> Any and all info is appreciated. Thanks in advance.
>
> Scott Holthausen
>
> ################################################################
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 10:32:54 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
sahmad <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: sahmad <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / re
sistors
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
If you must then file extensions .txt or .doc help rather than .dat.
Syed.
-----Original Message-----
From: Goldman, Patricia J. [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 8:09 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors
/ re sistors
Please do not send attachments over TechNet. They clog up the system.
----------
From: Peggi Blakley
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors /
resistors
Date: Thursday, May 14, 1998 9:31AM
<<File Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT>>
<<File Attachment: winmail.dat>>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 09:39:57 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Bauer <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Bauer <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistors
MIME-Version: 1.0
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 18:27:04 +0100
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <[log in to unmask]>
From: Matthias Mansfeld <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
Subject: Re: GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
In-Reply-To: <v03102802b180be173c60@[157.175.110.24]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
On 14 May 98 at 10:44, Jerry Cupples wrote:
> Fellow TN'ers,
>
> My Eudora Pro 3.1 is not dealing with certain email attachment files
> on postings to TechNet the past few days.
If you mean some emails with subject "[TN] Read: need info:
automated counting": I could not read them properly with Pegasus
2.53, too. It seems that they are something Micro$oft special
(Header: Content-Type: application/ms-tnef; name="winmail.dat") and
NOT MIME-compatible.
Some other Mails are readable, and this strange winmail.dat is
indicated as attachment in binary format, but nothing (for
Pegasus) senseful inside.
Regards Matthias Mansfeld
-----------------------------------------------
Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
* Printed Circuit Board Design and Assembly
Am Langhoelzl 11, D-85540 Haar, GERMANY
P.O.B. 1143, D-85529 Haar, GERMANY
Phone: +49-89-4620 0937, Fax: +49-89-4620 0938
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
Internet: http://home.t-online.de/home/matthias.mansfeld
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 09:43:02 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Bauer <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Bauer <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber format question
X-To: Scott Holthausen <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Scott,
PADS PowerPCB does have a problem writing the RS-274-X format. I believe
this is to be
corrected in the latest (2.2) release. To create a good RS-274-X file, I use
PC-Gerber II. RS-274-X
adds the aperture data to the beginning of the gerber file.
John Bauer
IDEO Product Development
-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Scott Holthausen
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 8:59 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Gerber format question
Hello TechNet,
Can someone explain the difference between the RS-274-D and RS-274-X gerber
formats?
As a secondary problem, I had a vendor ask me to send him a gerber file in
RS-274-X format and when I looked at it with my gerber viewer, it looked
different than the same file that was in RS-274-D format? Is this a
problem with my design package (PADS PowerPCB) or my gerber viewer (Lavenir
ViewMate)?
Any and all info is appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Scott Holthausen
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 10:51:09 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
sahmad <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: sahmad <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Thank God, I did not even see the .vcf, .unk and .bnd files. The .unk file I
think signifies an "unknown" extension (unk for unknown). Maybe ICP should
send such files back to the originator as unpostable.
Syed.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jerry Cupples [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 9:44 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
Fellow TN'ers,
My Eudora Pro 3.1 is not dealing with certain email attachment files on
postings to TechNet the past few days.
These are ususally named something like:
rfc822.txt 6
vcard.vcf 29
ATTRIBS.BND
att1.unk 9
It seems that these attachments are sometimes uuencoded, and that in some
cases th result is that my mail program stops downloading messages, or even
hangs up.
It has been suggested by TechNet insiders that my software is to blame, and
that I "contact my system administrator for a software upgrade". Since I of
course know I have the best computer in the world with the latest software,
and would never let anyone from MIS touch my treasured 20th Anniversary
Mac, this is not the desired answer.
So I put this question to you...
Why not change the mailserver software to strip all email attachments
before remailing postings to the list?
It seems to me that most of these are some sort of bell and whistle thing
for email display which some new mail programs generate. I don't need that,
myself, it just bloats the hard drive further.
The effect would be that it would prevent the attachment of resumes, GIF's
and other such stuff going out to the list, but my thought is that this
might be a good thing. I cannot recall the distribution of a useful
attachment via this listserver.
Is this good thinking, or bad?
regards,
Jerry Cupples
Interphase Corporation
Dallas, TX USA (now a hockey town, too)
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 09:57:39 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Arlene Infante <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Arlene Infante <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Fulton Feng,
I also would like to get information regarding this issue.
In my case I would like to know if there is a test procedure for
Accelerated Reliability of Immersion Gold finish (PCB):
Test Requirements
Test Method
Evaluation Criteria (pass/ fail)
We have our own coupon design for doing accelerated reliability test
using Bellcore and we are planning to include gold finish PCB but I'm not
sure if I can use the same procedure and criteria for Gold finish.
Thanks
Arlene
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 09:33:56 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Hamilton, Richard -4454" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Hamilton, Richard -4454" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
X-To: Jerry Cupples <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Jerry and all,
I am using Outlook 97 (part of Office 97) and had the same attachment
failures. So I cannot suggest where the problem comes in. I do not know what
we are using for an email gateway.
I would suggest that we all do as has been suggested for proper email on the
TechNet Forum, no attachments. This would eliminate the issue, and ensure
that everyone gets the intended information.
Richard
-----Original Message-----
From: Jerry Cupples [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 8:44 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
Fellow TN'ers,
My Eudora Pro 3.1 is not dealing with certain email attachment files on
postings to TechNet the past few days.
These are ususally named something like:
rfc822.txt 6
vcard.vcf 29
ATTRIBS.BND
att1.unk 9
It seems that these attachments are sometimes uuencoded, and that in some
cases th result is that my mail program stops downloading messages, or even
hangs up.
It has been suggested by TechNet insiders that my software is to blame, and
that I "contact my system administrator for a software upgrade". Since I of
course know I have the best computer in the world with the latest software,
and would never let anyone from MIS touch my treasured 20th Anniversary
Mac, this is not the desired answer.
So I put this question to you...
Why not change the mailserver software to strip all email attachments
before remailing postings to the list?
It seems to me that most of these are some sort of bell and whistle thing
for email display which some new mail programs generate. I don't need that,
myself, it just bloats the hard drive further.
The effect would be that it would prevent the attachment of resumes, GIF's
and other such stuff going out to the list, but my thought is that this
might be a good thing. I cannot recall the distribution of a useful
attachment via this listserver.
Is this good thinking, or bad?
regards,
Jerry Cupples
Interphase Corporation
Dallas, TX USA (now a hockey town, too)
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 01:15:36 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Poh Kong Hui <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Poh Kong Hui <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: : Solder on GoldFinger
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Technetters,
Could anyone advise me, how to get rid of solder contaminated on the gold
finger; If I don't tape the Gold finger during screen-printing process, I
keep getting solder on gold-finger, even the screen-printer has stencil wiper.
It don't help much.
Anyone has way that help me to resolve this issue ?
Thks in Advance.
Poh
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 13:13:02 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gerber format question
X-To: John Bauer <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
John:
Have you contacted PADS about this phenomenon or was your discovery the result of your
independent analysis of their version of 274X. The reason I ask is that we are experiencing the
same difficulties but have been dealing with it on a case by case basis. When we send out 274X
gerbers to our board house, we always send along an aperture list just in case they have any
questions. However, without fail, several PWBs sent out recently have had some readability
issue. We were writing it off to operator error at the board house, but now that someone else
(you) has mentioned PADS as the source of the problem, more questions are being formed.
We're using PADS PowerPCB 2.0 on WINNT and WIN95 for critical place and route, SPECCTRA 7.1 for
autorouting, and CAM350 for post processing. What format discrepancies have you identified
specifically? Hopefully, you can give us some ideas of what to look for till we install 2.2.
One thing I've noticed recently was that thermal apertures sometimes have their inner and outer
diameter swapped.
Thanks,
Paul Anderson
Bauer wrote:
> Scott,
>
> PADS PowerPCB does have a problem writing the RS-274-X format. I believe
> this is to be
> corrected in the latest (2.2) release. To create a good RS-274-X file, I use
> PC-Gerber II. RS-274-X
> adds the aperture data to the beginning of the gerber file.
>
> John Bauer
> IDEO Product Development
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Scott Holthausen
> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 8:59 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Gerber format question
>
> Hello TechNet,
>
> Can someone explain the difference between the RS-274-D and RS-274-X gerber
> formats?
>
> As a secondary problem, I had a vendor ask me to send him a gerber file in
> RS-274-X format and when I looked at it with my gerber viewer, it looked
> different than the same file that was in RS-274-D format? Is this a
> problem with my design package (PADS PowerPCB) or my gerber viewer (Lavenir
> ViewMate)?
>
> Any and all info is appreciated. Thanks in advance.
>
> Scott Holthausen
>
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>
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> ################################################################
--
Have a Golden Day,
Paul Anderson
Amherst Systems Inc
[log in to unmask]
716-631-0610 x190
716-631-0629 (fax)
http://www.amherst.com/
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 19:03:50 +0100
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <[log in to unmask]>
From: Matthias Mansfeld <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
Subject: Re: Gerber format question
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
On 14 May 98 at 11:58, Scott Holthausen wrote:
> Hello TechNet,
> Can someone explain the difference between the RS-274-D and RS-274-X
> gerber formats?
RS-274-D is a "dumb" format with only coordinates and aperture
numbers assigned. The PWB designer has to supply a file or a sheet
of paper (which gets lost often....) with descriptions HOW the
aperture are.
RS-274-X "Extended Gerber" is a extension to this format which
*includes* all necessary definitions, additionally with more
possibilities with filled polygons etc. That means, it is more
complicated, and sometimes incompatibilities happen, caused by bad
implementations of the "official" syntax. But mostly, it works fine.
Here in Germany, it is not so much used to the designers and PWB
manufactures, but I for myself had nly the best experiences with it.
No wrong apertiure tables, better CAM import etc.
Some URLs which
give good explanations about the different Gerber styles.
http://www.artwork.com/gerber/appl2.htm "D-codes, Apertures and
Gerber Plot Files"- about RS-274-D-
http://www.artwork.com/gerber/274x/rs274x.htm
"What's all this about RS274X Anyway?"
RS274X - A Description of how the RS274X Extended Gerber Specification
Works....
- Introduction in RS274X -
http://www.gerbersystemscorp.com/11-Format/11-01-000.html
Gerber Systems Corporation Description of Gerber Format
- Description directly from the inventor -
The whole definition of extended Gerber can be downloaded as pdf-file
from
ftp://ftp.GerberSystemsCorp.com/pub/GSC/pdf/RS274XB.pdf
> As a secondary problem, I had a vendor ask me to send him a gerber
> file in RS-274-X format and when I looked at it with my gerber
> viewer, it looked different than the same file that was in RS-274-D
> format? Is this a problem with my design package (PADS PowerPCB) or
> my gerber viewer (Lavenir ViewMate)?
I remember that there was some times ago a thread about some bugs in
the RS-274-X postprocessor from PADS PowerPCB. I don't know
whether these bugs are fixed now. Perhaps you should search this
topic in the Technet- and DesignerCouncil archieves under
http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm or ask PADS.
Regards
Matthias Mansfeld
-----------------------------------------------
Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
* Printed Circuit Board Design and Assembly
Am Langhoelzl 11, D-85540 Haar, GERMANY
P.O.B. 1143, D-85529 Haar, GERMANY
Phone: +49-89-4620 0937, Fax: +49-89-4620 0938
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
Internet: http://home.t-online.de/home/matthias.mansfeld
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 13:20:57 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Hint pwb1 <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Hint pwb1 <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Particles in holes
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Milind,
Look for bugs. Bacteria in the feed wqater to the electroless bath or the
copper plating bath will cause the problem that you have as related to
particles in holes. These bacteria will continue to grow even in the
solutions containing copper ions (a good antibacterial) and they can cause
platings that look like fingers or even spirals extending into the holes from
the hole walls. These bacteria are common in reclaimed/recycled waters and
may even come in from your deionizer tanks.
Phil Hinton
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 12:16:16 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jeff Hempton <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jeff Hempton <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: ASSY:profile max temps?
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Hello fellow TechNetters!
I am setting up IR and convection reflow profiling guidelines for
this new employer of mine. I know all of the basics for SMT, but I
have a question I could not find literature on, and could not find in
the TechNet archives, and would appreciate your experienced opinions:
I know individual components have Max temp ratings, but as a general
rule, what are the max temps that one ABSOLUTELY SHOULD NOT EXCEED?
Now, that probably sounds like a silly question, but we are doing
work with paste-in-hole and related technologies...large connectors,
etc.....and I am having to get real creative with profiles, increasing
temps to handle the mass of the big connectors, which has a tendency
to get the "chips" a little toasty. I have kept the max temps to 230
deg C., but please share any info that may be detrimental, such as
should I be worried about cracking/stressed chip caps at these temps,
etc.
Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanx for your TechNet support!
United Technology Electronic Controls
Jeff L. Hempton, Sr. SMD Engineer
Huntington, In
Phone: 219-359-3514
Fax: 219-358-0695
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 13:37:41 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Fab/Assy:Process (Philosophy Question)
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 98-05-14 06:44:19 EDT, you write:
<< Hi TechNet!
In a former life, I met the late Jim Bryan and was treated to several
lectures on "What a 'process' is". He also wrote a series of articles on
this subject for PC Fab which I no longer have (sometimes you just have to
clean house).
Does anyone still have a copy of these articles they could fax to me?
Please reply offline. Also, I WILL contact PC Fab myself.
Also, I would like to have the TechNet's opinion of what a 'process' is to
them. I am about to enter into this discussion with a bunch of assembly
folks (I'm just a board guy, you know) who think I ought to be able to spec
in the boards so they can go through all of their 'processes' no matter how
they control them, several sites, one material.
As I recall, (and, trust me, I used to be able to recite this in my sleep)
Jim said that the process window had to be large enough so that a variety
of materials can run through without a change in process parameters, and
all of these materials will acquire the desired characteristics of the
outcome of the process. In other words, you shouldn't have to change your
process every time something different comes along and you should be able
to run a lot of different materials through your process. A robust process
has a window you could drive a truck through.
Anyone care to continue this discussion? My apologies to those who don't
like this sort of thing on TechNet.
Regards,
Dave Sullivan
Rockwell Collins >>
Good Morning Dave!
What a interesting topic to start the day off with! First, I want to say
I'm sorry I can't help you with any of Jim Bryan's articles. I have to admit
I've never heard of him, or read any of his articles...but I would really be
interested to read them though.
Second, I'd like to say you don't have to apologize for starting what I
think is a very good thread. I think that sometimes a lot of us get so deep
into the technical aspects of our jobs, that it's good to step back once in a
while and take a look at the big picture so to speak, of what it is we're
doing....
So, what do I think a process is? Hmmmmm.....to me, that's kinda' tough
to define so that what I say is true in all cases, just as it is to define
what a "big window" is.
What might be a considered a robust process with a "big window" to
someone working on a manufacturing floor at one company, would be a nightmare
trying to implement the same thing on the manufacturing floor at another
company..... everything is relative.
The qualities and characteristics that I think define what a good
process is, I would have to say it's knowledgable human beings...it's as
simple as that.
With knowledgable, well trained humans, it doesn't matter what type of
product or technology you're dealing with, there will be the capability of
adapting to any requirement that is needed.
I've not been working in this industry as long as many of you have, I
started back in 1987 after I got out of the Navy. But in the 10-years that
I've been doing this, the one thing that I quickly learned in the beginning
and still goes on just as much today as it did back then, is what I call "Silo
Mentality".
Somebody learns something and keeps it in their "Silo", never sharing
the knowledge with anybody else. It goes on between different companies as
well as between individuals or departments working together at the same
company...I guess if there's one thing that I miss about the military, is the
lack of that kind of thinking.
Those of you that have been in the military know that there's a constant
effort put forth to make sure that everybody is well-trained and knowledgable
in whatever field they're in, so they can be prepared for any
situation...their lives depend on it.
I know that my analogy might be kinda' hokey, but I think that many
times the process problems that we all see day in and day out have something
to do with not being aware of a problem because of the lack of knowledge. This
starts from the beginning of the process building a product, applies to all
people involved starting from the design engineer as well as the production
worker on the manufacturing floor...everybody needs to know what they're doing
from beginning to end in order to have a robust process with a big window...
So when somebody asks me about the process I have where I work, or how
robust it is, I don't base my answer listing what kind of equipement we have,
or how many places we gather SPC data while the product is being built, I will
try to show them what level of knowledge and experience there is within the
human beings that are involved with our operation...and how we improve our
process through learning.
...did I make any sense?
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 11:27:27 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
ETS <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: ETS <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ASSY:profile max temps?
X-To: Jeff Hempton <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
For best results when performing pin in paste reflow you should use
convection heating from top and bottom sides of the board. 220 to 230 (230
might be a little too hot but you should go by the max temp rating for the
lowest-temp rated component) should be the max temp seen on the board (when
profiled). Various ovens will have various reflow zone temps to acheive this
due to the differences in thermal energy transfer.
If you would like to discuss further contact me off line.
Sincerely,
Brian Stumm
ETS, LLC
509-483-0900 (voice)
509-483-0331 (fax)
[log in to unmask] (e-mail)
> Hello fellow TechNetters!
> I am setting up IR and convection reflow profiling guidelines for
> this new employer of mine. I know all of the basics for SMT, but I
> have a question I could not find literature on, and could not find in
> the TechNet archives, and would appreciate your experienced opinions:
> I know individual components have Max temp ratings, but as a general
> rule, what are the max temps that one ABSOLUTELY SHOULD NOT EXCEED?
> Now, that probably sounds like a silly question, but we are doing
> work with paste-in-hole and related technologies...large connectors,
> etc.....and I am having to get real creative with profiles, increasing
> temps to handle the mass of the big connectors, which has a tendency
> to get the "chips" a little toasty. I have kept the max temps to 230
> deg C., but please share any info that may be detrimental, such as
> should I be worried about cracking/stressed chip caps at these temps,
> etc.
> Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanx for your TechNet support!
>
> United Technology Electronic Controls
> Jeff L. Hempton, Sr. SMD Engineer
> Huntington, In
> Phone: 219-359-3514
> Fax: 219-358-0695
> E-mail: [log in to unmask]
>
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 14:40:51 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Aric parr <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Capacitor Damage At Wave Solder
You are already too cold for bottom side chip capacitors. It is very common
for bottom side to exceed 130-150C (110-140C on top) prior to wave
soldering. If you have top side components failing with a cold profile,
check the top side reflow profile.
One solution I have used for wave soldering sensitive LCDs was to put a
heat sink on top of just the part. This kept it 10-20C colder than the rest
of the panel, provided the sink was removed immediately after exiting the
wave. Heat sink material depends upon whether top side preheat is used.
-------------
Original Text
From: C=US/A=INTERNET/DDA=ID/TechNet(a)IPC.ORG, on 5/14/98 11:37 AM:
We are experiencing failures of .25% film capacitors, presumably from heat
damage during wave solder. Top side preheat temperatures measured 210F,
within the process range we like. Tried cooling it down to 163F topside,
got more solder defects, and some caps still going out of tolerance. We
suspect that parts can't take thermal transfer during transit through the
wave, where topside gets about 100F warmer (of course part bodies see
less).
Manufacturer says no, it's our preheat, still too high at 163F, even though
they claim that the film can withstand 284F in the preheat zone. Boards
are
at least 10 layers with planes, and soldering cooler than 163 will mean
lots
of defects, especially where the RMA doesn't dry out or activate properly.
Speeding up the conveyor results in lots of top side insufficients. Hand
soldering works, but is expensive. Can't live with these parts, can't
flush
them. Should we consider cooler preheat, or are there other wave solder
tricks we can try?
Joe Kane
Lockheed Martin Control Systems
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 14:59:10 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mirka Halas <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Thermal relief
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-UNICODE-2-0-UTF-7
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Hello Designers,
I am in process of converting from Gerber 274 to 274X,
and I opened
can of warms, which is called thermal reliefs.
So far we used thermal relief and antipads developed by the rule of
thumb, that it should be oversized by 20 mils from the pad.
I would like to understand the calculation, and where I can shrink
the dimensions to get
more plane surface for our high speed boards.
I read IPC-D-275,IPC-2221 and IPC-2222, and do not see calculation for
the outside diameter
of thermal relief. 60% of the land is calculated for the web width, but
what is the hight of the web?
Is it the same as the diameter of Clearance area in planes?
Is IPC's calculation for the clearance area in planes too conservative.
One manufacturer can do
minimum antipads with diameter of the drill plus .016".
Thanks in advance
Mirka
--
Mirka Halas <[log in to unmask]>
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 16:19:09 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Zhong-You Shi <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Zhong-You Shi <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Thermal relief
X-To: [log in to unmask]
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Can anyone tell me how to discontinue the subscription of the
[log in to unmask] I want to do that but forgot the command. Thanks!
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 16:23:26 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Devlin, Dan" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Devlin, Dan" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Thermal relief
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
read the lower part of this response!
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Zhong-You Shi [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 4:19 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Thermal relief
>
> Can anyone tell me how to discontinue the subscription of the
> [log in to unmask] I want to do that but forgot the command. Thanks!
>
> ################################################################
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 15:28:07 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jeff Hempton <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jeff Hempton <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: : Solder on GoldFinger
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Poh,
I battled this issue in a previous life at Raytheon. Our conclusion:
Take your lumps and tape the gold fingers. EVERYTHING else we tried
was unsuccessful or more work/messier then taping. Good luck.
______________________________ Forward Header __________________________________
Subject: [TN] : Solder on GoldFinger
Author: Poh Kong Hui <[log in to unmask]> at Internet
Date: 5/15/98 1:15 AM
Hi Technetters,
Could anyone advise me, how to get rid of solder contaminated on the gold
finger; If I don't tape the Gold finger during screen-printing process, I
keep getting solder on gold-finger, even the screen-printer has stencil wiper.
It don't help much.
Anyone has way that help me to resolve this issue ?
Thks in Advance.
Poh
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 16:35:49 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
APeder01 <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: APeder01 <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Storing PCB's
Mime-Version: 1.0
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I believe the use of cold storage may be intended slow or minimize the
copper-tin intermetallic growth. If I simply bake a board for a long
time, the copper-tin intermetallic grows faster and can become
problematic for soldering. I'd question how much shelf life I'm
buying by reducing the storage temp from 25C to 14C.
One man's opinion.
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: [TN] Storing PCB's
Author: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]> at smtp
Date: 5/14/98 11:53 PM
I am confused.
For years, I have understood that the best way to store pcb's prior to
assembly is in a heated, relatively dry environment. I am sure that the
general consensus amongst most manufactureres is that this works best.
Well, just recently I was told by a company setting up a new facility that
they had been advised by a well known consultant to use a cold dry
environment. They are planning a 12-14 degree Celsius storeroom, once again
relatively dry.
Is there new thinking on this, or have they been badly advised?
[Nicholas Kane]
[Axion Australasia]
[Suite 3, 651 Canterbury Road]
[Surrey Hills]
[Victoria 3127 Australia]
[tel: 613 9899 3511 fax: 613 9899 3811]
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 15:46:11 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Axtell, Michael (AZ77)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Axtell, Michael (AZ77)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: stop TECHNET
I agree.
The format is great.
-----Original Message-----
From: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 1998 11:09 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] stop TECHNET
The Technet has shown me where consensus lies and where varying opinion
rules.
The cross-pollination and variety of subjects have been extraordinarily
useful.
I would hope the format doesn't change.
Frank
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 22:32:20 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Particles in holes
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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Hi Milind,
I would look critically at the drilling operation as in my experience this
is the main source of hole blockages. What entry and exit materials are you
using. Debris from these or just glass fibres from the wall of the hole can
be difficult to see until after plating. Close inspection and
micro-sectioning of blocked holes should reveal the source of the blockage.
ie if it is metallic copper or foreign matter. Check the drilled panels
carefully with dim backlighting to see any fibres in the hole.
Using high quality new or refurbished (not resharpened) drills and aluminium
entry material coupled with the correct feeds and speeds and good extraction
are all important.
Good Luck
-----Original Message-----
From: Milind Rao <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: 14 May 1998 14:45
Subject: [TN] Particles in holes
>Sorry for my earlier mail without subject
>------------
>Hi
>We are getting particles in both component holes / via holes on and off
>and in double sided / multilayer boards. This is observed after pattern
>plating
>We use High build copper and Pattern plating.
>In some holes the particles are severe and reduce the hole size
>considerably. The problem is occuring very randomly.
>Has anybody got remedy for this ?
>Thanks in advance for the help
>Milind
>
>
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 18:41:33 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Dmitriy Sklyar <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Dmitriy Sklyar <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: ADMIN: New Administrator.
X-To: [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask],
[log in to unmask], [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hello everyone.
There have been some changes in IPC's IS stuff:
Effective Monday, May 18th, Hugo Scaramuzza (and you thought my name was difficult
to spell!) will assume responsibility for administration of IPC email forums. Please
extend the same courtesy, support and patience for him as you did for me.
The mail forum footers and references on the IPC web page are being modified to
reflect the change.
Thank you all for your support and understanding. I hope that I provided adequate
service to the industry and to all of you.
Regards,
*******************************************
Dmitriy Sklyar
Electronic Communications Manager
IPC
2215 Sanders Road
Northbrook, IL 60062-6135
voice : 847-509-9700 ext. 311
fax : 847-509-9798
e-mail : [log in to unmask]
URL : http://www.ipc.org
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 09:46:21 +1000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Michael Yarrow <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Michael Yarrow <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistors
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 09:42:38 +1000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ADMIN: New Administrator.
X-cc: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Nice try to avoid the obvious question Dmitriy :
Where do you go now ?
I know it's none of my business , still , please
Hope it's not too sad
Thanks for the help Dmitriy .
paul ; ResMed
>----------
>From: Dmitriy Sklyar[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>Sent: Friday, 15 May 1998 9:41
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: [TN] ADMIN: New Administrator.
>
>Hello everyone.
>
>There have been some changes in IPC's IS stuff:
>
>Effective Monday, May 18th, Hugo Scaramuzza (and you thought my name was
>difficult
>to spell!) will assume responsibility for administration of IPC email
>forums. Please
>extend the same courtesy, support and patience for him as you did for me.
>
>The mail forum footers and references on the IPC web page are being modified
>to
>reflect the change.
>
>Thank you all for your support and understanding. I hope that I provided
>adequate
>service to the industry and to all of you.
>
>Regards,
>
>*******************************************
>Dmitriy Sklyar
>Electronic Communications Manager
>IPC
>2215 Sanders Road
>Northbrook, IL 60062-6135
>voice : 847-509-9700 ext. 311
>fax : 847-509-9798
>e-mail : [log in to unmask]
>URL : http://www.ipc.org
>*******************************************
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 11:40:18 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Storing PCB's
X-To: Nicholas Kane <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Nicholas,
I have not been around long enough in the industry (only 8 years) to
have any "old" thinking on the topic, so let's look at the whole picture.
Generally speaking for most chemical reactions around room temperature (and
all the temperature ranges we are throwing around here are) reaction rates
double with every 10C rise in temperature. This of course assumes that
enough heat/alternate energy source is available to provide the activation
energy for reactions to even happen. We will also assume that the reactions
we are interested in are not diffusion limited. A little more on that
later.
With that being said, any chemist would tell you that the cooler
room idea is a good one. But now let's look at it in not such a theoretical
sense, but in terms of printed circuit boards. In the past, say the 1980's
and into 1990-91 one could still receive boards from a supplier, especially
from the humid Far East, and have problems with them in manufacturing
because of outgassing during manufacturing. This was usually due to
moisture explosively vaporizing inside the board and then coming out through
blow holes in the plated through holes, forming holes in the joints or even
blowing the majority of the solder right out of the joint. We are talking
about more than a thousand fold increase in volume here as the water turns
to steam. To counteract this people would place their new incoming boards
in an oven for x temperature for y time (can't remember the conditions!).
This solved the symptom, but not really the issues - poor bare board
manufacturing environment and poor hole quality! Today if you are buying
from a quality board vendor you should not be seeing this problem, even with
Thermount (Aramid) boards. At least we haven't and you can bet we've
looked. So we just store our boards on shelves in the air-conditioned plant
proper. Of course we are not a military provider that has signed a contract
to provide 10 radios today and another 10 just like it in 10 years either.
We go through our boards pretty fast. If you are in the same manufacturing
stream as us and have good vendors, why do anything?
There is another reaction I have not mentioned yet and that is the
growth of intermetalics between the HASL layer and the copper. With enough
heat and time and aided by a thin HASL layer, a warm oven can consume all
your free solder on the board. This one may be diffusion controlled, I
don't remember. The fellows at the British National Physics Lab could tell
you more about this possibility.
And getting REALLY esoteric, (hope you can tell I'm really enjoying
doing this :) ) if you are dealing with boards with a 100% tin finish
there is the possibility that your tin could go from metallic tin to gray
tin at 13.2C. Hey metalurgists, can this still happen in the presence of
lead and antimony?
If we look at even the bigger picture there are costs involved with
both heating and cooling, which will vary whether you are near Hobart on
Tasmania (where snow is possible) or near one of the great Australian
deserts (no map handy). Next, if you chose to keep your boards in a cool
room there is the possibility that your system could lose coolant. If you
have a very moist climate, and if the dew point is reached in the chamber
and this happens often you will be condensing water onto your boards, which
will enhance surface oxide formation to some small extent. Also coolant
loss would put even more CFC's, HCFC's or HFC's into the atmosphere and
contribute to what may or may not be happening - global warming.
regards,
Bev Christian
Nortel
> ----------
> From: Nicholas Kane[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 9:53 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Storing PCB's
>
> I am confused.
>
> For years, I have understood that the best way to store pcb's prior to
> assembly is in a heated, relatively dry environment. I am sure that the
> general consensus amongst most manufactureres is that this works best.
>
> Well, just recently I was told by a company setting up a new facility that
> they had been advised by a well known consultant to use a cold dry
> environment. They are planning a 12-14 degree Celsius storeroom, once
> again relatively dry.
>
> Is there new thinking on this, or have they been badly advised?
>
>
>
>
> [Nicholas Kane]
> [Axion Australasia]
> [Suite 3, 651 Canterbury Road]
> [Surrey Hills]
> [Victoria 3127 Australia]
> [tel: 613 9899 3511 fax: 613 9899 3811]
>
> ################################################################
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> information.
> For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at [log in to unmask] or
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> ################################################################
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 20:00:18 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
JSSallo <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: JSSallo <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ADMIN: New Administrator.
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Dmitriy
Thanks for all of your help and hard work
Regards
Jerry Sallo
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 17:02:34 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Arthur Kahlich <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Arthur Kahlich <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Read: need info: BAD ATTACHMENT
Hi all,
Please delete the attachment before responding on this subject. I have to go
through a very messy delete procedure for every one of these messages.
Dmitry (or Hugo): could something be added to the listserver to kill this
non-compliant type of attachment? (or as somebody else has mentioned,
all attachments?)
Arthur Kahlich
Solliday Engineering Corp.
Phone: (415)621-0616
Email: [log in to unmask]
-----Original Message-----
From: Unknown [SMTP:Unknown]
Sent: None
Subject:
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Content-Type: application/ms-tnef; name="winmail.dat"
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
>Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="winmail.dat"
>X-Priority: 3 (Normal)
>X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
>X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0
>X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 000000008FB025636E83D011B72444455354000064902200
>X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4
>Importance: Normal
>X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: [log in to unmask]
>Message-ID: <001001bd7f92$80c9bf20$6b646464@generator>
>Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 09:46:21 +1000
>Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
> Michael Yarrow <[log in to unmask]>
>Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
>From: Michael Yarrow <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: [TN] Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors /
> resistors
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Status: RO
<<<Non-compliant MIME stuff deleted>>>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 16:55:50 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Hamilton, Richard -4454" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Hamilton, Richard -4454" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ADMIN: New Administrator.
X-To: Dmitriy Sklyar <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Dmitriy,
And thanks to you for your support and activity on the forum. Good luck in
your future activities! (With IPC?)
Richard
-----Original Message-----
From: Dmitriy Sklyar [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 4:42 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] ADMIN: New Administrator.
Hello everyone.
There have been some changes in IPC's IS stuff:
Effective Monday, May 18th, Hugo Scaramuzza (and you thought my name was
difficult
to spell!) will assume responsibility for administration of IPC email
forums. Please
extend the same courtesy, support and patience for him as you did for me.
The mail forum footers and references on the IPC web page are being modified
to
reflect the change.
Thank you all for your support and understanding. I hope that I provided
adequate
service to the industry and to all of you.
Regards,
*******************************************
Dmitriy Sklyar
Electronic Communications Manager
IPC
2215 Sanders Road
Northbrook, IL 60062-6135
voice : 847-509-9700 ext. 311
fax : 847-509-9798
e-mail : [log in to unmask]
URL : http://www.ipc.org
*******************************************
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 17:01:21 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jean Connick <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jean Connick <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Help
Can anyone help me locate an Epoxy, RTV or other, that when cured is
semi rigid, with an excellent bond strength to glass. (A one part system
is preferred).
Thanks for any/all your assistance ahead of time
Jean Connick
Tel: 714-996-1248 x 299
Fax: 714-961-7836
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 09:33:33 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Joseph E. J. Duclos Jr." <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Joseph E. J. Duclos Jr." <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Read: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistors
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 20:47:55 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ADMIN: New Administrator.
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Dmitriy,
I've spoken on the phone with you a few times over the past 4-5 years
when I was having problems (mostly operator error on my part, but we don't
need to get into that...hehehe), but never have met you face to face so that I
could give you a warm handshake, and say thanks for all of your hard work!
I imagine keeping this list going has been one of your "side jobs" in
addition to all the other stuff that has been heaped on your plate, and you
have done a fine job!
Hugo is gonna to have some pretty big shoes to fill, but I imagine that
you have done a "brain dump" with him and passed on the kinds of things that
will help him keep this list running as smoothly as you have been able to do
over the years.
I wish you the best of luck and hope that whatever is ahead of you,
brings you nothing but the best!
Once Again, THANKS!!!
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 09:44:23 +0900
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Hyun J. Kang" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Hyun J. Kang" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: STOP TECHNET!
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all,
no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes too
active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days and get
a few 100 messages.
I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub lists
such as:
IPC standard related
wet processes
multilayer
photoimaging
laminate
etc......
Any comments?
Jens Behrens
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CSS Asia Co., Ltd.
Tel: 82-2-523-8810
Fax: 82-2-523-1483
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 21:29:32 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Storing PCB's
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
In a message dated 5/14/98 5:00:02 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[log in to unmask] writes:
<<
Nicholas,
I have not been around long enough in the industry (only 8 years) to
have any "old" thinking on the topic, so let's look at the whole
picture...(snip)
A little more on that later... (snip)
With that being said, any chemist would tell you that the cooler room idea is
a good one. But now let's look at it in not such a theoretical sense...
(snip)
or even blowing the majority of the solder right out of the joint. We are
talking about more than a thousand fold increase in volume here as the water
turns to steam...
(snip)
Of course we are not a military provider that has signed a contract to provide
10 radios today and another 10 just like it in 10 years either...
(snip)
There is another reaction I have not mentioned yet...
(snip)
And getting REALLY esoteric, (hope you can tell I'm really enjoying doing this
:) ) if you are dealing with boards with a 100% tin finish...(snip)
which will vary whether you are near Hobart on Tasmania (where snow is
possible) or near one of the great Australian deserts (no map handy)...
(snip)
Also coolant loss would put even more CFC's, HCFC's or HFC's into the
atmosphere and
contribute to what may or may not be happening - global warming...
(snip)
regards,
Bev Christian
Nortel >>
Lordy Woman! You been at Starbucks sippin' on double expresso's all day long
today? You're starting to sound like me with the way I can go on and on
sometimes....(GRIN)
I'm just joshin' ya!
I must admit though, I've never read anything as entertaining and kept my
interest on PCB storage as I did today! GOOD response! You taught me
something!
You're normally kinda' reserved and to the point with most of the responses
that I've read of yours, are we starting to see the REAL Bev now? (GRIN
again...)
-Steve Gregory-
P.S. You guys really gonna buy Bay Networks?
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 11:01:32 +0900
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Hyun J. Kang" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Hyun J. Kang" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistors
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=====================_895255660==_"
--=====================_895255660==_
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Good day Technet.
I'm currently battling with our parts guys over inventory control of
components. For the big stuff like ICs it is fairly easy to count them, but
for chip caps / resistors it is more difficult to count them 'cause they are
on tape and reel. I've suggested the technique of measuring the length of
tape and dividing by the pitch, but our inventory guys want something
automated.
I'm sure such a thing exists, but have no idea where to begin looking. Can
a Technet guru point me in the direction of an automated counting machine
for counting parts on tape and reel? Please reply off the Technet if it
sounds like an advert.
Thanks,
Graham Collins
Process Engineer
Litton Systems Canada
(902) 873-2000 extension 215
Attachment Converted: C:\EUDORA\INCOMING\TNneedin
--=====================_895255660==_
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--=====================_895255660==_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
CSS Asia Co., Ltd.
Tel: 82-2-523-8810
Fax: 82-2-523-1483
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
--=====================_895255660==_--
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 11:14:25 +0900
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Hyun J. Kang" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Hyun J. Kang" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=====================_895256433==_"
--=====================_895256433==_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Good thinking. I have the same problem.
----------
From: Jerry Cupples
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 11:44 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] GEN: attachment files on TechNet postings
Fellow TN'ers,
My Eudora Pro 3.1 is not dealing with certain email attachment files on
postings to TechNet the past few days.
These are ususally named something like:
rfc822.txt 6
vcard.vcf 29
ATTRIBS.BND
att1.unk 9
It seems that these attachments are sometimes uuencoded, and that in some
cases th result is that my mail program stops downloading messages, or even
hangs up.
It has been suggested by TechNet insiders that my software is to blame, and
that I "contact my system administrator for a software upgrade". Since I of
course know I have the best computer in the world with the latest software,
and would never let anyone from MIS touch my treasured 20th Anniversary
Mac, this is not the desired answer.
So I put this question to you...
Why not change the mailserver software to strip all email attachments
before remailing postings to the list?
It seems to me that most of these are some sort of bell and whistle thing
for email display which some new mail programs generate. I don't need that,
myself, it just bloats the hard drive further.
The effect would be that it would prevent the attachment of resumes, GIF's
and other such stuff going out to the list, but my thought is that this
might be a good thing. I cannot recall the distribution of a useful
attachment via this listserver.
Is this good thinking, or bad?
regards,
Jerry Cupples
Interphase Corporation
Dallas, TX USA (now a hockey town, too)
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--=====================_895256433==_
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--=====================_895256433==_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
CSS Asia Co., Ltd.
Tel: 82-2-523-8810
Fax: 82-2-523-1483
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
--=====================_895256433==_--
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 22:45:24 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Help
X-To: [log in to unmask]
X-cc: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Jean:
This is one of those experiences that may be exactly what you need, or may
also result in gales of laughter.
I had a similar need, to glue my rear view mirror to my windshield, in a non-
standard position. I solved the problem by using standard Dow RTV silicone,
BUT, in order to get it to adhere, I had to roughen the surface of the glass,
using emery paper.
Now, using emery paper on your parts may be difficult, or impractical, and so
my suggestion is use a mild glass etch, which could be a simple 10% solution
of ammonium biflouride, which you could put on with a cotton swab. Rinse
well, then dry, and apply your silicone.
Hope it works for you.
Rudy Sedlak
RD Chemical Company
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 22:42:45 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tools
X-To: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
X-cc: "K.T. Sia" <[log in to unmask]>,
Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Marco,
In general, it is not a good idea to try to use film from one manufacturer
processed through chemistry from another. Today's phototooling films are
specifically designed for use with a particular developer. The Kodak films
in particular are not compatable with other developers.
Having said that, some of the DuPont films can be used in the Kodak
developers. Others can not. And we have not done very extensive testing
to prove long term compatibility. If you will send a note directly with
information about the specific films and chemicals you are considering, I
will tell you what I know about there compatibility.
Bob Seyfert
Technical Manager - Phototools
DuPont Electronics
At 04:02 PM 5/13/98 +0800, Marco Biagtan wrote:
>Hi
>Does anyone have an idea about photo tool production? I want to use DuPont
>photo tools with KODAK chemistry, is it ok?
>
>
>Appreciate any info,
>
>Marco
>
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>
>
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 11:37:46 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Arnold Escanilla <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Arnold Escanilla <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tools
X-To: Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Bob,
Thanks for the reply, I appreciate it.
Actually, someone from DuPont is offering us their photo tooling product
which is the Cronalar PHC-7. I don't mind evaluating this however it would
be somewhat difficult for me since I need to change the entire chemistry of
our developer machine to that of DuPont's. I was told by DuPont however
that it would be possible to process the film using other manufacturer's
developer. I don't have any idea as to what effects this might have on the
developer chemicals or the photo tools that's why I'm gathering all
information I can get.
Presently, we are using Kodak's ECU7 film series for contact printing with
their recommended chemistry which is RA2000 developer and RU4000 fixer.
Thanks Again!
Marco Biagtan
Process Engineer - Artwork Section
NEC Components Philippines Inc.
----------
> From: Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Photo tools
> Date: Friday, May 15, 1998 10:42 AM
>
> Hi Marco,
>
> In general, it is not a good idea to try to use film from one
manufacturer
> processed through chemistry from another. Today's phototooling films are
> specifically designed for use with a particular developer. The Kodak
films
> in particular are not compatable with other developers.
>
> Having said that, some of the DuPont films can be used in the Kodak
> developers. Others can not. And we have not done very extensive testing
> to prove long term compatibility. If you will send a note directly with
> information about the specific films and chemicals you are considering, I
> will tell you what I know about there compatibility.
>
> Bob Seyfert
> Technical Manager - Phototools
> DuPont Electronics
>
>
>
> At 04:02 PM 5/13/98 +0800, Marco Biagtan wrote:
> >Hi
> >Does anyone have an idea about photo tool production? I want to use
DuPont
> >photo tools with KODAK chemistry, is it ok?
> >
> >
> >Appreciate any info,
> >
> >Marco
> >
> >################################################################
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> >
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 12:36:04 CST
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Weber Chuang <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Weber Chuang <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Particles in holes
X-To: [log in to unmask]
q
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Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 21:44:15 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Engineering / Design Dept." <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Mission Peak Services
Subject: HELPPPPPPPP
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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HELPPPPPPPPPPPPPP
I HEVE BEEN TRYING TO REMOVE MY ACCOUNT FROM THE TECH NET SERVER. I
FOLLOWED THE PROPER PROCEDURES AND GOT MYSELF A CONFIRMATION FROM THE
SERVER (LISTSERV) THAT I AM NO LONGER ON THE LIST. GREAT!!!!! BUT WHY DO
I KEEP GETTING ALL TECH NET EMAILS
I HAVE SENT EMAILS TO DMITRIT SKLAR AND HAVE NOT RECEIVED ANY RESPONSE.
--
******************************
Mission Peak Services
Engineering Department
Visit us at:
http://www.missionpeak.com
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 17:22:24 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Anderson Lee/FATC <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Anderson Lee/FATC <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Recommend Transparent Molding Compound source?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_017F_01BD8026.068A9560"
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------=_NextPart_000_017F_01BD8026.068A9560
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="big5"
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Hello everybody,
=20
I am going to survey transparent molding compound that used for =
photosensitive electron device purpose.=20
I have ever inquired some agent of compound manufacturer in Taiwan, like =
Hitachi Chemical, Sumitomo, Shin-Etsu.
But, all are not available right now.
Could anybody kindly recommend me supplier source, including =
manufacturer, tel., fax or others.
Being appreciate of you in advance.
=20
Best Regards,
=20
Anderson Lee / E-mail:[log in to unmask]
=20
Formosa Advanced Technologies Corp., Website:www.fatc.com, welcome your =
visiting
=20
=20
=20
------=_NextPart_000_017F_01BD8026.068A9560
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="big5"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Dbig5 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 =
HTML//EN">
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.2106.11"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=3D3><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT =
color=3D#000000>Hello=20
everybody,</FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D3><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT=20
color=3D#000000></FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT color=3D#000000><FONT=20
face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT =
size=3D3></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman">I am going to survey transparent =
molding=20
compound that used for photosensitive electron device purpose. =
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman">I have ever inquired some agent of =
compound=20
manufacturer in Taiwan, like Hitachi Chemical, Sumitomo, =
Shin-Etsu.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman">But, all are not available right=20
now.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D3><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT =
color=3D#000000>Could anybody=20
kindly recommend me supplier source, including manufacturer, tel., fax =
or=20
others.</FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT color=3D#000000><FONT=20
face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT size=3D3></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D3><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT=20
color=3D#000000></FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT color=3D#000000><FONT=20
face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT size=3D3>Being appreciate of you in=20
advance.</FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT=20
size=3D3></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman">Best Regards,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman">Anderson Lee / <A=20
href=3D"mailto:E-mail:[log in to unmask]">E-mail:[log in to unmask]</A></=
FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman">Formosa Advanced Technologies Corp., =
Website:www.fatc.com, welcome your visiting</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"Times New Roman" =
size=3D3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D3><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT=20
color=3D#000000></FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT color=3D#000000><FONT=20
face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT =
size=3D3></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2></FONT> </DIV></BODY></HTML>
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 05:45:53 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Solder Ball?
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I had experienced them in the past, but now that I've switched fluxes....I
don't have them anymore. I went through a flux trial to qualify a flux for
our no-clean process. What kind of flux are you using now?
Jason Smith
Process Materials Engineer
Lexmark Electronics
(606) 232-7667
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to
[log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Jason Smith)
bcc: Jason Smith
Subject: Re: [TN] Solder Ball?
Alvin Leong wrote:
>
> Hi Technetee,
> Anyone experience the solder ball appearing in the no-clean
process?
> What is the contributor? I forseen a misprinted PCB on the solder paste
> station is one of it.
> 1. What is the recommendation on the smear board cleaning procedure?
> 2. Ultra-sonic cleaner?
> 3. What type of chemical?
> 4. If an ultra-sonic is the solution, then what is the side impact to
> the package on double-sided process?
>
> Hope anyone can share the info.
>
> Thks.
>
> ################################################################
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>
################################################################Generally,i
n the no clean process, as I understand, solder balls are more
prevalent.
You can try the following to see if it helps:
1. Lower preheat temperature
2. Is there sufficient flux on the board?(wave solder)
3. Soldermask: glossy or matte? The matte masks are less [prone to
solder balls.
4. Is mask properly cured? Try an extended UV cycle to harden the
mask.
Good luck
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 06:07:47 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Particles in holes
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
The question would be.....do you have any idea what the particles are?
That would be my number one step is solving the problem. Kinda hard to fix
a problem without knowing the root cause of it. Send a sample to a lab to
determine what it is. Could be dross.....could be from the flux
particulates....could be from you board coating.....get my picture.
Jason Smith
Process Materials Engineer
Lexmark Electronics
(606) 232-7667
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to
[log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Jason Smith)
bcc: Jason Smith
Subject: [TN] Particles in holes
Sorry for my earlier mail without subject
------------
Hi
We are getting particles in both component holes / via holes on and off
and in double sided / multilayer boards. This is observed after pattern
plating
We use High build copper and Pattern plating.
In some holes the particles are severe and reduce the hole size
considerably. The problem is occuring very randomly.
Has anybody got remedy for this ?
Thanks in advance for the help
Milind
______________________________________________________
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 06:25:42 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: wave soldering expertise
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
As industry is moving to more hard fact quality measures and
standardizational measures, does anyone have any ideas as to what to
implement into a process control system on wave soldering? I currently
have visual with the glass plate and reliability covered with the wave
optimizer and SPC for control limits, etc. What else is out there in the
arena of process control for wave soldering. I also do ionic testing,
solder samples, and ion chromatography tests. What have I missed that is
critical?
Jason Smith
Process Materials Engineer
Lexmark Electronics
(606) 232-7667
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 13:32:01 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Gabriela Bogdan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Gabriela Bogdan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ADMIN: New Administrator.
X-To: Dmitriy Sklyar <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Dmitriy,
Thank you for the wonderful job!
When you'll remember these years when you stood by us like a solid
stone, maybe you'll remember
the words of Franks best song.
Wishing you success,
Gaby
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 11:38:21 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Graham Naisbitt <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Graham Naisbitt <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ADMIN: New Administrator.
X-cc: Dmitriy Sklyar <[log in to unmask]>
Dmitriy
I echo the thoughts and wishes of the others. Sorry you are leaving, and
thanks for the help and good work.
Regards, Graham Naisbitt
__________________________________________________________________________
[log in to unmask]
Concoat Ltd
Alasan House, Albany Park
Camberley GU15 2PL UK http://www.concoat.co.uk
-----Original Message-----
From: Dmitriy Sklyar <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: 15 May 1998 00:44
Subject: [TN] ADMIN: New Administrator.
>Hello everyone.
>
>There have been some changes in IPC's IS stuff:
>
>Effective Monday, May 18th, Hugo Scaramuzza (and you thought my name was
difficult
>to spell!) will assume responsibility for administration of IPC email
forums. Please
>extend the same courtesy, support and patience for him as you did for me.
>
>The mail forum footers and references on the IPC web page are being
modified to
>reflect the change.
>
>Thank you all for your support and understanding. I hope that I provided
adequate
>service to the industry and to all of you.
>
>Regards,
>
>*******************************************
>Dmitriy Sklyar
>Electronic Communications Manager
>IPC
>2215 Sanders Road
>Northbrook, IL 60062-6135
>voice : 847-509-9700 ext. 311
>fax : 847-509-9798
>e-mail : [log in to unmask]
>URL : http://www.ipc.org
>*******************************************
>
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 12:04:43 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Donal O Brien <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: pcb finishes
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Hi,
Anyone got any information on the effect of board finish on wave
solder yields. Do matt finish boards tend to give less shorts than gloss.
I believe there is a relationship between the lower surface tension created
by gloss finishes and shorts occurring on for example pmcia sockets.
Any comments please
Rgds,
Donal O Brien
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 08:04:16 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
TOSTEVIN_BC <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: TOSTEVIN_BC <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re[2]: [TN] Help
X-To: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Only a true chemist would tell the rest of us to etch our windshields
with a, "simple 10% solution of ammonium biflouride." I must remember
to ask for it at the auto parts store!
Rudy, there's $$$ to be made in marketing a mirror adhesive kit that
really works. I'm - 0 for 10 - on those things.
Bruce Tostevin
Benchmark Electronics
Hudson, NH
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: [TN] Help
Author: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]> at 0UTG0ING
Date: 5/14/98 10:45 PM
Jean:
This is one of those experiences that may be exactly what you need, or may
also result in gales of laughter.
I had a similar need, to glue my rear view mirror to my windshield, in a non-
standard position. I solved the problem by using standard Dow RTV silicone,
BUT, in order to get it to adhere, I had to roughen the surface of the glass,
using emery paper.
Now, using emery paper on your parts may be difficult, or impractical, and so
my suggestion is use a mild glass etch, which could be a simple 10% solution
of ammonium biflouride, which you could put on with a cotton swab. Rinse
well, then dry, and apply your silicone.
Hope it works for you.
Rudy Sedlak
RD Chemical Company
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 08:36:49 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Help
X-To: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Jean, Rudy,
If you are going to use ammonium bifluoride (ammonium hydrogen fluoride for
the non-chemically inclined), BE CAREFUL. All ionic fluorides should be
treated with care. Certainly this one is not as bad as hydrofluoric acid,
fluorosulfuric acid or super oxidizers like arsenic pentafluoride, but do be
careful. I could go on about other very interesting nasties, but I'll
control myself and stop here. Fluoride burns are nasty. They don't always
hurt at first, but they sure will later! Fluoride will continue to
penetrate the skin and will eventually start to leach calcium from the bones
and can lead to localized "chemical osteoporosis" (my term, I'm not a med).
It would be a good idea to have at hand as a first aid treatment a saturated
solution of tetramethylammonium chloride or some other quarternary ammonium
salt. If one comes in contact with a solution capable of liberating
fluoride, dip the affected portion in an ice cold saturated solution of this
stuff (good chemical term). The tetramethyl ammonium ion will sequester the
fluoride ions enough to let the body deal with them. The cold decreases the
diffusion rate of the fluoride into the depths of the body. Certainly the
ice will dilute the stored room temperature saturated solution, but that's
OK. Obviously remove the affected portion form the cold solution once in a
while to avoid excessive cooling and its attendant problems.
I'm not making this up. Check it out in the CRC Handbook of Laboratory
Safety, 2nd Edition, CRC Press Inc., Boca Raton, 1976, pp45-47 (obviously
different pages in newer editions! :) ) This is based on some excellent
work by a med in DuPont, who know full well about fluoride burns from past
experiences, unfortunately.
regards,
Bev Christian
Nortel
> ----------
> From: RSedlak[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 10:45 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Help
>
> Jean:
>
> This is one of those experiences that may be exactly what you need, or may
> also result in gales of laughter.
>
> I had a similar need, to glue my rear view mirror to my windshield, in a
> non-
> standard position. I solved the problem by using standard Dow RTV
> silicone,
> BUT, in order to get it to adhere, I had to roughen the surface of the
> glass,
> using emery paper.
>
> Now, using emery paper on your parts may be difficult, or impractical, and
> so
> my suggestion is use a mild glass etch, which could be a simple 10%
> solution
> of ammonium biflouride, which you could put on with a cotton swab. Rinse
> well, then dry, and apply your silicone.
>
> Hope it works for you.
>
> Rudy Sedlak
> RD Chemical Company
>
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 07:51:13 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Alex Neussendorfer <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Alex Neussendorfer <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Copper Plugging Vias
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
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A word of caution: Holes will normally plate shut closer to the surfaces,
leaving a barrel shaped hole with trapped plating solution.
----------
> From: [log in to unmask]
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Copper Plugging Vias
> Date: Tuesday, May 12, 1998 3:47 PM
>
> Address,
>
> How many suppliers are copper plugging .008 finish vias, provided
the
> surface finish is OSP. Provide your answer(s) on finished board
> thicknesses of .062 and .028, std tolerances. If so, what
percentage,
> nominal, are you able to plug shut. Through cross-sectioning do you
> have the following conditions.
>
> From my past experience the plugging of vias is not feasible using
an
> electroless and electrolytic plating combination process.
> Cross-sectioning would later show a dog-bone effect. Does this
still
> hold true today.
>
> Thanks,
>
> John Gulley
>
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 08:06:14 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: BGA Electrical Performance
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Question: What electrical performance advantages does a BGA package
provide over the SOIC or QSOP package for resistor termination networks?
Please respond to: [log in to unmask]
Thank You!
Sincerely,
Mike Howieson
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 13:29:04 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: FAB Land around via holes
MIME-Version: 1.0
Can anyone help with a query on land around via holes. I have a copy of
IPC-A-600 Rev E Aug 1995 which states for plated through holes the
minimum land between the track and pad and hole must not be less than
0.002" as a minimum standard. This means that misregistration towards
the track is not acceptable if the pad is reduced below 0.002" even if
there is no actual breakout. On the other hand, the hole is allowed to
break out of the pad in any other direction by as much as half the
diameter. Clearly the two are incompatible with each other since with
registration that bad there is bound to be breakout towards tracks in
some areas.
Has there been a revision specifically for via holes only, or is there
any other specification relating to landless via holes as this criteria
is impossible to meet on some designs. The implications of meeting this
spec are to increase via pad size and/or reduce hole size which has
implications for design density and manufacturing cost.
Any views on this would be greatly appreciated. For production drilling
on large panels, what minimum land do you think would be needed at the
outset to guarantee minimum annular 0.002" on the finished panel taking
account of drill size and etch reduction also?
Best Regards
--
Paul Gould
[log in to unmask]
Isle of Wight,UK
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 07:02:47 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Stuart Chessen <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Stuart Chessen <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / res
X-To: "Hyun J. Kang" <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="IMA.Boundary.301142598"
--IMA.Boundary.301142598
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Description: cc:Mail note part
I know APS makes a Taped axial, radial & SMT Component counter around
$2400 US ( I couldn't find the company number, but distributers sell
it like Comkyl (800)538-1578). There are others too, just as good, but
is it worth the time and money to control parts that most are only
$.01 each?
Some other tricks for counting is to have your pick and place give you
the count usage to subtract when returning to stock.
Divide the reel into quarters and go to the next quarter mark and
divide from orginal reel size count ( example 2000 component reel
size, if 1/2 used up, record 1000 on your inventory system)
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: [TN] need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resisto
Author: "Hyun J. Kang" <[log in to unmask]> at _Internet
Date: 5/15/98 11:01
Good day Technet.
I'm currently battling with our parts guys over inventory control of
components. For the big stuff like ICs it is fairly easy to count them, but
for chip caps / resistors it is more difficult to count them 'cause they are
on tape and reel. I've suggested the technique of measuring the length of
tape and dividing by the pitch, but our inventory guys want something
automated.
I'm sure such a thing exists, but have no idea where to begin looking. Can
a Technet guru point me in the direction of an automated counting machine
for counting parts on tape and reel? Please reply off the Technet if it
sounds like an advert.
Thanks,
Graham Collins
Process Engineer
Litton Systems Canada
(902) 873-2000 extension 215
Attachment Converted: C:\EUDORA\INCOMING\TNneedin
--IMA.Boundary.301142598
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CSS Asia Co., Ltd.
Tel: 82-2-523-8810
Fax: 82-2-523-1483
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
--IMA.Boundary.301142598--
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Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 09:54:34 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Gagrani, Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Gagrani, Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: No Technet Mails
MIME-version: 1.0
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Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Are there any problems ? Or its just me , should I check out for not
receiving Technet Mails at my premises ??
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Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 09:14:52 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
ECI TEC <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: ECI TEC <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Technet messages
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Hello
I was on business trip for couple weeks. When I came back, I found no technet
messages at my account. Is there a problem with a network? or the distribution
system has been changed?
Michael
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 08:56:45 +0200
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "[log in to unmask]"
<[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Ericsson Radio Systems AB Kumla
Subject: Re: Particles in holes
X-To: Milind Rao <[log in to unmask]>
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Milind Rao wrote:
>
> Sorry for my earlier mail without subject
> ------------
> Hi
> We are getting particles in both component holes / via holes on and off
> and in double sided / multilayer boards. This is observed after pattern
> plating
> We use High build copper and Pattern plating.
> In some holes the particles are severe and reduce the hole size
> considerably. The problem is occuring very randomly.
> Has anybody got remedy for this ?
> Thanks in advance for the help
> Milind
>
> ______________________________________________________
> Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
>
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Hello!
I`ve seen a similar probelm. Go to your electroless. Look at the
conditioning step. Feel the side walls of the rinse tank afterwards.
If it`s slippery, well then you might have an algea problem.The algea
get stuck in the holes, gets activated and then plated.
Good luck!
Peter Fogelqvist
Ericsson Circuits
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=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 17 May 1998 22:10:38 +0200
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Achim Neu <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Privat
Subject: Solderability Test for BGA
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
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Hello Technet,
many times discussion BGA components with our customer they request a
solderability certification. But I don´t no any standard test of
solderability for BGA´s.
Does anybody know something like solderability test for BGA ?
Any help welcome.
Achim
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 17:42:52 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Arturo J. Aguayo" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FR4 material/Rogers material compatibility?
X-To: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Mitch Morey wrote:
>
> I have a "similar" question which hopefully someone can answer. I've
> been asked by our engineering group if FR4 material, is compatible with
> the Rogers 3000 and 4000 materials? We'd like to make a board using the
> Rogers material for some circuitry and FR4 material with the other
> circuitry.
>
> Any luck?
>
> Mitch Morey
> Sr PCB Designer
> NSI Communications (was ComStream Corp)
> San Diego CA
>
> >>> FRANCEYJ <[log in to unmask]> 04/30/98 10:14am >>>
> Ed
>
> Your customer is probably asking for "tetrafunctional" epoxy (FR4)
> which has
> comparatively higher Tg and chemical resistance (to "difunctional
> epoxy").
> Your laminate or board supplier will advise.
The key issue in making hybrid FR4/high performance material is to have
materials with matching CTE's in the X/Y plane. In short, both product
families (RO3000 and RO4000 families) can be made into MLB
configurations with FR4 (and there are several programs already doing
so). If you have any additional questions please let me know, thank you.
Art Aguayo, Technical Support Manager
Rogers Corporation, Microwave Materials Division
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 17 May 1998 17:44:57 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: ENIG/Heat sink
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi technetters ,
We are considering lamination of heat sink on PCB with Electroless Nickel
Immersion Gold ( ENIG ) finishing . What is practical experience with such
process ??
Lamination on Nickel should not be a problem , but what about lamination on
Immersion Gold??
Regards
Edward Szpruch
Eltek Ltd - Israel
Tel 972 3 9395050
Fax 972 3 9309581
E-mail : [log in to unmask]
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Date: Sun, 17 May 1998 09:27:39 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ADMIN: New Administrator.
X-To: Dmitriy Sklyar <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Dmitriy ,
First of all , thank You for Your exellent job You performed over a years .
I wish You good luck in Your next position .
I wish Hugo Scaramuzza will admistrate Nechnet as good as you made it !
Best regards
Edward Szpruch
Eltek Ltd - Israel
Tel 972 3 9395050
Fax 972 3 9309581
E-mail : [log in to unmask]
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Date: Sat, 16 May 1998 15:45:00 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Lainie Loveless <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Not read: [TN] need info: automated counting
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Date: Sat, 16 May 1998 11:07:19 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Wolfgang Schenke <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Wolfgang Schenke <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Excellon Drill format question
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M25 command defines the start of a pattern.
Are the commands following M25 executed immediately or stored until M01 (end
of pattern) and executed with M02.
Can inside a M25 definition be another M25 definition (nested patterns) ?
Wolfgang
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Date: Sat, 16 May 1998 12:43:03 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
TheITMTeam <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: TheITMTeam <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ASSY:profile max temps?
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Jeff -
The Max temp you shouldn't exceed for an application depends upon the
application. There can't be a set "max temperature" because everyone's
assembly compoistion is different.
Usually it is a component that has the "lowest thermal threshold of pain" but
it could be (if, for example, there are components on the board that can
withstand fairly high temperatures) the substrate, maybe even the solder
paste. It is up to you to determine whatever it is that is the Most
Vulnerable Component (MVC) on the assembly. Whatever that it is, I suggest
taking the temperature its manufacture says it shouldn't exceed and subtract 5
deg. C from that value as a buffer. The resulting temperature should not be
exceeded anywhere on the assembly. This defines the upper limit of the reflow
temperature envelope at peak. The lower temperature, Full Liquidus Temp or
Reflow Temp is defined by the solder paste manufacturer and is usually about
25-30 deg C above the alloy's melting point.
Phil Zarrow
ITM, Inc.
Durham, NH USA
www.ITM-SMT.com
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Date: Sat, 16 May 1998 02:48:00 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
GuitarBud <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: GuitarBud <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ASSY:profile max temps?
X-To: [log in to unmask]
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IR is tricky in that the emisivity of the part plays a large role in its
ability to absorb IR energy. Max component temp's that I have generally seen
max out at 140C. You might want to try using a connector with a different
emisivity coefficient.
If you can't get enough energy to the joints, you could also consider press-
fit connectors.
Frank
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Date: Sun, 17 May 1998 21:50:49 -0700
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From: Roberto Granados <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: info
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WE ARE INTERESTED IN THIS TECNOLOGY
PLEASE SEND ME INFORMATION ABOUT THIS.
I AM WORKING IN MY GRADUATION FINAL ASSIGMENT
IN UNIVERSIDAD DON BOSCO FROM EL SALVADOR.
ALEX GRANADOS
MECHANICAL ENGENIEERING STUDENT.
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 19:18:50 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Storing PCB's
X-To: Nicholas Kane <[log in to unmask]>
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Hi TechNet - Oh good - a metallurgy question! I'll try to fill in some info
(and add some opinion) that may be useful. Many folks split solderability
into two distinct categories: 1) Surface Oxide Mechanisms, 2) Intermetallic
Mechanisms. Both of these categories are very heavily dependent on
diffusion for going from a no-problem to a big-problem issue. Diffusion is
a time and temperature variable. If your solderable coating is of
sufficient thickness then you should only be dealing with a surface oxide
mechanism. Some solderable coatings are have better oxide growth resistance
than others (in terms of oxide type and thickness). You always form an
intermetallic layer during soldering. However, if the solderable coating is
too thin then either the solderable coating is consumed (e.g. a thin HASL
finish converts into copper/tin intermetallic) or the sacrificial coating
is breached (e.g. nickel diffusing through a gold finish). Dr. Chris Hunt
of NPL published a good paper containing the formula's for getting a first
order approximation of oxide and intermetallic diffusion growth in the SMI
96 conference proceeds that you may find helpful (Bev -this is who you
couldn't remember!).
WHY all of this info? - because if you would plug in a "cold " storage
temperature into the oxide and/or intermetallic growth equations you will
find that the amount of growth just about the same as room temperature
storage conditions! I haven't seen anyone bring forth data supporting that
"cold" storage would extend board shelf life. There has been several data
packages and papers that have shown that the amount of moisture (e.g.
humidity) can be detrimental to solderability due to the changes in oxide
formation (e.g. type) that can occur. My recommendation is to focus on a
pwb storage area that is dry and not spend time (and $$) on trying to keep
things cold.
Also, just to add some fuel to the debate that TechNet had on whether
nickel is a diffusion barrier: If you look at the nickel/copper phase
diagram it is very evident that copper can diffuse into nickel. However,
the kinetics parameters need to also be taken into account in addition to
the thermodynamic parameters, so the end results is that nickel does act as
a diffusion barrier (sorry Werner - you and I disagree on this one).
The simple answer is to procure solderable finishes that have sufficient
thickness to avoid intermetallic problems and use storage conditions that
do not promote oxide growth problems. Now if it were only that easy. Hope
this helps. Good Luck.
Dave Hillman
Rockwell Collins
[log in to unmask]
Nicholas Kane <[log in to unmask]> on 05/14/98 08:53:13 AM
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond
to Nicholas Kane <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: David D Hillman/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
Subject: [TN] Storing PCB's
I am confused.
For years, I have understood that the best way to store pcb's prior to
assembly is in a heated, relatively dry environment. I am sure that the
general consensus amongst most manufactureres is that this works best.
Well, just recently I was told by a company setting up a new facility that
they had been advised by a well known consultant to use a cold dry
environment. They are planning a 12-14 degree Celsius storeroom, once
again relatively dry.
Is there new thinking on this, or have they been badly advised?
[Nicholas Kane]
[Axion Australasia]
[Suite 3, 651 Canterbury Road]
[Surrey Hills]
[Victoria 3127 Australia]
[tel: 613 9899 3511 fax: 613 9899 3811]
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 21:46:15 -0500
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From: Enza Hill <[log in to unmask]>
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I haven't been getting any e-mail from your forum. I didn't
unsubscribe...what happened?
Enza
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Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 19:29:32 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Matthew Sanders <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Matthew Sanders <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Non wetting surfaces (exposed Cu)
Hello,
I've been seeing boards from some fab vendors recently that have non
wetting of the HAL finish on copper surfaces. Now, according to IPC-6012
(3.5.4.6), if the non wetting is on non soldered surfaces, which is the
case with my boards, 1% of conductor surfaces can have exposed Cu for
class 3. If you count each of the holes we have twice (once for each
side), we have less than that percentage. I'm still not very comfortable
with this, though, so I was hoping someone could tell me the
ramifications of exposed Cu in finished assemblies; it seems like it'd
potentially be a reliability problem potentially. Can someone shed some
light on this?
Thanks,
Matt Sander
Matthew Sanders
PWB Procurement Engineer, Trimble Navigation Limited
[log in to unmask]
Phone: (408) 481-7817
Fax: (408) 481-8590
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Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 11:28:50 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Allen <[log in to unmask]>
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From: Paul Allen <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: TN Electrical Conductive expoxy use of
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Dear Tech Netters,
I have an application requiring the use of AIT electrical conductive
expoxy, ME 8452 does anyone have an experience in controlling thickness
of bond lines.Currently with our application bonding two PCB's together,
squeeze out is proving hard to control. Our customer wants zero. Any
ideas.
Paul Allan.
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Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 15:40:14 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Chan, Marcelo" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Chan, Marcelo" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: TN Electrical Conductive expoxy use of
X-To: Paul Allen <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
If glass beads are allowable, that maybe your answer....beads are available in
many sizes and they are mixed with your epoxy and then applied....
Marcelo
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Allen [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 1998 2:29 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] TN Electrical Conductive expoxy use of
Dear Tech Netters,
I have an application requiring the use of AIT electrical conductive
expoxy, ME 8452 does anyone have an experience in controlling thickness
of bond lines.Currently with our application bonding two PCB's together,
squeeze out is proving hard to control. Our customer wants zero. Any
ideas.
Paul Allan.
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 11:54:16 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mark Simmons <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Excellon Drill format question
X-To: Wolfgang Schenke <[log in to unmask]>
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Wolfgang, yes M25 pattern is executed immediatley. MO2 looks for the
last M25. Sorry, no nesting. You can have several M25's, but they must
be executed before a new M25 is introduced.
Mark Simmons, V-Score Central
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Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 15:48:00 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jim Marsico 516-595-5879 <[log in to unmask]>
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From: Jim Marsico 516-595-5879 <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Solderability Test for BGA
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I asked this same question to Technet back in November of 1996 and received
only one response. I attached it for reference.
--Boundary_[ID_HEo4Ioq4xCJwG49kHmAhCw]
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Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 13:32:00 EDT
From: "Foster, Donald C." <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ASSY: BGA SOLDERABILITY
To: 'Technet' <[log in to unmask]>
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No bites on this one yet so I'll give it a try.
I don't think anyone has got a good handle on this one yet, however the
solderability is much more robust than leaded components so the lack of
solderability spec hasn't cause major heartburn yet(?). This issue also
depends on whether you are using all eutectic balls or dual alloy structure
(CBGA).
With all eutectic solder balls, any oxidation (even very thick ones) will be
broken up and displaced when the joint collapses during reflow, even if the
flux doesn't have enough activity to reduce all the oxide. And obviously
none of the standard methods used today would work. And I don't think anyone
is ready to use ellipsometry methods to measure sub-micron oxide thickness'
yet and I would have to guess the effectiveness would not be that great. The
only risk is if a large non-wetting oxide particle is trapped at the Cu pad
interface which will act as a starting crack reducing the fatigue life of
the joint.
My past experience (at another employer) with dual alloy structures
indicates they are very robust also. When we were attempting to define
solderability specs, we tried using steam aging to produce poorly solderable
parts. We had a very difficult time trying to produce unsolderable parts.
At the time, we were looking a tensile pull methods for evaluating
solderability, but this proved to be an unreliable method due to the large
scatter inherent in the method and the lack of producing parts with known
poor solderability. (The tensile pull method we looked at mimicked the board
attach process using WS-605 flux, pretty active stuff). We never came up
with a spec.
I did have one experience that was very bizarre which lead to a high temp
tensile pull method that allowed examination of the 90/10 ball , eutectic
interface without the use of metallurgical x-sectioning or C-SAM methods. We
noticed a growth of contaminant on the solder balls that was a result of
tray outgassing (due to improper processing of the tray) and a catalytic
interaction of the ball surface. It took about 3 weeks to grow the material
to a point in which it cause solderability problems. The main problem was
poor wetting and outgassing which caused excessive voiding. If you solder
to the ball using a tensile pull stud and pull at temps above 100C at low
strain rates, you can fracture at the ball / eutectic interface. One can
directly see the level of voiding in the eutectic part of the joint and can
see non-wetted parts of the solder ball.
I left this employer before this work was finished, but I don't think it
ever developed into a spec.
Don Foster
Symbios Logic
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Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 18:22:33 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Stewart, Dougal" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Stewart, Dougal" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: no messages -
MIME-Version: 1.0
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I have not received my usual 20-30 emails/day from the technet forum,
sincec Friday. Has a bomb dropped on America or have I done something to
offend?
Dougal
Dougal Stewart
Product Development Manager
Viasystems Selkirk Ltd
Selkirk, Scotland, TD7 5EJ
Tel: +44 1750 21601
Fax:+44 1750 22513
email [log in to unmask]
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Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 11:57:28 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Dhawan, Ashok" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Dhawan, Ashok" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: FW: [TN] STOP TECHNET!
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
There is no valid reason that Technet should ever stop unless similar
forum is established . I always regard Technet as a great tool in
execution of my Job.
Yes, I do also feel that the mail comes in bulk and create a tons of
load especially while you are away on short vacations. Improvements in
info flow are definately required. The suggestions to create info based
on subjects and index might improve .
ashok
> ----------
> From: Darrel Therriault[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: May 11, 1998 9:59 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] STOP TECHNET!
>
> Technet,
>
> I understand JB's dilemma, we all have it, but there are several times
> I
> see something come across Technet that I find interesting, so I find
> its
> worth hitting the "trash" button a few hundred times.
>
> DT
>
>
>
>
>
> At 11:17 AM 5/11/98 +0800, you wrote:
> >Hi all,
> >
> >no, I'm not serious - but I do have to say that TECHNET is sometimes
> too
> >active. Specially if you haven't checked your email for a few days
> and get
> >a few 100 messages.
> >
> >I think it would make sense to split the mailing list in several sub
> lists
> >such as:
> >
> >IPC standard related
> >wet processes
> >multilayer
> >photoimaging
> >laminate
> >etc......
> >
> >Any comments?
> >
> >Jens Behrens
> >
> >################################################################
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> >
> >
> >
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 12:52:05 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Edward J. Valentine" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Has the forum gone off-ilne ?
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TechNet -
I have not received any e-mail in the last two days from the Technet. Is
the Technet off-line ? Thanks, Ed Valentine
--
ProTronics, Inc.
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Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 09:49:35 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
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From: Fred Paul <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Where's Technet?
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I Haven't seen anything since Friday am, 5/15/98!
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Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 11:29:10 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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To all,
We are in the process of buying an automatic stencil (+printed board)
cleaner.
We would like to know if it is compatible with these kind of protective
coating (a
replacement to the HASL with Tin-Lead) or needs some special precaution.
**- OSP (organic solderability preservatives),
**- Au-Ni ,
**- Silver (by immersion).
We will use the MEGASOLV JB cleaning solution.
All information will be very appreciated.
Thanking you
,,
( . . )
----------o00---O---00o----------------------------------
Nicolas van der Heyden
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Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 11:33:55 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Automatic stencil cleaner.
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Sorry for my earlier mail without subject
------------------------------------------------------------------------
To all,
We are in the process of buying an automatic stencil (+printed board)
cleaner.
We would like to know if it is compatible with these kind of protective
coating (a
replacement to the HASL with Tin-Lead) or needs some special precaution.
**- OSP (organic solderability preservatives),
**- Au-Ni ,
**- Silver (by immersion).
We will use the MEGASOLV JB cleaning solution.
All information will be very appreciated.
Thanking you
,,
( . . )
----------o00---O---00o----------------------------------
Nicolas van der Heyden
------------------------------------------------------------
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 10:41:38 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
JSSallo <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: JSSallo <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Problem
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Has technet got a problem, or have I been lost for some reason. I'm getting no
messages!
Jerry Sallo
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 10:02:12 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Brad Kendall <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: subscribe TECHNET
Mime-Version: 1.0
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scubscribe Technet
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 09:06:28 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Terranova <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Terranova <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Is the server down?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
I haven't seen any mail for the past 2 days. Is the server down?
Regards,
Paul Terranova
Analytical and Environmental Test Services Lab
Digital Equipment Corporation
200 Forest Street
Mail Stop: MRO3-1/D2
Marlboro, MA 01752-3085
' Phone: (508)467-3109
* Fax: (508)467-6796
* Email: [log in to unmask]
WebSite: http://www.digital.com/lab-services
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 07:21:23 +0900
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"M. C. Chu" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "M. C. Chu" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Vibration at Drill Room
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Dear Technetters:
We have tried to check the vibration level of a drill room. We used FFT
Analyzer made by AFK Condition Monitoring System. We checked the vibration
level on a work table of a drill machine. It was around 0.5 to 2.5 micron
meters when the machine and the surrounding ones were off, and it was around
3.5 to 7 micron meters in plane direction and 1.5 to 3 micron meters in Z
direction when all the machine were running.
However I am not sure whether the vibration level observed is to be improved
or not. Please do advise me on the recommended maximum level of
vibration for small hole drilling.
Thanks and regards,
M. C. Chu
CSS Asia Co., Ltd.
Tel: 82-2-523-8810
Fax: 82-2-523-1483
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 12:29:17 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Khaled Hassan Fouad <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Khaled Hassan Fouad <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Printed Circuit Boards Factory
Subject: some problems
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear Sir,
I didn't receive any mail from you lately,eventhough i didn't quit
yet.Plz check my email in your mailing list .
--
Khaled H. Fouad
PCB Design Engineer, R&D Department
PCB Egypt , Member of BAHGAT Group Foundation
http://www.bahgat.com
Email : [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 15:24:10 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, Rwmpc <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Rwmpc <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Hey TechNet...Are you out there?
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hey TechNet. Could I have unintentionally logged myself off? It's been
awfully quiett out there the last few days.
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 12:47:29 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Steve Collins <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Steve Collins <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Test
MIME-Version: 1.0
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No messages today from Technet
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 16:40:09 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
tana <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <[log in to unmask]>
From: tana <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: University of Salford
Subject: Panasonic printer
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Hi Technetters!
Is there anyone out there using panasonic stencil printers?
Thanks
Dr. Tennyson Nguty, AeroMech Department, Newton Building, Salford University
Manchester M5 4WT, UK. Tel: 0161-295 5951/4696, Fax: 0161-295 5575/5108
>>>>>> Is my reality same as yours?
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 15:37:01 -0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Collins, Graham" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Collins, Graham" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistor s
X-To: "Lustig, Steven K.." <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Steve
Exactly what I needed, thanks!
- Graham
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Lustig, Steven K.. [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 9:09 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] need info: automated counting chip capacitors /
> resistors
>
> Graham,
>
> We have a V-tek PC-2500 Motorized SMD Taped Parts Counter which we have
> given to our stockroom for those same inventory purposes. They are
> happy with it and find it easy to use. Basically, you place the reel on
> one spindle, feed the tape through the counting sprocket and into a
> second reel. It is motorized so it counts fairly quickly and you can
> then quickly rewind the reel to get the tape back the way it started and
> double-check your count at the same time. Note that this equipment,
> like others I am aware of, counts the holes on the tape adjacent to the
> component pockets rather than the components themselves. So, if you are
> missing parts somewhere in the middle of the of the tape, it will not
> tell you this.
>
> Hope this helps
>
> -Steve
> Steven K. Lustig
> Process Engineer
> EMS Technologies, Inc.
> Norcross, GA
> (770) 263-9200 x4714
> [log in to unmask]
>
> >----------
> >From: Collins, Graham[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> >Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 7:55 AM
> >To: [log in to unmask]
> >Subject: need info: automated counting chip capacitors / resistors
> >
> >Good day Technet.
> >I'm currently battling with our parts guys over inventory control of
> >components. For the big stuff like ICs it is fairly easy to count them,
> but
> >for chip caps / resistors it is more difficult to count them 'cause they
> are
> >on tape and reel. I've suggested the technique of measuring the length
> of
> >tape and dividing by the pitch, but our inventory guys want something
> >automated.
> >I'm sure such a thing exists, but have no idea where to begin looking.
> Can a
> >Technet guru point me in the direction of an automated counting machine
> for
> >counting parts on tape and reel? Please reply off the Technet if it
> sounds
> >like an advert.
> >
> >Thanks,
> >
> >Graham Collins
> >Process Engineer
> >Litton Systems Canada
> >(902) 873-2000 extension 215
> >
> >
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 13:03:06 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Karl Sweitzer <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Karl Sweitzer <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Image Acquisition Systems http://www.kodak.com/cgsHome/ias.shtml
Subject: Re: Storing PCB's
X-To: Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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After reading Bev's great discussion, I decided to put some numbers on
the moisture vs. temperature vs. relative humidity. From a SI
psychrometric chart, I put together the following summary table of
moisture content (g water vapor / kg dry air):
% Rel | Temperature |
Humidity | 25C | 10C | 5C |
---------+-------+-------+-------+
90% | 18 | 7 | 5 |
---------+-------+-------+-------+
50% | 10 | 4 | 2.5 |
---------+-------+-------+-------+
As Bev pointed out, an air-conditioned storage room (lower temperature
and humidity) can do wonders.
Be careful at assembly, low humidity is BAD for ESD!
--
Karl Sweitzer voice: 716.47.77546
Eastman Kodak Company pager: 716.25.33681
800 Lee Road fax: 716.47.77293
Rochester, NY 14650-3118 mailto:[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 09:42:45 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mike Barmuta <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Help
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Jean: There are many adhesive systems that "might" work well for your
application, however there some issues you need to consider to select the
"right" adhesive.
1. What is it that you are bonding to the glass?
2. Is this assembly fixtured?
3. How fast do you want the adhesive to cure?
4. If baking is required what is the max exposure temp?
5. When you say "semi rigid" what are you looking for?
impact resistance, vibration resistance, compliance,
elongation, elasticity, medium range shore D hardness etc.
6. What are you looking for in "excellant bond strength"?
sheer strength, peel strength, tensile strength etc.
7. Are there any electrical requirements?
dielectric stength, insulation resistance etc.
8. What is the min/max service and storage temp requirements?
9. etc. etc. etc.
As you can see there many factors that come into play. The better you can define
the requirements the better the proper adhesive can be selected. Companies such
as Grace, 3M, Ciba, Dow, Loctite etc. all make good products that could probably
work for you. I would contact them and discuss your application needs. As a
sidelight 3M has a nice little duo-pack system as part of their DP epoxy
adhesive series. It will bond to glass, is semi-flexible, cures fairly rapidly
and has good over all properties. The other above mentioned suppliers also carry
similar products.
Regards
Michael Barmuta
Staff Engineer
Fluke Corp.
Everett Wa.
425-356-6076
On Thu, 14 May 1998 17:01:21 -0700 Jean Connick wrote:
> From: Jean Connick <[log in to unmask]>
> Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 17:01:21 -0700
> Subject: [TN] Help
> To: [log in to unmask]
>
> Can anyone help me locate an Epoxy, RTV or other, that when cured is
> semi rigid, with an excellent bond strength to glass. (A one part system
> is preferred).
>
> Thanks for any/all your assistance ahead of time
>
> Jean Connick
> Tel: 714-996-1248 x 299
> Fax: 714-961-7836
> E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
>
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> ################################################################
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 12:16:38 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Karl Sweitzer <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Karl Sweitzer <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Image Acquisition Systems http://www.kodak.com/cgsHome/ias.shtml
Subject: Re: Thermal relief
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Mirka,
The thermal relief issue has bugged me too. The rule of thumb that I
hear often is that you want to have a maximum sum of .160in of 1oz
copper trace width going into a pth (.080in for 2oz). This means that
if you have 4x 1oz power planes that you want to connect to one solder
pin with a 4 spoke thermal relief design, then the trace should be:
.160 in / (4 planes * 4 spokes)= .010in wide.
Unfortunately, there not as much agreement on thermal relief "spoke"
length. Most people I have checked with use .010 to .020in lengths.
Another guideline is to use 4 spokes (per layer) whenever possible to
give a uniform temperature distribution around the PTH. 3, 2 and 1
spoke can also be used when necessary.
*********************************************************************
I have developed the following equations based on simple physics, (no
testing). There are three issues of concern:
1) The temperature rise when soldering
2) The temperature rise under electrical load
3) The voltage drop under electrical load
For the first case, the equations are based on simple 1D heat
transfer:
Q= (K a dT)/L = K dT (a/L)
where Q is the input heat power, K is the thermal conductivity of the
material, dT is the temperature difference and a, L are the cross
section area and length.
The actual values to use in this equation are an area of debate. K is
easy. I use K=10 (W/inC) in mixed SI and english units for Copper.
dT is the temperature difference between the ambient temperature of
the board and the solder joint at reflow. Lets ASSUME 100C ambient
(mild preheat) and 250C soldering temperature for a dT of 150C for
example. Lets also ASSUME that we are using a 25W hand soldering
iron. These assumptions can be changed around to suit your conditions.
We can now rearrange the above equation to solve for geometry:
(a/L)= K dT/Q or L= a K dT/Q
If we use the .160" of 1oz copper trace width as a rule for the area
we can calculate the length needed as:
L= .160in * .00135in * 10 W/inC * 150C / 25W = .013in
This falls in the .010 to .020in range that I mentioned above. Note:
larger dT and smaller Q assumptions increase length.
The second concern, can be evaluated by changing the equation. The
electrical resistance in a copper trace is:
R= pL/a
where R is ohms, and p= 6.7E-7 ohm*in. The power dissipated is:
Q= i^2R
Combining these equations and solving for dT:
dT=(p/K)*(iL/a)^2
(p/K)=6.7E-8 in^2C/A^2 or to allow for minimum plating thickness and
trace width, I use (p/K)=1E-7 in^2C/A^2
For example, the temperature rise in a 15A .160in 1oz copper thermal
relief spoke .013in long is:
dT= 1E-7 in^2C/A^2 *(15A *.013in /(.160in *.00135in))^2= 0.08C
This is a very small temperature rise and it shows how good copper is
for this use.
The final concern is voltage drop:
V= iR= ipL/a
For our example above:
V= 15A * 6.7E-7 ohm*in *.013in / (.160in *.00135in)= .0006 volts
***********************************************************************
Based on all this analysis, my department tends to use a 4 spoke
design with .015in wide by .010in long spokes on outer layers and
.020in long spokes on inner layers. We have set up a common aperature
table and will use this when we have 4 or fewer layers. The increased
temperature rise and voltage drop when there are fewer layers are
still small.
Any comments on this analysis??? I hope it helps :)
--
Karl Sweitzer voice: 716.47.77546
Eastman Kodak Company pager: 716.25.33681
800 Lee Road fax: 716.47.77293
Rochester, NY 14650-3118 mailto:[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 09:14:26 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Jones, Heidi N (NM75)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Jones, Heidi N (NM75)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Help
Try Emerson & Cuming Stycast 1265. It is a two part clear epoxy, and it
adheres very well to glass, as long as the glass is clean. For technical
data, call Emerson & Cuming Specialty Polymers at 1-800-832-4929.
Heidi Jones
Senior Manufacturing Engineer
Honeywell, Defense Avionics Systems
9201 San Mateo NE
Albuquerque, NM 87113-2227
(505) 828-5806
FAX (505) 828-5500
email: [log in to unmask]
----------
From: Jean Connick[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 6:01 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Help
Can anyone help me locate an Epoxy, RTV or other, that when cured is
semi rigid, with an excellent bond strength to glass. (A one part system
is preferred).
Thanks for any/all your assistance ahead of time
Jean Connick
Tel: 714-996-1248 x 299
Fax: 714-961-7836
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 16:16:32 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Oven problems
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I am experiencing solderability problems due to my oven glue procurement at
the wave solder. My pads are nice and shiny before the oven then they come
out with a haze that can't be wiped off or cleaned off with alcohol. Is
there anything that I am missing that could be caused by the oven? Would
nitrogen help this?
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 10:11:05 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Phil Dam <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Phil Dam <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Particles in holes
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Assuming you mean high build electroless copper and pattern plate I would
look at your electroless process, in particular the e copper bath. We have
in the past experienced noduling of the plated copper within the holes when
the air aggitation of the bath was insufficient and caused localized areas of
little or no air aggitation. A small amount of "sanding" on the panel
surfaces or racks was present to tip off the problem usually, but a time or
two we had no sanding but the problem. Copper noduling became very evident
after pattern plating. Increasing the air supply to the electroless bath
along with modifications to the air spargers fixed the problem. Other causes
of instability may be at work also, too high operating temperature, high
caustic, formaldehyde concentrations, or low chelator, stabilizer
concentration. (Check bath chemistry to be sure it is within the recommended
operating ranges for all components).
Phil Dam
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 10:09:08 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"William E. Johnson" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "William E. Johnson" <[log in to unmask]>
Is the server down?
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 12:58:47 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Byrns Nancy <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Byrns Nancy <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: IPC-RB-276
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Hi everyone
I would like to know if someone have a copy of IPC-RB-276. It's
impossible to got a copy from IPC because this document is supersedes.
We are currently working with IPC-D-275 and we need to have a copy of
IPC-RB-276.
Look in your archive maybe you will find it.
Thanks you
Nancy Byrns
Oerlikon Aerospace
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 17:39:17 +0200
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Weiner Mickey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Weiner Mickey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: test - please ignore
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
test123
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 14:59:53 +0900
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
=?euc-kr?B?v8C8vMPmILTruK4gwPzA2iDB9cbysPjA5cewwfq6uMH1xsA=?=
<[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: =?euc-kr?B?v8C8vMPmILTruK4gwPzA2iDB9cbysPjA5cewwfq6uMH1xsA=?=
<[log in to unmask]>
Subject: DISCOLORATION
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
HI ! EVERYBODY
I HAVE A PROBLEM.
AFTER I/R REFLOW PROCESS, PCB WAS DISCOLORED AROUND
GOLD PLATING, ESPECIALLY EXPOSED EPOXY AREA CHANGED
LIGHT VIOLET.
THE PCB WAS APPLIED A HASL PROCESS AND EDGE CONNECTOR
GOLD PLATING. WE TESTED MANY TIMES AND ONLY PCB WHICH
WAS APPLIED THE HASL PROCESS AND GOLD PLATING PROCESS.
THERE IS LOW PEAK OF Sn BY SEM ANALYSIS ON THE DISCOLORED
SPECIMEN ONLY.
THE GOLD PLATING CHEMICAL MAKER SAID :
IF AMINO-COMPOUNDS WHICH IS USED HARDNER OF EPOXY
MATERIAL JOIN WITH A CYANIDE, PCB CAN DISCOLORATION AFTER
THERMAL SHOCK.
PLEASE HELP ME WHY THE PCB WAS DISCOLORED AS SOON AS
POSSIBLE.
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 15:22:47 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Storing PCB's
X-To: David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Nicholas:
Just so you know, SMTA members are entitled to free reprints of SMI papers
(e.g. the Hunt paper David H. mentioned). The alternative is to purchase a
reprint for $5/page. Just call 612-920-7682 and Amy will be able to help you.
Regards,
-David
At 07:18 PM 5/15/98 -0500, you wrote:
>Hi TechNet - Oh good - a metallurgy question! I'll try to fill in some info
>(and add some opinion) that may be useful. Many folks split solderability
>into two distinct categories: 1) Surface Oxide Mechanisms, 2) Intermetallic
>Mechanisms. Both of these categories are very heavily dependent on
>diffusion for going from a no-problem to a big-problem issue. Diffusion is
>a time and temperature variable. If your solderable coating is of
>sufficient thickness then you should only be dealing with a surface oxide
>mechanism. Some solderable coatings are have better oxide growth resistance
>than others (in terms of oxide type and thickness). You always form an
>intermetallic layer during soldering. However, if the solderable coating is
>too thin then either the solderable coating is consumed (e.g. a thin HASL
>finish converts into copper/tin intermetallic) or the sacrificial coating
>is breached (e.g. nickel diffusing through a gold finish). Dr. Chris Hunt
>of NPL published a good paper containing the formula's for getting a first
>order approximation of oxide and intermetallic diffusion growth in the SMI
>96 conference proceeds that you may find helpful (Bev -this is who you
>couldn't remember!).
>
>WHY all of this info? - because if you would plug in a "cold " storage
>temperature into the oxide and/or intermetallic growth equations you will
>find that the amount of growth just about the same as room temperature
>storage conditions! I haven't seen anyone bring forth data supporting that
>"cold" storage would extend board shelf life. There has been several data
>packages and papers that have shown that the amount of moisture (e.g.
>humidity) can be detrimental to solderability due to the changes in oxide
>formation (e.g. type) that can occur. My recommendation is to focus on a
>pwb storage area that is dry and not spend time (and $$) on trying to keep
>things cold.
>
>Also, just to add some fuel to the debate that TechNet had on whether
>nickel is a diffusion barrier: If you look at the nickel/copper phase
>diagram it is very evident that copper can diffuse into nickel. However,
>the kinetics parameters need to also be taken into account in addition to
>the thermodynamic parameters, so the end results is that nickel does act as
>a diffusion barrier (sorry Werner - you and I disagree on this one).
>
>The simple answer is to procure solderable finishes that have sufficient
>thickness to avoid intermetallic problems and use storage conditions that
>do not promote oxide growth problems. Now if it were only that easy. Hope
>this helps. Good Luck.
>
>Dave Hillman
>Rockwell Collins
>[log in to unmask]
>
>
>
>
>Nicholas Kane <[log in to unmask]> on 05/14/98 08:53:13 AM
>
>Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond
> to Nicholas Kane <[log in to unmask]>
>
>To: [log in to unmask]
>cc: (bcc: David D Hillman/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
>Subject: [TN] Storing PCB's
>
>
>
>
>I am confused.
>
>For years, I have understood that the best way to store pcb's prior to
>assembly is in a heated, relatively dry environment. I am sure that the
>general consensus amongst most manufactureres is that this works best.
>
>Well, just recently I was told by a company setting up a new facility that
>they had been advised by a well known consultant to use a cold dry
>environment. They are planning a 12-14 degree Celsius storeroom, once
>again relatively dry.
>
>Is there new thinking on this, or have they been badly advised?
>
>
>
>
>[Nicholas Kane]
>[Axion Australasia]
>[Suite 3, 651 Canterbury Road]
>[Surrey Hills]
>[Victoria 3127 Australia]
>[tel: 613 9899 3511 fax: 613 9899 3811]
>
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>
>
SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
Enabling members to achieve success
in surface mount and companion technologies
through education, training and access to knowledge.
5200 Willson Road, Suite 215, Edina, MN 55424-1343
612-920-7682 F 612-926-1819
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 15:22:53 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: fluoride burns
X-To: Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Bev is right about fluoride burns - a few weeks ago a man spent an entire
"ER" episode dying from them.
-David
At 08:36 AM 5/15/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Jean, Rudy,
>If you are going to use ammonium bifluoride (ammonium hydrogen fluoride for
>the non-chemically inclined), BE CAREFUL. All ionic fluorides should be
>treated with care. Certainly this one is not as bad as hydrofluoric acid,
>fluorosulfuric acid or super oxidizers like arsenic pentafluoride, but do be
>careful. I could go on about other very interesting nasties, but I'll
>control myself and stop here. Fluoride burns are nasty. They don't always
>hurt at first, but they sure will later! Fluoride will continue to
>penetrate the skin and will eventually start to leach calcium from the bones
>and can lead to localized "chemical osteoporosis" (my term, I'm not a med).
>
>It would be a good idea to have at hand as a first aid treatment a saturated
>solution of tetramethylammonium chloride or some other quarternary ammonium
>salt. If one comes in contact with a solution capable of liberating
>fluoride, dip the affected portion in an ice cold saturated solution of this
>stuff (good chemical term). The tetramethyl ammonium ion will sequester the
>fluoride ions enough to let the body deal with them. The cold decreases the
>diffusion rate of the fluoride into the depths of the body. Certainly the
>ice will dilute the stored room temperature saturated solution, but that's
>OK. Obviously remove the affected portion form the cold solution once in a
>while to avoid excessive cooling and its attendant problems.
>
>I'm not making this up. Check it out in the CRC Handbook of Laboratory
>Safety, 2nd Edition, CRC Press Inc., Boca Raton, 1976, pp45-47 (obviously
>different pages in newer editions! :) ) This is based on some excellent
>work by a med in DuPont, who know full well about fluoride burns from past
>experiences, unfortunately.
>
>regards,
>Bev Christian
>Nortel
>> ----------
>> From: RSedlak[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 1998 10:45 PM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [TN] Help
>>
>> Jean:
>>
>> This is one of those experiences that may be exactly what you need, or may
>> also result in gales of laughter.
>>
>> I had a similar need, to glue my rear view mirror to my windshield, in a
>> non-
>> standard position. I solved the problem by using standard Dow RTV
>> silicone,
>> BUT, in order to get it to adhere, I had to roughen the surface of the
>> glass,
>> using emery paper.
>>
>> Now, using emery paper on your parts may be difficult, or impractical, and
>> so
>> my suggestion is use a mild glass etch, which could be a simple 10%
>> solution
>> of ammonium biflouride, which you could put on with a cotton swab. Rinse
>> well, then dry, and apply your silicone.
>>
>> Hope it works for you.
>>
>> Rudy Sedlak
>> RD Chemical Company
>>
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>> information.
>> For the technical support contact Dmitriy Sklyar at [log in to unmask] or
>> 847-509-9700 ext.311
>> ################################################################
>>
>
>################################################################
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>
>
SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
Enabling members to achieve success
in surface mount and companion technologies
through education, training and access to knowledge.
5200 Willson Road, Suite 215, Edina, MN 55424-1343
612-920-7682 F 612-926-1819
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 18:39:41 -0400
Reply-To: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Duane Briggs <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: AMI
Subject: Voids in solder joints
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
IPC-610-B does not address voids inside solder joints so I'm requesting the
input of fellow practitioners. Searching the archive turned up nothing on
this subject. Soldering (both wave and reflow) sometimes results in voids
that can be x-ray imaged and verified by destructive testing. Some of
these voids or combination of voids result in SMT heel fillets that are
less than 50% of the width of the lead or less than 50% hole fill. Some
voids from reflow seem inevitable especially in J-leaded solder joints.
Has anyone tried to quantify how much voiding is acceptable? I would
appreciate all thoughtful responses.
Duane B
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 01:39:11 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Searching_for_Antimony
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="divider"
--divider
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Att. Sales / Export Department
Re: Request for ANTIMONY
A "RFQ" for ANTIMONY which, to the best of our knowledge
are being offered by you, was placed with us by one of our clients.
We are a world wide sourcing firm and we are paid by our clients to
find them suitable suppliers.
To you, our service is totally FREE OF CHARGE !!!
The information we will get from you will not only be immediately sent
to this particular client but also to other clients looking for same or
similar items.
Please use our Internet interface at:
http://www.thebol.com
in order to register the products / materials / equipment or services
for which you are interested to get requests from our subscribers.
Once registered,the system will forward to you automatically the
relevant to you requests.
There you can also get more information about us and our
FREE for SUPPLIERS SERVICE.
We are looking forward to serve you to the best of our ability.
Best Regards
BOL sourcing international Ltd
Purchasing department
mailto:[log in to unmask]
--divider--
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 13:59:04 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
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From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: subscribe
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 15:31:39 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
JON MOORE <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: JON MOORE <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Capacitor Damage At Wave Solder -Reply
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Are these caps on the topside or bottom side going through the wave?
>>> "Kane, Joseph" <[log in to unmask]> 05/14/98 10:33am >>>
We are experiencing failures of .25% film capacitors, presumably from
heat
damage during wave solder. Top side preheat temperatures measured
210F,
within the process range we like. Tried cooling it down to 163F topside,
got more solder defects, and some caps still going out of tolerance. We
suspect that parts can't take thermal transfer during transit through the
wave, where topside gets about 100F warmer (of course part bodies see
less).
Manufacturer says no, it's our preheat, still too high at 163F, even though
they claim that the film can withstand 284F in the preheat zone. Boards
are
at least 10 layers with planes, and soldering cooler than 163 will mean lots
of defects, especially where the RMA doesn't dry out or activate properly.
Speeding up the conveyor results in lots of top side insufficients. Hand
soldering works, but is expensive. Can't live with these parts, can't flush
them. Should we consider cooler preheat, or are there other wave solder
tricks we can try?
Joe Kane
Lockheed Martin Control Systems
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 13:34:56 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: PT44 Team
X-To: [log in to unmask]
X-cc: [log in to unmask]
Mentorship would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Tom
Thomas J. Waraksa
Eaton Corporation/Actuator and Sensor Division
1400 S. Livernois Avenue, P.O. Box 5020
Rochester Hills, Michigan 48308-5020
Phone: 248-608-7309 Fax: 248-656-2621 E Mail: [log in to unmask]
-------------
Original Text
From: Sherri A. Bettendorf@01713@Lectron_RH, on 5/13/98 3:36 PM:
Tim and Tom,
I am basically bowing out on the PT44 team so that I can concentrate my
efforts on the JR program. Would you like me to act as the "mentor" since
Mike Arnott has already been removed as such? I don't have a problem with
that. Let John and I know. Thanks.
*************************************
Sherri A. Bettendorf
Actuator and Sensor Division - Eaton Corporation
248-608-7381, FAX 248-656-2621, PAGER 248-400-1638
EMAIL Address: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 08:44:40 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Scott Decker <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Enterprise Server Group
Subject: Re: ADMIN: New Administrator.
MIME-Version: 1.0
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SteveZeva wrote:
> Dmitriy,
>
> I've spoken on the phone with you a few times over the past 4-5 years
> when I was having problems (mostly operator error on my part, but we don't
> need to get into that...hehehe), but never have met you face to face so that I
> could give you a warm handshake, and say thanks for all of your hard work!
>
> I imagine keeping this list going has been one of your "side jobs" in
> addition to all the other stuff that has been heaped on your plate, and you
> have done a fine job!
>
> Hugo is gonna to have some pretty big shoes to fill, but I imagine that
> you have done a "brain dump" with him and passed on the kinds of things that
> will help him keep this list running as smoothly as you have been able to do
> over the years.
>
> I wish you the best of luck and hope that whatever is ahead of you,
> brings you nothing but the best!
>
> Once Again, THANKS!!!
>
> -Steve Gregory-
>
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> ################################################################
Dmitriy,
I echo the same as Steve said above. I too, have talked to you some time ago, (former
life/company)
and you helped me out also. Thanks for the good work and best of luck to you....
--
Scott Decker
AKA: PadMasterson
Praegitzer Design On Location at
Enterprise Server Group CO3
Intel Corporation
Ph: (503)-677-6582
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 15 May 1998 10:20:32 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Christopher Rhodes <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Christopher Rhodes <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: The US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) Common Sense
Initiative (CSI) Electronics Subcommittee,
X-cc: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
The US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) Common Sense Initiative (CSI)
Electronics Subcommittee, to which several IPC members belong, is exploring ideas
regarding integrating safety and health improvements with pollution prevention and
other environmental performance goals.
Toward that end, the Subcommittee would like to pose several general questions to the
industry:
1--What problems and issues exist with the present EPA and OSHA environmental, health
and safety framework, and what impediments exist to hinder improved performance in
either or both areas? For example, are there actions you might undertake to improve
worker safety, but environmental regulations prevent you from doing so (or vice
versa)?
2--If a forum of health experts were convened (with NIOSH and OSHA), what specific
topics might be included on the agenda that could allow for constructive engagement
of all stakeholders?
3--How can a rapidly changing industry most effectively be in conformance with the
precautionary principle?
FYI, this is the precautionary principle: "When as activity raises threats of harm
to human health of the environment, precautionary measures should be taken even if
some cause and effect relationships are not fully established scientifically. In
this context, the proponent of an activity, rather than the public, should bear the
burden of proof."
Also FYI, the CSI is EPA's "cleaner, cheaper, smarter" project in regulatory reform.
Any comments, thoughts, examples or inquiries are quite welcome.
Thank you.
Christopher Rhodes
Director of Public Policy
IPC
2215 Sanders Road
Northbrook IL 60062
847/509-9700 x306
fax 509-9798
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 16:02:49 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Andy Slade <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FAB Land around via holes
X-To: Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Hi Paul,
One possible solution to the problem is the use of "teardropping" or
"snowman" pads that effectively increase the land area specifically at
the circuit to pad interfaces with little or no effect on overall
spacing. This is fairly easily accomplished with most CAM/Tooling
softwares these days and can be done by your board supplier.
Hope this helps
Andy Slade
[log in to unmask]
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: [TN] FAB Land around via holes
Author: Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]> at SMTPLink-Hadco
Date: 05/15/98 1:29 PM
Can anyone help with a query on land around via holes. I have a copy of
IPC-A-600 Rev E Aug 1995 which states for plated through holes the
minimum land between the track and pad and hole must not be less than
0.002" as a minimum standard. This means that misregistration towards
the track is not acceptable if the pad is reduced below 0.002" even if
there is no actual breakout. On the other hand, the hole is allowed to
break out of the pad in any other direction by as much as half the
diameter. Clearly the two are incompatible with each other since with
registration that bad there is bound to be breakout towards tracks in
some areas.
Has there been a revision specifically for via holes only, or is there
any other specification relating to landless via holes as this criteria
is impossible to meet on some designs. The implications of meeting this
spec are to increase via pad size and/or reduce hole size which has
implications for design density and manufacturing cost.
Any views on this would be greatly appreciated. For production drilling
on large panels, what minimum land do you think would be needed at the
outset to guarantee minimum annular 0.002" on the finished panel taking
account of drill size and etch reduction also?
Best Regards
--
Paul Gould
[log in to unmask]
Isle of Wight,UK
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 16:57:20 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Brad Kendall <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Automatic stencil cleaner.
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
I started with Megasolv in my AAT cleaner. It ate the paint off the machine
and really did not clean my stencils that well without a long cleaning
cycle. I switched to Zestron and it works fantastic and cut cleaning time
in half. It does not eat paint and is in the same price range.
Brad Kendall
Hella Electronics Corp.
[log in to unmask] on 05/19/98 11:33:55 AM
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Brad Kendall/Hella North America Inc.)
Subject: [TN] Automatic stencil cleaner.
Sorry for my earlier mail without subject
------------------------------------------------------------------------
To all,
We are in the process of buying an automatic stencil (+printed board)
cleaner.
We would like to know if it is compatible with these kind of protective
coating (a
replacement to the HASL with Tin-Lead) or needs some special precaution.
**- OSP (organic solderability preservatives),
**- Au-Ni ,
**- Silver (by immersion).
We will use the MEGASOLV JB cleaning solution.
All information will be very appreciated.
Thanking you
,,
( . . )
----------o00---O---00o----------------------------------
Nicolas van der Heyden
------------------------------------------------------------
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 14:05:07 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Wally Doeling (wallyd)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Wally Doeling (wallyd)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Voltage spacing on finished boards
Currently we need information on spacing for innerlayers and
outerlayer for using 48V. DC nominal voltage planes.
There are guidelines in IPC-D-275, but we have had failures in the
past with this voltage and the suggested spacing.
This product should continue functioning for at least 15 years.
So far, I have not found out what the max. peak voltage will be so
any answers should indicate not only the spacing at this voltage, but a
volts/mil.
for 48V. and above.
I would appreciate any input and the logic/experience behind your
recommendations!
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 17:18:43 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: DISCOLORATION
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Hi Choong!
Finally! Somebody else experienced the same problem I had a few years
ago...I thought I was going nuts back then. We were building VGA cards and the
same thing happened to us. Down around the gold fingers was where we had what
we started calling; "The purple plague".
The vendor you spoke with was right, it does have something to do with
the gold plating chemicals. If I remember correctly, it was because the FAB
vendor didn't follow the proper process, or clean the PCB adequately when
doing the gold plating...I'm not sure of the precise problem, we were just
told that it had to do with something not being done right during the gold
plating.
Whatever it is, it'll get darker with higher temperatures during reflow.
Once we found the problem, we tried cleaning the boards using Freon as well as
water, to see if by doing that it would eliminate the problem, but no luck.
We were told back then that once the chemicals had soaked into the
laminate, that was it...you couldn't do anything to keep it from discoloring.
The bad thing about it is, it doesn't start to turn purple until the board
sees reflow temperatures, so you couldn't separate and purge the bad PCB's
before hand...so unless somebody else has figured out something else, these
boards are hosed...
Supposedly though, it's nothing harmful, it just makes the boards
purple...
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 23:19:17 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Matthias Mansfeld <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <[log in to unmask]>
From: Matthias Mansfeld <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
Subject: Getting rid of Air Bubbles in Solder Paste Syringes
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Hello Technetters,
I have some solder paste syringes which contain air bubble, probably
from transport. That means, I have to fight with a bit of overflow
during dispensing, rather boring with 0805 or SOICs. Pull back flow
is not so easy to set up with my equipment, thus, the best would be
to get rid of these bubbles.
Does anybody know an easy, proven trick? ( I have no vacuum chamber
available).
Many thanx in advance, regards
Matthias Mansfeld
-----------------------------------------------
Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
* Printed Circuit Board Design and Assembly
Am Langhoelzl 11, D-85540 Haar, GERMANY
Phone: +49-89-4620 0937, Fax: +49-89-4620 0938
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
Internet: http://home.t-online.de/home/matthias.mansfeld
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 14:58:10 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ron Hayashi <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ron Hayashi <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Interconnect Stress Test
X-cc: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Has anyone ever heard of an Interconnect Stress Test for bare Printed
Wiring Boards? If so, where can I obtain the corresponding coupon in
which to perform the testing, as well as how to perform the test?
Any help in getting an answer would be gretly appreciated.
You can contact me on or off line.
Ron Hayashi <[log in to unmask]>
ph. # 1-619-695-2222, ext. 243
or Fax me 1-619-695-2165
Thank you very much..
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 18:17:15 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Duane Briggs <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Duane Briggs <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Solder void acceptability
MIME-Version: 1.0
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IPC-610-B does not address voids inside solder joints so I'm requesting the
input of fellow practitioners. Searching the archive turned up nothing on
this subject. Soldering (both wave and reflow) sometimes results in voids
that can be x-ray imaged and verified by destructive testing. Some of
these voids or combination of voids result in SMT heel fillets that are
less than 50% of the width of the lead or less than 50% hole fill. Some
voids from reflow seem inevitable especially in J-leaded solder joints.
Has anyone tried to quantify how much voiding is acceptable? I would
appreciate all thoughtful responses.
Duane B
[log in to unmask]
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################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 17:37:16 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Interconnect Stress Test
X-To: Ron Hayashi <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
You can call Bill Birch at PWB Interconnects
in Canada. His phone number is 613-828-6340.
Bill can explain everything you need to know about this
test method.
At 02:58 PM 5/19/98 -0700, Ron Hayashi wrote:
>Has anyone ever heard of an Interconnect Stress Test for bare Printed
>Wiring Boards? If so, where can I obtain the corresponding coupon in
>which to perform the testing, as well as how to perform the test?
>
>Any help in getting an answer would be gretly appreciated.
>
>You can contact me on or off line.
>
>Ron Hayashi <[log in to unmask]>
>ph. # 1-619-695-2222, ext. 243
>or Fax me 1-619-695-2165
>Thank you very much..
>
>################################################################
>TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8c
>################################################################
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following text in the body:
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>################################################################
>Please visit IPC web site (http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm) for additional
information.
>For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
847-509-9700 ext.312
>################################################################
>
>
Josh Moody
Materials Quality Engineer
Hewlett-Packard - Richardson (HPSD)
ph# (972) 497-4617
[log in to unmask]
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################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 15:37:28 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Joseph E. J. Duclos Jr." <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Joseph E. J. Duclos Jr." <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Excellon Drill format question
X-To: Wolfgang Schenke <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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From what I read on the screens of the Excellon CNC-5 & 6 controllers steps
are executed upon read. HOWEVER, if, by chance an error has crept into the
drill code say at T8, I have had machines stop at T3, T4, up to T8. I
believe this is due to buffer size in the machine itself.
Nesting of steps:
FMAT,2 FMAT,1
M01 M24
M04 R02M26X05Y
R02M02X05Y M26
M02XY M24
M02XY06 M26XY06
M02XY M26
M08M30 M27
This will result in a pattern of 6 total pieces (3 along the 'X' axis & 2
along the 'Y' axis)
A caution about nested steps, some software/machines can only handle 2 sets
of 'nests' the above example shows only 1.
Hope this helps:
JOE SENDZ......
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 17:54:58 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Edwards, Ted A (AZ75)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Edwards, Ted A (AZ75)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Interconnect Stress Test
X-To: "[log in to unmask] (IPM Return requested)" <[log in to unmask]>
The machine is made by PWB Interconnect Solutions in Ottawa Canada and the
expert is Bill Birch who is heading the IPC Task Group defining tests
qualify it. So far it has been correlated to thermal ovens and
microsections and at IPC Expo a presentation was made by a staff member form
Delco correlating it to the Delco 1000 hour test.
Bill may be reached at 819-684-9849 or e mail [log in to unmask]
----------
From: [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Interconnect Stress Test
Date: Tuesday, May 19, 1998 5:02PM
Has anyone ever heard of an Interconnect Stress Test for bare Printed
Wiring Boards? If so, where can I obtain the corresponding coupon in
which to perform the testing, as well as how to perform the test?
Any help in getting an answer would be gretly appreciated.
You can contact me on or off line.
Ron Hayashi <[log in to unmask]>
ph. # 1-619-695-2222, ext. 243
or Fax me 1-619-695-2165
Thank you very much..
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 17:55:29 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Solderability Test for BGA
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: multipart/mixed;
Boundary="0__=ZgomjRyZqvCq0dIuZbkSQmzUd5zXYBCmp27Y1zsrYOeAYZBUGpIPzVVe"
--0__=ZgomjRyZqvCq0dIuZbkSQmzUd5zXYBCmp27Y1zsrYOeAYZBUGpIPzVVe
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Hi Achim! The ANSIJ-STD-002A (to be released shortly) contains a new
solderability test method for components and could be useful for BGA type
components. The Surface Mount Simulation test is basically: printed your
solder paste on a non-reflowable substrate (e.g. ceramic, teflon, etc),
place your component into the paste, reflow, clean, and examine for 95% or
better wetting. This new method has been shown to be very useful for fine
pitch components that bridge if tested with the standard Dip and Look
method. You could do the Surface Mount Simulation method and if the BGA
solderballs are too oxidized I would expect that you would have either very
poor wetting or a "glob" of solder with the BGA solderball sitting on top
of it! Your only complication is that the BGA solderball contains no "lead"
that would have solderability problems - you would be looking for oxide
"skin" issues on the BGA solderball. Some Wetting Balance work has been
attempted with BGA components but the results were unsatisfactory and very
inconclusive. Good Luck.
Dave Hillman
JSTD-002 CoChairman
[log in to unmask]
Achim Neu <[log in to unmask]> on 05/17/98 03:10:38 PM
Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: David D Hillman/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
Subject: [TN] Solderability Test for BGA
--0__=ZgomjRyZqvCq0dIuZbkSQmzUd5zXYBCmp27Y1zsrYOeAYZBUGpIPzVVe
Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
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Hello Technet,
many times discussion BGA components with our customer they request a
solderability certification. But I don=B4t no any standard test of
solderability for BGA=B4s.
Does anybody know something like solderability test for BGA ?
Any help welcome.
Achim
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 19:19:10 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FAB Land around via holes
X-To: Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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A couple of suggestions regarding this:
1) remember that on the vias you can work with a "max" hole size (in most cases). In other
words, a .018" via would be drilled at .018" or less, depending on your comfort level (most shops
will go to .0125"). A component hole must be drilled .006" to .009" over the bottom end of the
tolerance (based on +-.003" tolerance) to insure lead fit. This in itself should gain you
approx. .006" to .009" pad diameter reduction.
2) A teardrop placement towards the circuit will allow you to still maintain annular ring in the
event of hole movement towards the circuit. Many design and CAM station software have this
feature available.
JOHN WAITE
Paul Gould wrote:
> Can anyone help with a query on land around via holes. I have a copy of
> IPC-A-600 Rev E Aug 1995 which states for plated through holes the
> minimum land between the track and pad and hole must not be less than
> 0.002" as a minimum standard. This means that misregistration towards
> the track is not acceptable if the pad is reduced below 0.002" even if
> there is no actual breakout. On the other hand, the hole is allowed to
> break out of the pad in any other direction by as much as half the
> diameter. Clearly the two are incompatible with each other since with
> registration that bad there is bound to be breakout towards tracks in
> some areas.
>
> Has there been a revision specifically for via holes only, or is there
> any other specification relating to landless via holes as this criteria
> is impossible to meet on some designs. The implications of meeting this
> spec are to increase via pad size and/or reduce hole size which has
> implications for design density and manufacturing cost.
>
> Any views on this would be greatly appreciated. For production drilling
> on large panels, what minimum land do you think would be needed at the
> outset to guarantee minimum annular 0.002" on the finished panel taking
> account of drill size and etch reduction also?
>
> Best Regards
> --
> Paul Gould
> [log in to unmask]
> Isle of Wight,UK
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 18:11:00 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Non wetting surfaces (exposed Cu)
X-To: Matthew Sanders <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hi Matt - The problem with exposed Cu on pwb's is that many fluxes are not
active enough to breakdown the oxidized Cu. Since you have a HASL finish
I'll bet that you have an expose Cu/Sn intermetallic rather than just Cu -
oxidized Cu/Sn surfaces are practically nonsolderable which means the
solder joints that appear to be made on those surfaces are at best very
poor metallurgical bonds and that means poor reliability for most use
environments. Some good info can be found in "The Mechanics of Solder Alloy
Wetting & Spreading", ISBN 0-442-01752-9. Chapter 6. Your real issue is the
location of the "exposed Cu". The edge of pads and the sidewalls of traces
do not cause problems ((for many use environments) in comparison to the pad
location where leads will be present. Many assemblers have "exposed Cu" on
assembles that have no corrosion problems. Check the TechNet archives for a
reference someone gave a while back on a paper that detailed exposed copper
on assemblies in the telecommunications industry over a 30 year period.
Good Luck.
Dave Hillman
Rockwell Collins
[log in to unmask]
Matthew Sanders <[log in to unmask]> on 05/15/98 09:29:32 PM
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond
to Matthew Sanders <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: David D Hillman/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
Subject: [TN] Non wetting surfaces (exposed Cu)
Hello,
I've been seeing boards from some fab vendors recently that have non
wetting of the HAL finish on copper surfaces. Now, according to IPC-6012
(3.5.4.6), if the non wetting is on non soldered surfaces, which is the
case with my boards, 1% of conductor surfaces can have exposed Cu for
class 3. If you count each of the holes we have twice (once for each
side), we have less than that percentage. I'm still not very comfortable
with this, though, so I was hoping someone could tell me the
ramifications of exposed Cu in finished assemblies; it seems like it'd
potentially be a reliability problem potentially. Can someone shed some
light on this?
Thanks,
Matt Sander
Matthew Sanders
PWB Procurement Engineer, Trimble Navigation Limited
[log in to unmask]
Phone: (408) 481-7817
Fax: (408) 481-8590
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 19:34:00 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Why are we complaining?
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Sometimes the smartass in me makes it difficult to resist (no dry film
intended) certain subjects. But If I remember correctly, We had a major
controversy over the flood of Emails generated from the Technet. This
in itself generated quite a few emails. Suddenly, we do not get
emails for a day or two and we are worried if maybe IPC did not pay the
bill or something. I guess it's kinda like some of the lifers in our
industry that complain about the industry, but still remain. "I bang my
head against the wall cause it feels so good when I stop?. Sorry,
but the irony intrigues me. Things that make you go
"Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm". JOHN WAITE
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 17:06:34 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Claude Romig <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Claude Romig <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Non-metal bearing waste streams
MIME-Version: 1.0
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--------------F7FB7083A62E6D41E47A4DA6
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Our local wastewater monitoring agency is under the impression that all
process waste streams must be treated by some metals removal process
whether there are metals in the waste streams or not. I am convinced
that this is not correct. I want to divert non-metal bearing waste
streams, pH adjust them and send the effluent directly to drain.
I am searching for a list of companies who practice this treatment
option so that I can educate our monitoring agency. Can anyone help?
Please e-mail me any information that you can. Thank you.
Claude Romig
Process Engineer
Westak, Oregon
--------------F7FB7083A62E6D41E47A4DA6
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
<HTML>
Our local wastewater monitoring agency is under the impression that <U>all</U>
process waste streams must be treated by some metals removal process whether
there are metals in the waste streams or not. I am convinced that
this is not correct. I want to divert non-metal bearing waste streams,
pH adjust them and send the effluent directly to drain.
<P>I am searching for a list of companies who practice this treatment option
so that I can educate our monitoring agency. Can anyone help?
Please e-mail me any information that you can. Thank you.
<P>Claude Romig
<BR>Process Engineer
<BR>Westak, Oregon</HTML>
--------------F7FB7083A62E6D41E47A4DA6--
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 21:11:42 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
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From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Why are we complaining?
X-To: [log in to unmask]
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Say John...
Do you moonlight as a writer for George Carlin? Just wondering...your
last post sounded like something he would've said...(GRIN) You understated the
obvious...I was rolling on the floor!!!
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 21:35:37 -0400
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: ryan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: no messages -
X-To: "Stewart, Dougal" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Dougal:
All is well in Rochester and Technet.
Ron
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 18:31:24 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ralph Hersey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ralph Hersey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FAB Land around via holes
X-To: Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
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Hi Paul--
IMO, your query is not a simple response, this is because there are
additional requirements in the manufacturing ("Performance")
specifications (IPC-RB-276 or IPC-6012) that need to be included, and
are not mentioned in the IPC-A-600E
There is a "consistency" problem in the IPC-A-600E, 2.10.3 "Annular Ring
- Supported Holes" (round lands) and 2.10.5 "Annular Ring - Irregularly
Shaped Lands", basically ignore 2.10.5. (Examples in 2.10.5, Accept
Class 3, 50 micrometer ARmin =97 that's OK. However, Accept Class 1 & 2
is in conflict, B) 25 micrometer ARmin. (there is no documented
requirement for this requirement), which is in conflict with C) which
allows 90 degree breakout, you can't have both. So, you need to use an
expanded interpretation of 2.10.3 for all "supported" (plated-through)
hole lands. =20
The following embedded responses to your series of inquiries concerning
"Conductor/Land Hole Registration" are based on the full interpretation
of the technical conductor/land junction area and land/hole registration
requirements of the IPC-RB-276, IPC-6012, and IPC-A-600E. Some of these
interpretations may stimulate some additional technet discussion, but
based on current IPC standard and specification requirements, "They're
in the book(s)".
>Can anyone help with a query on land around via holes. I have a copy of
>IPC-A-600 Rev E Aug 1995 which states for plated through holes the
>minimum land between the track and pad and hole must not be less than
>0.002" as a minimum standard.
The IPC-A-600E for conductor/land junction area, and land/hole
registration does not differentiate between component and via holes.=20
(It is assumed "track" means conductor and "pad" is a land.)=20
In IPC-RB-276, 3.7.3 "Annular Ring (External)" refers to Table 6 for
"Minimum Annular Ring Requirements", and IPC-6012, 3.4.3 "Annular Ring
(External)" refers to Table 3-5 for "Minimum Annular Ring
Requirements". Then in IPC-RB-276, 3.7.3, 1st sentence, last paragraph,
and IPC-6012, 3.4.3 "Annular Ring (External)" last sentence, only
paragraph, they both have a requirement that states, "Plated-through
holes identified as vias can have up to 90 degree breakout of the
annular ring if it does not occur at the conductor and land
intersection." With minor word changes, these requirements are the
Table in the IPC-A-600E. Interpretation of these requirements per the
referenced "tables", breakout is allowed for "all" Class 1 & 2 Products
plated-through holes. There is a minimum annular ring requirement for
Class 3, and the statement addressing "plated-through holes identified
as vias" is superfluous.=20
The only requirement in IPC-A-600E, 2.10 "Dimensional Characteristics",
2.10.3 "Annular Ring - Supported Hole", page 46, for a 50 micrometer
minimum annular ring (ARmin) is for Class 3 products.
In the IPC-A-600E, the "Table" of requirements (from IPC-RB-276 and
IPC-6012 is essentially the same) there is no ARmin for either Class 1
or Class 2. Under Class 2 requirements the last sentence states, "The
conductor junction should never be less than 50 micrometers [0.002
inch]". (Note=97 the corrected metric "typo" error of 0.55 mm.) The
"should" statement should be treated as a "comment" per the IPC's use of
the words such as "must, shall, should, may, can, etc", the "should"
requirement is not a requirement, and it shall be considered as a "it
would be nice option" in accordance with our use of words.
>This means that misregistration towards the track is not acceptable=20
>if the pad is reduced below 0.002" even if there is no actual breakout.
>On the other hand, the hole is allowed to break out of the pad in any
>other direction by as much as half the diameter. Clearly the two are
>incompatible with each other since with registration that bad there is
>bound to be breakout towards tracks in some areas.
1) Misregistration of the hole towards the conductor in the CLJA is
acceptable because there are no ARmin requirements for Class 1 & 2
Products, "breakout" of up to 180 and 90 degrees is respectively allowed
for Class 1 and Class 2 Products of the hole to land; with an additional
requirement that "breakout" in the conductor/land junction area (CLJA)
shall not reduce the conductor width in the CLJA to less than 70% (Class
1) or 80% (Class 2) of the design conductor width minimum (DWCmin) in
the product definition data (PDD) (could be a master drawing), or the
production master nominal.
2) Because there is no ARmin for Class 1 and 2 Products, the edge of
the hole can be "tangent" to the land and the "end" of the conductor in
the CLJA (by definition, tangency is not breakout).
3) Incompatibilities - there aren't any, as in the above comment 1),
Class 1 and 2 Products allows two levels of "restricterd" breakout or
"tangency" with no ARmin requirements, and Class 3 has a 50 micrometer
ARmin requirement.
>Has there been a revision specifically for via holes only, or is there
>any other specification relating to landless via holes as this criteria
>is impossible to meet on some designs.
Per existing manufacturing specification requirements(IPC-RB-276 or
6012), there is no differentiation between component and via hole lands,
for Class 1 & 2 Products, "tangency" or limited reduction in CW in the
CLJA is acceptable.
There is a test program (through ITRI) that is evaluating "butt" or
"land-less" interlayer connections for multilayer printed boards,
unfortunately, "outer layer" interconnections are not included in the
test matrix.
Some printed board designs are "designed" for "controlled" breakout of
up to 90 degrees for Class 2 Products with very good reliability results
for specific environments. As Andy Slade (Hadco) commented, using
"filleted land patterns" (modifying the land pattern by adding a
"teardrop" or "snowman") in the CLJA will eliminate the probability of=20
"breakout" in the CLJA. This is what a quality design would include if
"controlled" breakout is allowed, and coupled with "reliability" are
"design" requirements.
>The implications of meeting this spec are to increase via pad size
>and/or reduce hole size which has implications for design density
>and manufacturing cost.
Not really, it depends on how "land" size is increased, use "obround",
or "elongated" hexagonal or octagonal shaped lands, by (appropriately)
orient the lands in a consistent direction on each "X" or "Y" orthogonal
conductive pattern layer, and by limiting conductors to ingress or
egress from a land only at the "ends" of the lands . If you want, I can
generate and direct e-mail to you a <*.pdf> sketch of the general design
concepts.
>Any views on this would be greatly appreciated. For production drilling
>on large panels, what minimum land do you think would be needed at the
>outset to guarantee minimum annular 0.002" on the finished panel taking
>account of drill size and etch reduction also?
You'll need to characterize all manufacturing and material tolerances.
>Best Regards
--
>Paul Gould
>[log in to unmask]
>Isle of Wight,UK
Paul, I hope this helps, if not, please feel free to contact me.
--=20
Ralph
Ralph Hersey & Associates
3885 Mills Way
Livermore, CA 94550-3319
PHN/FAX: 925.454.9805
e-mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 22:06:43 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: fluoride burns
X-To: [log in to unmask]
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Okay, I am seriously crazed by any sort of implications that I have suggested
any procedure that was potentially very dangerous.
And I want to get some serious chemistry understanding going on here.
The bottom line is that "flouride" by itself, while no pussy cat, is not
crazily dangerous. However, CONCENTRATED HF is. Note the casual reference
to the term CONCENTRATED.
Specifically, as pH goes down, Flouride goes from the ionized salt to the
protonated form, HF. Even this, by itself is no more dangerous than HCl,
Hydrochloric Acid, which is sold as toilet cleaner, in every grocery store.
What does get dangerous is when the HF concentration gets high enough to form
the dimer, (HF)2, which is damn dangerous, However, you risk averse, please
make very careful notes, there is no concentration of Ammonium Biflouride in
water, that can create any of the dimer, (HF)2!
Which is why I recommended the use of Ammonium Biflouride, not
HF.(Hydrofluoric Acid)
So, go back to sleep, and try not to drink the stuff, or get it into open
wounds, and eyes, and if it does get on your skin, try to rinse it off within,
say, 10-15 minutes.
And find something else, that actually helps us all get our jobs done, and
quit sweating the details.
Yours in chemistry,
Rudy Sedlak
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 13:56:22 +1000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Getting rid of Air Bubbles in Solder Paste Syringes
X-cc: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi Matthias
I am surprised you put up with the bubbles .
We return them as non conforming to specs., and that is the end of it .
With copy of A black mark in black book on top of it .
As you guessed correctly, without vacuum you can do very little ;
even than the bubbles can push the paste out of syringe ;
you really do not want to get into desperate modes like this .
Your syringes are capped on point with a pin pushing into exit ?
If they have just a screw on cap as most do ( standard EFD tip caps ) ,
that is one way to get the air in .
No fun to bubble on o805's , agree .
Sorry ; no tricks .
I'll forward you contact on Ed Salido ; Philips ; Manila ;
he may know better , doing o402's .
See you paul ; ResMed
>----------
>From: Matthias Mansfeld[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>Sent: Wednesday, 20 May 1998 8:19
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: [TN] Getting rid of Air Bubbles in Solder Paste Syringes
>
>Hello Technetters,
>
>I have some solder paste syringes which contain air bubble, probably
>from transport. That means, I have to fight with a bit of overflow
>during dispensing, rather boring with 0805 or SOICs. Pull back flow
>is not so easy to set up with my equipment, thus, the best would be
>to get rid of these bubbles.
>Does anybody know an easy, proven trick? ( I have no vacuum chamber
>available).
>
>Many thanx in advance, regards
>Matthias Mansfeld
>-----------------------------------------------
>Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
>* Printed Circuit Board Design and Assembly
>Am Langhoelzl 11, D-85540 Haar, GERMANY
>Phone: +49-89-4620 0937, Fax: +49-89-4620 0938
>E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
>Internet: http://home.t-online.de/home/matthias.mansfeld
>
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>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 07:59:04 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: ENIG/Heat sink
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi technetters ,
I sent this question several days ago . I had problems with my e-mail , so I
do not know if this message was distributed properly .
We are considering lamination of heat sink on PCB with Electroless Nickel
Immersion Gold ( ENIG ) finishing . What is practical experience with such
process ??
Lamination on Nickel should not be a problem , but what about lamination on
Immersion Gold??
Regards
Edward Szpruch
Eltek Ltd - Israel
Tel 972 3 9395050
Fax 972 3 9309581
E-mail : [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 00:58:42 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: IPC Forums were down, now back up
X-To: [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
No, it wasn't a reaction to the "Stop TechNet" thread of msgs.
The IPC mail server, operating in conjunction with the list servers used to manage
the electronic forums, is a complex system that routinely handles 100,000 messages a
day; frequently MANY more than that. There is additional network hardware and
software that must interact with this mail server.
Sometimes something fails and that happened last Thursday. On Friday, an
administrative action was taken to limit backlog on the gateway so we didn't lose our
whole mail system. The cause of failure isn't important right now; what's important
is that all the forums should now be back up.
IF YOU RECEIVE THIS MESSAGE, YOU ARE STILL SUBSCRIBED AND NO FURTHER ACTION IS
REQUIRED ON YOUR PART. (You should also be receiving regular postings.) Thank you
all for your patience; you never know how much you'll miss something until it's gone.
I'd like to also request additional support from you. When things don't seem to be
working correctly on one of the forums, please DON'T post to the forum asking if
something is wrong. Instead, send your inquiry ONLY to the address in the footer
message which appears at the end of every forum posting. Please strive to keep
postings to the forums timely and technical.
Funding and administration of these electronic forums is another of the services to
the industry provided and paid for by the member companies of your IPC through their
annual dues. For more information on membership and benefits, please point your web
browser to http://www.ipc.org
Jack
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 02:39:46 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Karen Tellefsen <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Karen Tellefsen <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: fluoride burns
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
RSedlak wrote:
>
> Okay, I am seriously crazed by any sort of implications that I have suggested
> any procedure that was potentially very dangerous.
>
> And I want to get some serious chemistry understanding going on here.
>
> The bottom line is that "flouride" by itself, while no pussy cat, is not
> crazily dangerous. However, CONCENTRATED HF is. Note the casual reference
> to the term CONCENTRATED.
>
> Specifically, as pH goes down, Flouride goes from the ionized salt to the
> protonated form, HF. Even this, by itself is no more dangerous than HCl,
> Hydrochloric Acid, which is sold as toilet cleaner, in every grocery store.
>
I don't think so. HF is a lot more dangerous than HCl. Bev's description
of the toxicology of HF exposure to skin is pretty accurate. I've worked
with a lot of concentrated acids, and HF is by far the scariest. I think
Bev and I have a serious understanding of the chemistry.
Any acidic solution containing F- is dangerous and can cause burns,
that may not seem so bad at first. The problem is that the burns don't
heal, they get worse with time and may eventually attact bone. F-
ties up calcium ions in tissue, and since Ca+ is needed for tissue repair,
the tissue deteriorates.
The medical treatment for F- burns is subcutaneous injections of calcium
salts.
This information can be found in the MSDS for acidic fluoride salts and
good laboratory safety manuals.
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 17:09:08 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Edwin C. Salido" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Edwin C. Salido" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re[2]: [TN] Getting rid of Air Bubbles in Solder Paste Syrin
X-To: Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear Paul,
Nice to hear from you again. Before, we try to do something with
syringe having air bubblesor gaps. If gap is near the tip, we squeeze
out paste to remove. If it's in the middle , we tap the syringe
against the table. This procedure is not fool proof. But today and
due to the criticality of 0402, we are returning syringe with air
gaps.
Rgds.,
Edwin
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: RE: [TN] Getting rid of Air Bubbles in Solder Paste Syringes
Author: Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]> at #SMTP
Date: 20/05/1998 01:56 PM
Hi Matthias
I am surprised you put up with the bubbles .
We return them as non conforming to specs., and that is the end of it .
With copy of A black mark in black book on top of it .
As you guessed correctly, without vacuum you can do very little ;
even than the bubbles can push the paste out of syringe ;
you really do not want to get into desperate modes like this .
Your syringes are capped on point with a pin pushing into exit ?
If they have just a screw on cap as most do ( standard EFD tip caps ) ,
that is one way to get the air in .
No fun to bubble on o805's , agree .
Sorry ; no tricks .
I'll forward you contact on Ed Salido ; Philips ; Manila ;
he may know better , doing o402's .
See you paul ; ResMed
>----------
>From: Matthias Mansfeld[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>Sent: Wednesday, 20 May 1998 8:19
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: [TN] Getting rid of Air Bubbles in Solder Paste Syringes
>
>Hello Technetters,
>
>I have some solder paste syringes which contain air bubble, probably
>from transport. That means, I have to fight with a bit of overflow
>during dispensing, rather boring with 0805 or SOICs. Pull back flow
>is not so easy to set up with my equipment, thus, the best would be
>to get rid of these bubbles.
>Does anybody know an easy, proven trick? ( I have no vacuum chamber
>available).
>
>Many thanx in advance, regards
>Matthias Mansfeld
>-----------------------------------------------
>Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
>* Printed Circuit Board Design and Assembly
>Am Langhoelzl 11, D-85540 Haar, GERMANY
>Phone: +49-89-4620 0937, Fax: +49-89-4620 0938
>E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
>Internet: http://home.t-online.de/home/matthias.mansfeld
>
>################################################################
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>information.
>For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
>847-509-9700 ext.312
>################################################################
>
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 06:54:07 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Engelmaier <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Engelmaier <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Capacitor Damage At Wave Solder -Reply
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Joe,
Actually, most chip capacitors that crack, and do not have prior damage u=
p to=0Aplacement, crack as the result of too rapid cooling in combination=
with large=0Asolder fillets (see Klein Wassinks book). A study in German=
y, published at=0ANEPCON West'96 or 95, showed increase in reliability o=
f chip capacitors with=0Aoff-set attachments, because of the resulting sm=
aller fillets. You may want to=0Amake the soldering pads narrower=97the w=
idth of the CCs ar slightly less and=0Acheck how fast you are cooling aft=
er the solder wave.
Werner Engelmaier
Engelmaier Associates, L.C.
Electronic Packaging, Interconnection and Reliability Consulting
7 Jasmine Run
Ormond Beach, FL 32174 USA
Phone: 904-437-8747, Fax: 904-437-8737
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 06:54:14 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Engelmaier <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Engelmaier <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: : CEM-1 & Nylon 6/6
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Hi,
Could anybody provide me with the following prperties of CEM-1 and Nylon 6/6:\
CEM-1: Tg, CTE(x,y,<Tg), CTE(x,y,>Tg), CTE(z,<Tg), CTE(z,>Tg)
Nylon 6/6 unfilled: Tg, CTE(<Tg), CTE(>Tg)
Thank you in advance.
Werner Engelmaier
Engelmaier Associates, L.C.
Electronic Packaging, Interconnection and Reliability Consulting
7 Jasmine Run
Ormond Beach, FL 32174 USA
Phone: 904-437-8747, Fax: 904-437-8737
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 06:54:12 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Engelmaier <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Engelmaier <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: TN] Interconnect Stress Test
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Hi Ron,
The Interconnect Stress Test (IST) is currently being round-robin tested by
two IPC committees and the test method is being developed for IPC-TM-650.
You can reach PWB Interconnect Solutions Inc., Bill Birch at 613-828-6340.
IST works.
Werner Engelmaier
Engelmaier Associates, L.C.
Electronic Packaging, Interconnection and Reliability Consulting
7 Jasmine Run
Ormond Beach, FL 32174 USA
Phone: 904-437-8747, Fax: 904-437-8737
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 14:48:21 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Test pattern
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi technetters ,
We are trying to evaluate some alternatives for pattern plating line . Apart
of hole sizes , panel thickness etc there is great importance of pattern on
the board , that represents land areas , isolated condoctors , isolated
holes etc . Does anyone has this kind of test patern ??
Regards
Edward Szpruch
Eltek Ltd - Israel
Tel 972 3 9395050
Fax 972 3 9309581
E-mail : [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 13:13:24 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Gareth Jones>" <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: University of Salford
Subject: Imaging or writing
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Hello,
Can somebody please tell me the difference between Direct laser
Imaging (DLI) and Direct laser writing (DLW). I am aware that DLW is used on MCM
programmable substrates and I assume this operation is done using a
laser beam . Is DLI following on a similar principle except that the
features are simply imaged onto the substrate, and how is the
acheived if one of the advantages of LDI is that their is no
requirement for a mask.
Cheers
Gareth
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 08:23:37 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Test pattern
X-To: "Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi Ed,
I've typically taken the gerber data for one of my "nightmare" jobs and modified it. I would
incorporate various drill sizes and adjust the lands for minimum annular ring to a shield area.
Put the test pattern on the largest panel you run, incorporate HCD and LCD areas opposing each
other (allows to check front to back close down rates/funneling), Isolate circuits around the
edge of the panel and in the center. I would also suggest incorporating impedance test lines
randomly for Electrical evaluation as well as your cross sectioning evaluation. I'm sure that
there may be a generic pattern from IPC, but I've found that it is better to go through the
"pain" of generating one that may be more closely associated with the type of work and plating
issues I deal with in my shop. Hope this helps.... JOHN WAITE
Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering wrote:
> Hi technetters ,
> We are trying to evaluate some alternatives for pattern plating line . Apart
> of hole sizes , panel thickness etc there is great importance of pattern on
> the board , that represents land areas , isolated condoctors , isolated
> holes etc . Does anyone has this kind of test patern ??
> Regards
> Edward Szpruch
> Eltek Ltd - Israel
> Tel 972 3 9395050
> Fax 972 3 9309581
> E-mail : [log in to unmask]
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 08:39:03 -0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ruben Irizarry <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Misterious silence
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Hey,
I have not received any mails in the last two days, I misses my daily 20-30
mails.
Ruben
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 09:06:52 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: fluoride burns
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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You must have a helluva time finding toothpaste that does not burn
incredibly......
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 09:26:21 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Sheila Smith <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Sheila Smith <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: TN Electrical Conductive expoxy use of
X-To: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Paul,=20
Normally you would use a self-shimming material for this type of =
application. Self-shimming simply means that microballoons [i.e. tiny =
glass or phenolic spheres, either hollow or solid} of a minimum diameter =
are added to the adhesive. When the adhesive bondline is squeezed down, =
the microballoons hold the two substrates apart by approximately the =
distance of the sphere diameter. 5 mil microballoons will give you =
consistent 5 mil bondlines. You could also use a glass scrim cloth, but =
I doubt your customer would go for that ...
Sheila @ tracor
----------
From: Paul Allen[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 1998 2:29 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] TN Electrical Conductive expoxy use of
Dear Tech Netters,
I have an application requiring the use of AIT electrical conductive
expoxy, ME 8452 does anyone have an experience in controlling thickness
of bond lines.Currently with our application bonding two PCB's together,
squeeze out is proving hard to control. Our customer wants zero. Any
ideas.
Paul Allan.
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Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 08:48:40 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Andrew A Schroeder <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Andrew A Schroeder <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: fluoride burns
X-To: Karen Tellefsen <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Karen Tellefsen <[log in to unmask]> on 05/20/98 04:39:46 AM
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond
to Karen Tellefsen <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Andrew A Schroeder/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
Subject: Re: [TN] fluoride burns
RSedlak wrote:
>
> Okay, I am seriously crazed by any sort of implications that I have
suggested
> any procedure that was potentially very dangerous.
>
> And I want to get some serious chemistry understanding going on here.
>
> The bottom line is that "flouride" by itself, while no pussy cat, is not
> crazily dangerous. However, CONCENTRATED HF is. Note the casual
reference
> to the term CONCENTRATED.
>
> Specifically, as pH goes down, Flouride goes from the ionized salt to the
> protonated form, HF. Even this, by itself is no more dangerous than HCl,
> Hydrochloric Acid, which is sold as toilet cleaner, in every grocery
store.
>
I don't think so. HF is a lot more dangerous than HCl. Bev's description
of the toxicology of HF exposure to skin is pretty accurate. I've worked
with a lot of concentrated acids, and HF is by far the scariest. I think
Bev and I have a serious understanding of the chemistry.
Any acidic solution containing F- is dangerous and can cause burns,
that may not seem so bad at first. The problem is that the burns don't
heal, they get worse with time and may eventually attact bone. F-
ties up calcium ions in tissue, and since Ca+ is needed for tissue repair,
the tissue deteriorates.
The medical treatment for F- burns is subcutaneous injections of calcium
salts.
This information can be found in the MSDS for acidic fluoride salts and
good laboratory safety manuals.
All,
One more liitle piece of infomation about fluoride burns. As the HF ties
of the Calcium
in your blood, it form a salt in your viens and arteries. If you don't get
those injections of Calcium salt within about an hour or so, there is no
way to remove that salt from your viens. It collects in your heart and you
die within about 24 hours.
it isn't a very pleasant way to die.
Have a nice day,
Some Co-Op
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 16:13:42 +0200
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"b. van zalk" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "b. van zalk" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: IPC 2222 High CTI use FR-6 CRM-5 ?
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Unclassified
Hello,
I have a few questions about IPC 2222 page 11 figure 4-2.
For good electricals and high CTI, FR-6 or CRM-5 should be used.
Does CTI mean Comparitive Tracking Index and if so what is
the definition of it ?
We have never heard before about FR-6.
What kind of materials are FR-6 and CRM-5 ?
I hope sombody can help me out with these questions.
Thanks,
Bas van Zalk
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 10:22:32 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
TOM HYBISKE <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: TOM HYBISKE <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: fluoride burns
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
> The medical treatment for F- burns is subcutaneous injections of calcium
> salts.
Take it from someone who had injections under the fingernails after an accident
involving HF, it's no party!
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Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 09:50:00 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Darrell Drake <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Darrell Drake <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Assembly
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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I am working with a customer's PCB design that uses non-plated =
(unsupported) through holes and connects to a lap pad on the circuit =
side (the pad is approx. 2 to 3 lead lengths from the hole). The =
components to be mounted consist of both axial a radial passives =
(horizontal for resistors, caps, etc., & vertical for transistors, etc). =
My question for discussion and comment is whether to or not to mount the =
component body flush to the substrate. If you elevate the component body =
off of the substrate without some type of spacer or support, during =
handling it is highly probable that a downward force applied to the =
component will result in lifted/damaged pads on the opposite (circuit) =
side. I am familiar with the use of spacers/supports for supported =
holes (PTH) and that it is desirable to maintain some spacing from the =
substrate for lead compliancy; however, I have not found references =
which address the aforementioned. The typical operating environments are =
high vibration coupled with high temperature (>=3D150degC <=3D200degC). =
The PCB substrate is typically polyimide and ranges in thickness from =
.062" to .090" .
Any comments ? Expert opinions ?
D. Drake
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 10:40:39 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Holly Evans <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Holly Evans <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: AESF Papers
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>
Dear Technetters, I am forwarding this message from Compliancenet to get
broader feedback.
Hello Everyone,
>> The IPC Environmental Health and Safety committee has decided to
partner with the American Electroplaters and Surface Finishers (AESF) at their
>> next annual conference, which is held each year in Orlando during
>> the last week in January. I and a few others from our committee have
>> this annual conference over the past five years or so, and find it to
>> be an excellent conference focusing on current environmental
>> issues and pollution prevention (P2). Few conferences can get U.S.
EPA Administrator Browner to attend, even though she doesn't know what
"F006" means in terms of the industry's wastewater treatment sludge!
>>
>> In order to show our committment to enhancing our relationship with
>> AESF, we are committing to holding four paper sessions next January.
>> We are seeking topics for these sessions, and papers as well. We need
>> five papers per session, or 20 papers in total.
>>
>> We need sessions and papers which are "outside the box". I'm
>> interested in what ideas you have for these. Some thoughts that I have
>> are
>> - P2 through purchasing agreements (aka performance based
>> purchasing) Two professors from N.Ill State University presented an
>> extremely interesting paper on what the automotive industry has done.
>> It would be good to hear what's being done in our industry (ies).
>>
>> - EHS management system software programs
>> Gabe Crognale presented an interesting paper at IPC Expo last week.
>> There was good interest in his topic. Are there more examples of this
>> whether in our industry (ies) or not?
>>
>> - Use/reuse
>> This topic can range from saving $$ and WWT costs as delineated in
>> DfE case study 5 on how to reuse microetchant four times before
>> disposal to how to exempt WWT sludge from F006 regulation. I think
>> both areas are vastly underutilized in our industry.
>>
>> - Innovative processing techniques
>> Where are we in 1998 (1999 conference) relative to the Project
>> Ecocircuit model. Specifically 1) no chelated metals, 2) no tin/lead
>> (solder) use, 3) on-site etchant recycling, 4) 75% water recycling and
>> bottom line 5) 0.5-1% of sales for waste management? What demonstrated
>> that will get us there and beyond?
>>
>> - Benchmarking
>> Seems like what we'v done so far is acceptable to many. Perhaps we
>> could look at the ratios for the 1997 data, and if acceptable, pursue
>> 1998 data for Expo 1999, which will be only two months from the AESF
>> conference.
>>
>> - Other topics???
>>
>> CAN WE GET AT LEAST FIVE PAPERS PER SESSION ON THESE TOPICS?
>> Lee Wilmot
>> HADCO Corp
>> [log in to unmask]
>> 603/896-2424
>
If you have an idea for a specific paper, please e-mail IPC's Director of
Environmental Programs, Holly Evans, at [log in to unmask]
>
Holly Evans
Director of Environmental and Safety Programs
IPC
1400 Eye St., N.W., Suite 540
Washington, D.C. 20005-2208
phone: 202-638-6219
fax: 202-638-0145
e-mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 11:12:45 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Dave Robertson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Dave Robertson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Assembly
X-To: Darrell Drake <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
This is an application where I would opt to install the components flush to
the board for the very machanaical reasons that you state in your original
message. Failure to do so is to invite premature mechanical failure when
the PWA is placed into operation. The lead forms to make the connections
required will provide more than enough lead compliance in most cases. The
biggest thing that you have to watch for are individual components such as
power transistors, triacs, etc. that might lead to heat damage of the board
substrate. These need to be properly supported and heat sinks used.
Dave Robertson <[log in to unmask]>
Chairman 5-22c Manual Soldedring Task Group
At 09:50 AM 5/20/98 -0500, you wrote:
>I am working with a customer's PCB design that uses non-plated
(unsupported) through holes and connects to a lap pad on the circuit side
(the pad is approx. 2 to 3 lead lengths from the hole). The components to
be mounted consist of both axial a radial passives (horizontal for
resistors, caps, etc., & vertical for transistors, etc). My question for
discussion and comment is whether to or not to mount the component body
flush to the substrate. If you elevate the component body off of the
substrate without some type of spacer or support, during handling it is
highly probable that a downward force applied to the component will result
in lifted/damaged pads on the opposite (circuit) side. I am familiar with
the use of spacers/supports for supported holes (PTH) and that it is
desirable to maintain some spacing from the substrate for lead compliancy;
however, I have not found references which address the aforementioned. The
typical operating environments are high vibration coupled with high
temperature (>=150degC <=200degC). The PCB substrate is typically polyimide
and ranges in thickness from .062" to .090" .
>
>Any comments ? Expert opinions ?
>
>D. Drake
>
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>################################################################
>
>
>
--
------------------------------------------------------------
David E. Robertson (908) 245-6200
Sales Manager (908) 245-6176 fax
Hexacon Electric Co.
161 W. Clay Ave.
Roselle Park NJ 07204-1946
e-Mail: [log in to unmask]
URL: http://www.hexaconelectric.com
------------------------------------------------------------
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 08:18:06 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ron Hayashi <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ron Hayashi <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: TN] Interconnect Stress Test -Reply
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Thanks to all those that replied on my question regarding Interconnect
Stress Testing.
Ron
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 11:30:31 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Assembly
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Hello there,
Although I'm no expert, mounting the component flush to the board as you
are thinking is how I've seen television tuner boards and digital satellite
system (DSS) tuner boards mount their thru-hole...and most are single sided.
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 11:38:51 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Larry Campbell <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Larry Campbell <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Assembly -Reply
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
You shouldn't have any problems with the axial leaded
components, providing you followed the bend radius
requirements. The component, if elevated, will bend above the
board rather than at the pad. You may have some problems with
your radial components if you only have 2-3 lead diameters from
the hole to the pad. You could mount those components flush to
the board but may get some entrapment if coated. We have, in
the past, stood the components off the board .015 and put the
strain releif on the bottom of the board where it attached to the
pad.
Larry Campbell
BFGoodrich, Avionics Systems
>>> Darrell Drake <[log in to unmask]> 05/20/98
10:50am >>>
I am working with a customer's PCB design that uses
non-plated (unsupported) through holes and connects to a lap
pad on the circuit side (the pad is approx. 2 to 3 lead lengths
from the hole). The components to be mounted consist of both
axial a radial passives (horizontal for resistors, caps, etc., &
vertical for transistors, etc). My question for discussion and
comment is whether to or not to mount the component body
flush to the substrate. If you elevate the component body off of
the substrate without some type of spacer or support, during
handling it is highly probable that a downward force applied to
the component will result in lifted/damaged pads on the
opposite (circuit) side. I am familiar with the use of
spacers/supports for supported holes (PTH) and that it is
desirable to maintain some spacing from the substrate for lead
compliancy; however, I have not found references which address
the aforementioned. The typical operating environments are high
vibration coupled with high temperature (>=150degC
<=200degC). The PCB substrate is typically polyimide and
ranges in thickness from .062" to .090" .
Any comments ? Expert opinions ?
D. Drake
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 09:04:39 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Arlene Infante <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Arlene Infante <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Reliability of Immersion Gold PCB
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Fulton Feng,
I also would like to get information regarding this issue.
In my case I would like to know if there is a test procedure for
Accelerated Reliability of Immersion Gold finish (PCB):
Test Requirements
Test Method
Evaluation Criteria (pass/ fail)
We have our own coupon design for doing accelerated reliability test
using Bellcore and we are planning to include gold finish PCB but I'm not
sure if I can use the same procedure and criteria for Gold finish.
Thanks
Arlene
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 12:33:24 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: fluoride burns
X-To: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Technetters,
OK, let's have another go at this. This is not going the way I had hoped.
1) I didn't say not use ammonium bifluoride, just be careful. The hydrogen
fluoride bonds in the HF2- ion are among the strongest hydrogen bonds known,
to the point that the bonds are best described in terms of 3c-4e- MO
covalent bonding theory, so there is less free fluoride than with other
compounds. It is a good choice, just use caution. No attempt to drive
anyone crazy was intended.
2) HF is definitely more dangerous than HCl.
3) I have just got off the telephone with Dr. Jack Passmore, a world
renowned fluorine chemist, and he tells me if he got an ionic fluoride on
his skin he would not be wasting any time getting to a sink to wash it off.
The label on a bottle of sodium fluoride gives it an exposure value of 2 on
a scale of 1 to 4, so I would never wait even five minutes, let alone 15
before washing.
4) If I am not mistaken the active fluorine-containing ingredient in
toothpaste is "stannous fluoride", which on exposure to air forms stannic
oxyfluoride. This material is polymeric and insoluble. The fluorine atoms
in tin compounds have a high degree of covalent character in their bonds to
the central tin, as opposed to a 100% ionic bond, and there is little
tendency for them to leave the tin. As a result, there is an extremely
small amount of free fluoride. If this were not the case we would all be
running around with mottled teeth.
6) In concentrated HF is it more like (HF)n. There may be some (HF)2, but
certainly it would only be the dominant species at one intermediate
concentration. The degree of "polymerization" (hydrogen bonding) is not the
source of the danger, just the increasing concentration of HF.
5) Tom Hybiske wrote about the subcutaneous injection of a calcium salt for
HF burns. Specifically the salt is calcium gluconate and the treatment is
excrutiatingly painful. Fortunately I cannot tell you this from personal
experience. My whole point in mentioning the bit about the FIRST AID
treatment with the ternary ammonium salt skin exposure antidote was to help
people avoid having to go through the MEDICAL treatment of the injections.
Ever vigilantly yours,
Bev Christian, PhD
Nortel
> ----------
> From: RSedlak[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 9:06 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] fluoride burns
>
> You must have a helluva time finding toothpaste that does not burn
> incredibly......
>
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Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 09:48:06 -0700
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Thank you Dmitriy!
I wish you the best in your new position. Your work as TechNet system administrator has been exceptional. Your
work has been a major contributor to the success of this informative network.
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Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 10:19:07 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Matthew Park <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Matthew Park <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Fuji CP3 for 1005 chip pkg
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hii.
I am pondering of placing 1005 chip pkg (0402) with our Fuji
CP3 chipshooter. Does any one out there who has experience
with it?. I am getting mixed responses from Fuji.
If it works with 0.7mm nozzles, what problem will I encounter
(such as fall-out, mispick, misplacement, cam speed
reduction...)?? We have one of few latest CP3 machines, being
made in 1992 with firmware ver #6.81.
Greatly appreciate your feedbacks
regards
Mpark
NII-Norsat International Inc.
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Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 20:40:59 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Gabriela Bogdan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Gabriela Bogdan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: SMD OPTOCOUPLERS
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Hi,TechNetters!
I am trying to find the cause for bond failures between the diode and
the lead after reflow soldering
of smd optocouplers.The failed components are DIP's-modified for SMT.
I am thinking about:
-Profile-the data sheet says only :lead soldering temp:max 260C for 10
sec.
-Drying???
-General incompatibility with the process?
The failure was detected at electrical testing and verified by X-ray
too-I saw the broken wire
at the wedge bond heel on the lead.
Has anyone ever had a similar problem?
Gaby
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 13:31:43 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, BSFlag <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: BSFlag <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Fuji CP3 for 1005 chip pkg
X-To: [log in to unmask]
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We had lots of problems with 0603's on a cp3, I cannot imagine 0402's. I
understood there was a problem with the vision. Not much help.
Mike
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 11:17:44 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Claude Romig <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Claude Romig <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Ruthenium Analysis Options
MIME-Version: 1.0
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We are running an Electroless Nickel/Immersion Gold line, one bath of
which contains Ruthenium. We use a Varian Spectra20 AA to measure the
Ruthenium via method of additions. I recently purchased a new burner to
be used solely for this line. The machine was inspected early this
year. Two analyses of the same sample yield values of 67 and 147 ppm
(the specification is 125 ppm). Frustrating.
Does anyone know another method that I can use to measure the Ru?
Thanks.
Claude Romig, Process Engineer
Westak, Oregon
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 15:01:28 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kelly Kovalovsky <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kelly Kovalovsky <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: IPC-1170 Supplier Survey Form
MIME-Version: 1.0
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I was told by a colleague today that IPC-1170 is available from IPC
electronically for no fee. My colleague could not remember the contact name,
however. Can anyone help?
Kelly Kovalovsky
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 15:12:50 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mike Holmes x4356 <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mike Holmes x4356 <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: IPC-1170 Supplier Survey Form
Kelly,
Don't you mean IPC-1710?
|
/|\
/ | \
/ |__\ /\
/____@_\ |
~~[________)~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~[]~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Michael L. (Mike) Holmes
Charter Member, Space Coast Chapter, IPC Designers Council
MS 1-5852
Designer 3 Harris Corporation
PWB Design Group Government Communications Systems Division
Digital and Electronic 2400 NE Palm Bay Road
Packaging Section Palm Bay, FL 32905
Work 407 727-4356 Fax 407 729-7540
email [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 14:17:18 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re[2]: [TN] IPC-1170 Supplier Survey Form
X-To: Mike Holmes x4356 <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Or IPC-1720
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: [TN] IPC-1170 Supplier Survey Form
Author: Mike Holmes x4356 <[log in to unmask]> at Internet
Date: 5/20/98 3:12 PM
Kelly,
Don't you mean IPC-1710?
|
/|\
/ | \
/ |__\ /\
/____@_\ |
~~[________)~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~[]~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Michael L. (Mike) Holmes
Charter Member, Space Coast Chapter, IPC Designers Council
MS 1-5852
Designer 3 Harris Corporation
PWB Design Group Government Communications Systems Division
Digital and Electronic 2400 NE Palm Bay Road
Packaging Section Palm Bay, FL 32905
Work 407 727-4356 Fax 407 729-7540
email [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 12:32:13 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: APQP & FMEA
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Does anyone know where I can get more information on APQP (Advanced Product
Quality Planning) and FMEA (Failure Mode Analysis)? I would like to know
how these approaches work and how to perform them.
Thanks in Advance for your help!
Kathy Palumbo
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 15:52:49 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kelly Kovalovsky <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kelly Kovalovsky <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: IPC-1170 Supplier Survey Form
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Ok, I believe you.
Let's try IPC-1710. I got the number from a company internal document that
sounds like it might have been wrong.
Kelly Kovalovsky
[log in to unmask] on 05-20-98 03:11:15 PM
Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc:
Subject: Re: [TN] IPC-1170 Supplier Survey Form
Kelly,
Don't you mean IPC-1710?
|
/|\
/ | \
/ |__\ /\
/____@_\ |
~~[________)~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~[]~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Michael L. (Mike) Holmes
Charter Member, Space Coast Chapter, IPC Designers Council
MS 1-5852
Designer 3 Harris Corporation
PWB Design Group Government Communications Systems Division
Digital and Electronic 2400 NE Palm Bay Road
Packaging Section Palm Bay, FL 32905
Work 407 727-4356 Fax 407 729-7540
email [log in to unmask]
*****************************************************************************
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 15:42:13 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Denton <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Denton <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: The US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) Common Sense
Initiative (CSI) Electronics Subcommittee,
X-To: Christopher Rhodes <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hello,
A quick question that I hope is appropriate for this forum.
What is the status/future of manufacturing tin-lead reflowed boards? Is
there any truth to the rumor that they are or will become illegal in
the U.S. in order to reduce the consumption/handling of lead? Many shops
will only make SMOBC boards but there are still companies that request
reflowed boards because of either current carrying capacity concerns or
other reasons. What is the EPA's stance on this?
Christopher Rhodes wrote:
>
> The US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) Common Sense Initiative (CSI)
> Electronics Subcommittee, to which several IPC members belong, is exploring ideas
> regarding integrating safety and health improvements with pollution prevention and
> other environmental performance goals.
> Toward that end, the Subcommittee would like to pose several general questions to the
> industry:
>
> 1--What problems and issues exist with the present EPA and OSHA environmental, health
> and safety framework, and what impediments exist to hinder improved performance in
> either or both areas? For example, are there actions you might undertake to improve
> worker safety, but environmental regulations prevent you from doing so (or vice
> versa)?
> 2--If a forum of health experts were convened (with NIOSH and OSHA), what specific
> topics might be included on the agenda that could allow for constructive engagement
> of all stakeholders?
> 3--How can a rapidly changing industry most effectively be in conformance with the
> precautionary principle?
>
> FYI, this is the precautionary principle: "When as activity raises threats of harm
> to human health of the environment, precautionary measures should be taken even if
> some cause and effect relationships are not fully established scientifically. In
> this context, the proponent of an activity, rather than the public, should bear the
> burden of proof."
>
> Also FYI, the CSI is EPA's "cleaner, cheaper, smarter" project in regulatory reform.
>
> Any comments, thoughts, examples or inquiries are quite welcome.
>
> Thank you.
>
> Christopher Rhodes
> Director of Public Policy
> IPC
> 2215 Sanders Road
> Northbrook IL 60062
> 847/509-9700 x306
> fax 509-9798
> [log in to unmask]
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 15:53:49 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Aric parr <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: APQP & FMEA
APQP is an automotive specification. It can be obtained from AIAG (810 358
3003).
I may have an old area code
-------------
Original Text
From: C=US/A=INTERNET/DDA=ID/TechNet(a)IPC.ORG, on 5/20/98 3:46 PM:
Does anyone know where I can get more information on APQP (Advanced Product
Quality Planning) and FMEA (Failure Mode Analysis)? I would like to know
how these approaches work and how to perform them.
Thanks in Advance for your help!
Kathy Palumbo
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 15:43:20 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bill Burke <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bill Burke <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Jumper Wires
Could you tell me how many "jumper wires" or
"haywires" are allowed on a Printed Circuit Card
Assembly, Class 3, High Reliability & what spec
they are covered by????
Bill Burke
Printed Circuit Board Designer
Lockheed Martin Fairchild Systems
300 Robbins Lane
Syosset, New York 11791-6012
Voice: (516) 349-2454
Intra-Company *8-349-2454
Fax: (516) 931-4037
email: [log in to unmask]
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 15:34:55 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Eric Yakobson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Eric Yakobson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Need Dry Film Laminator
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Anybody has any idea how to locate an inexpensive used dry film laminator?
Eric Yakobson
Alpha PC Fab
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 14:02:07 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ted Stern <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Circuit Research
Subject: Re: Ruthenium Analysis Options
X-To: Claude Romig <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear Mr. Romig:
Was your purchase of a new burner to reduce burner apparature plugging
due to the high solids in the samples? If so, try diluting your sample
by 4X, then performing the method of standard additions with the dilute
solution. Based upon the concentration you are measuring (125 mg/L),
a 4X dilution will still leave you in the manufacuterers recommended
operating range.
Have you attempted to employ a nitrous oxide/acetylene flame? Although
this fuel mix is regarded as reducing sensitivity, we have had success
employing nitrous oxide/acetylene in the measurement of chrome. Despite
the manufacturers suggestion, the nitrous oxide technique improved spike
recovery and duplicate relaibility without reducing sensitivity. I
would also experiment with the flame stoichiometry to maximize
sensitivity. There are several elements we test which are very
sensitive to the fuel flow.
Lastly, it is posssible to supress interferring speicies by adding 4%
wieght to volume uranyl nitrate to all samples and/or prepared standards
(See Varian technical literature). This may not be practical with the
method of standard additions however.
Good luck and feel free to call me if you have further questions.
Regards,
Ted Stern
Claude Romig wrote:
>
> We are running an Electroless Nickel/Immersion Gold line, one bath of
> which contains Ruthenium. We use a Varian Spectra20 AA to measure the
> Ruthenium via method of additions. I recently purchased a new burner to
> be used solely for this line. The machine was inspected early this
> year. Two analyses of the same sample yield values of 67 and 147 ppm
> (the specification is 125 ppm). Frustrating.
>
> Does anyone know another method that I can use to measure the Ru?
> Thanks.
>
> Claude Romig, Process Engineer
> Westak, Oregon
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 13:41:37 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Darrel Therriault <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Darrel Therriault <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Jumper Wires
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Bill,
I just went through this exercise and here is what I found :
IPC-R-700 defines several methods for applying jumper wires based on
material or contact/surface and other things.
IPC-A-610 (9.3) says they are acceptable for type 1,2,3 boards.
IPC-D-275 (4.8) says jumpers are considered a component and need to be
documented as such, but are again acceptable on all types, including
military applications.
What I determined was essentially, as long as jumpers are done correctly
there is no stated limit I could find. If you happen to get some other
data, I'd appreciate a quick note and point me to it.
Hope this helps..........DT
At 03:43 PM 5/20/98 -0400, you wrote:
> Could you tell me how many "jumper wires" or
>"haywires" are allowed on a Printed Circuit Card
>Assembly, Class 3, High Reliability & what spec
>they are covered by????
>
>Bill Burke
>Printed Circuit Board Designer
>Lockheed Martin Fairchild Systems
>300 Robbins Lane
>Syosset, New York 11791-6012
>Voice: (516) 349-2454
>Intra-Company *8-349-2454
>Fax: (516) 931-4037
>email: [log in to unmask]
> [log in to unmask]
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 13:40:29 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Vaughan, Ralph H" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Vaughan, Ralph H" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: IPC Specs
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Greeting,
I will be the first to commend ipc for all the good work that they do
for us, but I gotta say that the practice of obsoleting specs and
replacing with new, renumbered documents is making me long for the old
mil-spec days where specs NEVER changed (I never thought I'd say that).
Not too long ago, after much spec comparison and analysis, we convinced
our government customers that it would be prudent to move from
Mil-P-55110 to the IPC-RB-276. In the time it took to get the new
drawing callout approved, re-train the pwb designers and revise their
guidelines, and bring our stellar board suppliers up to speed (no small
task), RB-276 had been superceded by the 6012 document. Now I just
learn today that IPC-D-275 is superceded by another document. This
kills efforts to streamline and standardize documentation systems.
Also, when these continuous changes take place, it would be convenient
to have a detailed side paper published explaining all the changes (and
maybe why the changes were made). May be a lot to ask, but it would
keep every user from doing it individually.
Anyone else see this as a problem?
That's all the whining for now.
Ralph
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 16:47:16 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Holly Evans <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Holly Evans <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: The US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) Common Sense
Initiative (CSI) Electronics Subcommittee,
X-To: John Denton <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Dear Technetters --
Although this is an inquiry that is more appropriate for Compliancenet, I
will respond on TechNet because the use of lead in the industry has
technical as well as environmental/regulatory considerations.
There is currently no pending legislative or regulatory proposals in the
U.S. that would ban or tax the use of lead in electronic devices. There
are, however, several pending in Europe (Sweden, Denmark, European Union)
and in Japan. All of these proposals would either ban, phase-out, or
discourage through voluntary means the use of lead in electronic devices
and automobiles by certain dates.
The IPC is watching these proposals closely because any international
restrictions may be adopted by OEMs in order to sell their products in
international markets. As a result, in the future, OEMs may be looking to
eliminate lead in their products. Due to the unique nature of tin/lead
solder and its importance to the electronics industry, there may be
exceptions for circuit boards and certain components; however, at this
date, it is unclear what is going to happen.
I hope this overview helps. Please call or e-mail me if you have
additional questions.
Regards
At 03:42 PM 5/20/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Hello,
>
>A quick question that I hope is appropriate for this forum.
>What is the status/future of manufacturing tin-lead reflowed boards? Is
>there any truth to the rumor that they are or will become illegal in
>the U.S. in order to reduce the consumption/handling of lead? Many shops
>will only make SMOBC boards but there are still companies that request
>reflowed boards because of either current carrying capacity concerns or
>other reasons. What is the EPA's stance on this?
>
>Christopher Rhodes wrote:
>>
>> The US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) Common Sense Initiative (CSI)
>> Electronics Subcommittee, to which several IPC members belong, is
exploring ideas
>> regarding integrating safety and health improvements with pollution
prevention and
>> other environmental performance goals.
>> Toward that end, the Subcommittee would like to pose several general
questions to the
>> industry:
>>
>> 1--What problems and issues exist with the present EPA and OSHA
environmental, health
>> and safety framework, and what impediments exist to hinder improved
performance in
>> either or both areas? For example, are there actions you might
undertake to improve
>> worker safety, but environmental regulations prevent you from doing so
(or vice
>> versa)?
>> 2--If a forum of health experts were convened (with NIOSH and OSHA),
what specific
>> topics might be included on the agenda that could allow for constructive
engagement
>> of all stakeholders?
>> 3--How can a rapidly changing industry most effectively be in
conformance with the
>> precautionary principle?
>>
>> FYI, this is the precautionary principle: "When as activity raises
threats of harm
>> to human health of the environment, precautionary measures should be
taken even if
>> some cause and effect relationships are not fully established
scientifically. In
>> this context, the proponent of an activity, rather than the public,
should bear the
>> burden of proof."
>>
>> Also FYI, the CSI is EPA's "cleaner, cheaper, smarter" project in
regulatory reform.
>>
>> Any comments, thoughts, examples or inquiries are quite welcome.
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> Christopher Rhodes
>> Director of Public Policy
>> IPC
>> 2215 Sanders Road
>> Northbrook IL 60062
>> 847/509-9700 x306
>> fax 509-9798
>> [log in to unmask]
>>
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>################################################################
>
>
Holly Evans
Director of Environmental and Safety Programs
IPC
1400 Eye St., N.W., Suite 540
Washington, D.C. 20005-2208
phone: 202-638-6219
fax: 202-638-0145
e-mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 16:47:41 -0400
Reply-To: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: BARRY DARNELL <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: CDI
Subject: AUTOROUTERS
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi everyone,
I am considering buying the CCT Specctra autorouter and would like some feedback from designers that have used this product.
Please email me directly and not over Technet.
If there is a better place to post this, please let me know.
Thanks,
Barry Darnell
(864)627-8800 Ext. 231
[log in to unmask]
Computer Dynamics, Inc.
Printed Circuit Board Designer
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 16:14:43 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Need Dry Film Laminator
X-To: Eric Yakobson <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Try calling Network Circuits in Irving, TX. I understand from one of my =
suppliers that they have a Dupont HRL -24 laminator for sale. Their =
number is 972 313-1400.
Hope this helps.
Ed Cosper
----------
From: Eric Yakobson[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 2:35 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Need Dry Film Laminator
Anybody has any idea how to locate an inexpensive used dry film =
laminator?
Eric Yakobson
Alpha PC Fab
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 16:17:48 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: APQP & FMEA
X-To: Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Kathy,
Just so happens I just got a copy of a FMEA manual. They can be obtained from
Automotive Industry Action Group ( AIAG). Their number is 810-358-3003.
----------
From: Kathy Palumbo[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 2:32 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] APQP & FMEA
Does anyone know where I can get more information on APQP (Advanced Product
Quality Planning) and FMEA (Failure Mode Analysis)? I would like to know
how these approaches work and how to perform them.
Thanks in Advance for your help!
Kathy Palumbo
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 16:02:15 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: IPC Specs
X-To: "Vaughan; Ralph H" <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
All,
I have to agree with Ralph. I am not one to grip, b***h, complain or
otherwise (99.9%). I would also like to see the specification numbers
stay constant and to bump the rev where necessary. At one time I
could call out spec numbers and sections verbatim with reference to
IPC. Try doing that now and and you will build a Level III in a Level
I environment. So, is IPC trying to minimize the occurences of
changing the overall control number and is there a spreadsheet on your
webpage that shows superceded specs and their replacement numbers?
Thanks.
John
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: [TN] IPC Specs
Author: "Vaughan; Ralph H" <[log in to unmask]> at Internet
Date: 5/20/98 1:40 PM
Greeting,
I will be the first to commend ipc for all the good work that they do
for us, but I gotta say that the practice of obsoleting specs and
replacing with new, renumbered documents is making me long for the old
mil-spec days where specs NEVER changed (I never thought I'd say that).
Not too long ago, after much spec comparison and analysis, we convinced
our government customers that it would be prudent to move from
Mil-P-55110 to the IPC-RB-276. In the time it took to get the new
drawing callout approved, re-train the pwb designers and revise their
guidelines, and bring our stellar board suppliers up to speed (no small
task), RB-276 had been superceded by the 6012 document. Now I just
learn today that IPC-D-275 is superceded by another document. This
kills efforts to streamline and standardize documentation systems.
Also, when these continuous changes take place, it would be convenient
to have a detailed side paper published explaining all the changes (and
maybe why the changes were made). May be a lot to ask, but it would
keep every user from doing it individually.
Anyone else see this as a problem?
That's all the whining for now.
Ralph
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 16:16:51 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mike Buetow <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mike Buetow <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: IPC Specs
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Ralph,
Thanks for your note. This is a valid question, although I assume that when you say
mil specs "never" changed, it's because the numbers didn't change, not the actual
contents. After all, MIL-PRF-55110 is now at F revision.
I would like to point out that IPC-RB-276 was published in 1992, and not superseded
until 1997, and that IPC-D-275, published in 1991, wasn't superseded until 1998.
That's a lot of time between revisions. In fact, we frequently hear from industry
that the standards don't keep up with the technology.
Although IPC doesn't have the resources at this time to draw up lists showing the
differences between standards, often, larger OEMs prepare such comparisons. In fact,
Boeing prepared a detailed list comparing 276, 55110, and 6012, which it shared with
IPC. When such lists are shared with IPC, we typically make them available to the
industry on a as-requested basis, although we do not double-check for accuracy.
Remember too, that it is the task groups, made up of volunteers from industry, that
write these standards and wrestle with the decisions. IPC is a facilitator and
publisher, but our technical policy is set by a special committee made up of chairmen
of the task groups, and the whole structure operates in (mostly) an autonomous
fashion.
It's a great discussion point. I'm interested in seeing what others have to say.
Mike Buetow
IPC Communications Manager
>>> "Vaughan, Ralph H" <[log in to unmask]> 05/20/98 03:40PM >>>
Greeting,
I will be the first to commend ipc for all the good work that they do
for us, but I gotta say that the practice of obsoleting specs and
replacing with new, renumbered documents is making me long for the old
mil-spec days where specs NEVER changed (I never thought I'd say that).
Not too long ago, after much spec comparison and analysis, we convinced
our government customers that it would be prudent to move from
Mil-P-55110 to the IPC-RB-276. In the time it took to get the new
drawing callout approved, re-train the pwb designers and revise their
guidelines, and bring our stellar board suppliers up to speed (no small
task), RB-276 had been superceded by the 6012 document. Now I just
learn today that IPC-D-275 is superceded by another document. This
kills efforts to streamline and standardize documentation systems.
Also, when these continuous changes take place, it would be convenient
to have a detailed side paper published explaining all the changes (and
maybe why the changes were made). May be a lot to ask, but it would
keep every user from doing it individually.
Anyone else see this as a problem?
That's all the whining for now.
Ralph
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 16:19:27 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Hugo Scaramuzza <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Hugo Scaramuzza <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Test message - Please ignore
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
This is only a test....
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 16:11:04 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David D Sullivan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David D Sullivan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: IPC Specs
X-To: "Vaughan, Ralph H" <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Ralph,
In the IPC-6012 subcommittee meeting we addressed some of this. We asked
the IPC to provide a paper trail from IPC-RB276 to IPC-6012. Something
along the lines of running a revision on IPC-RB-276 which says that the
spec has been superceded by IPC-6012. Therefore, we didn't have to change
a bunch of drawings to IPC-6012 at once. We just change them as needed. I
believe that IPC did do this for us. NOW, when IPC-RB-276 is ordered the
one sheet IPC-RB-276 with the supercede note on it is sent and a copy of
IPC-6012 is sent. I think this adequately addresses our drawing issues
and, hopefully, yours.
Regards,
Dave Sullivan
Rockwell Collins, Inc.
"Vaughan, Ralph H" <[log in to unmask]> on 05/20/98 03:40:29 PM
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond
to "Vaughan, Ralph H" <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: David D Sullivan/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
Subject: [TN] IPC Specs
Greeting,
I will be the first to commend ipc for all the good work that they do
for us, but I gotta say that the practice of obsoleting specs and
replacing with new, renumbered documents is making me long for the old
mil-spec days where specs NEVER changed (I never thought I'd say that).
Not too long ago, after much spec comparison and analysis, we convinced
our government customers that it would be prudent to move from
Mil-P-55110 to the IPC-RB-276. In the time it took to get the new
drawing callout approved, re-train the pwb designers and revise their
guidelines, and bring our stellar board suppliers up to speed (no small
task), RB-276 had been superceded by the 6012 document. Now I just
learn today that IPC-D-275 is superceded by another document. This
kills efforts to streamline and standardize documentation systems.
Also, when these continuous changes take place, it would be convenient
to have a detailed side paper published explaining all the changes (and
maybe why the changes were made). May be a lot to ask, but it would
keep every user from doing it individually.
Anyone else see this as a problem?
That's all the whining for now.
Ralph
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 14:27:26 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Olson, Jack C" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Olson, Jack C" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: IPC Specs
X-To: "Vaughan, Ralph H" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Well, I feel like I complain enough as it is so I wasn't gonna bring it up,
but since you asked, I have to agree with you.
I was QUITE surprised yesterday when someone reported that they couldn't
even obtain a copy of 275/276 from the IPC itself, the organization that
published it!
What did they do? BURN all the old copies the day the new one superceded?
sheesh...
I can handle an occasional numbering change, but the old requirements should
still be AVAILABLE if someone needs to see what they said, dontcha think?
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vaughan, Ralph H [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>
> I will be the first to commend ipc for all the good work that they do
> for us, but I gotta say that the practice of obsoleting specs and
> replacing with new, renumbered documents is making me long for the old
> mil-spec days where specs NEVER changed (I never thought I'd say that).
> Not too long ago, after much spec comparison and analysis, we convinced
> our government customers that it would be prudent to move from
> Mil-P-55110 to the IPC-RB-276. In the time it took to get the new
> drawing callout approved, re-train the pwb designers and revise their
> guidelines, and bring our stellar board suppliers up to speed (no small
> task), RB-276 had been superceded by the 6012 document. Now I just
> learn today that IPC-D-275 is superceded by another document. This
> kills efforts to streamline and standardize documentation systems.
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 14:40:35 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mike Wilson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mike Wilson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Jumper Wires
X-To: Bill Burke <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Bill, many times the maximum number of jumpers permitted is spelled out
in your contract by the "customer" . You might check with your Contracts
guy to see if it is stipulated there.
Mike Wilson ( [log in to unmask] )
Design Account Executive
Praegitzer Design
1777 Sentry Parkway West
Dublin Hall Suite 407
Blue Bell, Pa 19422
Ph: 215-646-7710 Fx: 215-646-7753
Check out our Web site @ http://www.pii.com
-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [SMTP:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bill Burke
Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 3:43 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Jumper Wires
Could you tell me how many "jumper wires" or
"haywires" are allowed on a Printed Circuit Card
Assembly, Class 3, High Reliability & what spec
they are covered by????
Bill Burke
Printed Circuit Board Designer
Lockheed Martin Fairchild Systems
300 Robbins Lane
Syosset, New York 11791-6012
Voice: (516) 349-2454
Intra-Company *8-349-2454
Fax: (516) 931-4037
email: [log in to unmask]
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 18:15:33 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Fuji CP3 for 1005 chip pkg
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Hello there!
The problem with trying to use a CP-3 for 0402's is because of the nozzle
size, your pick-up's have to be dead perfect. If the feeder locating pins on
the device table have been beat-up at all (and they usually are), you won't
have the kind of repeatability you need to have without wasting a ton of
parts...(well, not a TON, but lots...)
Another problem is that you'll need to replace all your current small
nozzles with special 0402 nozzles, and they only do well with 0402 parts
(unlike the standard 1.3mm small nozzle which can place a variety of different
packages as you probably already know).
Because the CP-3's nozzles are spring loaded, and the nozzle for 0402's
is so delicate, it doesn't take much force whatsoever to tweek them enough
that they're unusable...just normal operation tweeks the nozzles.
It's been a while since I've worked with a CP-3, but at the last place I
worked (a contract assembler) where we had CP-3's, we would turn down business
that had 0402's on the boards because we just couldn't get the CP-3 to place
them reliably.
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 15:19:28 +0100
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Richard Tassone <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Testel Systems Corporation
Subject: Re: Fuji CP3 for 1005 chip pkg
X-To: Matthew Park <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Matthew:
The best machine for placing 0402's is the Siemens SIPLACE pick & place. It is and excellent
machine but is also pricey. The group withing Siemens that handles the machine is located in
Alpharetta, GA. Sorry, I don't know the number.
Richard Tassone
Matthew Park wrote:
> Hii.
>
> I am pondering of placing 1005 chip pkg (0402) with our Fuji
> CP3 chipshooter. Does any one out there who has experience
> with it?. I am getting mixed responses from Fuji.
>
> If it works with 0.7mm nozzles, what problem will I encounter
> (such as fall-out, mispick, misplacement, cam speed
> reduction...)?? We have one of few latest CP3 machines, being
> made in 1992 with firmware ver #6.81.
>
> Greatly appreciate your feedbacks
>
> regards
> Mpark
> NII-Norsat International Inc.
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 16:58:55 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kathy Palumbo <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: APQP & FMEA
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Everyone who responded to my APQP & FMEA question, THANK YOU!! It is
greatly appreciated!!
Kathy Palumbo
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 09:23:32 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Eddy <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Eddy <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: re [TN] : CEM-1 & Nylon 6/6
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD849A.3F642680"
------ =_NextPart_000_01BD849A.3F642680
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
any further question
Eddy Chen
EVERGREEN HITECH CONSULTANTS LTD.
TEL : 886-2-27667722 FAX:886-2-27630734 E-MAIL: [log in to unmask]
7th Fl., No. 35, Lane 13, KWAN FU SOUTH ROAD, TAIPEI, TAIWAN
http://www.asiansources.com/evhitech.co
------i?l?l?o-----
?H?oaI: Engelmaier [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
?C?e?E??: 1998|~5$e20$e PM 06:54
|??oaI: [log in to unmask]
?D|?: [TN] : CEM-1 & Nylon 6/6
Hi,
Could anybody provide me with the following prperties of CEM-1 and Nylon 6/6:\
CEM-1: Tg, CTE(x,y,<Tg), CTE(x,y,>Tg), CTE(z,<Tg), CTE(z,>Tg)
Nylon 6/6 unfilled: Tg, CTE(<Tg), CTE(>Tg)
Thank you in advance.
Werner Engelmaier
Engelmaier Associates, L.C.
Electronic Packaging, Interconnection and Reliability Consulting
7 Jasmine Run
Ormond Beach, FL 32174 USA
Phone: 904-437-8747, Fax: 904-437-8737
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
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------ =_NextPart_000_01BD849A.3F642680--
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 18:06:35 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Esher Grad
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Does anybody know of a tech that works on Esher Grad plotters in the
Southern California area?Thank you.
Bill Dworak
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 19:03:54 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Engineering / Design Dept." <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Mission Peak Services
Subject: Re: IPC Forums were down, now back up
X-To: Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
X-cc: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Jack Crawford wrote:
>
> No, it wasn't a reaction to the "Stop TechNet" thread of msgs.
>
> The IPC mail server, operating in conjunction with the list servers used to manage
> the electronic forums, is a complex system that routinely handles 100,000 messages a
> day; frequently MANY more than that. There is additional network hardware and
> software that must interact with this mail server.
>
> Sometimes something fails and that happened last Thursday. On Friday, an
> administrative action was taken to limit backlog on the gateway so we didn't lose our
> whole mail system. The cause of failure isn't important right now; what's important
> is that all the forums should now be back up.
>
> IF YOU RECEIVE THIS MESSAGE, YOU ARE STILL SUBSCRIBED AND NO FURTHER ACTION IS
> REQUIRED ON YOUR PART. (You should also be receiving regular postings.) Thank you
> all for your patience; you never know how much you'll miss something until it's gone.
>
> I'd like to also request additional support from you. When things don't seem to be
> working correctly on one of the forums, please DON'T post to the forum asking if
> something is wrong. Instead, send your inquiry ONLY to the address in the footer
> message which appears at the end of every forum posting. Please strive to keep
> postings to the forums timely and technical.
>
> Funding and administration of these electronic forums is another of the services to
> the industry provided and paid for by the member companies of your IPC through their
> annual dues. For more information on membership and benefits, please point your web
> browser to http://www.ipc.org
>
> Jack
>
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> ################################################################
i HAVE REQUESTED SEVERAL TIMES TO PLEASE REMOVE ME FROM THIS LIST, WITH
NO LUCK.
CAN YOU HELP???
--
******************************
Mission Peak Services
Engineering Department
Visit us at:
http://www.missionpeak.com
******************************
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 02:00:21 -0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
lcs Mixmaster Remailer <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: lcs Mixmaster Remailer <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Ionic Contamination
Hello Technet,
A supplier made us some board-assemblies with a ionic contamination at least twice as high as the IPC and MIL-specifications allow. This is probably due to residues from RMA solder paste. The boards are washed after wave soldering with water/detergent, but there is no intermediate cleaning after the reflow soldering. It takes a couple of days before the reflow soldered boards are wave soldered, so the paste-flux is not very cleanable anymore.I've heard so often that bad cleaning of RMA is much worse than good cleaning or no cleaning. I'm not sure, but this is what I think is the cause of the problem..
The question : will this ionic contamination, concentrated around the topside-smd's, really result in early failures ? The boards are built in hermetically sealed boxes, but will be used in a wide variety of temperatures. There are no fine-pitch devices on the boards. Any advice or comments are welcome.
Andy
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 11:13:06 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Photo tool stability
X-To: Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi Guys,
I have a problem with dimensional stability of photo tools. The photo
tools shrink after processing. I've tried increasing the drying
temperature (50-55C) just so it will not shrink but it still does. This is
really giving me a headache. Any suggestions?
Marco Biagtan
NEC-CPI Process Engineer.
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 08:34:20 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
drilbert <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: drilbert <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
X-To: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
What is your measurement method?
Marco Biagtan wrote:
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> I have a problem with dimensional stability of photo tools. The photo
> tools shrink after processing. I've tried increasing the drying
> temperature (50-55C) just so it will not shrink but it still does. This is
> really giving me a headache. Any suggestions?
>
> Marco Biagtan
> NEC-CPI Process Engineer.
>
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> For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or 847-509-9700 ext.312
> ################################################################
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 11:28:55 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kuan Kuan Ng <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Post Baking of PCBs & PCBAs
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Everybody in Technet!
I hope someone may know of any IPC or Mil specs concerning post baking of
PCBs and PCBAs. Would appreciate if youc could let me know.
Rgds - Kuan
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 13:01:17 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Edwin V. Maximo" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <emaximo@[192.1.1.215]>
From: "Edwin V. Maximo" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: BGA assembly process
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Does any one knows what is the basic assembly process flow for BGA
(from the BGA device to the PCB).
Any information will be highly appreciated.
Thanks,
Edwin Maximo
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 12:51:18 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
X-To: drilbert <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
thanks for the response.
I use a coordinate measuring machine and measure four corner points on the
photo tool. At first, I get the dimensions of the master film (X1,X2,Y1,Y2)
and then compare this with the dimensions taken from the contact film. The
contact film always show about -30 to -40 micron reduction in length.
Marco
----------
> From: drilbert <[log in to unmask]>
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Photo tool stability
> Date: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 11:34 PM
>
> What is your measurement method?
> Marco Biagtan wrote:
> >
> > Hi Guys,
> >
> > I have a problem with dimensional stability of photo tools. The photo
> > tools shrink after processing. I've tried increasing the drying
> > temperature (50-55C) just so it will not shrink but it still does.
This is
> > really giving me a headache. Any suggestions?
> >
> > Marco Biagtan
> > NEC-CPI Process Engineer.
> >
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 02:20:00 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jeff Seeger <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Applied CAD Knowledge Inc
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
X-To: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Marco Biagtan wrote:
>
> thanks for the response.
>
> I use a coordinate measuring machine and measure four corner points on the
> photo tool. At first, I get the dimensions of the master film (X1,X2,Y1,Y2)
> and then compare this with the dimensions taken from the contact film. The
> contact film always show about -30 to -40 micron reduction in length.
>
Are you allowing 24 hours for the films to stabilize
and measuring in a room controlled to the same temp/humidity
environment as they were created in?
Using 7 mil film?
Maybe you should be trying to dry it at as little an
heat rise as possible. Find out the hysteresis (sp?)
characteristics from your film vendor, you may be going
outside the temperature envelope.
(forgive me in advance, my photo experience is very old,
but had many many stability problems in hot/humid climate)
--
Jeff Seeger Applied CAD Knowledge Inc
Chief Technical Officer Tyngsboro, MA 01879
jseeger "at" appliedcad "dot" com 978 649 9800
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 02:40:32 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jeff Seeger <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Applied CAD Knowledge Inc
Subject: Re: Thermal relief
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Mirka Halas wrote:
>
> Hello Designers,
> I am in process of converting from Gerber 274 to 274X,
> and I opened
> can of warms, which is called thermal reliefs.
> So far we used thermal relief and antipads developed by the rule of
> thumb, that it should be oversized by 20 mils from the pad.
> I would like to understand the calculation, and where I can shrink
> the dimensions to get
> more plane surface for our high speed boards.
> I read IPC-D-275,IPC-2221 and IPC-2222, and do not see calculation for
> the outside diameter
> of thermal relief. 60% of the land is calculated for the web width,
> but what is the hight of the web?
Karl's response is probably the best analysis I've
seen on the characteristics of the thermal relief, "but"
> Is it the same as the diameter of Clearance area in planes?
> Is IPC's calculation for the clearance area in planes too conservative.
> One manufacturer can do
> minimum antipads with diameter of the drill plus .016".
>
Minimum per the drill size, per your vendor's capability
(.016 would be reduced producibility in many shops), but
maximum should be smaller than:
(Pos pad) + 2*(pos trace spacing) - 2*(registration allowance)
You really don't want to allow the signal wires to sneak
plane clearance underneath them on a high speed design.
This applies to the outer diameter of your thermal as
well - suddenly even the simplest pad geometry gets pretty
darn complicated, huh?
--
Jeff Seeger Applied CAD Knowledge Inc
Chief Technical Officer Tyngsboro, MA 01879
jseeger "at" appliedcad "dot" com 978 649 9800
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 09:04:52 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Stewart, Dougal" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Stewart, Dougal" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: DISCOLORATION
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Purple discoloration on gold plated boards is due to the formation of
'purple of Cassius', which yu should be able to find out about in your
chemistry books. I believe that it is due to some contamination absorbed
into the resin of the laminate. I remember this problem 15 years ago,
and a change of laminate supplier had the problem go away.
Dougal
Dougal Stewart
Product Development Manager
Viasystems Selkirk Ltd
Selkirk, Scotland, TD7 5EJ
Tel: +44 1750 21601
Fax:+44 1750 22513
email [log in to unmask]
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [log in to unmask] [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 1998 7:00 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] DISCOLORATION
>
> HI ! EVERYBODY
> I HAVE A PROBLEM.
> AFTER I/R REFLOW PROCESS, PCB WAS DISCOLORED AROUND
> GOLD PLATING, ESPECIALLY EXPOSED EPOXY AREA CHANGED
> LIGHT VIOLET.
> THE PCB WAS APPLIED A HASL PROCESS AND EDGE CONNECTOR
> GOLD PLATING. WE TESTED MANY TIMES AND ONLY PCB WHICH
> WAS APPLIED THE HASL PROCESS AND GOLD PLATING PROCESS.
>
> THERE IS LOW PEAK OF Sn BY SEM ANALYSIS ON THE DISCOLORED
> SPECIMEN ONLY.
>
> THE GOLD PLATING CHEMICAL MAKER SAID :
> IF AMINO-COMPOUNDS WHICH IS USED HARDNER OF EPOXY
> MATERIAL JOIN WITH A CYANIDE, PCB CAN DISCOLORATION AFTER
> THERMAL SHOCK.
>
> PLEASE HELP ME WHY THE PCB WAS DISCOLORED AS SOON AS
> POSSIBLE.
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 06:54:42 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Aric parr <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Ionic Contamination
Send a panel to someone like CSL (Hi Doug) to find out what the
contamination actually is, and if the rosin was removed without removing
the activators.
The residue could be detergents/antifoaming agents/saponifiers...from thier
cleaner that dragged into the last rinse or weren't rinsed off. The
supplier's DI bed could have died. Technet could probably fill volumes on
other sources.
The bottom line is, find out what the "contamination" is, and then there is
a solution to the problem. P.S. if the panels are properly specified, the
supplier should pay for any testing, including replacing panels sent out
for testing.
-------------
Original Text
From: C=US/A=INTERNET/DDA=ID/TechNet(a)IPC.ORG, on 5/20/98 10:26 PM:
Hello Technet,
A supplier made us some board-assemblies with a ionic contamination at
least twice as high as the IPC and MIL-specifications allow. This is
probably due to residues from RMA solder paste. The boards are washed after
wave soldering with water/detergent, but there is no intermediate cleaning
after the reflow soldering. It takes a couple of days before the reflow
soldered boards are wave soldered, so the paste-flux is not very cleanable
anymore.I've heard so often that bad cleaning of RMA is much worse than
good cleaning or no cleaning. I'm not sure, but this is what I think is the
cause of the problem..
The question : will this ionic contamination, concentrated around the
topside-smd's, really result in early failures ? The boards are built in
hermetically sealed boxes, but will be used in a wide variety of
temperatures. There are no fine-pitch devices on the boards. Any advice or
comments are welcome.
Andy
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 07:48:43 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Nelson, John" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Nelson, John" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
X-To: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Marco, make sure your raw film sits at 70 degrees and 50% out of the
plastic bag
for 24 hours before you image and process it. Then make sure it sits at
70/50 for a
couple of hours before you measure. If you still see a problem, change
your dryer
temperature. The old rule is "Overdrying makes oversize."
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marco Biagtan [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 11:13 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Photo tool stability
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> I have a problem with dimensional stability of photo tools. The photo
> tools shrink after processing. I've tried increasing the drying
> temperature (50-55C) just so it will not shrink but it still does.
> This is
> really giving me a headache. Any suggestions?
>
>
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 08:12:36 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Larry Campbell <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Larry Campbell <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Photo tool stability -Reply
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
What is the thickness of your film. You should be using 7mm,
nothing less. 3mm will expand and contract almost at will. You
should also store your film in a humidity and temperture
controlled environment. Don't measure the film immediately
after it comes out of processing since it has expanded during
drying. It will stabilize back to original size shortly. If you
photoplot your own artwork, is your photoplotter in a stabilized
environment?
Larry Campbell
BFGoodrich, Avionics Systems
>>> Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]> 05/20/98
11:13pm >>>
Hi Guys,
I have a problem with dimensional stability of photo tools. The
photo
tools shrink after processing. I've tried increasing the drying
temperature (50-55C) just so it will not shrink but it still does.
This is
really giving me a headache. Any suggestions?
Marco Biagtan
NEC-CPI Process Engineer.
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 14:18:18 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Matthias Mansfeld <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <[log in to unmask]>
From: Matthias Mansfeld <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
Subject: Tantal Caps crack during US cleaning
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Hi TechNetters,
one of my manufacturers has seen some problems with surface mount
tantal capacitors (Size B). The leads cracked during ultrasonic
cleaning.
Does anybody have similar experiences?
Are there any specifications or IPC documents which parts withstand
/withstand not which ceaning procedures?
Many thanx in advance, regards
Matthias Mansfeld
-----------------------------------------------
Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
* Printed Circuit Board Design and Assembly
Am Langhoelzl 11, D-85540 Haar, GERMANY
Phone: +49-89-4620 0937, Fax: +49-89-4620 0938
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
Internet: http://home.t-online.de/home/matthias.mansfeld
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 08:19:49 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Tom Kropski <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Tom Kropski <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: IPC Specs
X-To: Mike Buetow <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
I'd rather see the revision of doc's than new numbers. I appreciate the
current updates, but why change the numbers??
-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Buetow <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 5:24 PM
Subject: Re: [TN] IPC Specs
>Ralph,
>
>Thanks for your note. This is a valid question, although I assume that when
you say
>mil specs "never" changed, it's because the numbers didn't change, not the
actual
>contents. After all, MIL-PRF-55110 is now at F revision.
>
>I would like to point out that IPC-RB-276 was published in 1992, and not
superseded
>until 1997, and that IPC-D-275, published in 1991, wasn't superseded until
1998.
>That's a lot of time between revisions. In fact, we frequently hear from
industry
>that the standards don't keep up with the technology.
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 08:10:00 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jim Marsico 516-595-5879 <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jim Marsico 516-595-5879 <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: ADMIN: "SENDERS"
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
I have a problem, probably something to do with my server, whereas I don't know
who is sending out a Technet post. The "from" information in the memo header
only says "Technet", and, unless the writer ends the post with his or her name
and company, I can't tell who it is! Does anyone else have this problem or is
it just me?
Jim Marsico
AIL Systems Inc.
(516) 595-5879
[log in to unmask]
(See how nice I signed off with my name and other pertinent information!)
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 08:43:44 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: DISCOLORATION
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Hello All!
I lost the original post on this subject, so I will use Dougal Stewarts'
post to reply.
I haven't seen this one (purple stain) for quite awhile!
In the "early days" of reflowed tin/lead, we put the nickel/gold onto
edge card tabs right after etching but before reflow. The plated
tin/lead was easy to strip off the fingers and the process went well.
With the advent of HASL, it was a pain to nickel/gold plate prior to
HASL because of the infamous finger taping issues prior to HASL. So we
nickel/gold plated after HASL. HASL solder was quite difficult to
completely remove without both chemicals AND abrasion in the inline tab
plater.
We began to get the purple stain which turned up at soldermask bake and
got worse as the board saw more and more heat.
Our labs tested the product and found that in some rare instances that
there could be an ionic issue but not as disastrous as the cosmetic
issue. We decided to eliminate the cosmetic issue entirely by finding a
better way of taping the nickel/gold prior to HASL.
The purple stain itself is caused by a complexing of the Cobalt in the
gold with the Bromine in the laminate under heat. We suspected that
somehow the aggressive HASL solder strip chemistry combined with
abrasion provided a better path for the gold salts into the laminate.
We don't make boards anymore, but occasionally we get a few supplier
questions regarding acceptance.
I hope this helps.
Gerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Stewart, Dougal [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 21, 1998 4:05 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] DISCOLORATION
Purple discoloration on gold plated boards is due to the formation of
'purple of Cassius', which yu should be able to find out about in your
chemistry books. I believe that it is due to some contamination absorbed
into the resin of the laminate. I remember this problem 15 years ago,
and a change of laminate supplier had the problem go away.
Dougal
Dougal Stewart
Product Development Manager
Viasystems Selkirk Ltd
Selkirk, Scotland, TD7 5EJ
Tel: +44 1750 21601
Fax:+44 1750 22513
email [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 09:36:15 -0500
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Dave Artman <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Pepperl+Fuchs, Inc.
Subject: Gen: NE Ohio Designers Council Email
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Hello
Had several calls regarding the Norther Eastern Ohio Designers Council email
forum.
email address:
[log in to unmask]
email body:
subscribe dc-neodc < your name>
If you have any questions contact me via your favorite medium with the
info below.
Cheers
Dave
Name: Dave Artman
Company: Pepperl+Fuchs, Inc.
Phone: 216-425-3555
Fax: 216-425-4607
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 09:46:10 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jay DeKing <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jay DeKing <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: EMA Mid-Atlantic, Inc.
Subject: Re: ADMIN: "SENDERS"
X-To: Jim Marsico 516-595-5879 <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Jim,
When I get a message from TechNet, the "From" field has the name and/or
email address of the author, and the ""To" field says [log in to unmask]
Jay DeKing
EMA Mid-Atlantic, Inc.
(716)334-2970 voice
(716)334-3481 fax
[log in to unmask]
-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Marsico 516-595-5879 [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 21, 1998 8:10 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] ADMIN: "SENDERS"
I have a problem, probably something to do with my server, whereas I don't
know
who is sending out a Technet post. The "from" information in the memo
header
only says "Technet", and, unless the writer ends the post with his or her
name
and company, I can't tell who it is! Does anyone else have this problem or
is
it just me?
Jim Marsico
AIL Systems Inc.
(516) 595-5879
[log in to unmask]
(See how nice I signed off with my name and other pertinent information!)
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 08:48:17 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]ORG>,
David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Ni plating and Immersion Au
X-To: GuitarBud <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Hi Frank - No, I wouldn't recommend replacing the nickel with copper.
Copper will diffuse into/through the Ag finish creating an unsolderable
condition after an extended amount of time. The "extended" amount of time
will depend on the storage/use/handling conditions for the parts. You can
find some good info in Klein Wassink's book "Soldering in Electronics" ISBN
0-901150-14-2 on this issue. Good Luck.
Dave Hillman
Rockwell Collins
[log in to unmask]
GuitarBud <[log in to unmask]> on 05/02/98 12:42:37 AM
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond
to GuitarBud <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: David D Hillman/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
Subject: Re: [TN] Ni plating and Immersion Au
I am plating stamped 1018-Steel parts with Ni and then Ag. I am then
soldering them together with 2%Ag solder. It is roughly 1" x 8". Should I
use Cu in place of the Ni?
Frank
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 14:45:57 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Marco Biagtan wrote:-
>Hi Guys,
>
>I have a problem with dimensional stability of photo tools. The photo
>tools shrink after processing. I've tried increasing the drying
>temperature (50-55C) just so it will not shrink but it still does. This is
>really giving me a headache. Any suggestions?
>
Hi Marco,
It is important to pre-stabilise the film before plotting. If it is
taken straight from the packet and plotted you will have problems. If
you can take the film out of the packet and let the air get to it for at
least a couple of hours (ideally 24 hours) in your stabilised
environment you should minimise any movement after plotting.
What kind of shrinkage are you seeing. We generally consider we are
doing well if we get less than 0.025mm over 500mm which is 50ppm. The
difficulty is accurately measuring the error to that degree of accuracy.
Best Regards
Paul Gould
[log in to unmask]
Teknacron Circuits Ltd
Fax: 1983 865141
Tel: 1983 866531
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 09:23:45 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Stephanie Kaplan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Stephanie Kaplan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: IPC-1170 Supplier Survey Form
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
IPC-1710, OEM Standard for Printed Board Manufacturers' Qualification Profile (MQP),
and IPC-1720, Assembly Qualifaction Profile, are available from IPC customer service
at 847/509-9700. The cost for each document is $70 for IPC members and $140 for
non-members.
Stephanie A. Kaplan
Director, Market Research
The Institute for Interconnecting and Packaging Electronic Circuits
847/509-9700 ext. 317
>>> Kelly Kovalovsky <[log in to unmask]> 05/20/98 02:52PM >>>
Ok, I believe you.
Let's try IPC-1710. I got the number from a company internal document that
sounds like it might have been wrong.
Kelly Kovalovsky
[log in to unmask] on 05-20-98 03:11:15 PM
Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc:
Subject: Re: [TN] IPC-1170 Supplier Survey Form
Kelly,
Don't you mean IPC-1710?
|
/|\
/ | \
/ |__\ /\
/____@_\ |
~~[________)~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~[]~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Michael L. (Mike) Holmes
Charter Member, Space Coast Chapter, IPC Designers Council
MS 1-5852
Designer 3 Harris Corporation
PWB Design Group Government Communications Systems Division
Digital and Electronic 2400 NE Palm Bay Road
Packaging Section Palm Bay, FL 32905
Work 407 727-4356 Fax 407 729-7540
email [log in to unmask]
*****************************************************************************
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 09:25:55 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Gold Solder Pot
X-To: Kenny Bloomquist <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Hi Ken - My suggestion is to plot your monthly solder pot analysis results
and couple that with the amount/number of components that goes through your
solder pot. You should be able to "predict" where the impurity levels are
going to be and can use this data to support "why" you haven't jeopardized
the overall process reliability. Many shops just dump their solder pot
(dump = recycle) monthly rather than incur the cost of testing and doing
the predictions. As for the amount of gold that you can live with, take a
look at section 5.4 in the J-STD-001 Handbook - it does a nice job of
covering the details of gold removal and why! Good Luck.
Dave Hillman
Rockwell Collins
[log in to unmask]
Kenny Bloomquist <[log in to unmask]> on 05/14/98 09:58:37 AM
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond
to Kenny Bloomquist <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: David D Hillman/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
Subject: [TN] Gold Solder Pot
Fellow TechNeters,
We manufacture hardware for DOD per ANSI J-STD-001 and I have a couple of
questions regarding solder pots for removing gold from components prior to
tinning and soldering.
We send out solder samples for testing from our tinning and gold stripping
solder pots every thirty days. To answer the question of "what do you do
with parts that were tinned while the solder pot is being tested (and the
test fails)" we shut the pot down until the test results come back. The
problem is we only have one gold pot and don't want to shut it down during
testing. How does your companies address this issue? Is it fair to assume
that since there is a secondary tinning operation that the small amount of
gold that may remain on the parts will not be a problem? Do you dump the
pot every thirty days?
My second question is, what is the maximum amount of gold that can be
plated
on a terminal and still be soldered into an assembly with only tinning and
not cleaning? Is there a specification that allows this?
Thanks in advance for all responses.
Ken Bloomquist
Sr. Principal Process Eng.
PRIMEX Aerospace Company
[log in to unmask]
(425) 881-8990 ext. 6645
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 09:52:00 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ADMIN: "SENDERS"
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
I agree, Jim. It's usually called a signature file. In Groupwise, the lousy mail
system we use at IPC, I have my preferences set so that when I hit the send button, I
have to option to or not to attach the signature file.
You've probably done this already, but just in case--look through all your mail
applications preferences. There may be an option to have "verbose headers" which, if
checked, show ALL the to/from/cc fields. If you are using one of the
freeware/shareware browsers like Eudora Light or Pegasus, it's hard to get support,
but both of the ones I just mentioned have pretty nice manuals or help files that can
be downloaded.
If you're running on a Unix based, company propriatary e-mail system from a dumb
terminal or using a terminal emulator on a PC, you're at the mercy of your system
administrators. I've had both good and bad experience in those situations. I'm
always frustrated by the ones that tell me what I need instead of asking. While it's
borderline to topic acceptability, if we get a slow period some day you might want to
repost your msg with more info about exactly what mail system you are using and what
specific mail reader you have on your PC/terminal. Someone out there may have found
a work-a-round on seeing your whole header.
If it's an occasional curiosity on who posted, another option might be to hit your
reply button and see if all the addresses show up in the TO: field then. You should
be able to cancel/delete the reply screen after you see the info. Good luck. Jack
>>> Jim Marsico 516-595-5879 <[log in to unmask]> 05/21/98 07:10AM >>>
I have a problem, probably something to do with my server, whereas I don't know
who is sending out a Technet post. The "from" information in the memo header
only says "Technet", and, unless the writer ends the post with his or her name
and company, I can't tell who it is! Does anyone else have this problem or is
it just me?
Jim Marsico
AIL Systems Inc.
(516) 595-5879
[log in to unmask]
(See how nice I signed off with my name and other pertinent information!)
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 08:25:09 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Frequency problems with FR-4
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Has anybody had any problems with FR-4 at 100 to 200 MHz? I have =
several boards from several fabrication shops in which the signal loses =
amplitude above 80-100 MHz. The boards are controlled impedance (50 =
Ohms) with 5 mil traces and 5 mil dielectrics. The traces are about =
6.5" long.
I would appreciate any comments on this subject. The supplier of the =
material says that FR-4 should be good to 400 MHz.
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 10:47:40 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Drum disposal
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Can anyone advise me of who would pick up empty plastic chemical drums =
for recycling in the Tulsa, OK area. I'm guessing it would be someone =
out of Dallas or maybe St. Louis. Any help would be appreciated.
Ed Cosper
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 16:34:43 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Eddie Brunker <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Eddie Brunker <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR-4
X-To: Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Recently an article appeared in the Electronics Press after the head of
Multek visited Dovertron in Cork (part of the same group of companies), and
good friends of ours too.
The article focused on his warnings that at 300MHZ and above, Fr-4 is
unsuitable and future substrates should be of alternative materials, the
costs and processing should be considered etc...
I asked our design engineers to comment on this, and they have no problems
with FR-4 at 300MHZ which are speeds we use presently. I know of one other
company using FR-4 at these speeds, and if they are happy with it then so am
I, as they are big league!
Regards
At 08:25 21/05/98 -0700, you wrote:
> Has anybody had any problems with FR-4 at 100 to 200 MHz? I have
several boards from several fabrication shops in which the signal loses
amplitude above 80-100 MHz. The boards are controlled impedance (50 Ohms)
with 5 mil traces and 5 mil dielectrics. The traces are about 6.5" long.
> I would appreciate any comments on this subject. The supplier of
the material says that FR-4 should be good to 400 MHz.
>
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>
>
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 10:34:40 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mike Buetow <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mike Buetow <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: IPC-1710 Supplier Survey Form
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
I would add that the three qualification profiles are also available at no charge if
downloaded off the IPC web site (www.ipc.org/html/downloads.htm).
Descriptions of each follow.
IPC-1710, OEM Standard for Printed Board Manufacturers' Qualification Profile
Developed by the OEM council of the IPC, the MQP sets the standard for assessing PWB
manufacturers capabilities and allows PWB manufacturers to more easily satisfy
customer requirements.
IPC-1720, Assembly Qualification Profile
Developed by the OEM council of the IPC, IPC-1720 categorized an electronic assembly
manufacturer's capabilities and supplies the OEM customer with detailed, substantive
information.
IPC-1730, Laminator Qualification Profile
The IPC-1730 categorizes a laminator manufacturer's capabilities. Used for single or
multiple sites or locations, it eases auditing processes and reduces the frequency of
audits, thereby decreasing paperwork and enhancing effectiveness. The program
includes a description, approval and certification profile, and a quality profile.
Mike Buetow
Communications Manager
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 09:40:07 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR-4
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Fred,
I've personally done boards beyond 1Ghz with standard high Tg FR4
material. The high Tg (>140) was for Z-axis stability. The board was
exclusively 50 ohms impedance, and included a test coupon on the board
itself. One thing we did was ask for impedance testing to be done to
200db levels instead of the standard 20db. This would show any and all
discontinuities along the traces.
My recommendation is to talk with your fab shop and determine what
exactly they can do for you (technical input), and find out if they can
fabricate using GETEK material (much like FR4, should be no additional
costs) which has a lower and much more stable dielectric constant. My
fab shops was dieing to give me GETEK boards, but this particular
engineer wasn't familiar with it, and couldn't evaluate it properly.
But then again, he did get boards at 1.2Ghz using standard FR4 material.
Go figure?
Good luck,
Mitch Morey
Sr PCB Designer
NSI Communications
San Diego CA 92121
(619)657-5338
[log in to unmask]
>>> Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]> 05/21/98 07:25am >>>
Has anybody had any problems with FR-4 at 100 to 200 MHz? I
have several boards from several fabrication shops in which the signal
loses amplitude above 80-100 MHz. The boards are controlled
impedance (50 Ohms) with 5 mil traces and 5 mil dielectrics. The traces
are about 6.5" long.
I would appreciate any comments on this subject. The supplier of
the material says that FR-4 should be good to 400 MHz.
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 16:45:03 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Donal O Brien <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: solder spikes
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Hi technetters,
I have a problem at wave solder with spikes on a BNC connector.
The spikes are on the ground pins which are 1.6mm diameter protruding 1.4
mm with a flat surface. The land diameter is only.4mm which may be causing
a problem..
we use turbulent to heat the part to some effect but does not clear the
problem entirely.
any clues
Rgds
Donal o Brien
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 11:41:54 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Holly Evans <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Holly Evans <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Drum disposal
X-To: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <01BD84A5.E286D780@gateway>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Ed --
According to the IPC recycling guide, which is available off the IPC Home
Page under Environmental Programs, there are five listed recyclers of
plastics. One in Washington state, one in North Carolina, one in
California, one in Illinois, and one in Texas. I can't guarantee that they
will take your drums, but they may have some insight as to who may (they
also may have regional offices closer to you).
The contacts are as follows:
SemiCycle Foundation
2111 Karmer Lane
Austin, TX
Tim Jarvis
(512) 339-4229
Van Leer Container
4300 W. 130th St.
Chicago, IL 60658
Larry Bonick
708-371-5596
Russell Stanley West
9449 Santa Anita Ave.
Rancho Cucamonga, CA91730
Richard Anderson
909-980-7114
Reuse It Plastics, Inc
P.O. Box 2158
Cornelius, NC 28031
Barbara Canter
704-896-8971
Recycled Plastics Marketing
2829 152nd Ave. N.E.
Redmond, WA 98052
Craig Hart
206-867-3200
Please respond back to me directly ([log in to unmask]) if you have any
luck so I can keep record of company in my files.
Thanks
. At 10:47 AM 5/21/98 -0500, you wrote:
>Can anyone advise me of who would pick up empty plastic chemical drums for
recycling in the Tulsa, OK area. I'm guessing it would be someone out of
Dallas or maybe St. Louis. Any help would be appreciated.
>
>Ed Cosper
>
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>
Holly Evans
Director of Environmental and Safety Programs
IPC
1400 Eye St., N.W., Suite 540
Washington, D.C. 20005-2208
phone: 202-638-6219
fax: 202-638-0145
e-mail: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 11:42:23 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Dennis Beerman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Dennis Beerman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR-4
X-To: Eddie Brunker <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
6.5" is at the limits of a 200MHz trace on FR-4. Are you sure that a 5 mil
trace is 50 ohms in your application?
> ----------
> From: Eddie Brunker
> Sent: Thursday, May 21, 1998 11:34 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Frequency problems with FR-4
>
> Recently an article appeared in the Electronics Press after the head of
> Multek visited Dovertron in Cork (part of the same group of companies),
> and
> good friends of ours too.
> The article focused on his warnings that at 300MHZ and above, Fr-4 is
> unsuitable and future substrates should be of alternative materials, the
> costs and processing should be considered etc...
> I asked our design engineers to comment on this, and they have no problems
> with FR-4 at 300MHZ which are speeds we use presently. I know of one other
> company using FR-4 at these speeds, and if they are happy with it then so
> am
> I, as they are big league!
>
> Regards
>
>
> At 08:25 21/05/98 -0700, you wrote:
> > Has anybody had any problems with FR-4 at 100 to 200 MHz? I have
> several boards from several fabrication shops in which the signal loses
> amplitude above 80-100 MHz. The boards are controlled impedance (50 Ohms)
> with 5 mil traces and 5 mil dielectrics. The traces are about 6.5" long.
> > I would appreciate any comments on this subject. The supplier of
> the material says that FR-4 should be good to 400 MHz.
> >
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 11:54:25 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, BSFlag <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: BSFlag <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: BGA assembly process
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Use the same process as any other SMT process with a few Precautions.
1) BGA are very susceptible to moisture, bake them if they have been exposed.
2) Inspect Solder paste before placement, 100% (this is normally the biggest
gotcha)
3) If placement is off, do not attempt to "tweak" the part, remove clean board
and part and reapply solder paste.
4) Profile with a thermocouple attached to the solder ball, (drill a small
hole through the board and feed the wire from the bottom (a ball closet to the
middle is best)
Hope this helps
Mike
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 09:57:44 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR-4
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Fred,
Another concern is with the 5 mil lines at 50 ohms. For you microstip
layers (external), you'll only have about 3.5 mils of dielectric material to
the ground/power reference plane! That's a pretty thin dielectric
separation. For your stipline layers (internal) you'll have about a 7 mil
dielectric separation to your reference planes, so that should be ok, but
the external layers might be a concern for you.
Eddie bunker wrote:
(snip) Multek visited Dovertron in Cork (part of the same group of
companies), and good friends of ours too. The article focused on his
warnings that at 300MHZ and above, Fr-4 is unsuitable and future
substrates should be of alternative materials... (snip)
Interesting, coming from manufacturing companies. If I talk to my fab
shops they say there is no costs difference using GETEK material. Might
be interesting to see if Multek feels the same. Next thing, can Multek
supply the data they have to make this determination?
Good luck again,
Mitch Morey
>>> Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]> 05/21/98 07:25am >>>
Has anybody had any problems with FR-4 at 100 to 200 MHz? I
have several boards from several fabrication shops in which the signal
loses amplitude above 80-100 MHz. The boards are controlled
impedance (50 Ohms) with 5 mil traces and 5 mil dielectrics. The traces
are about 6.5" long.
I would appreciate any comments on this subject. The supplier of
the material says that FR-4 should be good to 400 MHz.
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 10:01:59 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR-4
X-To: [log in to unmask]
>>> Dennis Beerman <[log in to unmask]>>>
>6.5" is at the limits of a 200MHz trace on FR-4.
What do you mean by this Dennis? I've never heard of this "limitation".
Please inform us.
Mitch
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 09:17:32 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Matthew Park <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Matthew Park <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: solder spikes -Reply
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
I don't think you can eliminate it no matter what you do with the
wave profile or some other fancy tricks. My best advise is "hand
solder the BNC connector" Or you may try it by isolating the
ground pin from the board ground plane (use cross-shape
geometry pad).
re
Mpark
NII-Norsat International Inc.
>>> Donal O Brien <[log in to unmask]> May 21, 1998
8:45 am >>>
Hi technetters,
I have a problem at wave solder with spikes on a BNC
connector.
The spikes are on the ground pins which are 1.6mm diameter
protruding 1.4
mm with a flat surface. The land diameter is only.4mm which
may be causing
a problem..
we use turbulent to heat the part to some effect but does not
clear the
problem entirely.
any clues
Rgds
Donal o Brien
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 08:08:00 +0900
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: No Subject
Please add my e-mail to the distribution list.
Thanks,
Mike
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 11:29:39 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Lynch, Lyn" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Lynch, Lyn" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Removing Air From Solder Paste
In another life, I used a centrifuge to remove air from thick
epoxies. Should work nicely with solder paste. Be sure the end is
well sealed, otherwise, you'll have a full centrifuge and empty
syringes.
The views stated above are not necessarily those of my employer.
Lyn R. Lynch
Coates ASI
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 12:55:59 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, BSFlag <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: BSFlag <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Removing Air From Solder Paste
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I am not sure but a centrifuge my also sperate the flux from the solder balls.
Mike
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 11:56:27 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mike Medina <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mike Medina <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Drum disposal
X-To: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Check with your chemical suppiers and see if they will take back drums,
most of ours do. If that doesn't work, look in the yellow pages under
"recycling" or "plastic - scrap" for vendors that handle plastics. Most
chemical containers are Polyethylene, which is one of the most desirable
plastics for recycling, so there should be several companies to choose
from. If the state has some sort of Environmental assistance organization,
they might have lists of recycling companies.
Mike Medina
Multek, Inc.
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 12:13:02 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: spill-proof flux bottles
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Yesterday I met an electronics instructor who is looking for ".5 oz.
spill-proof flux bottles." He said they used to get them from PACE, but
that they discontinued the spill-proof caps. Any ideas?
Thank you,
-David
Plan now to attend:
Surface Mount International (San Jose, CA; 8/23-8/27)
Electronics Assembly Expo (Providence, RI; 10/24-10/29)
SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
Enabling members to achieve success
in surface mount and companion technologies
through education, training and access to knowledge.
5200 Willson Road, Suite 215, Edina, MN 55424-1343
612-920-7682 F 612-926-1819
[log in to unmask] www.smta.org
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 12:13:00 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Ni plating and Immersion Au
X-To: David D Hillman <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
We sell Klein Wassink's "Soldering in Electronics." Let me know if you're
interested...
-David
At 08:48 AM 5/21/98 -0500, you wrote:
>Hi Frank - No, I wouldn't recommend replacing the nickel with copper.
>Copper will diffuse into/through the Ag finish creating an unsolderable
>condition after an extended amount of time. The "extended" amount of time
>will depend on the storage/use/handling conditions for the parts. You can
>find some good info in Klein Wassink's book "Soldering in Electronics" ISBN
>0-901150-14-2 on this issue. Good Luck.
>
>Dave Hillman
>Rockwell Collins
>[log in to unmask]
>
>
>
>I am plating stamped 1018-Steel parts with Ni and then Ag. I am then
>soldering them together with 2%Ag solder. It is roughly 1" x 8". Should I
>use Cu in place of the Ni?
>
>Frank
>
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>
>
Plan now to attend:
Surface Mount International (San Jose, CA; 8/23-8/27)
Electronics Assembly Expo (Providence, RI; 10/24-10/29)
SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
Enabling members to achieve success
in surface mount and companion technologies
through education, training and access to knowledge.
5200 Willson Road, Suite 215, Edina, MN 55424-1343
612-920-7682 F 612-926-1819
[log in to unmask] www.smta.org
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 12:10:57 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David D Sullivan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David D Sullivan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Drum disposal
X-To: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Ed,
I know there is a guy who does this in Springfield, MO. Call Bill Cameron
at Litton ACD for this guy's name. Bill's number is (417) 862-0751. His
email is [log in to unmask]
Regards,
Dave Sullivan
Rockwell Collins
Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]> on 05/21/98 10:47:40 AM
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond
to Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: David D Sullivan/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
Subject: [TN] Drum disposal
Can anyone advise me of who would pick up empty plastic chemical drums for
recycling in the Tulsa, OK area. I'm guessing it would be someone out of
Dallas or maybe St. Louis. Any help would be appreciated.
Ed Cosper
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 13:22:53 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR-4
X-To: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hello Mitch
You wrote:
Snip....
One thing we did was ask for impedance testing to be done to
200db levels instead of the standard 20db. This would show any and all
discontinuities along the traces.
Snip.....
Question: With the impedance measurement techniques I've seen, this
parameter is not mentioned. How does one determine
from a given procedure, the dB level of the
particular test they are running?
BTW, I agree with your assertion that FR4 can be used with significant
signal content in the 1Ghz range.
Regards
Gerry
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 13:05:57 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Sherry Warner <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Sherry Warner <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: spill-proof flux bottles
X-To: David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Try Marshall Industries, they sell the "Plato" flux and liquid dispensers
with a leak proof double seal. You can get them ESD safe as well. BUT...
these are .2 oz.
www.marshall.com
800-432-2223
Sherry Warner
Sr. Engineer
>Yesterday I met an electronics instructor who is looking for ".5 oz.
>spill-proof flux bottles." He said they used to get them from PACE, but
>that they discontinued the spill-proof caps. Any ideas?
>
>Thank you,
>
>-David
>Plan now to attend:
>Surface Mount International (San Jose, CA; 8/23-8/27)
>Electronics Assembly Expo (Providence, RI; 10/24-10/29)
>
> SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
> Enabling members to achieve success
> in surface mount and companion technologies
> through education, training and access to knowledge.
>
>5200 Willson Road, Suite 215, Edina, MN 55424-1343
> 612-920-7682 F 612-926-1819
> [log in to unmask] www.smta.org
>
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 11:54:50 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR-4
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Gerry,
I might have gotten the "values" mixed up. I think I intended to say the
testing was requested to be done at 20us (micro) instead of the usual
200ps (picoseconds), not Db. Sorry for the confusion. I've been going
around my office looking for the fabrication drawing this was specified
on, but I can't find it. I hope I'm right this time. Best to talk with a fab house
about impedance testing issues. Our fab house at that time couldn't test
to the higher spped, so they had to have it done somewhere else.
Also, ask for the certification on your fab drawing. They will supply it to
you, if they DO do it.
But, A great reference spec for impedance testing, unless you use the
IPC-TM-650, is IPC-2141 (design for High Speed applications)
Thanks for the input.
Mitch
>>> "Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]> 05/21/98
09:22am >>>
Hello Mitch
You wrote:
Snip....
One thing we did was ask for impedance testing to be done to
200db levels instead of the standard 20db. This would show any and all
discontinuities along the traces.
Snip.....
Question: With the impedance measurement techniques I've seen, this
parameter is not mentioned. How does one determine
from a given procedure, the dB level of the
particular test they are running?
BTW, I agree with your assertion that FR4 can be used with significant
signal content in the 1Ghz range.
Regards
Gerry
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 13:22:55 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: spill-proof flux bottles
X-To: Sherry Warner <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Thanks, Sherry!
-David
At 01:05 PM 5/21/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Try Marshall Industries, they sell the "Plato" flux and liquid dispensers
>with a leak proof double seal. You can get them ESD safe as well. BUT...
>these are .2 oz.
>
>www.marshall.com
>800-432-2223
>
>
>
>Sherry Warner
>Sr. Engineer
>
>
>
>
>>Yesterday I met an electronics instructor who is looking for ".5 oz.
>>spill-proof flux bottles." He said they used to get them from PACE, but
>>that they discontinued the spill-proof caps. Any ideas?
>>
>>Thank you,
>>
>>-David
>>Plan now to attend:
>>Surface Mount International (San Jose, CA; 8/23-8/27)
>>Electronics Assembly Expo (Providence, RI; 10/24-10/29)
>>
>> SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
>> Enabling members to achieve success
>> in surface mount and companion technologies
>> through education, training and access to knowledge.
>>
>>5200 Willson Road, Suite 215, Edina, MN 55424-1343
>> 612-920-7682 F 612-926-1819
>> [log in to unmask] www.smta.org
>>
>>################################################################
>>TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8c
>>################################################################
>>To subscribe/unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with
>>following text in the body:
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>>Please visit IPC web site (http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm) for additional
>>information.
>>For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
>>847-509-9700 ext.312
>>################################################################
>
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>
>
Plan now to attend:
Surface Mount International (San Jose, CA; 8/23-8/27)
Electronics Assembly Expo (Providence, RI; 10/24-10/29)
SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
Enabling members to achieve success
in surface mount and companion technologies
through education, training and access to knowledge.
5200 Willson Road, Suite 215, Edina, MN 55424-1343
612-920-7682 F 612-926-1819
[log in to unmask] www.smta.org
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 14:23:20 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR-4
X-To: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi Mitch!
Thanks for the quick response!
As regards the IPC specs, one of my old friends and former colleague
Rich Mellitz did a lot of work for the IPC specs in the area of TDR and
impedance measurement. Rich is a stickler on Z0 measurement accuracy.
Rich, if you're out there - Hi!!!!!
We do Z0 testing on all our protos. This is in addition to work the
board shop does. The TDR setup we use launches a 30-35ps risetime pulse
with a 1/2 volt step. In addition to the Z0 itself, we take delay
measurements as well as watch the risetime at coupon launch and at
coupon exit. The measurement procedure is critical for accuracy.
Other test beds may do slower as you mention (200ps).
One thing I noticed was that you specified a slower pulse, i.e. in
microseconds. How does this benefit you?
Regards
Gerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Mitch Morey [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 21, 1998 2:55 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Frequency problems with FR-4
Gerry,
I might have gotten the "values" mixed up. I think I intended to say the
testing was requested to be done at 20us (micro) instead of the usual
200ps (picoseconds), not Db. Sorry for the confusion. I've been going
around my office looking for the fabrication drawing this was specified
on, but I can't find it. I hope I'm right this time. Best to talk with a
fab house
about impedance testing issues. Our fab house at that time couldn't test
to the higher spped, so they had to have it done somewhere else.
Also, ask for the certification on your fab drawing. They will supply it
to
you, if they DO do it.
But, A great reference spec for impedance testing, unless you use the
IPC-TM-650, is IPC-2141 (design for High Speed applications)
Thanks for the input.
Mitch
>>> "Gerald G. Gagnon" <[log in to unmask]> 05/21/98
09:22am >>>
Hello Mitch
You wrote:
Snip....
One thing we did was ask for impedance testing to be done to
200db levels instead of the standard 20db. This would show any and all
discontinuities along the traces.
Snip.....
Question: With the impedance measurement techniques I've seen, this
parameter is not mentioned. How does one determine
from a given procedure, the dB level of the
particular test they are running?
BTW, I agree with your assertion that FR4 can be used with significant
signal content in the 1Ghz range.
Regards
Gerry
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 14:15:38 -0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Questions on micro-BGA and voids on BGA
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
What is the IPC acceptability for percentage of void on BGA and Micro-BGA. We
found the void of 25% on one solder joint cross section of a micro-BGA. Is it
acceptable?
How to rework micro-BGA? Do we have to apply solder paste before replacing the
part?
Wellington
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Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 08:33:24 +1000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Klasek <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Removing Air From Solder Paste
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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Hi Lyn
Appreciate the shot but the metal and flux separation would be
inevitable .
Still, good point to file for other applications .
Paul Klasek
ResMed
>----------
>From: Lynch, Lyn[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>Sent: Friday, 22 May 1998 2:29
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: [TN] Removing Air From Solder Paste
>
> In another life, I used a centrifuge to remove air from thick
> epoxies. Should work nicely with solder paste. Be sure the end is
> well sealed, otherwise, you'll have a full centrifuge and empty
> syringes.
>
> The views stated above are not necessarily those of my employer.
>
> Lyn R. Lynch
> Coates ASI
>
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 19:46:48 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
X-To: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Just a couple of quick Ideas without diving too deep into the situation.
1) Do you stabilize the film (open the package and "fan" it) for 24 hrs before using in
plotting. This should be done in the plotter area
2) Are your humidity and temp in the plotting room and other areas consistent with each
other?
3) Some material movement from the processor is normal (1-2 mils over the sheet of film). If
your shrinkage is constant, size at the plotting/cam station according.
There are a number of other items that will also cause this, but start simple... JOHN WAITE
Marco Biagtan wrote:
> Hi Guys,
>
> I have a problem with dimensional stability of photo tools. The photo
> tools shrink after processing. I've tried increasing the drying
> temperature (50-55C) just so it will not shrink but it still does. This is
> really giving me a headache. Any suggestions?
>
> Marco Biagtan
> NEC-CPI Process Engineer.
>
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 19:54:26 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR-4
X-To: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi Fred,
I'm finding that many fab houses have settled into modified glass/epoxy systems for a lot of
the Hi Speed applications. I would suggest running your design on a couple of different types.
Mitch suggested the G-Tek, which does well, but I would also consider Nelco's material (N-6000?-
Sorry all, if I got the wrong number). Also check cleanliness levels. JOHN WAITE
Mitch Morey wrote:
> Fred,
>
> I've personally done boards beyond 1Ghz with standard high Tg FR4
> material. The high Tg (>140) was for Z-axis stability. The board was
> exclusively 50 ohms impedance, and included a test coupon on the board
> itself. One thing we did was ask for impedance testing to be done to
> 200db levels instead of the standard 20db. This would show any and all
> discontinuities along the traces.
>
> My recommendation is to talk with your fab shop and determine what
> exactly they can do for you (technical input), and find out if they can
> fabricate using GETEK material (much like FR4, should be no additional
> costs) which has a lower and much more stable dielectric constant. My
> fab shops was dieing to give me GETEK boards, but this particular
> engineer wasn't familiar with it, and couldn't evaluate it properly.
>
> But then again, he did get boards at 1.2Ghz using standard FR4 material.
> Go figure?
>
> Good luck,
> Mitch Morey
> Sr PCB Designer
> NSI Communications
> San Diego CA 92121
> (619)657-5338
> [log in to unmask]
>
> >>> Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]> 05/21/98 07:25am >>>
> Has anybody had any problems with FR-4 at 100 to 200 MHz? I
> have several boards from several fabrication shops in which the signal
> loses amplitude above 80-100 MHz. The boards are controlled
> impedance (50 Ohms) with 5 mil traces and 5 mil dielectrics. The traces
> are about 6.5" long.
> I would appreciate any comments on this subject. The supplier of
> the material says that FR-4 should be good to 400 MHz.
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 08:25:01 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Arnold C. Escanilla" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Arnold C. Escanilla" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
X-To: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi John,
Thanks for the advise.
There have been a lot of suggestions about conditioning the photo tool for
24hrs after taking them out of the bag. We usually only condition them for
4 hours but I'll try your suggestions. Thanks!
By the way, the dimensional instability problem only happens with our
contacted films and not our plotted ones, but thanks for the input anyway.
Marco
----------
> From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Photo tool stability
> Date: Friday, May 22, 1998 7:46 AM
>
> Just a couple of quick Ideas without diving too deep into the situation.
> 1) Do you stabilize the film (open the package and "fan" it) for 24
hrs before using in
> plotting. This should be done in the plotter area
> 2) Are your humidity and temp in the plotting room and other areas
consistent with each
> other?
> 3) Some material movement from the processor is normal (1-2 mils over
the sheet of film). If
> your shrinkage is constant, size at the plotting/cam station according.
> There are a number of other items that will also cause this, but
start simple... JOHN WAITE
>
> Marco Biagtan wrote:
>
> > Hi Guys,
> >
> > I have a problem with dimensional stability of photo tools. The photo
> > tools shrink after processing. I've tried increasing the drying
> > temperature (50-55C) just so it will not shrink but it still does.
This is
> > really giving me a headache. Any suggestions?
> >
> > Marco Biagtan
> > NEC-CPI Process Engineer.
> >
> > ################################################################
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Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 09:16:35 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Edwin V. Maximo" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <emaximo@[192.1.1.215]>
From: "Edwin V. Maximo" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: TAB test methods
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Does anyone know how a TAB device (after it has been placed in a PCB)
is tested and what methods/machines are being used.
Any information given will be appreciated.
Thanks,
Edwin Maximo
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 08:31:17 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
>By the way, the dimensional instability problem only happens with our
>contacted films and not our plotted ones, but thanks for the input anyway.
Marco,
Just had another thought if it is only your contacts. If you are using a
single sided glass exposure frame with a flexible membrane over the top,
your copy film will be in contact with the membrane and will tend to get
mechanically stretched. This would result in an apparent shrinkage after
exposure. If this is a possibility, put a sheet of black card on top of
the film before closing the lid and pulling the vacuum.
Hope this helps.
Paul Gould
[log in to unmask]
Teknacron Circuits Ltd
Fax: 1983 865141
Tel: 1983 866531
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 08:53:28 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Stewart, Dougal" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Stewart, Dougal" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR4 (but ref:GETEK)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Mitch Morey wrote My recommendation is to talk with your fab shop and
determine what
> exactly they can do for you (technical input), and find out if they
can
> fabricate using GETEK material (much like FR4, should be no additional
> costs) which has a lower and much more stable dielectric constant.
I don't know what b********t people tell you in the US of A, but
whenever the guys from GE talk to me they say that the material is more
expensive (has to be, it's new and better!) and the processing is not
the same as FR4 - the bond cycle is extremely tortuous and is at least
2x the length of an FR4 cycle. In my book, this means that there are
additional costs, and you should expect to pay more. I assume that
Mr.Morey is from an assembly, not Fab facility, so why don't you ask
your supplier what he thinks about the cost, and don't listen to the GE
sales guy who only wants you to specify his material.
sorry if this upsets the people at GE
Dougal
Dougal Stewart
Product Development Manager
Viasystems Selkirk Ltd
Selkirk, Scotland, TD7 5EJ
Tel: +44 1750 21601
Fax:+44 1750 22513
email [log in to unmask]
This statement is a personal view and does not neccessarily reflect the
views of my employer.
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 16:48:52 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
X-To: Paul Gould <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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Hi Paul,
Hi Paul,
I'm sorry but I don't quite understand what you mean about the single sided
glass exposure frame. The flexible membrane of our exposure machine has a
thin glass frame on top of it as well as a thick glass frame where we lay
our films. Is this the same?
Anyway, thanks a lot for the suggestion. This is the first time I've heard
of this and it might just be what I'm looking for.
Marco Biagtan
NEC Components Phils. Inc.
Process Engineer
Paul Gould wrote:
> Marco,
> Just had another thought if it is only your contacts. If you are using a
> single sided glass exposure frame with a flexible membrane over the top,
> your copy film will be in contact with the membrane and will tend to get
> mechanically stretched. This would result in an apparent shrinkage after
> exposure. If this is a possibility, put a sheet of black card on top of
> the film before closing the lid and pulling the vacuum.
> Hope this helps.
> Paul Gould
> [log in to unmask]
> Teknacron Circuits Ltd
> Fax: 1983 865141
> Tel: 1983 866531
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 07:07:44 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Aric parr <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ADMIN: "SENDERS"
I have the same problem.
I suspect it is the server software, too.
[log in to unmask]
-------------
Original Text
From: C=US/A=INTERNET/DDA=ID/TechNet(a)IPC.ORG, on 5/21/98 11:08 AM:
Jim,
When I get a message from TechNet, the "From" field has the name and/or
email address of the author, and the ""To" field says [log in to unmask]
Jay DeKing
EMA Mid-Atlantic, Inc.
(716)334-2970 voice
(716)334-3481 fax
[log in to unmask]
-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Marsico 516-595-5879 [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 21, 1998 8:10 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] ADMIN: "SENDERS"
I have a problem, probably something to do with my server, whereas I don't
know
who is sending out a Technet post. The "from" information in the memo
header
only says "Technet", and, unless the writer ends the post with his or her
name
and company, I can't tell who it is! Does anyone else have this problem or
is
it just me?
Jim Marsico
AIL Systems Inc.
(516) 595-5879
[log in to unmask]
(See how nice I signed off with my name and other pertinent information!)
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 08:02:11 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
X-To: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi Marco,
What Paul is referring to is if the drawer has a glass base, and the top side has a mylar.
It sounds like you have a "glass pac" style tooling. AT what point do you see the "distortion".
Is is off the diazo developer or during exposure, or after transfer of the phototool to imaging
area. Also, are you using a covercoat over your diazo (IE- APF,PPF, etc). Sorry about my
misinterpretation. I thought you were using 1st generation silvers. JOHN WAITE
Marco Biagtan wrote:
> Hi Paul,
> Hi Paul,
> I'm sorry but I don't quite understand what you mean about the single sided
> glass exposure frame. The flexible membrane of our exposure machine has a
> thin glass frame on top of it as well as a thick glass frame where we lay
> our films. Is this the same?
>
> Anyway, thanks a lot for the suggestion. This is the first time I've heard
> of this and it might just be what I'm looking for.
>
> Marco Biagtan
> NEC Components Phils. Inc.
> Process Engineer
>
> Paul Gould wrote:
>
> > Marco,
> > Just had another thought if it is only your contacts. If you are using a
> > single sided glass exposure frame with a flexible membrane over the top,
> > your copy film will be in contact with the membrane and will tend to get
> > mechanically stretched. This would result in an apparent shrinkage after
> > exposure. If this is a possibility, put a sheet of black card on top of
> > the film before closing the lid and pulling the vacuum.
> > Hope this helps.
> > Paul Gould
> > [log in to unmask]
> > Teknacron Circuits Ltd
> > Fax: 1983 865141
> > Tel: 1983 866531
> >
> > ################################################################
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 08:44:44 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Dieffenbacher, William C" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Dieffenbacher, William C" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: IPC Specs
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain
I have to agree with Ralph. IPC specs are great and provide the most
up-to-date information available. IPC specs evolve quickly and are the
focus of much change activity, unlike the status quo of many older military
specs. All this is terrific from a technology point of view but it does
make management of specifications and contract requirements very cumbersome.
Some of us are still building military and commercial hardware to very
specific design requirements. Our customers are reluctant to change, which
locks us into old specifications.
Yes, we are trying to eliminate specific design requirements from our
contracts using the Single Process Initiative. We have been successful in
many respects, but as soon as we get though this process we find the specs
have changed again. All this requires a great deal of effort to inform
customers, update documentation, train employees, and bring suppliers
up-to-date.
With no comparison document or revision document it is difficult to
demonstrate to our customers why we should roll to the latest
specifications. When we do finally get a requirements change we find the
requirements have changed again! I don't want to stop progress, or even
slow it down. I think all the changes are for the best in the long run, but
management of the changes with revision documents, providing the reason for
change, would make life a lot easier.
Bill Dieffenbacher
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Lockheed Martin Control Systems
600 Main St. Rm R52
Johnson City, NY 13790
Tel (607)770-2961
Fax (607)770-2056
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 09:18:32 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Sheila Smith <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Sheila Smith <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: solder training
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
TechNetters:
I'm looking for a training source to get some assemblers up to speed on =
J-STD-001B soldering technique. These people presently have not =
official solder certifications, but are doing soldering. I am looking =
for something within 150 miles of Philadelphia & would like to get the =
training done ASAP. We could either send the people to the training or =
have the training done in-house (suburban Phillie area). If you prefer, =
please contact me directly at [log in to unmask] Thanks in advance =
for your help.
Sheila Smith
Tracor Aerospace
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 16:32:00 +0200
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SMITH RUSSELL MSM PO US <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SMITH RUSSELL MSM PO US <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: fluoride burns
X-To: Karen Tellefsen <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
It seems that everyone is quite familiar with Fluoride burns. To add a
little more information to the discussion:
The fluoride will continue to damage the skin and bone structure until
such time as it is neutralized . The stand procedure agreed to by
medical personnel is the subcutaneous of Calcium Gluconate. This must
occur either between the burn and the bone or on the surface of the
bone. Either prospect is not considered enjoyable. Because of the
relatively large amount of solution used. ( 10-40) cc of solution per
injection and the large gauge needle required it becomes a quite
uncomfortable experience to say the least. Even with quick and complete
neutralization there is severe scaring and usually a large hard knot of
tissue forms under the epidermal layer , quite akin to a large cyst. The
whole procedure is neither fun or pretty for anyone.
Concentrated Fluoride acid compounds should be handled with
caution and respect. The effects in the event of bodily contact can be
severe with all acid compounds and as such proper protective clothing
should be utilized. As with any chemical reaction the placing of an
opposing compound on the skin will result in a chemical reaction.
Neutralization solutions are usable for some parts of the body provided
there is sufficient quality of sufficiently weak ionic strength as to
preclude further damage from reaction by products( heat, gas generation
etc. ) Many minor chemical burns have changed into major injuries and
loss of life due to trying to neutralize with an opposite compound. Many
an Eye has been lost because of the accepted practice of using a little
squeeze bottle with 8-12 oz. of fluid in it. My question to someone when
i see those is "WHICH EYE ARE YOU GOING TO TRY AND SAVE ? , SINCE YOU
OBVIOUSLY CAN"T SAVE BOTH.
I will always recommend the immediate and first course of
action in any bodily contact with a process chemistry of the level of
hazard associated with any concentrate whether it Acid or Base, to
remove any contaminated articles of clothing including shoes ,watches
and rings, and immediately apply copious amounts of fresh running water.
for 15 minutes. Cold water while less able to remove some materials than
hot water , will slow the blood circulation to the skin surface as well
as assure that the pores are closed to further inhibit the absorption of
the chemical if it is a systematic poison . then administer follow-up
first aid based on the compound. This time allows several things to
occur , the material is constantly being diluted and removed. The mind
of the victim is somewhat occupied and it allows time for the paramedics
to arrive. If they get there before the 15 minutes is up then make them
wait.
A quick word on rinsing of an accident victim , it requires two
people to help the victim. Especially if it is in the eyes. One person
is going to have to steady the victim and many times hold them, the
other will be needed to hold the eye lid of the victim open to assure
complete and thorough rinsing. ( don't forget to continually talk to
them and tell them to roll their eyes to assure transfer of the fluid
from the rear of the orbital socket. )
To promote fear amongst the operators handling this material
WILL INVARIABLY LEAD TO AN ACCIDENT. Simple education and teaching of
preventative techniques will assure confidence and skill in the persons
handling any chemical.
Lastly PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE. if you have materials that
may be spilled on a person or the floor , practice what the procedures
are, who does what where the proper devices are. Have a disaster drill
just like a fire drill. It takes just a few minutes to prepare, and it
could save an eye or a lifetime of disfigurement , or even a life. (
Remember what you learn at work would also work at home with children
and family members. )
If you have any further questions I would be most happy to discuss them
with you.
Just a little food for thought to put this whole thing in
perspective:
The mercury in 1 laboratory thermometer evaporated on
the pitchers mound in Yankee Stadium , is enough to contaminate all the
air contained ( if you put a roof on it ) in 8 hours. The air would
violate the OSHA /NIOSH standards.
Russ Smith
russell.smith@ cibasc.com
----------
From: Andrew A Schroeder
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] fluoride burns
Date: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 3:48PM
Karen Tellefsen <[log in to unmask]> on 05/20/98 04:39:46 AM
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>; Please
respond
to Karen Tellefsen <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Andrew A Schroeder/CedarRapids/Collins/Rockwell)
Subject: Re: [TN] fluoride burns
RSedlak wrote:
>
> Okay, I am seriously crazed by any sort of implications that I have
suggested
> any procedure that was potentially very dangerous.
>
> And I want to get some serious chemistry understanding going on here.
>
> The bottom line is that "flouride" by itself, while no pussy cat, is
not
> crazily dangerous. However, CONCENTRATED HF is. Note the casual
reference
> to the term CONCENTRATED.
>
> Specifically, as pH goes down, Flouride goes from the ionized salt to
the
> protonated form, HF. Even this, by itself is no more dangerous than
HCl,
> Hydrochloric Acid, which is sold as toilet cleaner, in every grocery
store.
>
I don't think so. HF is a lot more dangerous than HCl. Bev's
description
of the toxicology of HF exposure to skin is pretty accurate. I've
worked
with a lot of concentrated acids, and HF is by far the scariest. I
think
Bev and I have a serious understanding of the chemistry.
Any acidic solution containing F- is dangerous and can cause burns,
that may not seem so bad at first. The problem is that the burns don't
heal, they get worse with time and may eventually attact bone. F-
ties up calcium ions in tissue, and since Ca+ is needed for tissue
repair,
the tissue deteriorates.
The medical treatment for F- burns is subcutaneous injections of calcium
salts.
This information can be found in the MSDS for acidic fluoride salts and
good laboratory safety manuals.
All,
One more liitle piece of infomation about fluoride burns. As the HF
ties
of the Calcium
in your blood, it form a salt in your viens and arteries. If you don't
get
those injections of Calcium salt within about an hour or so, there is no
way to remove that salt from your viens. It collects in your heart and
you
die within about 24 hours.
it isn't a very pleasant way to die.
Have a nice day,
Some Co-Op
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 09:05:50 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mitch Morey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: re: GETEK
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Whooow! Dougal,
Guess it is a USA thing. We just have it too good over here. No, I don't
work for a fab or assembly house. I am a captive board designer and a
telecomm company who deals with numerous fab houses. We must
have it really good over here, because I can actually get fab shops to cut
major costs out of their quotes because there is SO much competition. I
have never talked to anyone from GE, and don't personally care what
they have to tell me, because THEY don't make my boards. I get to the
meat of the matter, and for me it doesn't cost me a cent more to go with
GETEK.
Wish you luck, but I'm afraid I can't help you. Maybe others in your
predicament (the UK) can help you out with suggestions?
Mitch Morey
Sr PCB Designer
NSI Communication
San Diego CA (the Great USA!)
>>> "Stewart, Dougal" <[log in to unmask]>
05/21/98 11:53pm >>>
Mitch Morey wrote My recommendation is to talk with your fab shop and
determine what
> exactly they can do for you (technical input), and find out if they
can
> fabricate using GETEK material (much like FR4, should be no additional
> costs) which has a lower and much more stable dielectric constant.
I don't know what b********t people tell you in the US of A, but
whenever the guys from GE talk to me they say that the material is more
expensive (has to be, it's new and better!) and the processing is not
the same as FR4 - the bond cycle is extremely tortuous and is at least
2x the length of an FR4 cycle. In my book, this means that there are
additional costs, and you should expect to pay more. I assume that
Mr.Morey is from an assembly, not Fab facility, so why don't you ask
your supplier what he thinks about the cost, and don't listen to the GE
sales guy who only wants you to specify his material.
sorry if this upsets the people at GE
Dougal
Dougal Stewart
Product Development Manager
Viasystems Selkirk Ltd
Selkirk, Scotland, TD7 5EJ
Tel: +44 1750 21601
Fax:+44 1750 22513
email [log in to unmask]
This statement is a personal view and does not neccessarily reflect the
views of my employer.
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 16:12:47 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
tana <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <[log in to unmask]>
From: tana <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: University of Salford
Subject: Re: Solder Paste Stencils
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
> Since we are major chemical vendors to the Solder Paste Stencil industry, we
> have prepared a brochure on how it is done. Give me your address, and I will
> send it to you.
>
> Wow, the stuff you can get off of TechNet!!
>
> Rudy Sedlak
> RD Chemical Company
> Mountain View CA
>
> ################################################################
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> ################################################################
>
>
>
Hi!
I am also interested in this information as well.
Thank you.
Dr. Tennyson Nguty, AeroMech Department, Newton Building, Salford University
Manchester M5 4WT, UK. Tel: 0161-295 5951/4696, Fax: 0161-295 5575/5108
>>>>>> Does an object exists while you are not looking at it?
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 11:18:11 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: solder training
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Sheila,
You might want to give a company called SMT Plus a call, they give a=
=0Aexcellent course for rework operators. The company was started by a ge=
ntleman=0Anamed Jim Blankenhorn who has been around this industry quite s=
ometime and is=0Avery knowledgeable.
I used his services training rework operators and inspectors while I=
was=0Aworking at another company, and it was money well spent.
SMT Plus has a web page at; www.smtplus.com. I've pasted a little of=
the=0Atext from one of the pages at the web site below. Their phone numb=
er is: (408)=0A438-6116
-Steve Gregory-
SMT Plus, Inc. Bringing Today's Technology To You.....
ONSITE TRAINING SEMINARS
=95Design Training Courses
=95SMT Manufacturing Engineering Courses
=95SMT Production Training Courses
The most advanced training to keep up with the changing demands of SMT
SMT Plus has been offering training courses to the surface mount industry=
for=0A12 years. Throughout those years, thousands of engineers, managers=
,=0Asupervisors and production workers have learned how to perform their =
tasks=0Awith a higher level of proficiency and efficiency. The teaching s=
taff of SMT=0APlus comes with a strong and vast background of experience.=
Many of the=0Ainstructors currently work for companies at the leading ed=
ge and bring the=0Alatest in knowledge and techniques to the classroom.
It is a simple process to setup to have the class be at your facility whe=
n you=0Awant it.
Types of Courses
The list of courses offered is quite extensive and is designed to provide=
you=0Awith real world, practical solutions to everyday problems.
SMT Repair Rework With Lab
This is a two day course consisting of one day of lecture followed by a f=
ull=0Aday of hands-on solder training. The lecture uses the new computer-=
based=0ATechEdge training course "SMT & Fine Lead Repair Rework". In the =
lab, each=0Astudent will be equipped with a new soldering system and prac=
tice soldering=0Aand desoldering a wide range of SMT parts.
This class is also available on an interactive multi media CD-ROM. Labele=
d=0Aunder Tech Edge "SMT & Line Lead Repair Rework" is an advanced teachi=
ng tool=0Aconsisting of eight entertaining, educational and easy-to-use m=
odules.
Basics of SMT: Training Manufacturing Personnel
A course designed for those new to SMT production. During this course, th=
e=0Abasics are presented on components, processes and sequences of assemb=
ly.
Troubleshooting SMT Processes & DFM
Understanding and controlling the processes are key to SMT manufacturing.=
In=0Athis course the cause and effect relationships are presented follow=
ed by SPC=0Aand problem solving. An essential course to advance those fam=
iliar with SMT=0Abut needing to improve.
SMT and Through-Hole Workmanship Standards-IPC Worker Proficiency Class B
The determination of what is good and a reject is key in a manufacturing=
=0Aoperation. By thoroughly understanding the standards it improves effic=
iency=0Aand consistency.
This class is also available on an interactive multi media CD-ROM. Labele=
d=0Aunder TechEdge "SMT & PTH Workmanship Standards" have a total of 196=
=0Aobjectives taught using virtual reality, 3D images, animations, videos=
and=0Afull narration. Click here for more information on this course.
BGA Repair Rework
This one day class is a lecture in the first half-day followed by hands-o=
n=0Atraining on the system. Equipment in your plant will be used for the =
training=0Aor arrangements can be made to bring in predetermined demo equ=
ipment.
Solder Training - Trainer Certification Course
Offered is a three-day course for certifying trainers on both SMT and PTH=
. The=0Afirst day is a lecture using the computer-based TechEdge training=
course=0Afollowed by two days of hands-on labs.
################################################################
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################################################################
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################################################################
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For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or 847-509-9700 ext.312
################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 11:53:34 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: solder training
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Contact Ray Chartrant of Chartrain Consulting. His # is 817-473-9018 and
E-mail is [log in to unmask] He will travel to your facility to train.
Excellent experienced individual. Cookson electronics also offers service
at their training facility in Chicago. Their number is 800-498-2429. They
have Electrovert machines.
Jason Smith
Lexmark Electronics
Process Materials Engineer
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to
[log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Jason Smith)
bcc: Jason Smith
Subject: Re: [TN] solder training
Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Sheila,
You might want to give a company called SMT Plus a call, they give=
a
excellent course for rework operators. The company was started by a
gentleman=0Anamed Jim Blankenhorn who has been around this industry qui=
te
sometime and is=0Avery knowledgeable.
I used his services training rework operators and inspectors while=
I
was=0Aworking at another company, and it was money well spent.
SMT Plus has a web page at; www.smtplus.com. I've pasted a little =
of
the=0Atext from one of the pages at the web site below. Their phone num=
ber
is: (408)=0A438-6116
-Steve Gregory-
SMT Plus, Inc. Bringing Today's Technology To You.....
ONSITE TRAINING SEMINARS
?Design Training Courses
?SMT Manufacturing Engineering Courses
?SMT Production Training Courses
The most advanced training to keep up with the changing demands of SMT
SMT Plus has been offering training courses to the surface mount indust=
ry
for=0A12 years. Throughout those years, thousands of engineers, manager=
s,
supervisors and production workers have learned how to perform their ta=
sks
with a higher level of proficiency and efficiency. The teaching staff o=
f
SMT=0APlus comes with a strong and vast background of experience. Many =
of the
instructors currently work for companies at the leading edge and bring =
the
latest in knowledge and techniques to the classroom.
It is a simple process to setup to have the class be at your facility w=
hen
you=0Awant it.
Types of Courses
The list of courses offered is quite extensive and is designed to provi=
de
you=0Awith real world, practical solutions to everyday problems.
SMT Repair Rework With Lab
This is a two day course consisting of one day of lecture followed by a=
full=0Aday of hands-on solder training. The lecture uses the new
computer-based=0ATechEdge training course "SMT & Fine Lead Repair Rewor=
k". In
the lab, each=0Astudent will be equipped with a new soldering system an=
d
practice soldering=0Aand desoldering a wide range of SMT parts.
This class is also available on an interactive multi media CD-ROM. Labe=
led
under Tech Edge "SMT & Line Lead Repair Rework" is an advanced teaching=
tool=0Aconsisting of eight entertaining, educational and easy-to-use mo=
dules.
Basics of SMT: Training Manufacturing Personnel
A course designed for those new to SMT production. During this course, =
the
basics are presented on components, processes and sequences of assembly=
.
Troubleshooting SMT Processes & DFM
Understanding and controlling the processes are key to SMT manufacturin=
g.
In=0Athis course the cause and effect relationships are presented follo=
wed by
SPC=0Aand problem solving. An essential course to advance those familia=
r with
SMT=0Abut needing to improve.
SMT and Through-Hole Workmanship Standards-IPC Worker Proficiency Class=
B
The determination of what is good and a reject is key in a manufacturin=
g
operation. By thoroughly understanding the standards it improves effici=
ency
and consistency.
This class is also available on an interactive multi media CD-ROM. Labe=
led
under TechEdge "SMT & PTH Workmanship Standards" have a total of 196
objectives taught using virtual reality, 3D images, animations, videos =
and
full narration. Click here for more information on this course.
BGA Repair Rework
This one day class is a lecture in the first half-day followed by hands=
-on
training on the system. Equipment in your plant will be used for the
training=0Aor arrangements can be made to bring in predetermined demo
equipment.
Solder Training - Trainer Certification Course
Offered is a three-day course for certifying trainers on both SMT and P=
TH.
The=0Afirst day is a lecture using the computer-based TechEdge training=
course=0Afollowed by two days of hands-on labs.
################################################################
TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1=
.8c
################################################################
To subscribe/unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with follo=
wing
text in the body:
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To unsubscribe: SIGNOFF TechNet
################################################################
Please visit IPC web site (http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm) for addition=
al
information.
For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
847-509-9700 ext.312
################################################################
=
################################################################
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To subscribe: SUBSCRIBE TechNet <your full name>
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################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 09:01:09 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
m keel <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: m keel <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD8560.2D2B29C0"
------ =_NextPart_000_01BD8560.2D2B29C0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
this just goes to show the more you know, the more you know . . .
With the new information "only happens to the contact films, not the =
plotted films". Can you look for some residual contamination that is =
not being removed from the stable base material post processing. you =
know the way chemistry is . . . the irrestible force
----------
From: Arnold C. Escanilla
Sent: Thursday, May 21, 1998 5:25 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Photo tool stability
Hi John,
Thanks for the advise.
There have been a lot of suggestions about conditioning the photo tool =
for
24hrs after taking them out of the bag. We usually only condition them =
for
4 hours but I'll try your suggestions. Thanks!
By the way, the dimensional instability problem only happens with our
contacted films and not our plotted ones, but thanks for the input =
anyway.
Marco
----------
> From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Photo tool stability
> Date: Friday, May 22, 1998 7:46 AM
>
> Just a couple of quick Ideas without diving too deep into the =
situation.
> 1) Do you stabilize the film (open the package and "fan" it) for =
24
hrs before using in
> plotting. This should be done in the plotter area
> 2) Are your humidity and temp in the plotting room and other areas
consistent with each
> other?
> 3) Some material movement from the processor is normal (1-2 mils =
over
the sheet of film). If
> your shrinkage is constant, size at the plotting/cam station =
according.
> There are a number of other items that will also cause this, but
start simple... JOHN WAITE
>
> Marco Biagtan wrote:
>
> > Hi Guys,
> >
> > I have a problem with dimensional stability of photo tools. The =
photo
> > tools shrink after processing. I've tried increasing the drying
> > temperature (50-55C) just so it will not shrink but it still does.
This is
> > really giving me a headache. Any suggestions?
> >
> > Marco Biagtan
> > NEC-CPI Process Engineer.
> >
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847-509-9700 ext.312
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l9itmqvrral4QEPoLUNQsCBQNdRDcCNg2wuACeByhfitmiPIL8k/38pPyxqtqXnVQ3AtSNADEf5G
BbCR8DWyWpANsBbwgxH/XFADUAngJlAEkFqQNfAyoAcrkE6RjBVMSVNUUwhFUlYKhTEuOGN/x3/S
39Pv1P/Lv0wBXNFi8wTyMrAvdQCA13ahEQnwv86RwGEEEImCJjHQpkAFIPxjLgWwMvBssgqFAhBD
4HMmgF6TZXgyIYjkBuBkHnmtF9cNUXAvAFNVQkBTQ1JJQkXMxzzdZtNmjmC8ETFQZa2a1zED2Ane
00lHTk9GRv95xtHf5P/mD+cf1h9J4BdAzzSiWpG7sdACd2VCwIVhhbqBaAJAcDovL1EwtwNQciDa
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/W/5f3lEzO/N/88P/9Af0S/7LwZPB1/+X3kY11//2G/Zf9qP25/crwnO3t/f7//g++Hv4v8E/xef
GK8Zv8vr/+lf6m/rf+yJ7ZlPBe5fdiP/79/w7/H/8w/0H/UuGg8pX/8qbxpPVWgrTy4/L08rj1lS
////AQ8CHwMv0YowLze/OM//MG9ZUgofCy8MPw1LDn8Pj/8QvxHPEt9A+BSvFbssv0gP/0kfSi/L
6RuvHL8dzx7f7f//WtYh/yMPJB8lLSZ/9VlKfz9Yr1m/Sr90L+01XDJkXFF9cDM2MFwwbHcgbshc
ZjNecHMyXgGs0itTce01fe0wAGAwAAADABAQAAAAAAMAERAAAAAAQAAHMACKkKeZhb0BQAAIMACK
kKeZhb0BHgA9AAEAAAAFAAAAUkU6IAAAAAADAA00/TcAAGTS
------ =_NextPart_000_01BD8560.2D2B29C0--
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 09:02:02 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Gu, Sam" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Gu, Sam" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Solder Paste Stencils
X-To: tana <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Rudy,
I do not have your e-mail, please send me a copy to the following address:
Sam Gu
Castelle
3255-3 Scott Blvd
Santa Clara, CA 95054
Thank you,
Sam
-----Original Message-----
From: tana [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Friday, May 22, 1998 8:13 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Solder Paste Stencils
> Since we are major chemical vendors to the Solder Paste Stencil
industry, we
> have prepared a brochure on how it is done. Give me your address,
and I will
> send it to you.
>
> Wow, the stuff you can get off of TechNet!!
>
> Rudy Sedlak
> RD Chemical Company
> Mountain View CA
>
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>
>
>
Hi!
I am also interested in this information as well.
Thank you.
Dr. Tennyson Nguty, AeroMech Department, Newton Building, Salford
University
Manchester M5 4WT, UK. Tel: 0161-295 5951/4696, Fax: 0161-295
5575/5108
>>>>>> Does an object exists while you are not looking at it?
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Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 11:12:56 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Manfred Huschka <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Manfred Huschka <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR-4
X-To: Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Fred,
although I am working for a PTFE/woven glass fabric manufacturer, I can tell you that based on many years of
experience in manufacturing FR4, BT/Epoxy, Polyimide, PTFE, etc. base materials, 400 MHz is still a good
frequency for FR4 - depending on tolerances.
Some design engineers use FR4 up to more than 1 GHz, whereas other ones use PTFE/woven glass laminates from
even as low as 200 MHz on.
Regards
Manfred Huschka
Taconic
--- On Thu, 21 May 1998 08:25:09 -0700 Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Has anybody had any problems with FR-4 at 100 to 200 MHz? I have several boards from several
fabrication shops in which the signal loses amplitude above 80-100 MHz. The boards are controlled impedance
(50 Ohms) with 5 mil traces and 5 mil dielectrics. The traces are about 6.5" long.
I would appreciate any comments on this subject. The supplier of the material says that FR-4 should
be good to 400 MHz.
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---------------End of Original Message-----------------
--------------------------------------------------------
Name: Manfred Huschka
Taconic Advanced Dielectric Division, Lynn Industrial Park, Mullingar,
Co. Westmeath, Republic of Ireland
Office: PF 1275, D-51676 Wipperfuerth, Germany
Tel.: +49 2267 888004
Fax: +49 2267 888005
E-mail: Manfred Huschka <[log in to unmask]>
Web: www.taconic-add.com
Date: 05/22/98
Time: 18:17:36
This message was sent by Z-Mail Pro - from NetManage
NetManage - delivers Standards Based IntraNet Solutions
--------------------------------------------------------
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Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 09:15:36 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Ma, David" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Ma, David" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: pwb-cca : FW: [TN] IPC Specs
X-To: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>,
"[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain
I second Ralph's feeling and suggestion. We have exactly the same problem
here in Lockheed Martin Missiles and Space. Thank you Ralph.
David Ma
Materials and Processes
> ----------
> From: Dieffenbacher, William C
> Reply To: [log in to unmask]
> Sent: Thursday, May 21, 1998 1:40 PM
> To: EPI_Exploder
> Subject: pwb-cca : FW: [TN] IPC Specs
>
> Interesting commentary below. I'm sure most of us can relate to it.
>
> Bill Dieffenbacher
>
> > ----------
> > From: Kane, Joseph
> > Sent: Thursday, May 21, 1998 4:12 PM
> > To: Burke, James F; Dieffenbacher, William C
> > Subject: FW: [TN] IPC Specs
> >
> >
> >
> > ----------
> > From: Vaughan, Ralph H[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> > Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Vaughan, Ralph H
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 4:40 PM
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: [TN] IPC Specs
> >
> > Greeting,
> >
> > I will be the first to commend ipc for all the good work that they do
> > for us, but I gotta say that the practice of obsoleting specs and
> > replacing with new, renumbered documents is making me long for the old
> > mil-spec days where specs NEVER changed (I never thought I'd say that).
> > Not too long ago, after much spec comparison and analysis, we convinced
> > our government customers that it would be prudent to move from
> > Mil-P-55110 to the IPC-RB-276. In the time it took to get the new
> > drawing callout approved, re-train the pwb designers and revise their
> > guidelines, and bring our stellar board suppliers up to speed (no small
> > task), RB-276 had been superceded by the 6012 document. Now I just
> > learn today that IPC-D-275 is superceded by another document. This
> > kills efforts to streamline and standardize documentation systems.
> > Also, when these continuous changes take place, it would be convenient
> > to have a detailed side paper published explaining all the changes (and
> > maybe why the changes were made). May be a lot to ask, but it would
> > keep every user from doing it individually.
> >
> > Anyone else see this as a problem?
> >
> > That's all the whining for now.
> >
> > Ralph
> >
> > ################################################################
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> 1.8c
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> additional
> > information.
> > For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
> > 847-509-9700 ext.312
> > ################################################################
> >
> >
> ========================================================================
> Help regarding Majordomo:
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> Archives for this list:
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> ========================================================================
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 09:53:40 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Douglas Mckean <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Auspex Systems
Subject: Re: Frequency problems with FR-4
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Back when I was working for a telco company, I wrote a paper
that mathematically analyzed FR-4 to an ideal upper limit of
about 850 MHz, IIRC. We were using FR-4 to an upper channel
freq of 860 MHz for analog and an upper of 1 GHz for ECL based
digital. Now this is no absolute. I met some designers that
wouldn't take FR-4 above about 300 or 400 MHz, but that was
their situation.
Our situation with the boards for the analog 850 stuff had it's
downside. There could be a variance of anywhere from 1 to 2 dB
of signal on the same board. This all depended greatly upon the
mfr'ing processes used and that in turn all depended upon what
exactly the board houses were told by the customer in making
the boards.
I'll stick my neck out and say as with anything, if the proper
information is given and someone is willing to pay any amount
of money for quality checks, you could take FR-4 as high as
you want.
Regards, Doug
Manfred Huschka wrote:
>
> Fred,
>
> although I am working for a PTFE/woven glass fabric manufacturer, I can tell you that based on many years of
> experience in manufacturing FR4, BT/Epoxy, Polyimide, PTFE, etc. base materials, 400 MHz is still a good
> frequency for FR4 - depending on tolerances.
>
> Some design engineers use FR4 up to more than 1 GHz, whereas other ones use PTFE/woven glass laminates from
> even as low as 200 MHz on.
>
> Regards
>
> Manfred Huschka
> Taconic
>
> --- On Thu, 21 May 1998 08:25:09 -0700 Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> Has anybody had any problems with FR-4 at 100 to 200 MHz? I have several boards from several
> fabrication shops in which the signal loses amplitude above 80-100 MHz. The boards are controlled impedance
> (50 Ohms) with 5 mil traces and 5 mil dielectrics. The traces are about 6.5" long.
> I would appreciate any comments on this subject. The supplier of the material says that FR-4 should
> be good to 400 MHz.
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 13:09:11 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Crashing lead from solution
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I have a solution and I want to get lead out of it. Is there a way to
selectively crash lead from this solution?
Chris Coon
Borden Chemical
Kent, WA
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 13:14:16 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Hogue, Pat (AZ76)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Hogue, Pat (AZ76)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Via Corrosion
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Greetings from sunny Arizona:
This is my first posting to the net so bear with me a bit please.
I recently had the question posed to me "we have a concern about
the possibility of autocatalytic corrosion in vias due to residual RMA
flux activator due to tenting of one side of the vias; what corrosion
rate might we expect".
I am familiar with the term "autocatalytic corrosion" as it applies
to crevice corrosion in stainless steels exposed to aerated chloride
solution. This is where chloride ion diffuses into the crevice and is
regenerated as freshly generated metal chloride hydrolyzes to chloride
and insoluble metal hydroxide. As chloride concentration increases so
does corrosion rate. Apparently this can also occur in copper and other
metals. I don't think this is the case with via corrosion since the
chloride concentration is fixed.
My approach was to assume the activator is diethylamine
hydrochloride, which I assume hydrolyzes into hydrochloric acid. I also
assumed that the acceptance limit of 1.55 micrograms per square
centimeter NaCl equivalent (MIL-STD-2000A) was the coverage within the
via. I next assumed that the via was filled with rinse water and that
99.5% of this water evaporated. This left (fortuitously) 0.1N HCl in
the via, for which Uhlig and Revie happen to give an initial current
density for copper electrode of 2E-3 A/sq meter. I assumed this rate of
reaction remains unimpeded (i.e., no polarization) and calculated time
to penetrate 4 mils of Cu. I got about 20 years. I must admit that I
assumed NO amine-caused stress corrosion cracking and no other fast
reactions.
Does anyone have experience or alternate analytical approach?
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 12:46:35 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Hogue, Pat (AZ76)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Hogue, Pat (AZ76)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Vacuum Degassing Solder Paste
How about using a vacuum to degas solder paste? Keep the time low and
pressure high to avoid evaporating volatile ingredients though. This works
well for adhesives and sealants.
Pat Hogue
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 13:04:11 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Charles Barker <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: pwb-cca : FW: [TN] IPC Specs
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Charles Barker@I-O INC
05/22/98 01:04 PM
It is hard enough to get everyone in house to agree to a performance spec
and then....................... the reference documents change!
Bah Humbug! One step forward and slide back two. When the same base number
is used on new revisions, at least you have the choice ( if you want) of
referring to Spec. "XXX,' latest revision.
[log in to unmask] on 05/22/98 11:15:36 AM
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Charles Barker/US/I-O INC)
Subject: Re: [TN] pwb-cca : FW: [TN] IPC Specs
I second Ralph's feeling and suggestion. We have exactly the same problem
here in Lockheed Martin Missiles and Space. Thank you Ralph.
David Ma
Materials and Processes
> ----------
> From: Dieffenbacher, William C
> Reply To: [log in to unmask]
> Sent: Thursday, May 21, 1998 1:40 PM
> To: EPI_Exploder
> Subject: pwb-cca : FW: [TN] IPC Specs
>
> Interesting commentary below. I'm sure most of us can relate to it.
>
> Bill Dieffenbacher
>
> > ----------
> > From: Kane, Joseph
> > Sent: Thursday, May 21, 1998 4:12 PM
> > To: Burke, James F; Dieffenbacher, William C
> > Subject: FW: [TN] IPC Specs
> >
> >
> >
> > ----------
> > From: Vaughan, Ralph H[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> > Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Vaughan, Ralph H
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 4:40 PM
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: [TN] IPC Specs
> >
> > Greeting,
> >
> > I will be the first to commend ipc for all the good work that they do
> > for us, but I gotta say that the practice of obsoleting specs and
> > replacing with new, renumbered documents is making me long for the old
> > mil-spec days where specs NEVER changed (I never thought I'd say that).
> > Not too long ago, after much spec comparison and analysis, we convinced
> > our government customers that it would be prudent to move from
> > Mil-P-55110 to the IPC-RB-276. In the time it took to get the new
> > drawing callout approved, re-train the pwb designers and revise their
> > guidelines, and bring our stellar board suppliers up to speed (no small
> > task), RB-276 had been superceded by the 6012 document. Now I just
> > learn today that IPC-D-275 is superceded by another document. This
> > kills efforts to streamline and standardize documentation systems.
> > Also, when these continuous changes take place, it would be convenient
> > to have a detailed side paper published explaining all the changes (and
> > maybe why the changes were made). May be a lot to ask, but it would
> > keep every user from doing it individually.
> >
> > Anyone else see this as a problem?
> >
> > That's all the whining for now.
> >
> > Ralph
> >
> > ################################################################
> > TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV
> 1.8c
> > ################################################################
> > To subscribe/unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with
> > following text in the body:
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> > To unsubscribe: SIGNOFF TechNet
> > ################################################################
> > Please visit IPC web site (http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm) for
> additional
> > information.
> > For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
> > 847-509-9700 ext.312
> > ################################################################
> >
> >
> ========================================================================
> Help regarding Majordomo:
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 13:06:47 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Charles Barker <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Via Corrosion
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Charles Barker@I-O INC
05/22/98 01:06 PM
Pat,
Your question is VERY interesting. I would really like to know what answers
you get.
Hopefully, some of the gurus on here can provide additional insight.
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to
[log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Charles Barker/US/I-O INC)
Subject: [TN] Via Corrosion
Greetings from sunny Arizona:
This is my first posting to the net so bear with me a bit please.
I recently had the question posed to me "we have a concern about
the possibility of autocatalytic corrosion in vias due to residual RMA
flux activator due to tenting of one side of the vias; what corrosion
rate might we expect".
I am familiar with the term "autocatalytic corrosion" as it applies
to crevice corrosion in stainless steels exposed to aerated chloride
solution. This is where chloride ion diffuses into the crevice and is
regenerated as freshly generated metal chloride hydrolyzes to chloride
and insoluble metal hydroxide. As chloride concentration increases so
does corrosion rate. Apparently this can also occur in copper and other
metals. I don't think this is the case with via corrosion since the
chloride concentration is fixed.
My approach was to assume the activator is diethylamine
hydrochloride, which I assume hydrolyzes into hydrochloric acid. I also
assumed that the acceptance limit of 1.55 micrograms per square
centimeter NaCl equivalent (MIL-STD-2000A) was the coverage within the
via. I next assumed that the via was filled with rinse water and that
99.5% of this water evaporated. This left (fortuitously) 0.1N HCl in
the via, for which Uhlig and Revie happen to give an initial current
density for copper electrode of 2E-3 A/sq meter. I assumed this rate of
reaction remains unimpeded (i.e., no polarization) and calculated time
to penetrate 4 mils of Cu. I got about 20 years. I must admit that I
assumed NO amine-caused stress corrosion cracking and no other fast
reactions.
Does anyone have experience or alternate analytical approach?
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Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 14:05:07 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Crashing iron from solution
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I asked about lead, but I also wanted to know how to get iron out of
solution. Is it possible to selectively remove iron from a solution?
Chris Coon
Borden Chemical
Kent, WA
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Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 14:51:14 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Hogue, Pat (AZ76)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Hogue, Pat (AZ76)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Crashing iron from solution
X-To: "[log in to unmask] (IPM Return requested)"
<[log in to unmask]>
Here are a few suggestions:
1. Try adding scrap metal that is more active (see the EMF series in your old
chemistry book) than iron or lead, perhaps zinc, aluminum or magnesium to
displace these heavier (hazardous) metals from solution.
2. Try to use a chelating agent, e.g., sodium EDTA to capture ("chelate") the
metals. An Industrial water purification company like Kinetico can help.
3. Consider electrowinning (i.e., electroplating) the metals from solution
using a coulometric method (i.e., voltage varies until plating occurs, then
drops in voltage until the next metal plates out, etc.).
Pat Hogue
----------
From: [log in to unmask][SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;[log in to unmask]
Sent: Friday, May 22, 1998 11:05 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Crashing iron from solution
I asked about lead, but I also wanted to know how to get iron out of
solution. Is it possible to selectively remove iron from a solution?
Chris Coon
Borden Chemical
Kent, WA
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 17:59:23 -0400
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: john balchunas <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: john balchunas
Subject: Re: Stencil Procedural Design
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Bernard and Jim,
Here is my approach to Solder Stencil design. Feel free to use it if
the results please you too. You can also have a spreadsheet program
that I've developed to simplify the stencil design process - its in
Microsoft Excel format. If you are interested, contact me directly and
I'll E-Mail it to you. BTW, you can get additional information on
stencil design, and many other topics of interest by doing a keyword
search at the IPC E-Mail Forum for DesignerCouncil
http://jefry.ipc.org/archives/designercouncil.html and TechNet
http://jefry.ipc.org/archives/technet.html . Enjoy !
Solder Volumes:
Toe = average Terminal Width x 0.5 x average Terminal Thickness x (
average Terminal Thickness + 1.5 mils)
Sole = the lesser of ( average Terminal Width and ( Design Pad Width -
Etch Factor )) x average Terminal Length x 1.5 mils
Inner Heel = average Terminal Width x 0.215 x 2 x average Terminal
Thickness x 2 x average Terminal Thickness
Outer Heel = average Terminal Width x 0.5 x 2 x average Terminal
Thickness x ( 2 x average Terminal Thickness + 1.5 mils )
Sides = average Terminal Length x 2 x 0.5 x absolute value of ( average
Terminal Width - Design Pad Width - Etch Factor ) x 1.5 mils
Aperture Dimensions:
Aperture Width = Design Pad Width - ( Etch Factor/2 if Design Pad Width
< = 12 mils, otherwise Etch Factor/1 )
Aperture Length = ( Paste Volume/Solder Volume ) x ( 1/( (Stencil
Thickness + 1 mil ) x Aperture Width )) x ( Toe + Sole + Inner Heel +
Outer Heel + Sides )
Paste Volume/Solder Volume = 2.00 for 90% metal, 2.57 for 85% metal,
3.60 for 80% metal, 4.50 for 75% metal
John Balchunas
IPC Designer Council Member
Southern New England Chapter
> Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 11:36:22 -0400
> Reply-To: "DesignerCouncil E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
> "Walton, Jim" <[log in to unmask]>
> Sender: DesignerCouncil <[log in to unmask]>
> From: "Walton, Jim" <[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Re: Stencil Procedural Design
> X-To: "Bernard P. Domingo" <[log in to unmask]>
> Content-Type: text/plain
>
> Hello Bernard,
> I was curious to see how you are doing with the procedure. I am going to
> start one now also.
> Your Email has made me think that it is a good idea for my job too. I am
> not a process engineer I am a PCB designer. My idea is to take the
> gerber file that I create from my layout cad software and create a print
> for Incoming Quality inspectors to verify the stencil correct. But now I
> feel I need to understand and create a procedure so that the stencils
> are created consistently from board to board. Please email any
> suggestions or generic forms that I may use and as I develop mine I will
> copy you for any feedback. Maybe together we can get a good document.
>
> Jim Walton
> [log in to unmask]
> Automotive Group
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Bernard P. Domingo [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> > Sent: Monday, April 13, 1998 8:59 PM
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: [DC] Stencil Procedural Design
> >
> > Dear Sir/Madam:
> > Greetings! My name is Bernard P. Domingo, SMT Process Engineer from
> > EAI in the Philippines. I've received your catalog and Iwant to thank
> > you for all that information. In line with this, I'm going to make a
> > Project about Stencil Procedural Design, which will be our Company
> > Standard regarding Stencil Design. This will touch matters regarding
> > correct aspect ratio, snap-off distance, and pad-to-apperture
> > measurements. this project has the objective of eliminating or
> > minimizing defects such as solder balls and splashes. Your help will
> > be very much appreciated. If you could send me some information
> > regarding Stencil Procedural Design.
> >
> > Hoping for your cooperation. Thank you very much and More Power!
> >
> > Bernard P. Domingo
> > E-mail: [log in to unmask]
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 15:40:14 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Frequency Performance of FR-4
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thank you all for your inputs and thoughts on the subject of Frequency =
performance of FR-4 material. This is an interesting Discussion. Hope =
it continues.
The "problem" we were observing was that when a signal was injected =
into one end of a unterminated 50 Ohm transmission line and a scope was =
placed at the point of injection, the signal amplitude almost =
disappeared above 150 Mhz. When the "problem" was properly instrumented =
and the results properly analyzed, we concluded that the result was =
correct. The reflection at the source end of the line totally subtracts =
from the source resulting in a signal amplitude which is almost 0. If =
the probe is placed at the end of the (unterminated) transmission line =
the signal level is twice the source level. When the transmission line =
is properly terminated, the signal level is correct.
The Rise time of 175 psec was degraded to 375 psec.
Moral: =09
Use proper equipment and understand the theory before jumping to =
conclusions:
Tenative conclusion:
FR-4 is acceptable for rise times of 500 psec and frequencies up to 1 =
GHz.
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=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 09:04:15 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
X-To: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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Hi John,
Sorry guys if I misunderstood. We do have a glass base over which the
films are laid and then this is covered by a rubber covering before vacuum
and exposure.
I have always checked the film dimension after developing; I haven't really
checked the dimensions of the film after exposure since only a latent image
is seen (we're using silver halide for our contacts), but I'll try. We do
use overcoats over our films (PPF) but this is applied later during the
process.
John Waite wrote,
>
> Hi Marco,
> What Paul is referring to is if the drawer has a glass base, and the
top side has a mylar.
> It sounds like you have a "glass pac" style tooling. AT what point do
you see the "distortion".
> Is is off the diazo developer or during exposure, or after transfer of
the phototool to imaging
> area. Also, are you using a covercoat over your diazo (IE- APF,PPF,
etc). Sorry about my
> misinterpretation. I thought you were using 1st generation silvers.
JOHN WAITE
>
> Marco Biagtan wrote:
>
> > Hi Paul,
> > I'm sorry but I don't quite understand what you mean about the single
sided
> > glass exposure frame. The flexible membrane of our exposure machine
has a
> > thin glass frame on top of it as well as a thick glass frame where we
lay
> > our films. Is this the same?
> >
> > Anyway, thanks a lot for the suggestion. This is the first time I've
heard
> > of this and it might just be what I'm looking for.
> >
> > Marco Biagtan
> > NEC Components Phils. Inc.
> > Process Engineer
> >
> > Paul Gould wrote:
> >
> > > Marco,
> > > Just had another thought if it is only your contacts. If you are
using a
> > > single sided glass exposure frame with a flexible membrane over the
top,
> > > your copy film will be in contact with the membrane and will tend to
get
> > > mechanically stretched. This would result in an apparent shrinkage
after
> > > exposure. If this is a possibility, put a sheet of black card on top
of
> > > the film before closing the lid and pulling the vacuum.
> > > Hope this helps.
> > > Paul Gould
> > > [log in to unmask]
> > > Teknacron Circuits Ltd
> > > Fax: 1983 865141
> > > Tel: 1983 866531
> > >
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> > information.
> > > For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
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>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 20:03:37 -0500
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Enza Hill <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: wanted: volunteer PCB designer
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Hello Technetters!
My local SMTA chapter is having a Rework Symposium next month where we
are asking rework suppliers who are participating in a vendor day to be
prepared to rework a few specific components. Our committee thought it
would be nice if we could give each attendee a common rework board to
take around for demonstrations. I've been shopping around for low cost
alternatives from PCB houses. It would really help if I could find
someone to just lay the surface artwork out on CAD. It's nothing
fancy...4 unique component land patterns and a handful of chip lands.
Does anyone know of a fab house that might be willing to do it for cost
(or less????) - they can advertise their name on the PCB as a sponsor.
Any ideas on dummy component suppliers other than Topline? We're trying
to keep the cost as low as possible otherwise we won't be able to do it.
Can anyone help?
Thanks,
Enza
SMTA - Great Lakes Chapter president
email: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 18:15:35 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Admin Reply: Number changes to IPC Documents
X-cc: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
A recent thread of messages on TechNet discussed concerns about referencing and
obtaining superseded documents and documents with changes in their reference numbers.
The governing members of your IPC have tasked the IPC staff to provide the support
with obtaining IPC publications that the electronics industry needs. To accomplish
this end, Customer Support (under the team leadership of Jean Jones) will make every
effort to provide any current or previously published IPC document that is requested.
The first effort of Customer Service will be to advise requesters when a revision or
change has occurred which now makes the document different than what was originally
requested. If the requester is certain that they need/want an older version,
Customer Service will coordinate with the appropriate IPC department to provide a
copy of the requested document. Note that it MAY only be possible to provide black
and white copies of some older color documents.
The following information will provide a basic understanding of the numbering
changes. For several years your IPC has been involved with IEC, an international
(primarily European) standards development association. Once again, based on
direction from governing members of IPC, a decision was made to shift FROM IPC UNIQUE
document numbering and formatting schemes TO an internationally accepted schemes.
This is being phased in based on MAJOR document revisions.
As anyone involved with development of standards and specifications is aware, the
process is never easy and the bigger the scope, the harder it is to get industry
consensus on the whole document. For this reason, when complex documents enter the
revision process, they are reviewed to see if they can be broken down into sections
to facilitate development and approval.
The IPC numbering scheme was merely sequential and the actual numbers usually had no
obvious meaning. The international scheme provides four-number blocks in which the
first two numbers point to a GENERAL purpose/function. 22nn numbers refer to PWB
design. 60nn numbers refer to PWB performance. The last two digits of the block are
unique to a "family" of documents with a SPECIFIC purpose/function.
The first document in the family will always end in "0". This document will
typically be only a few pages and serves the purpose to establish and define that
specific family of documents. (This document has no value to the end user, typically
will not be published, but can be made available on request.)
The primary document in the family will end in "1" and will establish the "generic"
requirements that will apply to ALL THE OTHER DOCUMENTS IN THE FAMILY. Examples are
IPC-2221 for design requirements for all PWBs, and 6011 for performance requirements
for all PWBs. These documents will NOT CONTAIN ANYTHING UNIQUE TO ONLY ONE KIND of
PWB. None of this information will be repeated in the other documents so when it is
updated, it won't automatically require that other documents be updated also.
Other documents in the family will be unique to, in the example above, specific PWBs.
IPC-2222 is the design document for Rigid PWBs WHEN USED IN CONJUNCTION WITH
IPC-2221. IPC-6011 and IPC-6012 together provide the performance requirements for
rigid PWBs. I'm shooting from the hip now because I'm on the road and don't have the
documents handy to reference, but I think I remember that IPC-6011 and 6013 are all
that a user needs to identify the performance requirements for flex print boards.
Other family documents are in development, but the whole effort wasn't held up for
the few parts.
There is some arbitration on the part of the governing members and Dave Bergman, VP
of Technical Programs prior to the decision to renumber documents. For example,
IPC-A-600 and IPC-A-610 are in revision and will not be renumbered during this
effort; they will only increment one revision letter. The component mounting document
IPC-A-770 is becoming IPC-7070 through 7078 (7075 for BGAs, 7078 for Flip-Chip
components.) IPC-R-700C became 7711 for Rework of Electronic Assemblies (remove and
replace components) and 7721 for Repair and Modification of Printed Boards (laminate,
conductors, pads and plated through hole repair/mod.)
This got longer that I had hoped. If you have any specific questions, please reply
to me OFFNET ONLY.
Jack Crawford
Project Manager, Assembly
[log in to unmask]
(847) 509-9700 ext. 393
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=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 24 May 1998 07:55:11 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
HGross1029 <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: HGross1029 <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: BGA "Board"
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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I am trying to design a small board ( 1" x 1") which I
want to mount exactly like a real BGA would be assembled.
Could I please try to solicit information about how 30mil
balls could be attached to the board for mounting onto
a mother board.
thanx.....hg
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=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 24 May 1998 23:01:47 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Poh Kong Hui <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Poh Kong Hui <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: : Paste flux Splattering Test
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Technetters,
I would like to know, is there any standard, such as IPC, to define how to
test for solderpaste flux splattering.
Thanks.
Poh
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=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 24 May 1998 08:02:20 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Arturo J. Aguayo" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency Performance of FR-4
X-To: Fred Watt <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Hi to All,
Been following this long string of emails and just wanted to add a
comment or two from an RF/microwave point of view (which from some of
the comments I think probably already know). I also work for a high
frequency material supplier and have come across designs that use FR4 at
2 GHz and PTFE materials at 880 MHz. The case is that each application
is different and there is no set limit at which one type of material
ends and the other starts. One trend we have seen is that if the
application is digital, the switch to high performance materials is
sooner. The reason is that a square signal is made of of a series of
sine waves with a fundamental and a series of harmonics. When the
dielectric constant of a material changes vs frequency (which FR4 does),
the speed of each components is different. Faster rise times create the
need for higher level harmonics and these can start getting quite high
into the RF/microwave range (where dielectric losses are quite
critical). Hope this helps.
Art Aguayo, Technical Support Manager
Rogers Corporation
[log in to unmask]
Fred Watt wrote:
>
> Thank you all for your inputs and thoughts on the subject of Frequency performance of FR-4 material. This is an interesting Discussion. Hope it continues.
>
> The Rise time of 175 psec was degraded to 375 psec.
>
> Moral:
> Use proper equipment and understand the theory before jumping to conclusions:
>
> Tenative conclusion:
> FR-4 is acceptable for rise times of 500 psec and frequencies up to 1 GHz.
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 10:35:18 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Edwin V. Maximo" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <emaximo@[192.1.1.215]>
From: "Edwin V. Maximo" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: TAB test methods
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
I have to resend this message again because the server has told me
that this message is undelivered.
Does anyone know how a TAB device (after it has been placed in a PCB)
is tested and what methods/machines are being used.
Any information given will be appreciated.
Thanks,
Edwin Maximo
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Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 08:57:58 +0200
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"b. van zalk" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "b. van zalk" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: IPC 2222 High CTI use FR-6 CRM-5 ?
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Unclassified
Hello,
Because I didn't recieve any reply's I'm reposting this question.
I have a few questions about IPC 2222 page 11 figure 4-2.
For good electricals and high CTI, FR-6 or CRM-5 should be used.
Does CTI mean Comparitive Tracking Index and if so what is
the definition of it ?
We have never heard before about FR-6.
What kind of materials are FR-6 and CRM-5 ?
I hope sombody can help me out with these questions.
Thanks,
Bas van Zalk
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Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 17:19:23 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
KC Chan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: KC Chan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency Performance of FR-4
X-cc: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Hi all
Correct me if I am wrong.
Effective dielectric constant of a material changes vs frequency, no
matter what the dielectric is. When frequency increases, the effective
dielectric constant would get close to the material dielectric constant.
The reason why we have the effective dielectric constant is due to the
E-field trapped into the substrate.
By the way, does someone know about any news group or web sites about
Microwave or High frequency stuff.
KC Chan
IMS
> ----------
> From: Arturo J. Aguayo[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: [log in to unmask]
> Sent: Sunday, May 24, 1998 11:02 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Frequency Performance of FR-4
>
> Hi to All,
>
> Been following this long string of emails and just wanted to add a
> comment or two from an RF/microwave point of view (which from some of
> the comments I think probably already know). I also work for a high
> frequency material supplier and have come across designs that use FR4
> at
> 2 GHz and PTFE materials at 880 MHz. The case is that each application
> is different and there is no set limit at which one type of material
> ends and the other starts. One trend we have seen is that if the
> application is digital, the switch to high performance materials is
> sooner. The reason is that a square signal is made of of a series of
> sine waves with a fundamental and a series of harmonics. When the
> dielectric constant of a material changes vs frequency (which FR4
> does),
> the speed of each components is different. Faster rise times create
> the
> need for higher level harmonics and these can start getting quite high
> into the RF/microwave range (where dielectric losses are quite
> critical). Hope this helps.
>
> Art Aguayo, Technical Support Manager
> Rogers Corporation
> [log in to unmask]
>
>
> Fred Watt wrote:
> >
> > Thank you all for your inputs and thoughts on the subject of
> Frequency performance of FR-4 material. This is an interesting
> Discussion. Hope it continues.
> >
> > The Rise time of 175 psec was degraded to 375 psec.
> >
> > Moral:
> > Use proper equipment and understand the theory before
> jumping to conclusions:
> >
> > Tenative conclusion:
> > FR-4 is acceptable for rise times of 500 psec and
> frequencies up to 1 GHz.
> >
> > ################################################################
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> > For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
> 847-509-9700 ext.312
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>
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 10:39:00 +0100
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From: Anthony Morrissey <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: NMRC,Ireland
Subject: unsubscribe
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Hi all
Can somebody please tell me how to unsubscribe from technet
thanks
Anthony
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Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:01:40 +0200
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Thor-Inge Naesset <[log in to unmask]>
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Subject: subscribe
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Something went wrong last time i tried to subscribe, so here I try again !
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 09:08:50 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Deron Pirie <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Deron Pirie <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: polyimide
Mime-Version: 1.0
can anyone help me please, i have some questions concerning polyimide pcbs :-
1/ what type of inner layer oxidation is recommended / suitable for polyimide e.g. black, brown, red, reduced etc. ?
2/ what type of hole desmear is recommended / suitable for polyimide ?
3/ we have produced some trial pcbs and are getting slight hole wall pullaway - any ideas as to what might be causing this ?
best regards, deron pirie.
Deron Pirie
Irlandus Circuits Ltd.
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Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 11:12:53 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
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From: Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: HASL process
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To all TechNetters:
Can somebody tell me what is the coplanarity (flatness of pad) in the HASL
process
can we meet (4 mil, 6mil, 8 mil, more or less) ?
Thanks in advance for your help.
,,
( . . )
----------o00---O---00o----------------------------------
Nicolas van der Heyden
------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 08:49:17 -0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Thomas E. Waznis" <[log in to unmask]>
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From: "Thomas E. Waznis" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: polyimide
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
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1/ Red or reduced. If you go reduced; a little thicker to start with is
better.
2/ Permanganate needs to be stronger than for epoxy although the swell step
can probably be skipped. Check with SEMs for maximum texturing.
3/ See number 2.
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Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 11:25:06 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Khaled Hassan Fouad <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Khaled Hassan Fouad <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Printed Circuit Boards Factory
Subject: Concerning SMT board manufacturing
MIME-Version: 1.0
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We now produce single sided PCBs based on through hole technology,but we
want to go for manufacturing boards with SMD components. Is their any
special arrangements or machinery that must be used in megrating to SMD
,i.e special type of silk or flux or inks or any other material. Plz
give me any information regarding this question.
--
Khaled H. Fouad
PCB Design Engineer, R&D Department
PCB Egypt , Member of BAHGAT Group Foundation
http://www.bahgat.com
Email : [log in to unmask]
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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 00:05:59 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Graham Naisbitt <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Graham Naisbitt <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Ionic Contamination
X-cc: lcs Mixmaster Remailer <[log in to unmask]>
Andy,
I think Aric made some reasonable remarks but I would suggest that to
PERHAPS fix your problem boards, try cleaning in a pure chemistry. Suggest
Zestron, Armakleen, Kyzen although there are many others.
This should allow the aged residues to become more "washable" and you should
clean thoroughly and re-test. Are your products Class 1, 2 or 3? If 3, you
really ought to start again and wash ASAP after any soldering operation.
CSL, Robisan or Trace labs would be good contacts to review the issue in
more depth. Hope this helps.
Regards, Graham Naisbitt
__________________________________________________________________________
[log in to unmask]
Concoat Ltd
Alasan House, Albany Park
Camberley GU15 2PL UK http://www.concoat.co.uk
-----Original Message-----
From: lcs Mixmaster Remailer <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: 21 May 1998 03:25
Subject: [TN] Ionic Contamination
>Hello Technet,
>
>A supplier made us some board-assemblies with a ionic contamination at
least twice as high as the IPC and MIL-specifications allow. This is
probably due to residues from RMA solder paste. The boards are washed after
wave soldering with water/detergent, but there is no intermediate cleaning
after the reflow soldering. It takes a couple of days before the reflow
soldered boards are wave soldered, so the paste-flux is not very cleanable
anymore.I've heard so often that bad cleaning of RMA is much worse than good
cleaning or no cleaning. I'm not sure, but this is what I think is the cause
of the problem..
>
>The question : will this ionic contamination, concentrated around the
topside-smd's, really result in early failures ? The boards are built in
hermetically sealed boxes, but will be used in a wide variety of
temperatures. There are no fine-pitch devices on the boards. Any advice or
comments are welcome.
>
>Andy
>
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>
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 01:25:13 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Manfred Huschka <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Manfred Huschka <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Frequency Performance of FR-4
X-To: KC Chan <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
KC,
WWW.RFGLOBLNET.COM provides a forum specifically for the microwave industry. You can also visit the website of
PTFE base material suppliers.
Regards
Manfred Huschka
Taconic
www.taconic-add.com
--- On Mon, 25 May 1998 17:19:23 +0800 KC Chan <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Hi all
Correct me if I am wrong.
Effective dielectric constant of a material changes vs frequency, no
matter what the dielectric is. When frequency increases, the effective
dielectric constant would get close to the material dielectric constant.
The reason why we have the effective dielectric constant is due to the
E-field trapped into the substrate.
By the way, does someone know about any news group or web sites about
Microwave or High frequency stuff.
KC Chan
IMS
> ----------
> From: Arturo J. Aguayo[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: [log in to unmask]
> Sent: Sunday, May 24, 1998 11:02 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Frequency Performance of FR-4
>
> Hi to All,
>
> Been following this long string of emails and just wanted to add a
> comment or two from an RF/microwave point of view (which from some of
> the comments I think probably already know). I also work for a high
> frequency material supplier and have come across designs that use FR4
> at
> 2 GHz and PTFE materials at 880 MHz. The case is that each application
> is different and there is no set limit at which one type of material
> ends and the other starts. One trend we have seen is that if the
> application is digital, the switch to high performance materials is
> sooner. The reason is that a square signal is made of of a series of
> sine waves with a fundamental and a series of harmonics. When the
> dielectric constant of a material changes vs frequency (which FR4
> does),
> the speed of each components is different. Faster rise times create
> the
> need for higher level harmonics and these can start getting quite high
> into the RF/microwave range (where dielectric losses are quite
> critical). Hope this helps.
>
> Art Aguayo, Technical Support Manager
> Rogers Corporation
> [log in to unmask]
>
>
> Fred Watt wrote:
> >
> > Thank you all for your inputs and thoughts on the subject of
> Frequency performance of FR-4 material. This is an interesting
> Discussion. Hope it continues.
> >
> > The Rise time of 175 psec was degraded to 375 psec.
> >
> > Moral:
> > Use proper equipment and understand the theory before
> jumping to conclusions:
> >
> > Tenative conclusion:
> > FR-4 is acceptable for rise times of 500 psec and
> frequencies up to 1 GHz.
> >
> > ################################################################
> > TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using
> LISTSERV 1.8c
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> 847-509-9700 ext.312
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>
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> For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
> 847-509-9700 ext.312
> ################################################################
>
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---------------End of Original Message-----------------
--------------------------------------------------------
Name: Manfred Huschka
Taconic Advanced Dielectric Division, Lynn Industrial Park, Mullingar,
Co. Westmeath, Republic of Ireland
Office: PF 1275, D-51676 Wipperfuerth, Germany
Tel.: +49 2267 888004
Fax: +49 2267 888005
E-mail: Manfred Huschka <[log in to unmask]>
Web: www.taconic-add.com
Date: 05/25/98
Time: 13:58:06
This message was sent by Z-Mail Pro - from NetManage
NetManage - delivers Standards Based IntraNet Solutions
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 16:19:16 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Edwin V. Maximo" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <emaximo@[192.1.1.215]>
From: "Edwin V. Maximo" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: solder balls
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Can anyone tell me, would solder balls still occur when you have a
1:1 ratio between your solder mask and pad.
Any information will be appreciated.
Thanks,
Edwin Maximo
Electronic Assemblies Inc.
(632)7593884
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:58:25 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Eddie Brunker <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Eddie Brunker <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: solder balls
X-To: "Edwin V. Maximo" <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi,
The activity level of the flux in your solder paste influences the extent of
solder balling. As the activity level increases, the wetting force should
increase and the solder should have a greater attraction to the pads and to
itself. Some solder pastes tend to ball more than others. If you are using
one of the modern no-clean products which are on the edge of 10*8 ohms, (if
not under) then you should be able to get away with 1 to 1, but older
no-cleans with lower activity levels certainly require reductions. Why not
tell us what paste you are using and someone is bound to be able to tell you
straight away if you can get away with it.
Regards,
At 16:19 26/05/98 +0000, you wrote:
>Can anyone tell me, would solder balls still occur when you have a
>1:1 ratio between your solder mask and pad.
>
>Any information will be appreciated.
>
>Thanks,
>Edwin Maximo
>Electronic Assemblies Inc.
>(632)7593884
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 11:29:52 PDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ian Squires <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ian Squires <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Fwd: Re: [TN] Concerning SMT board manufacturing
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; X-MAPIextension=".TXT"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Date: Tue, 26 May 98 11:27:37 PDT
From: isquires
To: Khaled Hassan Fouad
Subject: Re: [TN] Concerning SMT board manufacturing
As an acceptable minimum you will need some new kit
Screen printer
Pick and place
reflow oven
rework equipment
if double sided boards then possibly a glue dispenser (or fingers on your=
reflow as opposed to chain)
You will also need to get your head round some new (to you)
stuff i.e.
solder paste variants and profiles
clean or no clean technology
rework and inspection standards / procedures
some of this info can be 'cadged' off possible suppliers (usually their =
reps or tech guys have relevant experience)
training will be a big MUST
Your question is very big to answer in one hit. but in short you have a =
lot of work ahead of you
If i can help break any of this down for you give me a shout.
good luck
Regards
Ian Squires
Senior Production Engineer
-------------------------------------------------------
Graseby Dynamics Ltd
Park Avenue, Bushey, Watford, Herts, WD2 2BW
Web Site: www.gradyn.co.uk
Phone: 01923-228566 xt 295
Fax: 01923-221361
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
Registered in England no. 480992
Registered office:
765 Finchley Road, London, NW11 8DS
-------------------------------------------------------
Regards
Ian Squires
Senior Production Engineer
-------------------------------------------------------
Graseby Dynamics Ltd
Park Avenue, Bushey, Watford, Herts, WD2 2BW
Web Site: www.gradyn.co.uk
Phone: 01923-228566 xt 295
Fax: 01923-221361
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
Registered in England no. 480992
Registered office:
765 Finchley Road, London, NW11 8DS
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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 18:43:57 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kelvin Ang <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kelvin Ang <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: TECOMAS (M) SDN BHD
Subject: surface mount solder joints
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Hello Technet,
1) I would like to better understand the relationship between smooth and
shinning solder
joints and reflow profile.eg: i've used different types of no-clean
solder pastes and observed differences in the solder joint
finish.Some are smooth and shinning while
others are somewhat dull and have scratchy lines on the solder
surface.i've tried to increase the soak zone dwell time but have not
been able to improve the finish.
2) can you also tell me if there will be any difference between sn63 and
ag2 % alloys
with regards to the shinning joints?
thanks.
kelvin.
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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 13:19:43 +0200
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"b. van zalk" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "b. van zalk" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: IPC 2222 High CTI use FR-6 CRM-5 ?
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Unclassified
Unclassified
Hello,
Because I didn't recieve any reply's I'm reposting this question.
I have a few questions about IPC 2222 page 11 figure 4-2.
For good electricals and high CTI, FR-6 or CRM-5 should be used.
Does CTI mean Comparitive Tracking Index and if so what is
the definition of it ?
We have never heard before about FR-6.
What kind of materials are FR-6 and CRM-5 ?
I hope sombody can help me out with these questions.
Thanks,
Bas van Zalk
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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 05:11:22 PDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Hal Winslow <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Hal Winslow <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: BGA
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Content-Type: text/plain
>I am trying to design a small board ( 1" x 1") which I
>want to mount exactly like a real BGA would be assembled.
>Could I please try to solicit information about how 30mil
>balls could be attached to the board for mounting onto
>a mother board.
>thanx.....hg
>
I would think you could treat this like you are reballing a plastic BGA.
There are fixtures (and services) that exist to accomplish this, and
many have been discussed on TechNet in the past, so you could search the
archives for "BGA Reballing". The folks that I have dealt with for this
are Rich Sentner at Singularity Electronic Systems (603) 430-6000 and
Rich Breault at Netco Automation (978) 372-7715.
It's very straightforward, and I wouldn't think you will have any
problems making the "components".
Hal Winslow
Cadent Medical Corp
______________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:00:28 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Imaging or writing
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Garth,
Laser Direct Imaging (LDI) is a term that has been applied to exposing a
photo resist directly with a laser beam - no phototool used. Etec and
Orbotech both have imagers that can do this. I understand CREO also showed
a new imager of this type.
I'm not familiar with the Direct Laser Writing, but I don't get very close
to MCM applications.
Bob Seyfert
DuPont Electronics
At 01:13 PM 5/20/98 +0000, <Gareth Jones> wrote:
>Hello,
>
>Can somebody please tell me the difference between Direct laser
>Imaging (DLI) and Direct laser writing (DLW). I am aware that DLW is used
on MCM
>programmable substrates and I assume this operation is done using a
>laser beam . Is DLI following on a similar principle except that the
>features are simply imaged onto the substrate, and how is the
>acheived if one of the advantages of LDI is that their is no
>requirement for a mask.
>
>Cheers
>Gareth
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 08:02:18 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mel Parrish <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mel Parrish <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: solder training
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Jack
Thanks for the forward
I have for all intent purposes given up reading TechNet as a normal routine. It takes more time than I have available.
I talked to her last week. It came from one of our Rockwell folks.
See ya, Mel
-----Original Message-----
From: Sheila Smith [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Friday, May 22, 1998 8:19 AM
To: [log in to unmask]; [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] solder training
TechNetters:
I'm looking for a training source to get some assemblers up to speed on J-STD-001B
soldering technique. These people presently have not official solder certifications,
but are doing soldering. I am looking for something within 150 miles of Philadelphia
& would like to get the training done ASAP. We could either send the people to the
training or have the training done in-house (suburban Phillie area). If you prefer,
please contact me directly at [log in to unmask] Thanks in advance for your
help.
Sheila Smith
Tracor Aerospace
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:21:32 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: RSedlak <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: polyimide
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 98-05-25 10:24:31 EDT, you write:
<< 1/ what type of inner layer oxidation is recommended / suitable for
polyimide e.g. black, brown, red, reduced etc. ?
>>
You can either get good peel/bond strength, which is traditionally what you
want with polyimide, OR you can get reliable oxide reduction. The two do not
go hand in hand. I have seen some fabricators doing it one way, others doing
it the other.
If you put a light red oxide on, you get great bond/peel strength, but to get
a reliable oxide reduction, you have to have a heavy oxide, read BLACK
(>0.5mg/square inch), and you do not get great bond/peel strength at this
oxide weight. And the reduction process tends to weaken the bond some also.
Can we send you literature on recommended processes for each?
Turns out that there is a patented way to increase the bond strength of an
oxide at any weight, and we own that technology.
Rudy Sedlak
RD Chemical Company
Mountain View CA
fax + 650-962-8004
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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:25:51 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Gagrani, Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Gagrani, Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: No. of layers Vs Cost
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I understand that more no. of layers would increase the cost of PCB,
but how is this function related ? Is there any formula (certainly
will have many no. of variables) which can be applied to figure
this out ?
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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 14:26:17 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Fred Johnson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Fred Johnson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: polyimide -Reply
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
1) Historically, the "red" or "brown" oxide were developed in part to use
on polyimide materials, since the very long crystalline structure of the
"black" oxide leads to fracturing because of lap shear stress induced
when the panel cools after the relatively high laminationand post-bake
temperatures used with polyimide. The only real difference between
"red" oxide and "black" oxide is in the concentrations of the caustic and
oxidizer; the actual chemicals are the same. A reduced oxide also works
just fine for polyimide, as long as you are using a reduced "red" or
"brown" oxide formulation.
2) Despite what an earlier posting has said, although permanganate
(when used in conjunction with a sweller, either a butyl-caustic or a
pyrol-type) works VERY well for conventional polyimide, the MDA-free
polyimides are not attacked very well by a permanganate process. If
etchback is required, it will be almost mandatory to use a plasma. It is
common to follow plasma with permanganate to get the surface
microroughening that plasma has difficulty in providing.
3) SEMs will be required to verify roughening of the resin. Once again,
topography will be a real challenge if using MDA-free polyimide.
Fred J.
>>> Deron Pirie <[log in to unmask]> 05/25/98 09:08am >>>
can anyone help me please, i have some questions concerning
polyimide pcbs :-
1/ what type of inner layer oxidation is recommended / suitable for
polyimide e.g. black, brown, red, reduced etc. ?
2/ what type of hole desmear is recommended / suitable for polyimide ?
3/ we have produced some trial pcbs and are getting slight hole wall
pullaway - any ideas as to what might be causing this ?
best regards, deron pirie.
Deron Pirie
Irlandus Circuits Ltd.
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 10:53:23 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: HASL alternative.Exposed copper
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To All TechNeters,
SUBJETC: HASL alternative.
We are presently analysing some alternatives to HASL. We have some
questions about the OSP alternative.
What happens to the exposed copper for the following cases if the assembly
does not go through a wave process:
- Our products can require that the same PCB allows for variations.
Variations imply that the same PCB can call for all or only components to
be assembled. When it is required to assemble a variation that excludes a
components, the stencil used in applying solder paste will "hide" the pads.
The OSP is pratically gone at the end of the process. This means that the
pads have no more protection again oxydation !
- What about the vias ?
Thanks in advance for your help.
,,
( . . )
----------o00---O---00o----------------------------------
Nicolas van der Heyden
------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:12:31 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mauricio Castro <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: No. of layers Vs Cost
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP
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The general rule of thumb is: if Double Sided is 100%, 4 layers will be 50%
more, 6 layers 25% more, 8 layers 12.5%, etc.
Example: if Double Sided PCB costs $1.00, 4 layers (same size) will cost
$1.50, 6 layers $1.875, 8 layers $2.08125, etc, etc.
This rule can be applied to standard PCB's and gives you an idea of costs.
Mauricio Castro
Molex de Mexico
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: [TN] No. of layers Vs Cost
Author: "Gagrani; Kishore" <[log in to unmask]> at INTERNET
Date: 26/5/98 9:25 AM
I understand that more no. of layers would increase the cost of PCB,
but how is this function related ? Is there any formula (certainly
will have many no. of variables) which can be applied to figure
this out ?
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 08:11:51 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Kimmey, Frank" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Kimmey, Frank" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: No. of layers Vs Cost
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
My experience has been a little different.
It seems more like if Double Sided is 100% than 4-layer is 200%, 6-layer
is 300%, 8-layer is 400%, etc.
FNK
> ----------
> From: Mauricio Castro[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;[log in to unmask]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 1998 7:12 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] No. of layers Vs Cost
>
> The general rule of thumb is: if Double Sided is 100%, 4 layers
> will be 50%
> more, 6 layers 25% more, 8 layers 12.5%, etc.
>
> Example: if Double Sided PCB costs $1.00, 4 layers (same size)
> will cost
> $1.50, 6 layers $1.875, 8 layers $2.08125, etc, etc.
>
> This rule can be applied to standard PCB's and gives you an idea
> of costs.
>
>
> Mauricio Castro
> Molex de Mexico
>
>
> ______________________________ Reply Separator
> _________________________________
> Subject: [TN] No. of layers Vs Cost
> Author: "Gagrani; Kishore" <[log in to unmask]> at
> INTERNET
> Date: 26/5/98 9:25 AM
>
>
> I understand that more no. of layers would increase the cost of PCB,
> but how is this function related ? Is there any formula (certainly
> will have many no. of variables) which can be applied to figure
> this out ?
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 10:26:54 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Marco,
If this is problem that occurs only with your contact films and not your
plotted films, then I would look first at your contact printing process.
It possible that it is rooted in your film (since this is a different film
than the plotter film), but I'd look first at the contacting process.
It is quite possible that the film is getting distorted in the exposure
step, as Paul suggested. In general, I recommend that you use a contact
frame designed for film-to-film contacting, such as those used in the
graphic arts (printing) industry. Trying to use a resist printer (which
was designed for thicker panels and larger volume air evacuation) often
results in dimensional stability problems. Also, some designs of contact
printer work better than others. Many newer designs put high emphasis on
rapid air evacuation to give short vacuum drawdown times. They do this by
various methods of applying pressure to push the air out. Some of these
can produce machanical distortion of the film at the same time. Some work
fine.
I suggest the following:
1. Be sure your contacting film is equlibrated the same way your plotting
film is.
2. Use a stiff, black, matted, plastic backup sheet behind your film when
you expose it. This will tend to protect the film from mechanical
distortions. These are available commercially in the U.S. through graphic
arts suppliers. I am uncertain about availability in Japan.
3. Use adequate drawdown time to insure complete air evacuation. One to
two minutes may be required on some contact frames. Run a test to
determine what your frame needs.
4. In order to separate size changes that occur during exposure verus
those that occur during processing, it is possible to expose a piece of
film, apply developer to the areas that contain the fiducials with a cotton
swab, then fix the fiduals by applying fixer with a cotton swab. Now turn
on the lights and carefully rinse the processed areas with another cotton
swab containing water. Allow the film to dry before measuring it.
If you still can't find the cause of your size change, send me a note
directly with the details of your process (type of contact frame, type of
film, process steps, etc.) and we'll spend some time tracking it down.
Best regards,
Bob Seyfert
DuPont Electronics
At 09:04 AM 5/23/98 +0800, you wrote:
>Hi John,
>Sorry guys if I misunderstood. We do have a glass base over which the
>films are laid and then this is covered by a rubber covering before vacuum
>and exposure.
>I have always checked the film dimension after developing; I haven't really
>checked the dimensions of the film after exposure since only a latent image
>is seen (we're using silver halide for our contacts), but I'll try. We do
>use overcoats over our films (PPF) but this is applied later during the
>process.
>
>
>John Waite wrote,
>>
>> Hi Marco,
>> What Paul is referring to is if the drawer has a glass base, and the
>top side has a mylar.
>> It sounds like you have a "glass pac" style tooling. AT what point do
>you see the "distortion".
>> Is is off the diazo developer or during exposure, or after transfer of
>the phototool to imaging
>> area. Also, are you using a covercoat over your diazo (IE- APF,PPF,
>etc). Sorry about my
>> misinterpretation. I thought you were using 1st generation silvers.
>JOHN WAITE
>
>>
>> Marco Biagtan wrote:
>>
>> > Hi Paul,
>> > I'm sorry but I don't quite understand what you mean about the single
>sided
>> > glass exposure frame. The flexible membrane of our exposure machine
>has a
>> > thin glass frame on top of it as well as a thick glass frame where we
>lay
>> > our films. Is this the same?
>> >
>> > Anyway, thanks a lot for the suggestion. This is the first time I've
>heard
>> > of this and it might just be what I'm looking for.
>> >
>> > Marco Biagtan
>> > NEC Components Phils. Inc.
>> > Process Engineer
>> >
>> > Paul Gould wrote:
>> >
>> > > Marco,
>> > > Just had another thought if it is only your contacts. If you are
>using a
>> > > single sided glass exposure frame with a flexible membrane over the
>top,
>> > > your copy film will be in contact with the membrane and will tend to
>get
>> > > mechanically stretched. This would result in an apparent shrinkage
>after
>> > > exposure. If this is a possibility, put a sheet of black card on top
>of
>> > > the film before closing the lid and pulling the vacuum.
>> > > Hope this helps.
>> > > Paul Gould
>> > > [log in to unmask]
>> > > Teknacron Circuits Ltd
>> > > Fax: 1983 865141
>> > > Tel: 1983 866531
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 11:28:42 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: No. of layers Vs Cost
X-To: "Gagrani, Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
refer to "Multichip Module Technologies and Alternatives" by Daryl Doane
and Paul Franzon for cost estimates. It's a pretty good book for
estimating.
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum."
<[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to "Gagrani,
Kishore" <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Jason Smith)
bcc: Jason Smith
Subject: [TN] No. of layers Vs Cost
I understand that more no. of layers would increase the cost of PCB,
but how is this function related ? Is there any formula (certainly
will have many no. of variables) which can be applied to figure
this out ?
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 10:50:01 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: MFG. Galvanic reactions
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi all,
I need some serious help here. I am experiencing what I believe to be a =
galvanic reaction=20
on parts Electroless gold plated at an outside source. The source =
claims that certain areas are not plating due to random residue left on =
the surface. However, after researching the problem we discovered that =
the problem is not as random as initially thought. When a non plated =
condition appears, it is an entire trace that is not plated. All pads =
and holes on that one trace do not take gold. I have only seen this =
occur in black oxide many years ago where the oxide would not cover one =
trace. I have since forgotten the mechanics of what causes this reaction =
or how we fixed it. I seem to remember it having something to do with =
silver but I just don't remember. Could someone please help?
Ed Cosper =20
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 11:42:15 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternative.Exposed copper
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Hi Nicolas!
As far as the exposed copper that results from an OSP process, there
isn't an issue as far as I know. Yes the copper will oxidize, but from the
little bit I know about metallurgy, it's my understanding is that the copper
will be coated with a layer of oxidation, and then it slows down dramatically.
For a illustration of that just think about some of the copper water lines in
old houses, the copper telephone lines exposed to the elements for years and
years...that shows that it takes quite a while for copper to deteriorate.
Somebody correct me if I'm wrong about this, but the exposed copper
problems that are defects usually have something to do with the exposed copper
being an indicator of some other problem, not the fact that the copper itself
is exposed. Oxidation of the copper is normally only a problem when trying to
solder to it...
C-ya,
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 07:46:42 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mark Simmons <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL process
X-To: Nicolas van der Heyden <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Nicolas, it's so difficult to say without seeing the specific P/N. But,
your range is huge. Is this SMT only? Mixed tech?
IXNEY ON THE SMOKE AND MIRRORS, eh? This is not brain surgery. After
all this time, why isn't there a standard pattern or series of patterns
that can be used to calibrate the process? Maybe in the form of coupon?
Once the process is verified "in control" it is easy to extrapolate and
project adjacent thickness on varying pad geometries.
To get you in the ballpark, a 25mil pitch QFP should be able to maintain
a range of; 300 micro in. plus or minus 200 micro in. So...thats half a
mil at the top of the range and 100 micro in. at the bottom.
if you need more specific info, contact me directly.
ps: I hope someone out there sees the value in standardizing this
important process. It's gonna be around for awhile.
mark
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:18:16 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bill Fabry <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re[2]: [TN] HASL alternative.Exposed copper
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Nicholas:
If today's OSP coatings are properly applied, the board can be exposed
to multiple thermal cycles without degrading the OSP to expose copper.
The other factor is to take care that the assembly NOT be washed with
an alcohol-based solvent to remove all of the coating after assembly.
A certain amount of the OSP coating is removed with each thermal
exposure (e.g. reflow, wave or hot-air rework process). However,
modern OSP coatings can withstand 4-6 thermal cycles before TRULY
exposing copper to the environment, even if the copper APPEARS to be
exposed.
With reference to vias, most assemblers do NOT fill them with solder
at SMT assembly. As long as they are NOT used for any through-hole
wire or component attachment, any oxidation developed in the hole
should not create a reliability problem for the assembly. If you are
concerned with via failure, print solder paste in them and reflow it
with the SMT components.
I agree with Steve in that the rate of copper oxidation slows down as
the thickness of oxidation increases. After initial assembly,
oxidation of unused component pads or vias should not pose a problem
for PCBA reliability. IMO, the concern about oxidation should be
focused around the addition of components after initial assembly
(ECOs, upgrades, etc.), after the oxide has had a chance to grow and
create unsolderable surfaces.
Bill Fabry
[log in to unmask]
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternative.Exposed copper
Author: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]> at INTERNET
Date: 5/26/98 11:42 AM
Hi Nicolas!
As far as the exposed copper that results from an OSP process, there
isn't an issue as far as I know. Yes the copper will oxidize, but from the
little bit I know about metallurgy, it's my understanding is that the copper
will be coated with a layer of oxidation, and then it slows down dramatically.
For a illustration of that just think about some of the copper water lines in
old houses, the copper telephone lines exposed to the elements for years and
years...that shows that it takes quite a while for copper to deteriorate.
Somebody correct me if I'm wrong about this, but the exposed copper
problems that are defects usually have something to do with the exposed copper
being an indicator of some other problem, not the fact that the copper itself
is exposed. Oxidation of the copper is normally only a problem when trying to
solder to it...
C-ya,
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:47:21 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ray Klein <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ray Klein <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Frequency Performance of FR-4
X-To: "[log in to unmask]"@class.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi KC Chan
I believe 'effective dielectric constant' is also a function of where a
trace is in a PWB layer. The closer to the surface the trace is the more
the dieletric of air (1.0) is effective in the propagation of signals.
Traces burried between two ground planes "see" the dieletric of the FR-4
material only. IPC-2141 has a nice discussion of this as well as dieletric
constants of various PWB materials (including FR-4) as a function of
frequency and the formulas to compute effective dieletric constant for
various PWB configurations.
Ray Klein
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 08:47:04 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Starenas <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: BGA
MIME-Version: 1.0
Try talking to EPIC Technologies in Woburn MA ( Jim Kohl 932-7870 ). They do
chip packaging / MCMs / FLIP CHIPS etc where they manufacture a circuit board
using an additive process on top of the chip die with a top layer of flexible
plated bumps rather then solder bumps ( requiring no under-fill on Flip Chips
), either gold or copper plated which you solder onto boards using standard
SMT processes. They do approx. 1 mil lines / spaces / and vias giving you the
density to minimize the layer counts. Give them a try, they may be able to
help you out with the board design and manufacture.
Paul Starenas
SCI Systems
>I am trying to design a small board ( 1" x 1") which I
>want to mount exactly like a real BGA would be assembled.
>Could I please try to solicit information about how 30mil
>balls could be attached to the board for mounting onto
>a mother board.
>thanx.....hg
>
I would think you could treat this like you are reballing a plastic BGA.
There are fixtures (and services) that exist to accomplish this, and
many have been discussed on TechNet in the past, so you could search the
archives for "BGA Reballing". The folks that I have dealt with for this
are Rich Sentner at Singularity Electronic Systems (603) 430-6000 and
Rich Breault at Netco Automation (978) 372-7715.
It's very straightforward, and I wouldn't think you will have any
problems making the "components".
Hal Winslow
Cadent Medical Corp
______________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 12:37:34 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Reflow Atmosphere
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
All,
We are just getting into volume SMT production and I have a=20
couple of questions about the benefits of a nitrogen reflow.
1) Is there a suggested SMT pitch that almost necessitates=20
the use of nitrogen (i.e. 20 mil does fine without but 16=20
mil needs it...)?
2) If we are using 100% mil-std finish parts, boards, and=20
RMA flux solder paste, are the benefits as great as if we=20
were using commercial parts, boards, and a no-clean flux=20
solder paste?
3) One of our customers claims that it increases the life=20
of the assembly by eliminating/reducing void formation=20
within the solder connection. Any insight into this?
We are in process of qualifying our SMT equipment, materials=20
and processes. Any suggestions, insight, or lessons learned=20
would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you all in advance of your help!!
Steve McBride
[log in to unmask]
(405) 624-5281
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 14:03:18 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Terranova <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Terranova <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: [TN] HASL alternative.Exposed copper
X-To: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
From my past dealings with OSPs (its been a number of years), I found
the same as stated below. However, I also found it was really tough to
tell if the OSP was present or not after multiple exposures. I'd be
interested to know exactly how this is tested. Either way, I don't think
it really mattered much whether the OSP was present. People felt better
thinking it was. Exposed copper was more of a cosmetic or perception
condition than a reliability concern. The hardest thing is convincing
folks that exposed copper is OK. Remember that this is old information
and certain situations or conditions may prove this wrong for certain
applications.
Regards,
Paul Terranova
Analytical and Environmental Test Services Lab
Digital Equipment Corporation
200 Forest Street
Mail Stop: MRO3-1/D2
Marlboro, MA 01752-3085
' Phone: (508)467-3109
* Fax: (508)467-6796
* Email: [log in to unmask]
WebSite: http://www.digital.com/lab-services
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Fabry [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 1998 12:18 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Re[2]: [TN] HASL
alternative.Exposed copper
Nicholas:
If today's OSP coatings are properly applied, the
board can be exposed
to multiple thermal cycles without degrading the
OSP to expose copper.
The other factor is to take care that the assembly
NOT be washed with
an alcohol-based solvent to remove all of the
coating after assembly.
A certain amount of the OSP coating is removed with
each thermal
exposure (e.g. reflow, wave or hot-air rework
process). However,
modern OSP coatings can withstand 4-6 thermal
cycles before TRULY
exposing copper to the environment, even if the
copper APPEARS to be
exposed.
With reference to vias, most assemblers do NOT fill
them with solder
at SMT assembly. As long as they are NOT used for
any through-hole
wire or component attachment, any oxidation
developed in the hole
should not create a reliability problem for the
assembly. If you are
concerned with via failure, print solder paste in
them and reflow it
with the SMT components.
I agree with Steve in that the rate of copper
oxidation slows down as
the thickness of oxidation increases. After
initial assembly,
oxidation of unused component pads or vias should
not pose a problem
for PCBA reliability. IMO, the concern about
oxidation should be
focused around the addition of components after
initial assembly
(ECOs, upgrades, etc.), after the oxide has had a
chance to grow and
create unsolderable surfaces.
Bill Fabry
[log in to unmask]
______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________
Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternative.Exposed copper
Author: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]> at
INTERNET
Date: 5/26/98 11:42 AM
Hi Nicolas!
As far as the exposed copper that results from an
OSP process, there
isn't an issue as far as I know. Yes the copper will
oxidize, but from the
little bit I know about metallurgy, it's my
understanding is that the copper
will be coated with a layer of oxidation, and then it
slows down dramatically.
For a illustration of that just think about some of the
copper water lines in
old houses, the copper telephone lines exposed to the
elements for years and
years...that shows that it takes quite a while for
copper to deteriorate.
Somebody correct me if I'm wrong about this, but
the exposed copper
problems that are defects usually have something to do
with the exposed copper
being an indicator of some other problem, not the fact
that the copper itself
is exposed. Oxidation of the copper is normally only a
problem when trying to
solder to it...
C-ya,
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 11:27:55 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Debbie Kenney <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Debbie Kenney <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Coplanarity for chip assembly
> As a manufacturer of flex circuits, pad coplanarity has become a
> major issue for us when our customers assemble the chip onto the flex.
> We are in dire need of information on sources and equipment available
> that can measure coplanarity of copper pads. Is laser or optical
> better?
>
> Any help and / or ideas are greatly appreciated.
>
> Debbie Kenney
> Disk Drive Division
> M-Flex
> [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 14:44:50 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Nelson, John" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Nelson, John" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Coplanarity for chip assembly
X-To: Debbie Kenney <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
I suggest you contact Cyber Optics in Minneapolis.
They have a line of laser profilometers with sub-micron resolution.
Cyber Optics Corp
5900 Golden Hills Drive
Minneapolis, MN 55416
1-800-746-6315
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Debbie Kenney [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 1998 2:28 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Coplanarity for chip assembly
>
> > As a manufacturer of flex circuits, pad coplanarity has become a
> > major issue for us when our customers assemble the chip onto the
> flex.
> > We are in dire need of information on sources and equipment
> available
> > that can measure coplanarity of copper pads. Is laser or optical
> > better?
> >
> > Any help and / or ideas are greatly appreciated.
> >
> > Debbie Kenney
> > Disk Drive Division
> > M-Flex
> > [log in to unmask]
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 14:55:34 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Lenny Kurup <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Lenny Kurup <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternative.Exposed copper
X-To: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Hi All,
The issue of exposed copper, and subsequent oxidation, for an electronic
application, is very important, not only from a joint defect point of view
but, also from a trace conductor viewpoint. A typical trace and/or pad is
built with a design for a minimum conduction amount, both heat and
electrical characteristics are calculated based on a thickness of
copper. Alter the copper thickness and/or purity, by oxidation for
instance, and you alter the characteristics of the circuit, which may lead
to subsequent field failures.
LK
On Tue, 26 May 1998, SteveZeva wrote:
> Hi Nicolas!
>
> As far as the exposed copper that results from an OSP process, there
> isn't an issue as far as I know. Yes the copper will oxidize, but from the
> little bit I know about metallurgy, it's my understanding is that the copper
> will be coated with a layer of oxidation, and then it slows down dramatically.
> For a illustration of that just think about some of the copper water lines in
> old houses, the copper telephone lines exposed to the elements for years and
> years...that shows that it takes quite a while for copper to deteriorate.
>
> Somebody correct me if I'm wrong about this, but the exposed copper
> problems that are defects usually have something to do with the exposed copper
> being an indicator of some other problem, not the fact that the copper itself
> is exposed. Oxidation of the copper is normally only a problem when trying to
> solder to it...
>
> C-ya,
>
> -Steve Gregory-
>
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>
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 13:56:15 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Lisa Williams <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Lisa Williams <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: IPC-RB-276
X-cc: [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask],
[log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
IPC will sell you a copy of IPC-RB-276. It will be marked "OBSOLETE" on all of the
pages, but you will be able to see the requirements. We sell it at the same old
price.
Lisa Williams
IPC
2215 Sanders Road
Northbrook, IL 60062
URL: www.ipc.org
>>> Byrns Nancy <[log in to unmask]> 05/19/98 11:58AM >>>
Hi everyone
I would like to know if someone have a copy of IPC-RB-276. It's
impossible to got a copy from IPC because this document is supersedes.
We are currently working with IPC-D-275 and we need to have a copy of
IPC-RB-276.
Look in your archive maybe you will find it.
Thanks you
Nancy Byrns
Oerlikon Aerospace
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 14:33:56 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Modular Components National, Inc." <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Modular Components National, Inc." <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Liquid Photo Image Soldermask
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To All
We are using RONASCREEN OPSR 5600 HARDENER & RONASCREEN 5600
OPSR 5600 CODE 2D-AU SOLDERMASK. The problem that we are having is after we
screen the board and tack cure the board at 160 F for 30 min. We then
expose the board then develop the board. Upon inspection of the board on
the developed areas we have found small little areas of soldermask all over
them if we try to develope them again they will not come off. Has anyone
come across this before if so, how did you fix it?
Last thing the the areas have Tin Lead on them.
THANK FOR ANY IMPUT
SAL MITICHI
Modular Components National, Inc.
2302 Industry Court
Forest Hill, MD 2150
PH (410) 879-6553
Fax (410) 838-7629
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################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 15:14:53 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Alex Neussendorfer <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Alex Neussendorfer <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Coplanarity for chip assembly
X-To: Debbie Kenney <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Check out ELECTRONIC PACKAGING SERVICES LTD CO.
430 Tenth Street Suite S-003A
Atlanta GA 30318
tel (404) 881-1114
They use a grating and laser light to show interference patterns to show
out-of-flat areas.
----------
> From: Debbie Kenney <[log in to unmask]>
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Coplanarity for chip assembly
> Date: Tuesday, May 26, 1998 1:27 PM
>
> > As a manufacturer of flex circuits, pad coplanarity has become a
> > major issue for us when our customers assemble the chip onto the flex.
> > We are in dire need of information on sources and equipment available
> > that can measure coplanarity of copper pads. Is laser or optical
> > better?
> >
> > Any help and / or ideas are greatly appreciated.
> >
> > Debbie Kenney
> > Disk Drive Division
> > M-Flex
> > [log in to unmask]
>
> ################################################################
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> ################################################################
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 14:54:51 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kim Vu <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kim Vu <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: PCB Designer with Allegro wanted
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear members,
Our clients are looking for several Senior PCB Designers with Allegro
experience.
Location: San Jose, CA
Position: Permanent with full benefits, stock options and 401K plan
Pay = DOE/Negotiable
Please give me a call at 408-245-1400 or fax at 408-245-5268 or email
[log in to unmask] if
you're interested or know of anyone who is.
Thanks.
Kim Vu
ACTIVE Staffing
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 16:36:47 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Dick Desrosiers <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Dick Desrosiers <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Marco at NEC-CPI wrote
----- Begin Included Message -----
Hi Guys,
I have a problem with dimensional stability of photo tools. The photo
tools shrink after processing. I've tried increasing the drying
temperature (50-55C) just so it will not shrink but it still does. This is
really giving me a headache. Any suggestions?
Marco Biagtan
NEC-CPI Process Engineer
------End Included Message---------------
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The problem with silver halide film is it's dimensional stability to humidity
changes. Silver film specs quote dimensional stability to be .012% per deg RH
change over 24 inches, whereas the thermal coefficient is .0009% per deg F for
7 mil film.
The solution is to switch to a dry process system using dry plot film which has a thermal coefficient of .00085% per deg F for 4 mil film and a humidity
coefficient of .0009% per deg RH.
Dick Desrosiers
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:29:17 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Brian Geijsbeek <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Stencil Blades and Solder Balls
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
TechNet,
I am having trouble with solder balls dinging metal squegee blades on the second
pass of some double-sided boards. The solder balls usually form due to vias on
the first pass. Is there any good, quick method for a stencil print operator to
assure that there are no solder balls on a board before it is printed, so the
blades will remain in good condition. Would performing a wipe of the board with
an alcohol wipe effect the quality of the print? Thank you in advance for any
suggestions that you might have.
Sincerely,
Brian Geijsbeek
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:03:40 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Stencil Blades and Solder Balls
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
In a message dated 5/26/98 5:41:52 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[log in to unmask] writes:
>>TechNet,
I am having trouble with solder balls dinging metal squegee blades on the
second
pass of some double-sided boards. The solder balls usually form due to vias
on
the first pass. Is there any good, quick method for a stencil print operator
to
assure that there are no solder balls on a board before it is printed, so the
blades will remain in good condition. Would performing a wipe of the board
with
an alcohol wipe effect the quality of the print? Thank you in advance for
any
suggestions that you might have.
Sincerely,
Brian Geijsbeek<<
Hello there Brian,
Okay...here ya' go, first, get some 80-grit sandpaper, then use a lotta
elbow grease, and sand them pesky balls offa the board!! What's that? Whaddya
mean no way? Awwwww......you're no fun!!
Seriously, it sounds to me like you do got one heck of a solderball
problem if it's bad enough for them to ding a stainless steel metal squeegee.
It also sounds to me like the fab shop that built these boards for you did
something that's causing the solder balls from the via's.
I'm guessing now because you didn't actually mention it, but did they
HASL the board and then go back and tent the via's? Because if that's what's
happened, there's no way your going to get all the balls off...what's
happening is that the plating is reflowing beneath the mask and then out
gassing thru a break in the via tent and giving you the little balls that
you're seeing... some of them are going to be bonded to the anular pads, and
others are just adhered to the mask. The ones that are bonded to any metal are
the ones that are tough to remove.
But moreover, what I would be concerned about is not just the solderball
problem you're seeing, (because it sounds to me like you're building product
with these fabs) but what's going on inside that little cavity that's been
somewhat enclosed by soldermask...is there any flux or flux residues trapped
in there? Something to worry about...
You know, I've only seen this sort of thing happen when they've put mask
plugs on both sides of the board tenting the via's...that's not necessary,
only one side of the board needs to be tented (if it's being done for
improving vacuum at ICT).
C-ya!
-Steve Gregory-
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 21:17:36 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Don Vischulis <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Don Vischulis <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Liquid Photo Image Soldermask
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Sal:
In addition to my experience, I've heard reports from others that LPI locks onto residual tin. I
can't claim that this applies to all masks, but improving the tin strip operation helped
significantly. The only rework is to strip the mask, strip the tin, and start over. I'm
evaluating a possible rework method but haven't had time to perform the tests. Check with Lea
Ronal's tech service to confirm that their resist locks onto residual tin.
Don Vischulis
QA Manager
ITO Industries
[log in to unmask]
Modular Components National, Inc. wrote:
> To All
> We are using RONASCREEN OPSR 5600 HARDENER & RONASCREEN 5600
> OPSR 5600 CODE 2D-AU SOLDERMASK. The problem that we are having is after we
> screen the board and tack cure the board at 160 F for 30 min. We then
> expose the board then develop the board. Upon inspection of the board on
> the developed areas we have found small little areas of soldermask all over
> them if we try to develope them again they will not come off. Has anyone
> come across this before if so, how did you fix it?
> Last thing the the areas have Tin Lead on them.
>
> THANK FOR ANY IMPUT
> SAL MITICHI
> Modular Components National, Inc.
> 2302 Industry Court
> Forest Hill, MD 2150
> PH (410) 879-6553
> Fax (410) 838-7629
>
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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 21:11:32 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Michael Carano <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Michael Carano <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: ec
Subject: Re: HASL alternative.Exposed copper
X-To: SteveZeva <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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SteveZeva wrote:
>
> Hi Nicolas!
>
> As far as the exposed copper that results from an OSP process, there
> isn't an issue as far as I know. Yes the copper will oxidize, but from the
> little bit I know about metallurgy, it's my understanding is that the copper
> will be coated with a layer of oxidation, and then it slows down dramatically.
> For a illustration of that just think about some of the copper water lines in
> old houses, the copper telephone lines exposed to the elements for years and
> years...that shows that it takes quite a while for copper to deteriorate.
>
> Somebody correct me if I'm wrong about this, but the exposed copper
> problems that are defects usually have something to do with the exposed copper
> being an indicator of some other problem, not the fact that the copper itself
> is exposed. Oxidation of the copper is normally only a problem when trying to
> solder to it...
>
> C-ya,
>
> -Steve Gregory-
>
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> For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or 847-509-9700 ext.312
> ################################################################Hi Nicolas,
I have come across this question of the exposed copper with respect to
OSP's. While solder paste spreading will vary from paste to paste and OSP
to OSP, no one has ever(to my knowledge) determined that the exposed
copper caused a long term reliability problem. Maybe Jack Crawford at
the IPC can help with this one.
Best regards,
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=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:51:21 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Engineering / Design Dept." <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Mission Peak Services
Subject: HELP
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Hi:
I have been very polite so far and I have asked to be removed off all
forums (lists) with IPC with no success. According to the server Iam no
longer on the distribution list but I continue to receive all TechNet
messages.
PPLEASE, ONCE AGAIN, SIGN ME OFF. THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG WITH YOUR
SERVER SOFTWARE.
--
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:37:14 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Eltek Ltd. - Process Engineering" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternative.Exposed copper
X-To: Lenny Kurup <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi LK ,
I think You are dealing with microelectronics and not with PCB . On " normal
" PCB there are some variations in tracks thickness ( due to plating
processes ) and widthness ( due to etching process ) in terms of several
microns .
Corrosion on exposed copper at edges of soldered pads is completly neglible
compared to mentioned above .
At 14:55 26/05/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Hi All,
>
>The issue of exposed copper, and subsequent oxidation, for an electronic
>application, is very important, not only from a joint defect point of view
>but, also from a trace conductor viewpoint. A typical trace and/or pad is
>built with a design for a minimum conduction amount, both heat and
>electrical characteristics are calculated based on a thickness of
>copper. Alter the copper thickness and/or purity, by oxidation for
>instance, and you alter the characteristics of the circuit, which may lead
>to subsequent field failures.
>
>LK
>
>On Tue, 26 May 1998, SteveZeva wrote:
>
>> Hi Nicolas!
>>
>> As far as the exposed copper that results from an OSP process, there
>> isn't an issue as far as I know. Yes the copper will oxidize, but from the
>> little bit I know about metallurgy, it's my understanding is that the copper
>> will be coated with a layer of oxidation, and then it slows down
dramatically.
>> For a illustration of that just think about some of the copper water lines in
>> old houses, the copper telephone lines exposed to the elements for years and
>> years...that shows that it takes quite a while for copper to deteriorate.
>>
>> Somebody correct me if I'm wrong about this, but the exposed copper
>> problems that are defects usually have something to do with the exposed
copper
>> being an indicator of some other problem, not the fact that the copper itself
>> is exposed. Oxidation of the copper is normally only a problem when trying to
>> solder to it...
>>
>> C-ya,
>>
>> -Steve Gregory-
>>
>> ################################################################
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following text in the body:
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>> Please visit IPC web site (http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm) for additional
information.
>> For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
847-509-9700 ext.312
>> ################################################################
>>
>>
>
>################################################################
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information.
>For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
847-509-9700 ext.312
>################################################################
>
>
Edward Szpruch
Eltek Ltd - Israel
Tel 972 3 9395050
Fax 972 3 9309581
E-mail : [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:02:13 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kelvin Ang <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kelvin Ang <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: TECOMAS (M) SDN BHD
Subject: Re: surface mount solder joints
MIME-Version: 1.0
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> Hello Technet,
> 1) I would like to better understand the relationship between smooth
> and
> shinning solder
> joints and reflow profile.eg: i've used different types of
> no-clean
> solder pastes and observed differences in the solder joint
> finish.Some are smooth and shinning while
> others are somewhat dull and have scratchy lines on the solder
> surface.i've tried to increase the soak zone dwell time but have not
> been able to improve the finish.
>
> 2) can you also tell me if there will be any difference between sn63
> and
> ag2 % alloys
> with regards to the shinning joints?
> thanks.
> kelvin.
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:26:34 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Motoyo Wajima <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Motoyo Wajima <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: No. of layers Vs Cost
X-To: "Kimmey, Frank" <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-2022-jp
Japan Taiwan
Double Sided 100 100
4-Layers 165 - 185 170 - 180
6-Layers 320 - 370 300 - 320
8-Layers 460 - 520 400 - 460
Through Type (without BVH,IVH)
Regards,
Motoyo Wajima,General Purpose Computer Division,Hitachi,Ltd.(Japan)
Kimmey, Frank $B$5$s$O=q$-$^$7$? (B:
>My experience has been a little different.
>It seems more like if Double Sided is 100% than 4-layer is 200%, 6-layer
>is 300%, 8-layer is 400%, etc.
>FNK
>> ----------
>> From: Mauricio Castro[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;[log in to unmask]
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 1998 7:12 AM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [TN] No. of layers Vs Cost
>>
>> The general rule of thumb is: if Double Sided is 100%, 4 layers
>> will be 50%
>> more, 6 layers 25% more, 8 layers 12.5%, etc.
>>
>> Example: if Double Sided PCB costs $1.00, 4 layers (same size)
>> will cost
>> $1.50, 6 layers $1.875, 8 layers $2.08125, etc, etc.
>>
>> This rule can be applied to standard PCB's and gives you an idea
>> of costs.
>>
>>
>> Mauricio Castro
>> Molex de Mexico
>>
>>
>> ______________________________ Reply Separator
>> _________________________________
>> Subject: [TN] No. of layers Vs Cost
>> Author: "Gagrani; Kishore" <[log in to unmask]> at
>> INTERNET
>> Date: 26/5/98 9:25 AM
>>
>>
>> I understand that more no. of layers would increase the cost of PCB,
>> but how is this function related ? Is there any formula (certainly
>> will have many no. of variables) which can be applied to figure
>> this out ?
>>
>> ################################################################
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>> additional
>> information.
>> For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
>> 847-509-9700
>> ext.312
>> ################################################################
>>
>> ################################################################
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>> 847-509-9700 ext.312
>> ################################################################
>>
>
>################################################################
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>################################################################
>
>
***********************************************
Motoyo Wajima
General Purpose Computer Division,Hitachi,Ltd.
1 Horiyamashita
Hadano-shi,Kanagawa-ken,259-13 Japan
E-mail:[log in to unmask]
Fax:+81-463-88-2935
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:43:21 +0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"S.K. INTERNATIONAL" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "S.K. INTERNATIONAL" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: import graphic
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Dear Sir,
We are very much interested in import of graphic lamination film in rolls
in bulk quantity.
We are also interested in paper / film connected to Decorative / Color
copiers / Inkjet / Laser / Digital / Printing / Converters / Stickers /
Labels / Lamination / Gifts etc. etc.
We request you to please quote your best export prices in roll form and
oblige.
Thanking you
Awaiting your early reply.
Best regards
Kamlesh Shah
S K International
81 Mint Road, Fort
Bombay 400001
India
Ph 2693257/ 2694821
Fax (9122) 2618849
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:49:12 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Bobby R. Mangona" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <bmangona@[192.1.1.215]>
From: "Bobby R. Mangona" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Insufficient Solder
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Can any one tell me the possible causes of an insufficient solder
found after reflow process.
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 08:44:16 +0200
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "[log in to unmask]"
<[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Ericsson Radio Systems AB Kumla
Subject: Re: MFG. Galvanic reactions
X-To: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Ed Cosper wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> I need some serious help here. I am experiencing what I believe to be a galvanic reaction
>
>
> Ed Cosper
>
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> ################################################################
Hi Ed!
I have come across this problem a couple of times. Some people seems
to believe that certain patterns on a PCB will result in this defect
due to a galvanic reaction. I however believe that this problem lies in
the activation step prior to nickel.It is enough if a single palladium
atom is attached on a trace, then everything in contact with this trace
will be nickel plated. If no palladium is attached, yes, then nothing
in the closed circuit will be plated.The reason why the activation step
fails can have it`s reasons. One is if soldermask residues is present.
And another is that the immersion time is to short. I might be wrong
stating this, it`s just a theory.
Regards
Peter Fogelqvist
Ericsson Circuits
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 03:54:51 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
TheITMTeam <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: TheITMTeam <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: surface mount solder joints
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Hi Kelvin -
There are a number of things that can affect the shininess of the joint.
Most of the time, in my experience, shininess of the joint is related to grain
structure - the finer the grain structure of the joint the shinier the
appearance and, accordingly, the grainier the joint, the duller the joint.
Finer grain growth can be promoted by quicker cooling of the joint,
particularly once you are past the solidus temperature (183 C in 63/37 and 179
C in 2% Ag). This is accomplished with the cooling modules on the reflow
equipment. Some machines, particularly older or lesser expensive models are
only equipped with fans on the off-load and these are blowing ambient temp air
on the board. Cooling modules incorporate heat exchanger systems and blow
cooled air on the board, directly after reflow and thus expedite cooling. Be
careful not to cool too rapidly - generally I suggest keeping your speed limit
during cooling the same as you used during heating. If you heat at a max of 4
deg. C per second, you should cool no faster than -4 deg. C per sec.
Regards,
Phil Zarrow
ITM, Inc.
Durham, NH USA
www.ITM-SMT.com
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:01:14 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Martin Farrell <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Martin Farrell <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: MFG. Galvanic reactions
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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I seen this problem a couple of years ago whilst using an Atotech E.Ni/ I.Au
plating line (apologies to Atotech). However, rather than the galvanic effect
mentioned, the problem was found to be occuring due to 2 factors, firstly when
the palladium catalyst was made up, palldium was added directly to D.I. water
rather than adding the sulphuric acid first. This affected solubility of the
palladium. The second factor was that the concentration of the nickel dipped to
below 70% at times when the E.Ni bath would be frantic. I hope this helps.
Martin Farrell (Chemist),
GEC-Marconi Avionics,
Edinburgh.
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 04:59:30 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Tomscimeca <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Tomscimeca <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Technet
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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I would like to subscripe to the Technet. Please e-mail me on directions for
subscribing. Thank you.
Sincerely,
Tom Scimeca
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 05:34:26 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Colin <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Colin <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Liquid Photo Image Soldermask
X-To: "Modular Components National, Inc." <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Sal,
First thing to do, would be to check your phototools, especially if you are
using Daizo films, and check the density. try another pass through the
ammonia developer, and darken it up. Next thing would be to check the
exposure time - are you over exposing?...a step wedge should clear this up,
and figures for the Lea Ronal effective step should be found in the data
sheet. Then try the concentrate on the developing solution...typical
concentration should be around 1-1.5%, and also do a Ph check.
At 14:33 26/05/98 -0400, you wrote:
> To All
> We are using RONASCREEN OPSR 5600 HARDENER & RONASCREEN 5600
>OPSR 5600 CODE 2D-AU SOLDERMASK. The problem that we are having is after we
>screen the board and tack cure the board at 160 F for 30 min. We then
>expose the board then develop the board. Upon inspection of the board on
>the developed areas we have found small little areas of soldermask all over
>them if we try to develope them again they will not come off. Has anyone
>come across this before if so, how did you fix it?
>Last thing the the areas have Tin Lead on them.
>
>
>
>THANK FOR ANY IMPUT
> SAL MITICHI
>Modular Components National, Inc.
>2302 Industry Court
>Forest Hill, MD 2150
>PH (410) 879-6553
>Fax (410) 838-7629
>
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:33:32 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
ECI TEC <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: ECI TEC <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Technet
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Tom
Ceck IPC home page:
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:56:47 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Stephen Ayotte <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Stephen Ayotte <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: PC Fab Question
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
I have a coworker who has asked me the following question:
"As a function of the number of times that a part is handled is there any type
of model or tool that can be used to predict the amount of handling damage and
or contamination that would occur."
This would be for a typical factory environment and for equipment and
inspection operators, not in a clean room environment with lab coats, masks and
gloves.
Thanks.
Stephen Ayotte, IMD Product Quality Engineer
Phone (607) 755-1537, t/l 855-1537
Pager (607) 755-7243 Pin #863 - external, 5-8888 Pin 2863 - internal
Fax (607) 755-4649
Stephen Ayotte
IMD Product Quality Engineer. Laminate Chip Carriers
Dept. 5QE, Bldg. 14-3, Office BB11
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:21:57 GMT
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Peter Swanson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Help
X-cc: [log in to unmask]
In message <[log in to unmask]> [log in to unmask] writes:
> Can anyone help me locate an Epoxy, RTV or other, that when cured is
> semi rigid, with an excellent bond strength to glass. (A one part system
> is preferred).
>
> Thanks for any/all your assistance ahead of time
>
> Jean Connick
> Tel: 714-996-1248 x 299
> Fax: 714-961-7836
> E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
Jean,
I would consider using a light curing system for glass bonding, as it is fast
and single part. Semi rigid versions available, with excellent bond stengths to
glass. Try Dymax Corp (CT) or Loctite.
Peter
--
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Peter Swanson Oxfordshire, England
INTERTRONICS
[log in to unmask] http://www.cygnetuk.demon.co.uk
Suppliers of materials and consumables to the electronics & related industries
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 08:22:03 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
TOSTEVIN_BC <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: TOSTEVIN_BC <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re[2]: [TN] Help
X-To: Peter Swanson <[log in to unmask]>
I do not know what your application is, but something that meets your
expressed criteria (semi-rigid, excellent bond strength to glass, one
part system), are many of the commercially available adhesives
formulated specifically to mount mirrors to walls.
Bruce Tostevin
Benchmark Electronics
Hudson, NH
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: [TN] Help
Author: Peter Swanson <[log in to unmask]> at 0UTG0ING
Date: 5/27/98 12:21 PM
In message <[log in to unmask]>
[log in to unmask] writes:
> Can anyone help me locate an Epoxy, RTV or other, that when cured is
> semi rigid, with an excellent bond strength to glass. (A one part system
> is preferred).
>
> Thanks for any/all your assistance ahead of time
>
> Jean Connick
> Tel: 714-996-1248 x 299
> Fax: 714-961-7836
> E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
Jean,
I would consider using a light curing system for glass bonding, as it is fast
and single part. Semi rigid versions available, with excellent bond stengths to
glass. Try Dymax Corp (CT) or Loctite.
Peter
--
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Peter Swanson Oxfordshire, England
INTERTRONICS
[log in to unmask] http://www.cygnetuk.demon.co.uk
Suppliers of materials and consumables to the electronics & related industries
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:57:43 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Starenas <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: BGA
MIME-Version: 1.0
Try talking to EPIC Technologies in Woburn MA ( Jim Kohl 932-7870 ). They do
chip packaging / MCMs / FLIP CHIPS etc where they manufacture a circuit board
using an additive process on top of the chip die with a top layer of flexible
plated bumps rather then solder bumps ( requiring no under-fill on Flip Chips
), either gold or copper plated which you solder onto boards using standard
SMT processes. They do approx. 1 mil lines / spaces / and vias giving you the
density to minimize the layer counts. Give them a try, they may be able to
help you out with the board design and manufacture.
>I am trying to design a small board ( 1" x 1") which I
>want to mount exactly like a real BGA would be assembled.
>Could I please try to solicit information about how 30mil
>balls could be attached to the board for mounting onto
>a mother board.
>thanx.....hg
>
I would think you could treat this like you are reballing a plastic BGA.
There are fixtures (and services) that exist to accomplish this, and
many have been discussed on TechNet in the past, so you could search the
archives for "BGA Reballing". The folks that I have dealt with for this
are Rich Sentner at Singularity Electronic Systems (603) 430-6000 and
Rich Breault at Netco Automation (978) 372-7715.
It's very straightforward, and I wouldn't think you will have any
problems making the "components".
Hal Winslow
Cadent Medical Corp
______________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:39:07 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Meschter, Stephan J" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Meschter, Stephan J" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: BGA Type Solder Sphere Deoxidation
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain
Hi,
This is my first technet request. I have been reading the net correspondence
with interest over the last month. I think that some of the processing
associated with BGA spheres may be relavent to my problem.
I am working on my PhD research project which is exploring the melting and
spreading behavior of an initially solid solder sphere placed on copper
substrates held at an elevated temperature in a gaseous formic acid/nitrogen
environment. I have been working mostly with tin and 63Sn/37Pb solder and am
now trying solder spheres with higher lead content. The sphere sizes that I
am using are between 25 and 35 mils in diameter. I found that with the tin
and tin-lead eutectic that some pretreatment of the spheres yield more
consistent melting/spreading behavior. To pretreat my spheres, I place 20-30
spheres in a 50 ml beaker with an RMA flux at 110-120C for 10 minutes
followed by a series of rinses to get the flux off. Since the flux did not
go up to the solder reflow temperature it is fairly easy to get off. First
the spheres are rinsed in 3 successively cleaner isopropyl alcohol baths at
50-60C (total time 20 minutes) then are put in a final rinse of 30-40C
methanol for 10 minutes followed by blowdrying with nitrogen.
When I pretreat the high lead content spheres using this method, I see the
spheres darkening as I rinse them...especially when I get to the methanol.
The resulting melting and spreading of these spheres is non-uniform. When I
melt them, it appears that they have an oxide skin on them. I am continuing
to tinker with the rinse process times and solvents to see if I can get a
combination that works. I the mean time, I was wondering if anyone out there
had any ideas.
I am looking for a sphere pretreatment scheme that will eliminate the oxide
skin and not have any residues on the sphere surface. The process should
not cause preferential etching of the tin or the lead on the sphere surface.
PS...A while back, as I was developing the my sphere pretreatment process, I
tried using a commercial solder brightener product followed by a DI water
rinse on the 63Sn/37Pb spheres and it didn't really provide the consistency
I had hoped for. I was going to try this again with the high lead content
spheres.
Thanks in advance for any help that you can offer.
Steph
*********************************************************
Stephan Meschter [log in to unmask]
Lockheed Martin Control Systems Phone :(607)770-2332
600 Main Street, MD R52F FAX :(607)770-2056
Johnson City, NY 13790-1888 MARCALL: 8 * 255-2332
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:49:48 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Meschter, Stephan J" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Meschter, Stephan J" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternative.Exposed copper
X-To: Michael Carano <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain
Hi,
Copper Oxide may not be as big a problem as Copper chlorides especially if a
bias voltage is applied and some liquid moisture is present. You would need
to evaluate the susceptibilty of your assembly to salt and moisture. This
is probably only a concern if you are in a harsh environment. You can try a
real easy experiment by putting a 5-10V bias between two adjacent copper
conductors and place a drop of salt between them and let it sit for a while
and watch what happens.
Steph
*********************************************************
Stephan Meschter [log in to unmask]
Lockheed Martin Control Systems Phone :(607)770-2332
600 Main Street, MD R52F FAX :(607)770-2056
Johnson City, NY 13790-1888 MARCALL: 8 * 255-2332
*********************************************************
> ----------
> From: Michael Carano[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Michael Carano
> Sent: Wednesday, May 27, 1998 12:11 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternative.Exposed copper
>
> SteveZeva wrote:
> >
> > Hi Nicolas!
> >
> > As far as the exposed copper that results from an OSP process,
> there
> > isn't an issue as far as I know. Yes the copper will oxidize, but from
> the
> > little bit I know about metallurgy, it's my understanding is that the
> copper
> > will be coated with a layer of oxidation, and then it slows down
> dramatically.
> > For a illustration of that just think about some of the copper water
> lines in
> > old houses, the copper telephone lines exposed to the elements for years
> and
> > years...that shows that it takes quite a while for copper to
> deteriorate.
> >
> > Somebody correct me if I'm wrong about this, but the exposed copper
> > problems that are defects usually have something to do with the exposed
> copper
> > being an indicator of some other problem, not the fact that the copper
> itself
> > is exposed. Oxidation of the copper is normally only a problem when
> trying to
> > solder to it...
> >
> > C-ya,
> >
> > -Steve Gregory-
> >
> > ################################################################
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> additional information.
> > For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
> 847-509-9700 ext.312
> > ################################################################Hi
> Nicolas,
> I have come across this question of the exposed copper with respect to
> OSP's. While solder paste spreading will vary from paste to paste and OSP
> to OSP, no one has ever(to my knowledge) determined that the exposed
> copper caused a long term reliability problem. Maybe Jack Crawford at
> the IPC can help with this one.
>
> Best regards,
>
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> 847-509-9700 ext.312
> ################################################################
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:05:17 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Thexton, Duane" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Thexton, Duane" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Defect Calculations
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
I am aware the IPC started a working group to develop industry standards
for defect calcuations (PPM, DPMO, etc.). I haven't heard much about
this group since then. Is it still functional? What is the status of
an industry standard?
Please reply via e-mail, or by telephone at 626-812-1894.
Thanks,
Duane Thexton
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:32:36 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Reflow Atmosphere
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Steve:
Send me your fax number and I will fax "Nitrogen for Flow and Reflow
Soldering?" by Armin Rahn, Rahn-Tec Consultants. He wrote this last year
for the SMTA newsletter.
Regards,
-David
At 12:37 PM 5/26/98 -0600, you wrote:
>All,
>
>We are just getting into volume SMT production and I have a
>couple of questions about the benefits of a nitrogen reflow.
>
>1) Is there a suggested SMT pitch that almost necessitates
>the use of nitrogen (i.e. 20 mil does fine without but 16
>mil needs it...)?
>
>2) If we are using 100% mil-std finish parts, boards, and
>RMA flux solder paste, are the benefits as great as if we
>were using commercial parts, boards, and a no-clean flux
>solder paste?
>
>3) One of our customers claims that it increases the life
>of the assembly by eliminating/reducing void formation
>within the solder connection. Any insight into this?
>
>
>We are in process of qualifying our SMT equipment, materials
>and processes. Any suggestions, insight, or lessons learned
>would be greatly appreciated.
>
>Thank you all in advance of your help!!
>
>Steve McBride
>[log in to unmask]
>(405) 624-5281
>
>################################################################
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847-509-9700 ext.312
>################################################################
>
>
David Gonnerman
Director of Publications
Plan now to attend:
Surface Mount International (San Jose, CA; 8/23-8/27)
Electronics Assembly Expo (Providence, RI; 10/24-10/29)
SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
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in surface mount and companion technologies
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:28:20 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Operator <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Operator <[log in to unmask]>
test
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:35:30 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Robert E. Mesick" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Robert E. Mesick" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Crashing Iron and Lead
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
From: [log in to unmask][SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;[log in to unmask]
Sent: Friday, May 22, 1998 11:05 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Crashing iron from solution
I asked about lead, but I also wanted to know how to get iron out of
solution. Is it possible to selectively remove iron from a solution?
Chris Coon
Borden Chemical
Kent, WA
Chris,
You can remove lead by precipitation at a pH of above 8.5. A little Sodium
Sulfide will remove any remaining lead to meet limits.
Iron can be remove selectively from some solutions, for example, chrome
plating solutions are purified using a cation resin. A lot depends on the
valence of the iron and the other ions in solution.
Best Regards,
Bob Mesick
Remco Engineering
Water and Wastewater Treatment Systems
www.remco.com
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:54:32 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: assist with removal of [log in to unmask] from forum lists
X-To: [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Yes, sir or madam, you have been very polite in your several requests. However, you
have not yet told us your name or given us a phone number to contact you so we can
help to remove you. The e-mail address on the message you send us always comes in
"[log in to unmask]" and I've replyed to this in the past requesting more info, but
I haven't received anything from you.
Apparently the subscriptions were originally "ordered" from a different e-mail
address, maybe even a different domain name which is now an alias pointing to your
current address.
Please forward or reply to any forum message you have just received. IMPORTANT!! Go
to your "To:" field and REMOVE ALL THE ADDRESSES THAT ARE THERE. Then add
[log in to unmask] and include a note that this is the forum(s) you wish to be removed
from. We should be able to read the header info and find your user address so it can
be deleted. Contact me OFFNET if you have further questions. Jack Crawford,
[log in to unmask], (847) 509-9700 ext 393
>>> "Engineering / Design Dept." <[log in to unmask]> 05/26/98 09:51PM >>>
Hi:
I have been very polite so far and I have asked to be removed off all
forums (lists) with IPC with no success. According to the server Iam no
longer on the distribution list but I continue to receive all TechNet
messages.
PPLEASE, ONCE AGAIN, SIGN ME OFF. THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG WITH YOUR
SERVER SOFTWARE.
--
******************************
Mission Peak Services
Engineering Department
Visit us at:
http://www.missionpeak.com
******************************
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:12:41 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternatives
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I have seen a lot traffic on different alternatives to HASL. Most seem =
to refer to various OSPs or some form of precious metal. However, I =
would like to offer a different approach.
Several years ago I worked with a pcb supplier who was requested to =
supply parts with a bare copper finish. No protective coating at all. =
The last operation in house was to clean the surface, rinse with DI, dry =
and then parts where immediately packaged in groups of 10 and vacuum =
sealed. We placed a strip of gray anti-oxidation paper from 3M in the =
package before sealing. According to our customer, it was easier for =
them to open a package of 10, and clean before fluxing with a mild =
sulfuric than it was to fight coplanarity issues of the solder. They had =
tried an OSP but found it to inconsistent. This practice spread to two =
other customers before I had left that supplier. I haven't found anyone =
else even remotely interested in that practice since but apparently it =
worked for at least 3 customers for over a year without any reported =
issues. I'm not sure if it is still being used but I thought I'd share =
that experience with the net.=20
Thanks,
Ed Cosper
Graphic Electronics Inc.
Tulsa, OK
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:54:22 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: BGA Test Fisture Formula's
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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All,
I luckely found some calculations for determining pin deflection, hole
diameter, pin length, hold (yes HOLD) diameter, etc. for Testing Fine
pitch devices (.010", .012") and BGAs.
Is anyone familiar with these formulas?
HSmin = SD + PT (tanO)
0 = sin-1 (Pd/Pl)
HSmin = (SD + PT)(PD/PL)
LEGEND
HSmin - min hold diameter
SD - shaft diameter
PT - plating thickness
0 - angle of deflection
PD - pin deflection
PL - pin length
Can I use these formulas to determine if testability is feasible, for
a very high dense assembly {4 - 600 I/O BGAs with 30 - .020" pitch
devices (160-pin nominal) in a 9 x 7 form factor}. I feel I am
missing several pieces to the overall formula picture. Can someone
advise where I can obtain the rest of the equation.
John Gulley
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:57:13 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bill Davis <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bill Davis <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL alternative.Exposed copper
X-To: Michael Carano <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Nicolas-
A lot of the exposed copper fears date back to military usage, when the exposed Cu was subjected to a wide variety of environs. Today, as a matter of practice, we have exposed copper on IC leads, especially when they are plated as opposed to dipped. I would ask myself, what would happen in extreme usage of the application-that is, if you're building boards for use in a PC desktop, the interior is not generally exposed to airborne acids or extremes in temperatures. Alternatively, if your application is for use in waste water treatment plants where all kinds of airborne contaminants exist, then one may be rightly concerned.
As a matter of pragmatic thinking, we, as an industry, need to get used to exposed copper. The IC industry is quickly moving to copper interconnects on their products, and only hermetic packages can guarantee no exposed copper...
Regards,
Bill
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Michael Carano [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 1998 9:12 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] HASL alternative.Exposed copper
>
> SteveZeva wrote:
> >
> > Hi Nicolas!
> >
> > As far as the exposed copper that results from an OSP process, there
> > isn't an issue as far as I know. Yes the copper will oxidize, but from the
> > little bit I know about metallurgy, it's my understanding is that the copper
> > will be coated with a layer of oxidation, and then it slows down dramatically.
> > For a illustration of that just think about some of the copper water lines in
> > old houses, the copper telephone lines exposed to the elements for years and
> > years...that shows that it takes quite a while for copper to deteriorate.
> >
> > Somebody correct me if I'm wrong about this, but the exposed copper
> > problems that are defects usually have something to do with the exposed copper
> > being an indicator of some other problem, not the fact that the copper itself
> > is exposed. Oxidation of the copper is normally only a problem when trying to
> > solder to it...
> >
> > C-ya,
> >
> > -Steve Gregory-
> >
> > ################################################################
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> > For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or 847-509-9700 ext.312
> > ################################################################Hi Nicolas,
> I have come across this question of the exposed copper with respect to
> OSP's. While solder paste spreading will vary from paste to paste and OSP
> to OSP, no one has ever(to my knowledge) determined that the exposed
> copper caused a long term reliability problem. Maybe Jack Crawford at
> the IPC can help with this one.
>
> Best regards,
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 08:13:45 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mike Barmuta <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Liquid Photo Image Soldermask
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Sal: If I'm reading your post correctly this is showing up on a Sn/Pb
board not SMOBC. If that is the case and you are using mechanical screening such
as a DP10 which applies higher squeegee pressures than hand screening, then what
your seeing is not unusual.Take a close look at the residual soldermask and see
if it has a dot pattern and spacing the same as the mesh in your screen printer.
I have seen this on LPI's from many different suppliers. The mask forms a
"compression bond" to the surface of the Sn/Pb when screened and will not
release during development. We worked with our suppler in the formulation and
formulation processing steps to solve the problem.
Regards
Michael Barmuta
Staff Engineer
Fluke Corp.
Everett Wa
425-356-6076
On Tue, 26 May 1998 11:33:56 -0700 Modular Components National, Inc. wrote:
> From: Modular Components National, Inc. <[log in to unmask]>
> Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 11:33:56 -0700
> Subject: [TN] Liquid Photo Image Soldermask
> To: [log in to unmask]
>
> To All
> We are using RONASCREEN OPSR 5600 HARDENER & RONASCREEN 5600
> OPSR 5600 CODE 2D-AU SOLDERMASK. The problem that we are having is after we
> screen the board and tack cure the board at 160 F for 30 min. We then
> expose the board then develop the board. Upon inspection of the board on
> the developed areas we have found small little areas of soldermask all over
> them if we try to develope them again they will not come off. Has anyone
> come across this before if so, how did you fix it?
> Last thing the the areas have Tin Lead on them.
>
>
>
> THANK FOR ANY IMPUT
> SAL MITICHI
> Modular Components National, Inc.
> 2302 Industry Court
> Forest Hill, MD 2150
> PH (410) 879-6553
> Fax (410) 838-7629
>
> ################################################################
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> For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
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> ################################################################
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 08:03:56 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bill Davis <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bill Davis <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Insufficient Solder
X-To: "Bobby R. Mangona" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Hi Bobby:
I'm fighting the same thing. Insights can be found in toward very interesting articles in the SMT magazine (May, 1997, page 44, The Complete Solder Paste Printing Process, by Richard S. Clouthier, and January, 1998, page 68, Stencil Adhesive Deposition, by Steve Breed). In general everything during the deposition process, squeegee type, pressure, speed, as well as solder paste type, mesh screen size, pad size and stencil size, can affect the acutal amount of solder left behind after the squeegee pass.
Check these articles, especially the first one.
Regards,
Dr. Bill
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bobby R. Mangona [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 27, 1998 6:49 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Insufficient Solder
>
> Can any one tell me the possible causes of an insufficient solder
> found after reflow process.
>
> ################################################################
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> ################################################################
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 08:24:04 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bill Davis <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bill Davis <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Reflow Atmosphere
X-To: David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Dave-
Can you shoot me a copy too? 4Fax: 408-321-4549
thx,
Dr. Bill Davis
> -----Original Message-----
> From: David Gonnerman [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 27, 1998 7:33 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Reflow Atmosphere
>
> Hi Steve:
>
> Send me your fax number and I will fax "Nitrogen for Flow and Reflow
> Soldering?" by Armin Rahn, Rahn-Tec Consultants. He wrote this last year
> for the SMTA newsletter.
>
> Regards,
>
> -David
>
>
> At 12:37 PM 5/26/98 -0600, you wrote:
> >All,
> >
> >We are just getting into volume SMT production and I have a
> >couple of questions about the benefits of a nitrogen reflow.
> >
> >1) Is there a suggested SMT pitch that almost necessitates
> >the use of nitrogen (i.e. 20 mil does fine without but 16
> >mil needs it...)?
> >
> >2) If we are using 100% mil-std finish parts, boards, and
> >RMA flux solder paste, are the benefits as great as if we
> >were using commercial parts, boards, and a no-clean flux
> >solder paste?
> >
> >3) One of our customers claims that it increases the life
> >of the assembly by eliminating/reducing void formation
> >within the solder connection. Any insight into this?
> >
> >
> >We are in process of qualifying our SMT equipment, materials
> >and processes. Any suggestions, insight, or lessons learned
> >would be greatly appreciated.
> >
> >Thank you all in advance of your help!!
> >
> >Steve McBride
> >[log in to unmask]
> >(405) 624-5281
> >
> >################################################################
> >TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8c
> >################################################################
> >To subscribe/unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with
> following text in the body:
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> >################################################################
> >Please visit IPC web site (http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm) for additional
> information.
> >For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
> 847-509-9700 ext.312
> >################################################################
> >
> >
>
> David Gonnerman
> Director of Publications
>
> Plan now to attend:
> Surface Mount International (San Jose, CA; 8/23-8/27)
> Electronics Assembly Expo (Providence, RI; 10/24-10/29)
>
> SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
> Enabling members to achieve success
> in surface mount and companion technologies
> through education, training and access to knowledge.
>
> 5200 Willson Road, Suite 215, Edina, MN 55424-1343
> 612-920-7682 F 612-926-1819
> [log in to unmask] www.smta.org
>
> ################################################################
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> ################################################################
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:44:07 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
William Casey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: William Casey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: BGA Type Solder Sphere Deoxidation
Stephan,
This topic sounds like it would make an extremely interesting thesis.
The cleaning processes you have briefly described would more likely
induce oxidation rather than remove it from the spherical surface. When
you have a non-uniform sphere geometry after liquidus, it is most likely
due to the oxidation concentration on the sphere or pad surface.
However, if the spheres are not melted in an inert atmosphere the oxide
skin may perpetuate your problems.
One of the techniques that I use, and it has been extremely successful,
is the use of a plasma cleaning process. There are a number of small
reaction chambers on the market. I currently use a March Px1000 system
for all development work. There are also hundreds of oxide reducing
recipes already in existence however, you may just want to spend some
time developing a custom recipe which will best fit your requirements.
The following is an example recipe that I have had good results with:
Gas 02
Pressure 90 mtorr
Power 359 watts
Process time 3 min
Gas Flow rate 536 sccm
Gas Ar
Pressure 150 mtorr
Power 250 watts
Process time 2 min
Gas Flow rate 100 sccm
Remember that argon etches organic and oxygen cleans organic. With the
argon etch atoms are elevated to a higher energy state which with
physically displace organic molecules or atoms. Weight loss of the
63/37 may be as high as 0.62E-12 grams per mm2. With the oxygen atom
will undergo an oxidation-reduction reaction converting surface organics
to water and CO2. There is basically no mass (other than the organic)
lost during this process.
The trick with your application will be limiting the sputtering effect
caused by large molecule inert gasses such as argon, while producing the
cleaning effect necessary.
William Casey
MCMS
Research & Development
Direct: (208) 898-1042
Fax: (208) 898-2740
[log in to unmask]
>----------
>From: Meschter, Stephan J[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>Sent: Wednesday,May 27,1998 7:39 AM
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: [TN] BGA Type Solder Sphere Deoxidation
>
>Hi,
>This is my first technet request. I have been reading the net correspondence
>with interest over the last month. I think that some of the processing
>associated with BGA spheres may be relavent to my problem.
>
>I am working on my PhD research project which is exploring the melting and
>spreading behavior of an initially solid solder sphere placed on copper
>substrates held at an elevated temperature in a gaseous formic acid/nitrogen
>environment. I have been working mostly with tin and 63Sn/37Pb solder and am
>now trying solder spheres with higher lead content. The sphere sizes that I
>am using are between 25 and 35 mils in diameter. I found that with the tin
>and tin-lead eutectic that some pretreatment of the spheres yield more
>consistent melting/spreading behavior. To pretreat my spheres, I place 20-30
>spheres in a 50 ml beaker with an RMA flux at 110-120C for 10 minutes
>followed by a series of rinses to get the flux off. Since the flux did not
>go up to the solder reflow temperature it is fairly easy to get off. First
>the spheres are rinsed in 3 successively cleaner isopropyl alcohol baths at
>50-60C (total time 20 minutes) then are put in a final rinse of 30-40C
>methanol for 10 minutes followed by blowdrying with nitrogen.
>
>When I pretreat the high lead content spheres using this method, I see the
>spheres darkening as I rinse them...especially when I get to the methanol.
>The resulting melting and spreading of these spheres is non-uniform. When I
>melt them, it appears that they have an oxide skin on them. I am continuing
>to tinker with the rinse process times and solvents to see if I can get a
>combination that works. I the mean time, I was wondering if anyone out there
>had any ideas.
>
>I am looking for a sphere pretreatment scheme that will eliminate the oxide
>skin and not have any residues on the sphere surface. The process should
>not cause preferential etching of the tin or the lead on the sphere surface.
>
>PS...A while back, as I was developing the my sphere pretreatment process, I
>tried using a commercial solder brightener product followed by a DI water
>rinse on the 63Sn/37Pb spheres and it didn't really provide the consistency
>I had hoped for. I was going to try this again with the high lead content
>spheres.
>
>Thanks in advance for any help that you can offer.
>
>Steph
>
>*********************************************************
>Stephan Meschter [log in to unmask]
>Lockheed Martin Control Systems Phone :(607)770-2332
>600 Main Street, MD R52F FAX :(607)770-2056
>Johnson City, NY 13790-1888 MARCALL: 8 * 255-2332
>*********************************************************
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:56:15 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Manual Soldering Iron Round Robin Testing, Call for Participation
X-cc: [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask],
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Manual Soldering Iron Round Robin Testing, Call for Participation
IPC Task Group 5-22c (Manual Soldering Task Group) will be conducting a Round Robin
on proposed Test Methods 2.5.33 series (Measurement of Electrical Overstress from
Soldering Hand Tools) in support of ANSI/J-STD-001. The round robin will be conducted
at the EMPF <website - http://empf.arl.psu.edu/ > in Indianapolis Indiana, on July
28th with July 29th scheduled as an additional day if needed.
This round robin test program is designed to determine the validity, accuracy, ease
of use, and repeatability of a set of proposed test methods to support
ANSI/J-Std-001B (Appendix A). The proposed test methods are designated as follows:
--2.5.33 Measurement of Electrical Overstress from Soldering Hand Tools
--2.5.33.1 Measurement of Electrical Overstress from Soldering Hand Tools - Ground
Measurements
--2.5.33.2 Measurement of Electrical Overstress from Soldering Hand Tools - Transient
Measurements
--2.5.33.3 Measurement of Electrical Overstress from Soldering Hand Tools - Current
Leakage Measurements
--2.5.33.4 Measurement of Electrical Overstress from Soldering Hand Tools - Shielded
Enclosure
End users are encouraged to participate in the round robin as both active
participants and official observers. Copies of the proposed Test Methods and the
Round Robin test plan are available from Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]> (847)
509-9700 x-393. Interested parties needing additional information should call Jack
or Task Group chairman Dave Robertson <[log in to unmask]> (908) 245-6200.
Active participants are invited to bring their own test equipment (per the test plan)
including any fabricated test boxes or screen boxes. It is mandatory that all
participants register with Jack Crawford at the IPC not later than July 22nd.
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:42:24 CDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ashraf Ezzat <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: energy per sq mt production of pcb
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Please remove the address from your mailing list.
Thank You.
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:09:47 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Call for Supplier Participation in Manual Soldering Iron Round
Robin Testing
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Call for Supplier Participation in Manual Soldering Iron Round Robin Testing
IPC Task Group 5-22c (Manual Soldering Task Group) will be conducting a Round Robin
on proposed Test Methods 2.5.33 series (Measurement of Electrical Overstress from
Soldering Hand Tools) in support of ANSI/J-STD-001. The round robin will be conducted
at the EMPF <website - http://empf.arl.psu.edu/ > Indianapolis Indiana, on July 28th
with July 29th scheduled as an additional day if needed. July 27th has been
designated as a day for equipment set-up and for suppliers to evaluate and test the
as-received condition of supplied equipment. As of May 15th the following soldering
equipment suppliers have agreed to supply equipment for the round robin:
Hexacon Electric Company
OK International
PACE Incorporated
Other interested suppliers are invited to participate by supplying equipment and to
participate in the test method evaluation. Copies of the Test Methods and Round
Robin test plan are available from Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]> (847) 509-9700
x-393. Interested parties needing additional information should call Jack or Task
Group chairman Dave Robertson <[log in to unmask]> (908) 245-6200.
Registered suppliers providing equipment need to ship their items to arrive at the
EMPF between July 15 - July 24. Ship all equipment to:
Mr. Jon Wiener (317) 655-3673 x-106
Attn: IPC Round Robin
EMPF
714 N. Senate Ave.
Indianapolis, IN 46202-3112
Jack Crawford, IPC Project Manger - Assembly
2215 Sanders Road, Northbrook IL 60062-6135
[log in to unmask] http://www.ipc.org
847-509-9700 x 393
fax 847-509-9798
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:18:38 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Reflow Atmosphere
X-To: Bill Davis <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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dave....shoot me a copy as well, if you don't mind. My fax no. is 606
232-5696. I'm having reflow probs
Jason Smith
Lexmark Electronics
Process Materials Engineer
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:20:24 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Greg Kilinski <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Greg Kilinski <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Wave Soldering with Sn10
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Does anyone have experience wave soldering with Sn10/Pb90 solder? My
concern is the plastic (non-eutectic) melting range of 268-302 C
(514-576 F), which may cause sluggish solder flow. Are there any other
areas of concern?
Thanks in advance.
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 18:45:12 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
COLIN LEYDEN <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: COLIN LEYDEN <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Holis Wave Soldering Machine
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Hi Folks,
I am interested in spare parts for Hollis Wave Soldering Equipment,
the MKIII in particular.
Can anyone recommend or even supply a name - address of a supplier
retailer?
Help would be very much appreciated.
Best Regards,
Colin Leyden
Senior Engineer
Polaroid (UK) Ltd.
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:30:36 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Wave Soldering with Sn10
X-To: Greg Kilinski <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
The problems I see is that you have to overheat the solder to get a good
flow. The actual temps, you have to experience from what I know.
Jason
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum."
<[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to Greg
Kilinski <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Jason Smith)
bcc: Jason Smith
Subject: [TN] Wave Soldering with Sn10
Does anyone have experience wave soldering with Sn10/Pb90 solder?
My
concern is the plastic (non-eutectic) melting range of 268-302 C
(514-576 F), which may cause sluggish solder flow. Are there any
other
areas of concern?
Thanks in advance.
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:27:45 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Richard Tassone <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Richard Tassone <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Testel Systems Corporation
Subject: QRe: [TN] BGA Test Fisture Formula's
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
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John,
I recommend you get your hands on a catalog from IDI. Page 102 has a thorough description of
pointing accuracy calculation, including examples. IdI's address is 5101 Richland Ave., Kansas
City, KS 66106. 913-342-5544
Richard
[log in to unmask]
[log in to unmask] wrote:
> All,
>
> I luckely found some calculations for determining pin deflection, hole
> diameter, pin length, hold (yes HOLD) diameter, etc. for Testing Fine
> pitch devices (.010", .012") and BGAs.
>
> Is anyone familiar with these formulas?
>
> HSmin = SD + PT (tanO)
>
> 0 = sin-1 (Pd/Pl)
>
> HSmin = (SD + PT)(PD/PL)
>
> LEGEND
>
> HSmin - min hold diameter
> SD - shaft diameter
> PT - plating thickness
> 0 - angle of deflection
> PD - pin deflection
> PL - pin length
>
> Can I use these formulas to determine if testability is feasible, for
> a very high dense assembly {4 - 600 I/O BGAs with 30 - .020" pitch
> devices (160-pin nominal) in a 9 x 7 form factor}. I feel I am
> missing several pieces to the overall formula picture. Can someone
> advise where I can obtain the rest of the equation.
>
> John Gulley
>
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org: Testel Systems Corporation
adr;dom: 268 North Lincoln Avenue;;Suite 1;Corona;CA;91720;
email;internet: [log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:36:27 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Holis Wave Soldering Machine
X-To: COLIN LEYDEN <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Electrovert Inc. bought out Hollis. They're number is 573-346-3341. I
have an old hollis machine that I'm stripping out now and getting ready to
sell. If you would have written this message a couple of days before I
committed to giving them the spare parts, you could have gotten a good deal
on them.
Jason
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum."
<[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to COLIN
LEYDEN <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Jason Smith)
bcc: Jason Smith
Subject: [TN] Holis Wave Soldering Machine
Hi Folks,
I am interested in spare parts for Hollis Wave Soldering Equipment,
the MKIII in particular.
Can anyone recommend or even supply a name - address of a supplier
retailer?
Help would be very much appreciated.
Best Regards,
Colin Leyden
Senior Engineer
Polaroid (UK) Ltd.
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:23:17 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Richard Tassone <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Richard Tassone <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Testel Systems Corporation
Subject: Re: BGA Test Fisture Formula's
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
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John:
We do a lot of fine pitch testing for flex circuits, MCM's, Ceramic, etc., to about 0.008". We
use a spring probe that's about 0.735" in length and has a plunger with a diameter of 0.006". We
couldn't find them on the market so we have them made for us.
After you calculate pointing accuracy of the probe itself, you must consider other error factors
as well. The concentricity of the probe to the receptacle, and the receptacle to mounting hole
will impact probing accuracy.
Regards,
John Alesi
[log in to unmask] wrote:
> All,
>
> I luckely found some calculations for determining pin deflection, hole
> diameter, pin length, hold (yes HOLD) diameter, etc. for Testing Fine
> pitch devices (.010", .012") and BGAs.
>
> Is anyone familiar with these formulas?
>
> HSmin = SD + PT (tanO)
>
> 0 = sin-1 (Pd/Pl)
>
> HSmin = (SD + PT)(PD/PL)
>
> LEGEND
>
> HSmin - min hold diameter
> SD - shaft diameter
> PT - plating thickness
> 0 - angle of deflection
> PD - pin deflection
> PL - pin length
>
> Can I use these formulas to determine if testability is feasible, for
> a very high dense assembly {4 - 600 I/O BGAs with 30 - .020" pitch
> devices (160-pin nominal) in a 9 x 7 form factor}. I feel I am
> missing several pieces to the overall formula picture. Can someone
> advise where I can obtain the rest of the equation.
>
> John Gulley
>
> ################################################################
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> For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or 847-509-9700 ext.312
> ################################################################
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org: Testel Systems Corporation
adr;dom: 268 North Lincoln Avenue;;Suite 1;Corona;CA;91720;
email;internet: [log in to unmask]
title: CEO
tel;work: 909-280-1220
tel;fax: 909-280-1228
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x-mozilla-html: FALSE
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 16:31:51 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hi Dick,
I have about 15 years of test data that shows that the Coefficient of
Thermal Expansion (CTE) for uncoated polyester film base is about 0.0010%
per 1=BAF regardless of the film thickness. The humidity coefficient of
expansion for uncoated base is 0.0008% per %RH for 7 mil polyester and
0.0009% per %RH for 4 mil polyester.
A film product that consists of polyester base coated with relatively thin
layers may have a higher humidity coefficient because these layers absorb
moisture more readily than the polyester. Modern silver halide films have
humidity coefficients in the range of 0.0009 - 0.0011% per %RH. The
humidity coefficient of diazo film and thermal imaging film are typically
in the range of 0.0008 - 0.0009% per %RH.
I don't believe it is possible to have a film whose structure is 90%+
polyester with a CTE that is significantly less than the polyester itself.
Bob Seyfert
DuPont Electronics
>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+++++
>
>
>
>The problem with silver halide film is it's dimensional stability to=
humidity
>changes. Silver film specs quote dimensional stability to be .012% per
deg RH
> change over 24 inches, whereas the thermal coefficient is .0009% per deg
F for
>7 mil film.
>The solution is to switch to a dry process system using dry plot film
which has a thermal coefficient of .00085% per deg F for 4 mil film and a
humidity
> coefficient of .0009% per deg RH.
>
>
>Dick Desrosiers
>[log in to unmask]
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 19:55:53 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: PC Fab Question
X-To: Stephen Ayotte <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Hi Steve,
If someone can answer this one with objective criteria, they better patent the answer.
Unfortunately from my experience, I've found that these issues are independent of each other
(unless you drop a board in a pile of dog poop in the plating room). In reference to handling
damage. As a customer, you do not want any incoming to you. As a manufacturer, Your transport
characteristics (slip sheeting, automation, operator traing/attitude, etc.) in conjunction with
the technology of the product (4 layer 062 thick using a .028 core, 1 ounce copper versus 12
layer 062 using .004" mil core with 1/4 ounce copper, line width of .010" versus .003" etc.) will
dictate your final results. I guess I've always viewed handling damage as a training/attitude
issue. There should be NONE, but accidents do happen. I guess to make a short story long, Your
handling will probably be organization dependent. I didn't even get into what would be
considered a "handling" defect because sometimes "handling" can be a catch all.
Now that I've bored the stuffing out of you with that, handling typically plays a small role
in contamination (key word- TYPICALLY), and is more related to the materials/process areas
(soldermask type and curing level/technique, resin to glass ratio of laminate, fluxes and
cleaning material such as aqueous versus semi aqueous, dwell time at soldercoat, blah, blah,
blah;). Also, contamination needs further definition, particulate, ionic, non ionic, etc.
The bottom line to the contamination question is that standards have been set ranging from
1mg/cm2 to 10mg/in2 for ionic as well as SIR (surface insulation resistance) numbers in the 10 to
the 8th Megohm range (sorry if i'm off here, been a while for me, and the memory is the second
thing to go).
I hope that I helped muddy the water for you on this, and I do apologize if I seem to have no
conclusive answer, but I am not truly aware of one and wanted to babble for a while (keeps my
hands busy).
SERIOUSLY THOUGH, I was hoping to give you some insight as to what I have seen and others
should have some interesting comments as well (please do not beat me up too bad on my answers, it
seems to be the first response to build on) JOHN WAITE
Stephen Ayotte wrote:
> I have a coworker who has asked me the following question:
>
> "As a function of the number of times that a part is handled is there any type
> of model or tool that can be used to predict the amount of handling damage and
> or contamination that would occur."
>
> This would be for a typical factory environment and for equipment and
> inspection operators, not in a clean room environment with lab coats, masks and
> gloves.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Stephen Ayotte, IMD Product Quality Engineer
> Phone (607) 755-1537, t/l 855-1537
> Pager (607) 755-7243 Pin #863 - external, 5-8888 Pin 2863 - internal
> Fax (607) 755-4649
> Stephen Ayotte
> IMD Product Quality Engineer. Laminate Chip Carriers
> Dept. 5QE, Bldg. 14-3, Office BB11
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 21:21:36 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Don Whittemore <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Liquid Photoresist
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I am trying to find a POSITIVE working liquid photoresist to be used in dip
applications. Any information or names of manufactures would be greatly
appreciated.
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 18:33:06 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Matthew Sanders <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Matthew Sanders <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Cheaper buried resistors
Hello all,
I've been reading through the archives and have gotten some interesting
information, but I'm still looking for more on buried resistors. I've
seen a lot about the Ohmega-Ply mat'l, and our vendor will do it for us,
but I'm concerned about the costs, especially since I need only about 1
dozen resistors. A lot of people have mentioned thick film technologies
such as carbon. How have the experiences been with this as a resistor?
What sort of tolerances can you hold, especially since it seems you have
to screen them on? Are there other application methods or materials?
Also, since we need our resistor on an internal layer, would we be able
to laminate other layers on top of it without affecting its performance?
If anyone has practical experience with this, I'd love to hear it.
Also, as a short term prototype (rather than the buried resistors), I'd
like to be able to have a multilayer circuit, but just leave a hole
between the outer layer and layer 2. It seems like it wouldn't be very
feasible to laminate it with a hole (although if it would, I'd certainly
consider it if someone can tell me how), so I was thinking it might just
be easiest to laser drill through the outer dielectric layer. Is it
possible to burn away a quarter inch square area of dielectric and leave
the circuitry untouched. How hard is this to do?
Thanks for the help...
Matt
Matthew Sanders
PWB Procurement Engineer, Trimble Navigation Limited
[log in to unmask]
Phone: (408) 481-7817
Fax: (408) 481-8590
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:10:20 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Frequency Performance of FR-4
X-To: [log in to unmask]
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Everyone seems to have a 1GHz ceiling on FR4. We routinely go higher than
that on our FR4 boards. It all comes down to how much loss you can tolerate.
Frank
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:14:27 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Frequency Performance of FR-4
X-To: [log in to unmask]
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KC,
Take a look at the GETEK dielectric constant vs. frequency. It is very stable
over a wide frequency range.
Frank
WJ
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:09:41 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Afri Singh <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Afri Singh <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Liquid Photoresist
X-To: [log in to unmask]
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
I HAVE JUST TESTED THE ONE FROM ASI/COATES WITH VERY GOOD RESULTS
CONTACT D ALBIN AT COATES --(602)276 7361
AFRI
On Wed, 27 May 1998, Don Whittemore wrote:
> I am trying to find a POSITIVE working liquid photoresist to be used in dip
> applications. Any information or names of manufactures would be greatly
> appreciated.
>
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>
>
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Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:26:53 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Plating Supplier
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I need to plate electroless silver over electrodeposited nickle to 1018 steel.
Can anyone recommend a good, professional, dependable, high-volume plating
supplier? We seem to have a hard time with plate shops. Is this a universal
problem?
Frank
WJ
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 17:12:37 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Marco Biagtan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Photo tool stability
X-To: Bob Seyfert <[log in to unmask]>
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Hi Bob,
Thanks for all your help. I will try all your suggestions and see which one
works. Thanks again!
Marco Biagtan
NEC Components Phils., Inc.
Process Engineer
Bob Seyfert wrote:
>
> Hi Marco,
>
> If this is problem that occurs only with your contact films and not your
> plotted films, then I would look first at your contact printing process.
> It possible that it is rooted in your film (since this is a different
film
> than the plotter film), but I'd look first at the contacting process.
>
> It is quite possible that the film is getting distorted in the exposure
> step, as Paul suggested. In general, I recommend that you use a contact
> frame designed for film-to-film contacting, such as those used in the
> graphic arts (printing) industry. Trying to use a resist printer (which
> was designed for thicker panels and larger volume air evacuation) often
> results in dimensional stability problems. Also, some designs of contact
> printer work better than others. Many newer designs put high emphasis on
> rapid air evacuation to give short vacuum drawdown times. They do this
by
> various methods of applying pressure to push the air out. Some of these
> can produce machanical distortion of the film at the same time. Some
work
> fine.
>
> I suggest the following:
>
> 1. Be sure your contacting film is equlibrated the same way your
plotting
> film is.
>
> 2. Use a stiff, black, matted, plastic backup sheet behind your film
when
> you expose it. This will tend to protect the film from mechanical
> distortions. These are available commercially in the U.S. through
graphic
> arts suppliers. I am uncertain about availability in Japan.
>
> 3. Use adequate drawdown time to insure complete air evacuation. One to
> two minutes may be required on some contact frames. Run a test to
> determine what your frame needs.
>
> 4. In order to separate size changes that occur during exposure verus
> those that occur during processing, it is possible to expose a piece of
> film, apply developer to the areas that contain the fiducials with a
cotton
> swab, then fix the fiduals by applying fixer with a cotton swab. Now
turn
> on the lights and carefully rinse the processed areas with another cotton
> swab containing water. Allow the film to dry before measuring it.
>
>
> If you still can't find the cause of your size change, send me a note
> directly with the details of your process (type of contact frame, type of
> film, process steps, etc.) and we'll spend some time tracking it down.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Bob Seyfert
> DuPont Electronics
>
>
>
> At 09:04 AM 5/23/98 +0800, you wrote:
> >Hi John,
> >Sorry guys if I misunderstood. We do have a glass base over which the
> >films are laid and then this is covered by a rubber covering before
vacuum
> >and exposure.
> >I have always checked the film dimension after developing; I haven't
really
> >checked the dimensions of the film after exposure since only a latent
image
> >is seen (we're using silver halide for our contacts), but I'll try. We
do
> >use overcoats over our films (PPF) but this is applied later during the
> >process.
> >
> >
> >John Waite wrote,
> >>
> >> Hi Marco,
> >> What Paul is referring to is if the drawer has a glass base, and
the
> >top side has a mylar.
> >> It sounds like you have a "glass pac" style tooling. AT what point do
> >you see the "distortion".
> >> Is is off the diazo developer or during exposure, or after transfer of
> >the phototool to imaging
> >> area. Also, are you using a covercoat over your diazo (IE- APF,PPF,
> >etc). Sorry about my
> >> misinterpretation. I thought you were using 1st generation silvers.
> >JOHN WAITE
> >
> >>
> >> Marco Biagtan wrote:
> >>
> >> > Hi Paul,
> >> > I'm sorry but I don't quite understand what you mean about the
single
> >sided
> >> > glass exposure frame. The flexible membrane of our exposure machine
> >has a
> >> > thin glass frame on top of it as well as a thick glass frame where
we
> >lay
> >> > our films. Is this the same?
> >> >
> >> > Anyway, thanks a lot for the suggestion. This is the first time
I've
> >heard
> >> > of this and it might just be what I'm looking for.
> >> >
> >> > Marco Biagtan
> >> > NEC Components Phils. Inc.
> >> > Process Engineer
> >> >
> >> > Paul Gould wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Marco,
> >> > > Just had another thought if it is only your contacts. If you are
> >using a
> >> > > single sided glass exposure frame with a flexible membrane over
the
> >top,
> >> > > your copy film will be in contact with the membrane and will tend
to
> >get
> >> > > mechanically stretched. This would result in an apparent shrinkage
> >after
> >> > > exposure. If this is a possibility, put a sheet of black card on
top
> >of
> >> > > the film before closing the lid and pulling the vacuum.
> >> > > Hope this helps.
> >> > > Paul Gould
> >> > > [log in to unmask]
> >> > > Teknacron Circuits Ltd
> >> > > Fax: 1983 865141
> >> > > Tel: 1983 866531
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:49:16 +0100
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Zachery D Boettcher <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Zachery D Boettcher <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Conveyorised Plasma
Mime-Version: 1.0
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I am looking for information on conveyorised
plasma system. Any information or names of
manufactures would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Zach
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 04:16:21 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Colin <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Colin <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Nickel foil
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Fellow Technetters,
I have had a request from one of my UK customers, where it would be
possible to source FULLY ANNEALED nickel foil.
He is looking for 18uM thick foil, treated preferably on both sides, but
one will suffice, in panel sizes around 18" x 12" or 24" x 18".
Any leads as to where I might get this material, either in Europe or
Stateside?
Either reply via TechNet, or off-line.
Thanks in advance.
Colin McVean
Polyclad Technical Services UK
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 07:15:00 PDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Kasprzak, Bill (esd) US" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Kasprzak, Bill (esd) US" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: : Anybody using water soluble ?
The text of this message is a "re-run" of an earlier message for which I
only received one response. Just looking for a few more.
Greetings:
I am curious whether or not someone has ever qualified a water soluble flux
for wavesoldering in accordance with J-Std-001B, Appendix D. I have
previously qualified Kester HF-1189A flux in accordance with J-Std-001A,
appendix D. At that time I was able to select a flux that was QPL listed
under Mil-F-14256, type WSF, and qualified our process according to the
appendix at level 2. Since then, J-Std-001 is now Rev B, Mil-F-14256 is a
thing of the past, etc etc.
So......
Are there any Class 3 producers out there who have gone through the
qualification of water soluble fluxes according to the provisions of
Appendix D ?? I'm just curious as to whether or not someone was able to
qualify something other than Kester HF1189A to the J-Std.
I'm interested in changing water soluble fluxes from the water based to an
alcohol based water soluble flux. I'd like to know if anyone out there has
been sucessful in passing the Appendix D requirements for class 3 activity.
If you're still using RMA's, how are you cleaning ?
Thanks,
Bill Kasprzak
Moog Inc.
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 07:36:16 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Aric parr <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Holis Wave Soldering Machine
These machines have not been manufactured for several years. Complete used
machines are periodically available on the open market for a few thousand
dollars (US) in N. America from many used equipment suppliers. It might be
worth your while to obtain one or two for spare parts. I have seen multiple
used equipment suppliers advertise in every issue of Circuits Assembly and
SMT. There are probably equivalent dealers in Europe.
Aric Parr
Sr. Manufacturing Engineer
Eaton Corporation
Actuator and Sensor Division
248 608 7780
[log in to unmask]
-------------
Original Text
From: C=US/A=INTERNET/DDA=ID/TechNet(a)IPC.ORG, on 5/27/98 2:03 PM:
To: Aric Parr@01635@Lectron_RH,
EatonWHQ@CorpMail@WHQCleveOH[C=US/A=INTERNET/DDA=ID/TechNet(a)IPC.ORG]
Hi Folks,
I am interested in spare parts for Hollis Wave Soldering Equipment,
the MKIII in particular.
Can anyone recommend or even supply a name - address of a supplier
retailer?
Help would be very much appreciated.
Best Regards,
Colin Leyden
Senior Engineer
Polaroid (UK) Ltd.
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 07:36:16 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Aric parr <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Holis Wave Soldering Machine
These machines have not been manufactured for several years. Complete used
machines are periodically available on the open market for a few thousand
dollars (US) in N. America from many used equipment suppliers. It might be
worth your while to obtain one or two for spare parts. I have seen multiple
used equipment suppliers advertise in every issue of Circuits Assembly and
SMT. There are probably equivalent dealers in Europe.
Aric Parr
Sr. Manufacturing Engineer
Eaton Corporation
Actuator and Sensor Division
248 608 7780
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 07:27:50 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: 1206 jumper
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I have a component that is glue cured on the bottom of a pcb. The
component is a 1206 size jumper. It is made up of iron/nickel alloy. The
problem I am having is that the part will fall off the board during wave
solder. Is the component not able to withstand all the heat of the solder
pot being that it is a solid metal material? Any ideas or solutions would
be appreciated.
Rob Williams
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:13:07 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Devlin, Dan" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Devlin, Dan" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: 1206 jumper
X-To: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
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It sounds as if you have an adhesion problem.
Does the residual glue stil have the flat impresasion from the chip?
What type of adhesive is being used? Some are stronger adhesives than
others.
A metal chip has a completely different surface tooth thanthat of a
ceramic chip.
Points to ponder.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [log in to unmask] [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Thursday, May 28, 1998 8:28 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] 1206 jumper
>
> I have a component that is glue cured on the bottom of a pcb. The
> component is a 1206 size jumper. It is made up of iron/nickel alloy.
> The
> problem I am having is that the part will fall off the board during
> wave
> solder. Is the component not able to withstand all the heat of the
> solder
> pot being that it is a solid metal material? Any ideas or solutions
> would
> be appreciated.
>
> Rob Williams
> [log in to unmask]
>
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:19:17 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Devlin, Dan" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Devlin, Dan" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: 1206 jumper
X-To: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
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> It sounds as if you have an adhesion problem.
> Does the residual glue stil have the flat impresasion from the chip?
> What type of adhesive is being used? Some are stronger adhesives than
> others.
> A metal chip has a completely different surface tooth thanthat of a
> ceramic chip.
> Points to ponder.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [log in to unmask] [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Thursday, May 28, 1998 8:28 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] 1206 jumper
>
> I have a component that is glue cured on the bottom of a pcb.
> The
> component is a 1206 size jumper. It is made up of iron/nickel
> alloy. The
> problem I am having is that the part will fall off the board
> during wave
> solder. Is the component not able to withstand all the heat of
> the solder
> pot being that it is a solid metal material? Any ideas or
> solutions would
> be appreciated.
>
> Rob Williams
> [log in to unmask]
>
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> LISTSERV 1.8c
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> For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask]
> or 847-509-9700 ext.312
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 08:28:35 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Charles Barker <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: 1206 jumper
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Charles Barker@I-O INC
05/28/98 08:28 AM
Hi Rob,
Have you checked the parameters of the glue being used? We had a similar
problem for regulat resistors and capacitors. Turned out that the process
folks were stretching the "pot life" too much. Is your curing process
correct? You might want to talk to someone like Loctite for more specifics.
Good luck!
Charlie B.
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Charles Barker/US/I-O INC)
Subject: [TN] 1206 jumper
I have a component that is glue cured on the bottom of a pcb. The
component is a 1206 size jumper. It is made up of iron/nickel alloy. The
problem I am having is that the part will fall off the board during wave
solder. Is the component not able to withstand all the heat of the solder
pot being that it is a solid metal material? Any ideas or solutions would
be appreciated.
Rob Williams
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 08:56:41 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
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From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Reflow Oven Heat Loading
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All,
Hello again...ready for another question from a newbie??
Again, I am getting some information about convection reflow=20
ovens that I do not necessarily buy into.
We have a Conceptronic HVN-102 7 zone reflow oven. We have=20
been advised that during production runs, we will need to=20
place 'buffer' circuit assemblies before and after each=20
actual production assembly to properly load the heaters in=20
our oven or, as we are told, our zone temps will drop to an=20
unacceptable level.
I am of the opinion that as long as each zone doesn't drop=20
more than (help me here...fill in the blank) ___ Deg. C.=20
then everything is good. Or as long as the board=20
temperature profile is acceptable. I can understanding=20
profiling the oven to understand what loading it can accept,=20
but I don't expect our oven to experience any unacceptable=20
loading on any one assembly that we may process.
Any insight into this would be appreciated.
Steve McBride
[log in to unmask]
(405) 624-5281
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 06:41:32 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Sater <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Sater <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: DST Foil
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Hello Techneters
I wonder what are the advantages of DSTF which make this type of
copper finish gaining so much popularity?
Thanks,
JS
_________________________________________________________
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 10:11:59 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Reflow Oven Heat Loading
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Steve -
Where did this info come from? If from your company internally, it is time to
call the oven manufacturer to come out and service your oven. If it came from
the oven manufacturer, it is time to consider getting a new oven. , I think it
is the former.
One of the key tests I use when evaluating reflow ovens is load testing. The
oven must perform the same regardless if there is one board in it or a
constant load of boards.
Most present day convection dominant ovens are "load capable" with good heat
transfer capacity. I hope the HVN is one of them. What you are doing is
totally unnecessary with the majority of ovens that I have tested. Definitely
contact the manufacturer as soon as possible.
Regards,
Phil Zarrow
ITM, Inc.
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 10:13:43 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: wave solder operator
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Is there anybody in the general area of Rochester, Albany, or Indicott, NY
that is looking for an experienced person in SMT repair and wave soldering.
Experienced using VOC Free no-cleans and running design of experiments. I
would appreciate a response. I have a gentleman that is very interested in
the general area and I would hate for his qualities and experience to go to
waste.
Jason Smith
Process Materials Engineer
Lexmark Electronics
(606) 232-7667
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 10:26:31 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: : Anybody using water soluble ?
X-To: "Kasprzak, Bill (esd) US" <[log in to unmask]>
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We have qualified an Alpha VOCFree no clean. The NR310 series is a good
flux as far as solder balling goes. It is compatable with alot of
finishes. They not only concentrate on the surface tension of the solder,
but with the coating as well.
Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum."
<[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to "Kasprzak,
Bill (esd) US" <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Jason Smith)
bcc: Jason Smith
Subject: [TN] : Anybody using water soluble ?
The text of this message is a "re-run" of an earlier message for which I
only received one response. Just looking for a few more.
Greetings:
I am curious whether or not someone has ever qualified a water soluble flux
for wavesoldering in accordance with J-Std-001B, Appendix D. I have
previously qualified Kester HF-1189A flux in accordance with J-Std-001A,
appendix D. At that time I was able to select a flux that was QPL listed
under Mil-F-14256, type WSF, and qualified our process according to the
appendix at level 2. Since then, J-Std-001 is now Rev B, Mil-F-14256 is a
thing of the past, etc etc.
So......
Are there any Class 3 producers out there who have gone through the
qualification of water soluble fluxes according to the provisions of
Appendix D ?? I'm just curious as to whether or not someone was able to
qualify something other than Kester HF1189A to the J-Std.
I'm interested in changing water soluble fluxes from the water based to an
alcohol based water soluble flux. I'd like to know if anyone out there has
been sucessful in passing the Appendix D requirements for class 3 activity.
If you're still using RMA's, how are you cleaning ?
Thanks,
Bill Kasprzak
Moog Inc.
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:13:43 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
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From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: heat deflection temp of FR4
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I've been searching for a tech sheet for FR4 and specifically 0.4mm
FR4 with the express aim of finding out the temperature exposure that
it will endure and dwell times at that temperature.
The board I'm working with is 25mm square
Can anybody point me in the right direction
Thanks in advance
Aidan Magner
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:55:59 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Valerie Webber <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Spec'ing Resisitivity on Plating Material
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Valerie Webber
05/28/98 09:55 AM
Does anyone know of a test method to measure the resistivity of gold
plating? We have a product that has a spec on the plating material and
refers to IPC-TM-650 method 2.5.14, however this method is for copper foil,
not plating. Is there a reason our customer might want a resistivity spec
on just the plating? Doesn't it make more sense to spec the final material
(copper foil plus plating), in which case, method 2.5.14 would work?
Prior to plating, the gold is in solution. Is there a resistivity test
method for solution form?
Any help on this is greatly appreciated.
Valerie
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:32:51 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Stephen R. Gregory" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: 1206 jumper
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Hi Rob,
I guess the first question would be what type of epoxy are you using? If
it's loctite, and it's 3609, the strength at high temperatures passes the test
they use to qualify it as a SMT adhesive for wave soldering, but there are
other loctite epoxy formula's that have much higher percentages of the cure
strength at elevated temperatures than 3609 does...the reason I jumped on 3609
first is because that's what a lot of people use.
At 150 degrees C., 3609 only has about 10% of it's normal cure
strength...enough to qualify as a SMT adhesive, but may not be enough for your
application. I imagine that little puppy you're putting on the backside gets a
little hotter, a lot quicker than a regular ol' resistor or capacitor does...
does solder wet to the whole component? Maybe the wetting forces are enough to
overcome what little strength is there.
3612, and 3614 are two formula's that retain near 70% of it's cure
strength at 150 C., but it's designed for stenciling according to Loctite
spec's...so it may not perform well if dispensed. By the way, you can check
all the spec's at Loctite's WEB page;
www.loctite.com
One last comment, there must be a reason that you're using iron/nickle
jumpers huh? High power or something like that? But if there's no special
reason, just use zero ohm resistors...or even better yet, if you can change
the board there's two ways you can put something there to avoid having to
place anything there at all. One way, is that if you have to place a jumper
at almost all of the jumper locations on the assembly, why not design a trace
in to connect the two pads and then use an exacto knife or a dremel to
configure the few jumpers that ARE supposed to be open.
One other idea is to design the two jumper pads close enough together and
in such a way that they bridge when they go across the wave, but won't bridge
if some epoxy is dispensed and cured at the centroid or a apex of whatever
pattern you want to put there...they could be pads, or some sort of trace
pattern. At least you wouldn't have to worry about putting a part there...
Just a few thoughts...
-Steve Gregory-
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:48:25 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Andrea Botvin <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Andrea Botvin <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Pro * Finders
Subject: (no subject)
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I have an excellent opportunity for a production supervisor of the
router and lamination and circuit assembly lines of a manufacturing
facility in Syracuse, NY. Do you know of anyone who might be interested?
I am offering a 50$ gift certificate to the restaurant of your
choice for the name of someone leading to a successful hire. The job
requires 5 years of supervisory experience manufacturing circuit
assemblies and printed wire boards. My phone # is 1800- 881-2972
Sincerely,
Andrea Botvin
President of Pro * Finders
--
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 08:55:13 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jared Lang <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jared Lang <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: 1206 jumper
X-To: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Hi Rob,
We had a similar problem where a number of DO-214AB diodes on the bottom
of the board could be easily knocked off in handling or in wavesolder.
We were using Heraeus 86002SP glue. We found that the epoxy used to
manufacture the diodes still had a small amount of the mold release
compound. We switched to Heraeus PD955M which has a higher shear factor
and it solved the problem. Granted, you are using metal 1206 jumpers,
but the solution may be as simple as changing the type of glue.
Regards,
Jared Lang
Manufacturing Engineer
Minarik Corp.
> ----------
> From: [log in to unmask][SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;[log in to unmask]
> Sent: Thursday, May 28, 1998 5:27 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] 1206 jumper
>
> I have a component that is glue cured on the bottom of a pcb. The
> component is a 1206 size jumper. It is made up of iron/nickel alloy.
> The
> problem I am having is that the part will fall off the board during
> wave
> solder. Is the component not able to withstand all the heat of the
> solder
> pot being that it is a solid metal material? Any ideas or solutions
> would
> be appreciated.
>
> Rob Williams
> [log in to unmask]
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 10:09:01 PDT
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jana Carraway <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: DST Foil
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
"John Sater" <[log in to unmask]> Wrote:
|
| Hello Techneters
|
| I wonder what are the advantages of DSTF which make this
| type of
| copper finish gaining so much popularity?
|
| Thanks,
|
| JS
|
John, the theoretical advantages are increased adhesion of dry film to the
plated topography which is usually the side applied to the B stage to make
laminate, lower profile for etch at the copper-laminate interface, and
possibly reduced cleaning costs. Polyclad, Nelco, AlliedSignal, etc. can
provide technical literature discussing DSTF or RTF. It is not necessarily a
drop in product. Precleaning is different, lamination can be different, hold
times, rework, and possibly oxide are processes that need to be optimized.
Jana Carraway
Maxtek -- the Maxim/Tektronix Multichip Module facility
tel 503.627.2063, fax 503.627.4651
email [log in to unmask], www.maxtek.com
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:03:59 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Hogue, Pat (AZ76)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Hogue, Pat (AZ76)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Nickel foil
X-To: "Colin (IPM Return requested)" <[log in to unmask]>
Try International Nickel Corp.
----------
From: Colin[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Colin
Sent: Thursday, May 28, 1998 2:16 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Nickel foil
Fellow Technetters,
I have had a request from one of my UK customers, where it would be
possible to source FULLY ANNEALED nickel foil.
He is looking for 18uM thick foil, treated preferably on both sides, but
one will suffice, in panel sizes around 18" x 12" or 24" x 18".
Any leads as to where I might get this material, either in Europe or
Stateside?
Either reply via TechNet, or off-line.
Thanks in advance.
Colin McVean
Polyclad Technical Services UK
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################################################################
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################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:24:04 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jack Crawford <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: admin note: Job Postings
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Just a reminder: While the technical forums appear to be good places to post job
needs and availabilities, the policy has NOT changed and these announcements are NOT
appropriate on any of the IPC forums except "DesignerCouncil".
Please keep your postings timely, technical and related to the forum you post them
on. Thanks to all for complying. Jack
IPC/SMTA Electronics Assembly Expo
Technical Committee Meetings, Conference, Exhibits
Providence RI October 24-29
More info at http://www.ipc.org
Jack Crawford, IPC Project Manager - Assembly
2215 Sanders Road, Northbrook IL 60062-6135
[log in to unmask] 847-509-9700 x 393 fax 847-509-9798
>>> "<Jason M. Smith>" <[log in to unmask]> 05/28/98 09:13AM >>>
Is there anybody in the general area of Rochester, Albany, or Indicott, NY
that is looking for an experienced person in SMT repair and wave soldering.
Experienced using VOC Free no-cleans and running design of experiments. I
would appreciate a response. I have a gentleman that is very interested in
the general area and I would hate for his qualities and experience to go to
waste.
Jason Smith
Process Materials Engineer
Lexmark Electronics
(606) 232-7667
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:27:01 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Hugo Scaramuzza <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Hugo Scaramuzza <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Technet
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The following information can also be found at:
http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm
If you have any problems, let me know.
E-Mail Forum Participation Rules:
As a e-mail forum subscriber, there are two kinds of activities you can =
perform:
*Post an e-mail message to the forum, or *Administer your subscription =
status=20
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posting to the forum:
To send a message to all the people currently subscribed to the forum, =
just send mail
to <forum name>=40ipc.org .=20
NOTE: Use the e-mail forum name you want to reach in place of the <forum =
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in the above instructions.
EXAMPLE: TO:<forum name>=40ipc.org SUBJECT:<your subject>MESSAGE:<your =
message>
Please note that sometimes you may receive non-delivery notification =
messages from
users on the forum who are having problems with their mail systems. These =
messages
are sent to you by default as to the originator of the message, and can be =
safely
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n to the
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concerned about
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------------------------------------------------------------------------
Administering your subscription status:
All commands (such as subscribe and signoff) must be sent to LISTSERV=40ipc=
.org . You
must never try to send any command to mail forum address (i.e. <forum =
name>=40ipc.org),
as it will be distributed to all the subscribers.=20
Also, please note that no other text, such as electronic signature, etc., =
should be
present in the messages to LISTSERV=40IPC.ORG. If your email program =
automatically
appends your signature to the message, please remove it.=20
Example for subscribing:=20
TO:LISTSERV=40IPC.ORGSUBJECT: MESSAGE:subscribe TechNet Joseph H. Smith
Example for signing off:
TO:LISTSERV=40IPC.ORGSUBJECT: MESSAGE:signoff DesignerCouncil
NOTE: You must send messages to the forum address ONLY from the e-mail =
address to
which you want to apply changes. In other words, if you want to sign off =
the mail
list, you must send the SIGNOFF command from the address that you want =
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------------------------------------------------------------------------
Additional Commands:
SET <forum name> <option>
Command enables/disables a specified option.=20
EXAMPLE: TO:LISTSERV=40IPC.ORGSUBJECT: MESSAGE:SET TechNet nomail
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The available options are as follows:
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executed
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query. The syntax is:
QUERY <forum name>
Also, wildcards are supported. For example, sending a command
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------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mail/Nomail Setting the NOMail option stops mail from the forumt to you, =
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For example, to temporarily disable mail delivery from TechNet to your =
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Digest/Nodigest Setting the Digest option causes the subscriber to =
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Setting the NODigest option causes individual messages to be sent to the =
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For example, to start receiving the TechNet messages in digest form, send =
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SET TechNet DIGEST
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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messages during
that cycle. Instructions on how to retrieve the individual postings are =
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Setting the NOIndex option causes individual messages to be sent to the =
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For example, to start receiving TechNet messages in index form, send the =
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SET TechNet INDEX
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Search This command allows you to search a database of all previous =
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SEARCH <search string> IN <forum name>=20
For example, to search TechNet for gold plating, send the following =
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SEARCH gold plating IN TechNet
Adding SINCE <date> after the forum name will impose the time constraints =
on your
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SEARCH gold plating IN TechNet SINCE 97/01/01
will search all postings since January 1=27st 1997.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
ACK/NOACK When you send a message, the server responds with a confirmatio=
n message,
saying that =22your message was delivered to the forum, etc.=22, but, by =
default, the
copy of your message is NOT sent to you. In other words, when you send a =
message to
the forum, you do not receive it back as a posting. However, you can =
change this
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ACK - A short confirmation message is sent to the sender of the posting =
(default)
NOACK - No posting acknowledgment is sent
Repro/NORepro REPRO - You receive a copy of your own postings
NOREPRO - You do not receive a copy of your own postings
For example, to receive both confirmation of the posting and the posting =
itself for
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SET TECHNET REPRO
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SET TECHNET NOACK
SET TECHNET REPRO
------------------------------------------------------------------------
THANKS You can send this command to see if the server is alive, and the =
messages to
and from the server are delivered normally.The server politely responds, =
=22You=27re
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------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------------
More features and functionality will be added later.
PLEASE NOTE: All of the commands, except your name under the =22subscribe=
=22 command, are
NOT case sensitive; feel free to type them as you wish.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mail List Descriptions=20
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This peer networking forum can be used to ask others for technical help, =
comments or
questions on IPC specifications, or other technical inquiries. IPC will =
also use
TechNet to announce meetings, important technical issues, surveys, etc. As =
a general
networking forum, any technical question is fair game.=20
Discussion of pricing is not appropriate for TechNet. Requests for =
recommendations of
products or suppliers are appropriate when responses are sent to the =
individual
requesting the information only and not to the entire TechNet forum.=20
<Picture>Return to top=20
Designer Council=20
This forum provides a means to stay current with the many programs of the =
IPC
Designers Council, and to exchange information with other designers. Got a =
question
you know another designer can answer for you? Here=27s the place to get =
the answers you
need today. Over 500 designers participate in this special IPC Designers =
Council
Forum.=20
Those looking for information on upcoming IPC Designers Council activities =
should
subscribe. Information, comments, and feedback about local chapter =
meetings, new
chapters forming, or anything else pertaining to the council are all =
encouraged.
Also, information about national and local meetings is disseminated.=20
<Picture>Return to top=20
ComplianceNet=20
The ComplianceNet forum covers environmental, safety and related regulation=
s or
issues. In addition to giving you a forum for exchanging information with =
your
colleagues and IPC staff, and getting information you need to do your jobs =
today, IPC
will provide the following information on ComplianceNet:=20
*Regulatory proposals, alerts and draft comments *Legislative updates *New =
regulatory
interpretations (i.e., photoresist skins) *Grass roots action alerts =
*Compliance
assistance=20
<Picture>Return to top=20
IPCsm840=20
This peer networking forum is very specific. Sign on here to comment, help =
or get
help on issues relating to =22Qualification and Performance Specification =
of Permanent
Polymer Coating (Soldermask) for Printed Boards.=22=20
ChipNet=20
This peer networking forum is very specific. Sign on here to comment, help =
or get
help on issues relating to ANSI/J-STD-012, =22Implementation of Flip Chip =
and Chip
Scale Technology.=22=20
Roadmap=20
This peer-networking forum is very specific. Roadmap=40ipc.org provides =
opportunity for
information exchange that facilitates coordinated development of IPC=27s =
National
Technology Roadmap for Electronic Interconnections. The biannual effort =
for global
benchmarking is also the subject of this forum. Roadmap=40ipc.org is used =
to analyze
recommendations for needed research or technology transfer. Others are =
encouraged to
use the forum to communicate their needs/questions. This includes members =
of other
road mapping teams such as NEMI, SIA, EDAC and others.=20
<Picture>IPC_New_Releases=20
Provides notification to subscribers when new and revised IPC publications =
are
available. Please note: This forum is for broadcast only, and not for =
posting
messages. The same subscription instructions apply.=20
<Picture>GenCAM=20
This peer networking forum can be used for comments or questions on =
IPC=27s effort to
standardize electronic data transfer strategies (DTS) and other inquiries =
regarding
transferring files from CAD to CAM. IPC will also use GenCAM to announce =
meetings,
important technical issues, new developments, etc.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you have any questions or concerns about IPC=27s e-mail forums, please =
contact Hugo
Scaramuzza at scarhu=40ipc.org
Hugo Scaramuzza
Electronic Communications Administrator
IPC
2215 Sanders Road
Northbrook IL 60062-6135
(847)509-9700 ext.312
fax:(847)509-9798
HugoScaramuzza=40ipc.org
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################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 14:26:11 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: FAB: FR1 laminate
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
What is FR1 and how does it differ from FR4?
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################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 15:36:33 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
DAVID MANDER <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: DAVID MANDER <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Need source
Has anyone heard of a product called "Alumina"? I believe it may be
a ceramic based substrate, aluminum clad. If anyone has heard of
this product or knows a contact, I would appreciate it. You can
respond to me directly at [log in to unmask]
Thanks.
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################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 15:47:21 -0400
Reply-To: "David R. McGowan" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "David R. McGowan" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Nickel foil
X-To: Colin <[log in to unmask]>
Colin,
I believe that Gould used to manufacature Ni foil with a treatment for
bonding. the Ni foil is still in the MF 150 spec, so someone must still
offer it. You could try contacting all the foil vendors.
Dave McGowan
-----Original Message-----
From: Colin <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Thursday, May 28, 1998 6:48 AM
Subject: [TN] Nickel foil
>Fellow Technetters,
>
>I have had a request from one of my UK customers, where it would be
>possible to source FULLY ANNEALED nickel foil.
>
>He is looking for 18uM thick foil, treated preferably on both sides, but
>one will suffice, in panel sizes around 18" x 12" or 24" x 18".
>
>Any leads as to where I might get this material, either in Europe or
>Stateside?
>
>Either reply via TechNet, or off-line.
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Colin McVean
>Polyclad Technical Services UK
>
>################################################################
>TechNet E-Mail Forum provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8c
>################################################################
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>################################################################
>Please visit IPC web site (http://jefry.ipc.org/forum.htm) for additional
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>For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
847-509-9700 ext.312
>################################################################
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:52:00 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Joy, Stephen C" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Joy, Stephen C" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Passive Shear tests
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Does anyone have any experience with shear testing on 0603's;
0805's or BGA devices? What is the methodology?
Thanks in advance,
Steve Joy
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################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 13:15:58 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Phil Hersey <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Phil Hersey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Metallized teflon film
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0089_01BD8A3A.C0C64F00"
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0089_01BD8A3A.C0C64F00
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I understand that prior to polyimide, vacuum metallized Teflon film was =
used for flex PCB's. Seems to me this would be an excellent RF board =
material in place of PTFE panel material (at 2 mil thickness a 50ohm =
trace would be 6 mil wide). Has it disappeared totally and if so, why?
=20
=20
Phil Hersey
[log in to unmask]
(702) 884-5388x128
------=_NextPart_000_0089_01BD8A3A.C0C64F00
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
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http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.71.1712.3"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#800000 size=3D2>I understand that prior to =
polyimide, vacuum=20
metallized Teflon film was used for flex PCB's. Seems to me this =
would be=20
an excellent RF board material in place of PTFE panel material (at =
2 mil=20
thickness a 50ohm trace would be 6 mil wide). Has it disappeared =
totally=20
and if so, why?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#800000 size=3D2> <BR> =
<BR>Phil=20
Hersey<BR><A href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]">[log in to unmask]</A><BR>(702)=20
884-5388x128</FONT> </DIV></BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_0089_01BD8A3A.C0C64F00--
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Date: Tue, 5 May 1998 13:46:10 -0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Adil Nasir <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Adil Nasir <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Panel thickness measurents
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hi All:
I plan to purchase a CECO overarm thickness meter for quick and accurate
measurements ( measuring the thickness of the panels after lamination ). I am
trying to eliminate any error in gage repeatibility and to make the measurement
quicker. I plan to also incorporate SPC software from NorthWest Analytical.
I would appreciate any input from anybody who has experience with the above,
as well as what kind of measurements would be the most beneficial without
much of an overkill, depending on the topography of the laminated panel.
Thanks
Adil
Lamination Engineer
Pycon Inc.
Santa Clara
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:06:34 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ron Hollandsworth <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ron Hollandsworth <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Subj: Corpane Semi-Aqueous Inline Cleaner
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TechNetters:
This is a FYI note to you all. We have implemented a
No-clean/Low-residue soldering technology here at ITT. By
implementing this technology we no long need our inline cleaner.
The cleaner has a membrane system, paxton blowers, and teflon seals
throughout. For more information please call:
Tom Cameron
Facilities Manager ITT A/CD
Tel: 219-451-5083
Better Hurry. Eastern Standard Time between 7:30 A.M. and 4:00 P.M.,
and there is voice mail if no answer
Please don't call me a spammer. I also work at ITT and I thought this
cleaner might help someone out there on TechNet who might just be
looking for a cleaner. It's got great Decanter. Call Tom for more
information.
If you can't get Tom e:mail me at:
[log in to unmask]
This will be the only TechNet message.
Thanks
Ron
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 17:16:22 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Nick Nicolaides <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Nick Nicolaides <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: What is acceptable ESD voltage on Tape and Reel?
MIME-Version: 1.0
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In performing various esd voltage checks. we noticed that some plastic reels
had upwards of 3000 volts and in some cases 1500 volts. What should be
acceptable and if others have check these what have you got and is it on the
tape or on the reel. Also type of components.
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:29:39 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
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From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Test Nets
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All,
Is 5000 Nets on an Assembled Fab considered nominal. If not, can
someone provide information on what is typical, what's low and what's
excessive. Thank you.
John Gulley
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 18:07:34 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Nick Nicolaides <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Nick Nicolaides <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: HASL Alternative to Exposed copper
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Exposed copper on solder resist is considered a non conformance per IPC600.
I can understand exposed copper with OSP since it does burn off during
Reflow and Wave soldering. In some cases copper is not tin lead. In several
operations, we seem to have the solder mask peel off slightly exposing
copper. Should this be acceptable similar to OSP.
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 18:38:13 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Cash, Alan" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Cash, Alan" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: What is acceptable ESD voltage on Tape and Reel?
X-To: Nick Nicolaides <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
For ESD sensitive (ESDS) components you must identify the sensitivity of the
components on the reel, and on surrounding reels on the machine.
EIA-625 states"Essential materials/items, during normal / intended use,
shall not cause stsatic voltages greater than +/- 200 volts to be within
twelve (12) inches of unprotected ESDS devices.
What is your electrical failure rate on these components after placement?.
You may not have a problem if you don't experience a large fall out in
electrical test and your failure analysis does not indicate ESD as the
failure cause. Latent failures may be indicatd by a higher than expected
return rate due to failure of ESDS components. This failure should also be
verified by failure analysis.
Al Cash
> ----------
> From: Nick Nicolaides[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Nick Nicolaides
> Sent: Thursday, May 28, 1998 5:16 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] What is acceptable ESD voltage on Tape and Reel?
>
> In performing various esd voltage checks. we noticed that some plastic
> reels
> had upwards of 3000 volts and in some cases 1500 volts. What should be
> acceptable and if others have check these what have you got and is it on
> the
> tape or on the reel. Also type of components.
>
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 19:22:52 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Nickel foil
X-To: Colin <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Talk to a company in Newburyport, Massachusetts, USA. Their name is Polyonics. Fred Hoover is
the president. I apologize that I do not have the number handy, but if you can't get it, Email
me and I will locate. Polyonics may be able to help or refer you to someone who can. JOHN WAITE
Colin wrote:
> Fellow Technetters,
>
> I have had a request from one of my UK customers, where it would be
> possible to source FULLY ANNEALED nickel foil.
>
> He is looking for 18uM thick foil, treated preferably on both sides, but
> one will suffice, in panel sizes around 18" x 12" or 24" x 18".
>
> Any leads as to where I might get this material, either in Europe or
> Stateside?
>
> Either reply via TechNet, or off-line.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Colin McVean
> Polyclad Technical Services UK
>
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 18:44:03 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Reflow Oven Heat Loading
Steve,
I'm not familiar with the Conceptronic Oven, but when I've bought larger
ovens, they were tested under load. We completely filled the oven with
material, and measured several places to insure that the oven reacted to
different loading conditions. The gains, offsets, etc. for the controllers
were set to react promptly to changes in the loading.
We have a very small oven (4 zones). I do have problems with loading down
the heaters if I run very large boards. When you send the first board
through, it doesn't react fast enough, and then when it does react, it
overshoots for the next board. Luckily, most of our hybrids are 1 inch x 1
inch, so I don't have problems.
Your 7 zone production oven should not have loading issues. Perhaps the
vendor can help you out by calibrating the controllers to handle the type
of loads that your are seeing.
Dave Anderson
Medtronic, Inc.
>>> <[log in to unmask]> 05/28/98 09:56am >>>
All,
Hello again...ready for another question from a newbie??
Again, I am getting some information about convection reflow
ovens that I do not necessarily buy into.
We have a Conceptronic HVN-102 7 zone reflow oven. We have
been advised that during production runs, we will need to
place 'buffer' circuit assemblies before and after each
actual production assembly to properly load the heaters in
our oven or, as we are told, our zone temps will drop to an
unacceptable level.
I am of the opinion that as long as each zone doesn't drop
more than (help me here...fill in the blank) ___ Deg. C.
then everything is good. Or as long as the board
temperature profile is acceptable. I can understanding
profiling the oven to understand what loading it can accept,
but I don't expect our oven to experience any unacceptable
loading on any one assembly that we may process.
Any insight into this would be appreciated.
Steve McBride
[log in to unmask]
(405) 624-5281
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 19:42:19 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Stephen R. Gregory" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: HASL Alternative to Exposed copper
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Nick,
Now here's an example of what I was saying in my post the other day about
exposed copper being a defect not due to the copper itself being exposed, but
due to another problem.
Why this would be a problem is because of the possibility that flux or
some other contaminate entering beneath the mask from where it had flaked
away, becoming trapped and not cleaned away. The fact that the copper is
exposed is not the problem, but the broken mask is.
So in short, this should be corrected by cleaning the area thoroughly
ensuring that there are no contaminates trapped beneath the mask, and then
spot repair the mask.
-Steve Gregory-
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 18:36:33 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Nickel foil -Reply
Polyonics
112 Parker Street
Newburyport, Massachusetts 01950
(508) 462-3600 (phone)
(508) 462-3048 (fax)
These numbers are about 2 years old, but hopefully they are right.
Dave Anderson
Medtronic, Inc.
>>> John Waite <[log in to unmask]> 05/28/98 06:22pm >>>
Talk to a company in Newburyport, Massachusetts, USA. Their name is
Polyonics. Fred Hoover is
the president. I apologize that I do not have the number handy, but if you
can't get it, Email
me and I will locate. Polyonics may be able to help or refer you to
someone who can. JOHN WAITE
Colin wrote:
> Fellow Technetters,
>
> I have had a request from one of my UK customers, where it would be
> possible to source FULLY ANNEALED nickel foil.
>
> He is looking for 18uM thick foil, treated preferably on both sides, but
> one will suffice, in panel sizes around 18" x 12" or 24" x 18".
>
> Any leads as to where I might get this material, either in Europe or
> Stateside?
>
> Either reply via TechNet, or off-line.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Colin McVean
> Polyclad Technical Services UK
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 09:20:08 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
JB <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: JB <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FAB: FR1 laminate
X-To: Ed Cosper <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At 14:26 28.05.98 -0500, you wrote:
>What is FR1 and how does it differ from FR4?
Just my topic!
FR1 is very similar to FR2, both are UL94-V0, both use a phenolic resin as
binder. The only difference to FR2 is the phenolic resin, which is a
different type. FR1 is mainly cold punchable and has a slightly better
operation temperatur. Therefore, many laminate maker which produce FR1 do
not produce FR2. Also, FR1 prices are the same as FR2.
I consider myself as having some knowledge about laminates - still, I can't
tell the difference between FR1 + FR2.
FR4 is a glass epoxy material and is completly different.
Jens Behrens
Want to know more about laminate? http://www.felsweb.com/lam_faq.htm
Laminate FAQ
>
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>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 09:22:18 +0800
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
JB <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: JB <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: DST Foil
X-To: John Sater <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At 06:41 28.05.98 -0700, you wrote:
>Hello Techneters
>
>I wonder what are the advantages of DSTF which make this type of
>copper finish gaining so much popularity?
What is DSTF?
Jens
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 20:24:44 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Don Vischulis <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Don Vischulis <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: FAB: FR1 laminate
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Ed:
Don't know what FR-1 is, but FR-2 is a flame retardant form of paper phenolic laminate. The
numbers after the FR appear to be assigned by performance and cost. FR-2 is lower Tg, cost and
performance than FR-4 which is lower cost, performance, and Tg than FR-5.
Hope this was some help.
Don Vischulis
[log in to unmask]
Ed Cosper wrote:
> What is FR1 and how does it differ from FR4?
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 15:57:33 PDT
Reply-To: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Brad Vanderhoof <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Xerox Corporation
Subject: Re: Need source
X-To: DAVID MANDER <[log in to unmask]>
Alumina is a ceramic substrate material.
Aluminum Oxide Al(2)O(3)
For suppliers try:
Coor Ceramics
Alsimag Technical Ceramics
Kyocera America
Or anyone working with thick film or ceramic multichip modules.
-----Original Message-----
From: DAVID MANDER [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, May 28, 1998 1:37 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Need source
Has anyone heard of a product called "Alumina"? I believe it may be
a ceramic based substrate, aluminum clad. If anyone has heard of
this product or knows a contact, I would appreciate it. You can
respond to me directly at [log in to unmask]
Thanks.
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 10:00:27 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
bernie <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: bernie <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Hakuto 1500C & 610i - Dry Film Cut Sheet Laminator
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello Technetters:
I have a Hakuto cut sheet laminator (1500C) with a small (?) problem. I =
periodically get wrinkled resist on the trailing edge of the panels. The =
panels being laminated are 0.062" thick outer layers. The problem shows =
up as the trailing edge of the dry film resist passes around the 1/4 =
moon shaped film guide. The trailing edge of the resist should be smooth =
and flush to the film guide. On one of our two machines, the center of =
the trailing edge is "baggy" rather than flush against the film guide. =
The problem occurs on the upper and lower sides. Generally, this does =
not cause any defects because the resist smoothes out on the panel. But, =
occasionally, the resist wrinkles, especially over holes, 0.150" dia and =
larger. We see defects such as shorts and tent failures depending on the =
severity of the wrinkles. The bagginess occurs every panel, the wrinkles =
occur only very occasionally. This problem has been looked at by =
equipment service rep, and we still have the problem.=20
We are operating the laminator with the following parameters: The panels =
are preheated to 115-120 F. The lamination roll temperature is 115 C =
(but we have tried lower temperature 105 C). The lamination roll =
pressure is 4.5 bar (but we have tried varying the pressure down to 3 =
bar). We are using 2.0 mil thick Dynachem AT resist. Roll speed is 2.7 =
meter/min. The 18" x 24" panels are run with the 24" edge leading. We =
use recoated lamination rolls, but the problem occurs even with new =
lamination rolls.=20
Any help with this problem is greatly appreciated.
Bernie
------=_NextPart_000_014D_01BD8AE8.9AD77860
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.2106.6"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Hello Technetters:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>I have a Hakuto cut sheet laminator =
(1500C) with=20
a small (?) problem. I periodically get wrinkled resist on the trailing =
edge of=20
the panels. The panels being laminated are 0.062" thick outer =
layers. The=20
problem shows up as the trailing edge of the dry film resist passes =
around the=20
1/4 moon shaped film guide. The trailing edge of the resist should be =
smooth and=20
flush to the film guide. On one of our two machines, the center of the =
trailing=20
edge is "baggy" rather than flush against the film guide. The =
problem=20
occurs on the upper and lower sides. Generally, this does not cause any =
defects=20
because the resist smoothes out on the panel. But, occasionally, the =
resist=20
wrinkles, especially over holes, 0.150" dia and larger. We see =
defects such=20
as shorts and tent failures depending on the severity of the wrinkles.=20
T</FONT><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>he bagginess occurs every panel, =
t<FONT=20
color=3D#000000 size=3D2>he wrinkles occur only very occasionally. =
</FONT><FONT=20
color=3D#000000 size=3D2>This problem has been looked at by equipment =
service rep,=20
and we still have the problem. </FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2><FONT color=3D#000000 =
size=3D2></FONT></FONT><FONT=20
color=3D#000000 size=3D2>We are operating the laminator with the =
following=20
parameters: </FONT><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>The panels are =
preheated to=20
115-120 F. The lamination roll temperature is 115 C (but we have tried =
lower=20
temperature 105 C). The lamination roll pressure is 4.5 bar (but we have =
tried=20
varying the pressure down to 3 bar). We are using 2.0 mil thick Dynachem =
AT=20
resist. Roll speed is 2.7 meter/min. The 18" x 24" panels are =
run with=20
the 24" edge leading. We use recoated lamination rolls, but the =
problem=20
occurs even with new lamination rolls. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Any help with this problem is =
greatly=20
appreciated.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Bernie</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:23:54 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Doug Alcoe <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Doug Alcoe <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Hakuto 1500C & 610i - Dry Film Cut Sheet Laminator
X-To: bernie <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001D_01BD8A7E.EAA90620"
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_001D_01BD8A7E.EAA90620
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Does the baggy-ness look like the bags under an old persons eyes??
It is imprtant to fully describe the problems "side effects" too.
please give more info. =20
Thanks, Doug
Date: Thursday, May 28, 1998 8:16 PM
Subject: [TN] Hakuto 1500C & 610i - Dry Film Cut Sheet Laminator
=20
=20
Hello Technetters:
I have a Hakuto cut sheet laminator (1500C) with a small (?) =
problem. I periodically get wrinkled resist on the trailing edge of the =
panels. The panels being laminated are 0.062" thick outer layers. The =
problem shows up as the trailing edge of the dry film resist passes =
around the 1/4 moon shaped film guide. The trailing edge of the resist =
should be smooth and flush to the film guide. On one of our two =
machines, the center of the trailing edge is "baggy" rather than flush =
against the film guide. The problem occurs on the upper and lower sides. =
Generally, this does not cause any defects because the resist smoothes =
out on the panel. But, occasionally, the resist wrinkles, especially =
over holes, 0.150" dia and larger. We see defects such as shorts and =
tent failures depending on the severity of the wrinkles. The bagginess =
occurs every panel, the wrinkles occur only very occasionally. This =
problem has been looked at by equipment service rep, and we still have =
the problem.=20
We are operating the laminator with the following parameters: The =
panels are preheated to 115-120 F. The lamination roll temperature is =
115 C (but we have tried lower temperature 105 C). The lamination roll =
pressure is 4.5 bar (but we have tried varying the pressure down to 3 =
bar). We are using 2.0 mil thick Dynachem AT resist. Roll speed is 2.7 =
meter/min. The 18" x 24" panels are run with the 24" edge leading. We =
use recoated lamination rolls, but the problem occurs even with new =
lamination rolls.=20
Any help with this problem is greatly appreciated.
=20
Bernie
------=_NextPart_000_001D_01BD8A7E.EAA90620
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 =
HTML//EN">
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.2106.6"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Does the baggy-ness look like the =
bags under an=20
old persons eyes??</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2></FONT><FONT size=3D2>It is imprtant =
to fully=20
describe the problems "side effects" =
too.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>please give more=20
info. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT=20
size=3D2> &nbs=
p;  =
; =20
Thanks, Doug</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: =
5px">
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><B>Date: </B>Thursday, May 28, 1998 =
8:16=20
PM<BR><B>Subject: </B>[TN] Hakuto 1500C & 610i - Dry Film Cut =
Sheet=20
Laminator<BR><BR></DIV></FONT>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Hello Technetters:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>I have a Hakuto cut sheet =
laminator (1500C)=20
with a small (?) problem. I periodically get wrinkled resist on the =
trailing=20
edge of the panels. The panels being laminated are 0.062" thick =
outer=20
layers. The problem shows up as the trailing edge of the dry film =
resist=20
passes around the 1/4 moon shaped film guide. The trailing edge of =
the=20
resist should be smooth and flush to the film guide. On one of our =
two=20
machines, the center of the trailing edge is "baggy" =
rather than=20
flush against the film guide. The problem occurs on the upper and =
lower=20
sides. Generally, this does not cause any defects because the resist =
smoothes out on the panel. But, occasionally, the resist wrinkles,=20
especially over holes, 0.150" dia and larger. We see defects =
such as=20
shorts and tent failures depending on the severity of the wrinkles.=20
T</FONT><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>he bagginess occurs every =
panel, t<FONT=20
color=3D#000000 size=3D2>he wrinkles occur only very occasionally. =
</FONT><FONT=20
color=3D#000000 size=3D2>This problem has been looked at by =
equipment service=20
rep, and we still have the problem. </FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2><FONT color=3D#000000=20
size=3D2></FONT></FONT><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>We are =
operating the=20
laminator with the following parameters: </FONT><FONT =
color=3D#000000=20
size=3D2>The panels are preheated to 115-120 F. The lamination roll=20
temperature is 115 C (but we have tried lower temperature 105 C). =
The=20
lamination roll pressure is 4.5 bar (but we have tried varying the =
pressure=20
down to 3 bar). We are using 2.0 mil thick Dynachem AT resist. Roll =
speed is=20
2.7 meter/min. The 18" x 24" panels are run with the =
24" edge=20
leading. We use recoated lamination rolls, but the problem occurs =
even with=20
new lamination rolls. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Any help with this problem is =
greatly=20
appreciated.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 =
size=3D2>Bernie</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 19:27:21 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"William E. Johnson" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "William E. Johnson" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Need source
X-To: [log in to unmask]
I recommend Kyocera. Please contact me if you would like further info.
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 23:29:06 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Passive Shear tests
X-To: "Joy, Stephen C" <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
JOY,
We use a Dage Microtester outfitted with the appropriate " force arm" into
which we fit a small metal rod that had been flattened at one end to allow
it to fit in under a 1206, 0805 or 0603 to shear them off. We have been
doing this for ten years with great success. It can also be done using an
Instron or other large tensile tester, although the jig you may need to
build to hold the board or partial board might be more interesting. Dage is
a British company and their equipment has generally been used for testing
wire bonds, using different force arms. Their American office is in
California some where. There is also an American company that makes a piece
of equipment called the Sebastian 5 that also does a good job. I think they
are in either Oregon or Washington state. I 'm doing this from home and I
don't have my files.
regards,
Bev Christian
Nortel
> ----------
> From: Joy, Stephen C[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Thursday, May 28, 1998 3:52 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Passive Shear tests
>
> Does anyone have any experience with shear testing on 0603's;
> 0805's or BGA devices? What is the methodology?
> Thanks in advance,
> Steve Joy
>
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>
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 08:50:37 +0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"BPL-PCB, Doddaballapur" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "BPL-PCB, Doddaballapur" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: SUPPLIER FOR SCREEN COATING CHEMICALS
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
DEAR FRIENDS,
I AM LOOKING FOR SOURCE FOR PURCHASING SCREEN COATING EMULSIONS, MESH
CLOTHS, CLEANING CHEMICALS AND OTHER RELATED PRODUCTS OF SCREEN MAKING
FACILITY USED
FOR PWB MANUFACTURING.
KINDLY SEND ADDRESS OR FAX NO. OF THE SUPPLIER.
WITH ADVANCE THANKS
K.CHANDRABOSE
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 00:31:10 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Spec'ing Resisitivity on Plating Material
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Valerie,
If the application is high frequency, then your customer may be more
interested in the plating material. As signal frequency increases, the signal
concentrates less and less in the center of the conductor and moves to the
surface of the conductor. The amount of penetration in to the conductor is
called the skin depth and is a function of frequency, permeability of the
conductor, and resistivity of the conductor.
To sum it up, at high enough frequencies, the plating may become the dominant
conductor.
Good luck,
Frank
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 14:30:34 +0930
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jeremy POLLARD <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jeremy POLLARD <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: BGA Footprint
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hello,
am hoping that someone out there has experience with BGA footprints.
We have completed Rev 1 of a double Eurocard PCB, 10 Layers with 7 x 356 pin BGA devices on board. While everything went well with this run and we had no problems with ball connections, it is impossible to perform any rework or modifications if required.
The footprint was the recommended pad with track out to a via or " Dog bone". On the next revision we would like to do the following, Elimnate the "dogbone", place a through hole in the actual pad for the ball and adjust the solder paste stencil so that the volume of paste deposited allows for the hole through the board.
I would use a hole size of 0.3mm (12mil) to 0.4mm(16mil) certainly no larger.
This approach should enable us to rework dodgy joints from the solder side of the PCB
It will also allow us access possibly to test the pins from the BGA.
Has anyone done this ?
Was it succesfull in a production environment ?
Many thanks foryour help.
regards
jeremy
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 02:18:03 -0400
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Hugh Scott Miller <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Far East Enterprises
Subject: Properties of Probimer 52 Soldermask
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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I am trying to determine the differences between Probimer-52 and other
soldermasks (Tamura, Taiyo, etc.). I understand that application
techniques differ, as Probimer requires a curtain coating process, while
the others can be sprayed, etc. Are there significant differences
between Probimer-52 and others? If so, what are they? Is one better
then the other? I am trying to make an argument for the changing to a
more conventional S/M and any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks for all of your help in advance.
Best Regards
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 16:34:03 +1000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Colin Weber <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Colin Weber <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: RLP532A (PQFP-132) Land Pattern
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I have a land pattern design for a 132 pin PQFP, 386EX chip.
The Z & G Land Pattern dimensions this device was layed out for
are inset by a total of 0.6mm, when compared to the specifications
outlined in the IPC-SM782 standard. In other words the pads need
to come out by a further 0.3mm each side to meet the same specs as
IPC.
This is a fine pitch device, 0.635mm spacing between pads.
Question 1: What effect would or could this have upon the assembly
line? We use HAL finish. Ie. Could there be reliability
problems with mounting the package?
Question 2: Does this FP device require a better surface than a
HAL finish, say Flash Gold or Alpha level?
The reasons I am asking is because we are having boards comming in
with faults. The fine pitch devices seem to be causing the most
problems.
One symptom we are experiencing is some pads on components are shiny,
some are dull, even to the extent this would occur on the same package.
Also connectors are troublesome. Our production boards don't appear to
exibit the same problems, however, our assembly house confirm that they
only temperature profile production boards, not these prototype ones.
The particular board which is consistently causing trouble is a 6 layer
SMT, processor board. Could ground planes in internal layers, underneath
the devices cause heatsinking problems for HAL finished boards?
Any thoughts or comments are most welcome.
Regards,
Colin Weber
---------------------------------------------
Cad/Cam Specialist
Research and Development
Varian Australia P/L
679 Springvale Road, Mulgrave,
Victoria 3170, Australia.Varian OSI
ph +61 3 9566 1409 (Voice Mail)
ph +61 3 9560 7133
Fax +61 3 9560 7950
E-Mail [log in to unmask]
Internet Home Page http://www.osi.varian.com
---------------------------------------------
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 07:33:58 -0000
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
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From: "(No Name Available)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: signoff technet
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________________________________________________
»¶ÓÄúʹÓùãÖÝÊÓ´°Ãâ·Ñµç×ÓÓÊÏähttp://www.163.net
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 10:29:26 +0200
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jorg Richstein <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jorg Richstein <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: RLP532A (PQFP-132) Land Pattern
X-To: Colin Weber <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: multipart/mixed;
Boundary="0__=GNaZ5yiVb1806MhLGUCwVMYIYWVaX6ryjVEqRGHZzU8q3yZxTga365bU"
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Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Disposition: inline
Colin
We have converted for these kind of geometries IC from HAL to flash gold
applications and generally speaking with good results. Do you have other FP
or FP similar geometries on this board? If so, and if they show no similar
problems you can probably exclude assembly process problems of your vendor
and home in on pcb design issues (like your mentioned heat sinking one).
J
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=F6rg
=
--0__=GNaZ5yiVb1806MhLGUCwVMYIYWVaX6ryjVEqRGHZzU8q3yZxTga365bU--
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 09:29:00 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mark Gillan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mark Gillan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Properties of Probimer 52 Solde
The following is based soley on my experience of Soldermask Processing,
please feel free to correct any inaccuracies.
We currently process Soldermask using P52 with 91h and aqueous systems,
Taiyo,Carapace etc..
The main differance is the base chemistry, Probimer 52 is epoxy based where
Taiyo, Tamura etc. are aqueous based.
Yes, P52 is normally curtain coated, it also requires specific chemistry for
developing (4-Butyrolacetone) which is a one part solvent which can be
recliamed to reduce costs. Aqueous systems can use a sodium carbonate
solution which is much cheaper.
P52 has a "very" long exposure time up to 60 sec on 7kW ORC units, again
aqueous systems require a lesser exposure time period on a 5kW lamp.
Holding fine webs is also harder using P52, typically you will have to start
adjusting exposure time v dev speed to achieve less than 6 thou webs. Taiyo
will process 4 thou with only an increase in exposure time.
Cure time for P52 is approx. 2 hours @ 150degC. Taiyo cures @ 150degC for 1
hour.
So why use P52?
On the plus side assembly shops are usually happy with the finish due to
the resilient (hardness of 6+) and very matt finish (low to non existant
solderballing). The electrical breakdown voltage is typically higher than
3kV which customers producing High volatge boards like. Aqueous systems are
about 0.5 to 2 kV in my experience.
One other point is cost, our experience shows that P52 can be more expensive
per sq foot than an aqueous system.
If you are looking to intrduce P52, then I would recommend 52CSM as the
solvent carrier is less toxic and finer webs are easier to attain.
If you require further info please email direct.
Mark Gillan
Process Engineer
Prestwick Circuits Ltd.
Scotland UK.
[log in to unmask]
----------
From: pacrim
To: TechNet
Subject: [TN] Properties of Probimer 52 Soldermas
Date: 29 May 1998 07:27
I am trying to determine the differences between Probimer-52 and other
soldermasks (Tamura, Taiyo, etc.). I understand that application
techniques differ, as Probimer requires a curtain coating process, while
the others can be sprayed, etc. Are there significant differences
between Probimer-52 and others? If so, what are they? Is one better
then the other? I am trying to make an argument for the changing to a
more conventional S/M and any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks for all of your help in advance.
Best Regards
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 12:11:35 +0900
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Kuwako, Fujio(MMS)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Kuwako, Fujio(MMS)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Need Test Labo. Information
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Greetings,
We need to test Dielectric Constant and Dissipation Factor
of the polymer material for mobile phone at the frequency up
to 10 GHz. Does anybody tell us who can test for us?
Kuwako
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 07:55:06 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
TOM HYBISKE <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: TOM HYBISKE <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: ? for Visula CAD users
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Good Morning,
I would like to speak to anyone using Zuken-Redac Visula CAD on a HP
9000/735 workstation running 10.2 O/S. I'm having problems with the shell
environments. Please contact me off-line. Thanks!
Tom Hybiske
General Atronics Corp.
Wyndmoor, PA
[log in to unmask]
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 08:04:26 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: BGA Footprint
X-To: Jeremy POLLARD <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Jeremy,
My guess is you will still get some solder wicking down the hole. Anyone
else try this yet? But I don't understand why you can't rework your BGAs,
not that you should have to rework many anyway. AirVac, SRT, Conceptronics
and others make very nice equipment for BGA rework.
regards,
Bev Christian
> ----------
> From: Jeremy POLLARD[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Friday, May 29, 1998 1:00 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] BGA Footprint
>
> Hello,
> am hoping that someone out there has experience with BGA footprints.
>
> We have completed Rev 1 of a double Eurocard PCB, 10 Layers with 7 x 356
> pin BGA devices on board. While everything went well with this run and we
> had no problems with ball connections, it is impossible to perform any
> rework or modifications if required.
> The footprint was the recommended pad with track out to a via or " Dog
> bone". On the next revision we would like to do the following, Elimnate
> the "dogbone", place a through hole in the actual pad for the ball and
> adjust the solder paste stencil so that the volume of paste deposited
> allows for the hole through the board.
> I would use a hole size of 0.3mm (12mil) to 0.4mm(16mil) certainly no
> larger.
> This approach should enable us to rework dodgy joints from the solder side
> of the PCB
> It will also allow us access possibly to test the pins from the BGA.
>
> Has anyone done this ?
> Was it succesfull in a production environment ?
>
> Many thanks foryour help.
>
> regards
>
> jeremy
>
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> information.
> For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
> 847-509-9700 ext.312
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>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 08:24:00 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Meigs, Jonathan" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Meigs, Jonathan" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: DST Foil
X-To: JB <[log in to unmask]>
DSTF is an acronym for Drum Side Treated Foil, more commonly known as
reverse treated foil. In the past, the matte surface of the foil (the
side not electroformed on the cathode) was treated to improve adhesion.
This surface has a higher profile than the shiny (or drum) side of the
foil. By treating the shiny side of teh foil with an adhesion promoting
structure, many advantages are seen ins subsequent processing.
Please contact me off-line if you are interested in more detail.
Jonathan Meigs
Product Development Engineer
AlliedSignal Oak-Mitsui
[log in to unmask]
(518) 686-8019
----------
>>>From: JB
>>>To: [log in to unmask]
>>>Subject: Re: [TN] DST Foil
>>>Date: Thursday, May 28, 1998 6:22PM
>>>
>>>At 06:41 28.05.98 -0700, you wrote:
>>>>Hello Techneters
>>>>
>>>>I wonder what are the advantages of DSTF which make this type of
>>>>copper finish gaining so much popularity?
>>>
>>>What is DSTF?
>>>
>>>Jens
>>>
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>>>################################################################
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information.
>>>For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at
>>>[log in to unmask] or 847-509-9700 ext.312
>>>################################################################
>>>
>>>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 13:32:00 +0000
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Mark Gillan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Mark Gillan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Properties of Probimer 52 Solde
X-To: "Poulin, Michel" <[log in to unmask]>
----------
From: Poulin, Michel
To: 'Mark Gillan'
Subject: RE: [TN] Properties of Probimer 52 Solde
Date: 29 May 1998 12:58
Mark,
Very good summary. So good that I've erase mty own answer...
A quick question :
We are looking to move from PR 52 91 to PR 52C. You've
mentioned it will make finer resolution. What can be really achieve
with PR52C and under which conditions ??
Our experience of CSM is based upon a trial we conducted several months
ago. The results showed an improved web perfomance with our current
process for 52 with 91h. In reality I would expect 4thou webs to be the
norm, and 2-3 thou achievable after adjustments to the process.
Does it need a UV bump ?
This will reduce exposure cycle time, I have been told by Ciba that a
50% reduction is not unrealistic, but, I would like to see that in use.
Does it need 12-15 C developer temp. ?
No, we ran perfectly well with 16-18 C, it may help with 2-3 thou webs
though?
Generally CSM performed better in a trial than standard 52. Long
term evaluation however may highlight issues which dont appear in a
trial.
Hope this helps and good luck.
Mark Gillan
Process Engineer
Prestwick Circuits Ltd,
Scotland UK.
Email: [log in to unmask]
> ----------
> From: Mark Gillan[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Mark Gillan
> Sent: Friday, May 29, 1998 5:29 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Properties of Probimer 52 Solde
>
> The following is based soley on my experience of Soldermask
> Processing,
> please feel free to correct any inaccuracies.
>
> We currently process Soldermask using P52 with 91h and aqueous
> systems,
> Taiyo,Carapace etc..
>
> The main differance is the base chemistry, Probimer 52 is epoxy based
> where
> Taiyo, Tamura etc. are aqueous based.
>
> Yes, P52 is normally curtain coated, it also requires specific
> chemistry for
> developing (4-Butyrolacetone) which is a one part solvent which can be
> recliamed to reduce costs. Aqueous systems can use a sodium carbonate
> solution which is much cheaper.
>
> P52 has a "very" long exposure time up to 60 sec on 7kW ORC units,
> again
> aqueous systems require a lesser exposure time period on a 5kW lamp.
>
> Holding fine webs is also harder using P52, typically you will have to
> start
> adjusting exposure time v dev speed to achieve less than 6 thou webs.
> Taiyo
> will process 4 thou with only an increase in exposure time.
> Cure time for P52 is approx. 2 hours @ 150degC. Taiyo cures @ 150degC
> for 1
> hour.
>
> So why use P52?
>
> On the plus side assembly shops are usually happy with the finish due
> to
> the resilient (hardness of 6+) and very matt finish (low to non
> existant
> solderballing). The electrical breakdown voltage is typically higher
> than
> 3kV which customers producing High volatge boards like. Aqueous
> systems are
> about 0.5 to 2 kV in my experience.
>
> One other point is cost, our experience shows that P52 can be more
> expensive
> per sq foot than an aqueous system.
> If you are looking to intrduce P52, then I would recommend 52CSM as
> the
> solvent carrier is less toxic and finer webs are easier to attain.
>
> If you require further info please email direct.
>
> Mark Gillan
> Process Engineer
> Prestwick Circuits Ltd.
> Scotland UK.
>
> [log in to unmask]
> ----------
> From: pacrim
> To: TechNet
> Subject: [TN] Properties of Probimer 52 Soldermas
> Date: 29 May 1998 07:27
>
> I am trying to determine the differences between Probimer-52 and other
> soldermasks (Tamura, Taiyo, etc.). I understand that application
> techniques differ, as Probimer requires a curtain coating process,
> while
> the others can be sprayed, etc. Are there significant differences
> between Probimer-52 and others? If so, what are they? Is one better
> then the other? I am trying to make an argument for the changing to a
> more conventional S/M and any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks for all of your help in advance.
>
> Best Regards
>
> ################################################################
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> 1.8c
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> ################################################################
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> additional
> information.
> For technical support contact Hugo Scaramuzza at [log in to unmask] or
> 847-509-9700 ext.312
> ################################################################
>
> ################################################################
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 07:48:23 -0600
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Oven Heat Loading Clarification
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
All,
To clarify my earlier posting....
It isn't that our oven has ever exhibited heat loading=20
problems. In fact, I plan on some heat loading experiments=20
to prove this. I just have an external customer who likes=20
to help. The problem is they are 100% convinced of the=20
following:
1) We absolutely have to have nitrogen on our reflow oven.
2) We have to place buffer boards before and after each=20
production assembly or else our heaters won't handle the=20
load properly.
I do appreciate all the responses so far, although more=20
opinions are welcomed and encouraged.
Thank you all for your help.
Steve McBride
[log in to unmask]
(405) 624-5281
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 15:08:45 +0200
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: What wood would a woodpeck peck?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=openmail-part-01a78542-00000002
--openmail-part-01a78542-00000002
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; name="What"
Content-Disposition: inline; filename="What"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Everybody, good day.
Does a woodpeck prefer hickory or limetree? And does a automatic wire
bonding machine prefer hard gold or soft gold? From the metaphor to the
problem: Our board supplier is a very good one, I think, but our special=
headache is not his, at least not yet. We design with Teflon-on-Brass
plates (US-made). On the Teflon (in fact Teflon mixed with ceramic and
glass etc) there is a Copper layer. This copper layer is etched and
Nickel plated. Finally you put electrolytic Gold on. The process is
such, that both the Nickel and the Gold becomes too hard for gold ball
wire ultrasonic bonding. Wanted hardness is 100 HV. The hardness from
supplier X is 450HV. The question is: what is possible to do in the
board processing steps? I know that the chemistry of Nickel-and Gold
baths is a mysterious world, current density plays a r=F4le, heat
treatments also and a lot of other things. But we don't have the time to=
experiment weeks and months. Is there someone with a woodpeck's
experience?
Ingemar Hernefjord
Ericsson Microwave Systems
Sweden
--openmail-part-01a78542-00000002
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d2VkZW59fQ==
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 08:16:24 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: nitrogen reflow soldering
X-cc: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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I just came across another article which may be of interest to all who were
interested in the Rahn article from the SMTA.
"Nitrogen Reflow Soldering: Testing at Canon Bretagne, France" was
published in the May, '98 Newsletter of the Tri-City (Quebec) SMTA Chapter
. Please contact editor Andr=E9 Bisson at <[log in to unmask]> to ask for a
reprint of this article.
Regards,
-David
David Gonnerman
Director of Publications
Plan now to attend:
Surface Mount International (San Jose, CA; 8/23-8/27)
Electronics Assembly Expo (Providence, RI; 10/24-10/29)
SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
Enabling members to achieve success
in surface mount and companion technologies
through education, training and access to knowledge.
5200 Willson Road, Suite 215, Edina, MN 55424-1343
612-920-7682 F 612-926-1819
[log in to unmask] www.smta.org
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 08:24:44 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Josh Moody <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Hakuto 1500C & 610i - Dry Film Cut Sheet Laminator
X-To: bernie <[log in to unmask]>
In-Reply-To: <016001bd8b12$9c32f7a0$c5f01ece@default>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii"
Have you thoroughly cleaned the small vacuum holes on the
rounded platen recently? You can ususally use a straightened
paper clip to do this. Simply slide the straightened end
into each individual hole and remove. The helps to remove
any resist buildup that has been collecting. Remember take
your time when you do this as you do not want to damage
any of these holes.
Good luck,
At 10:00 AM 5/29/98 -0500, you wrote:
>>>>
<excerpt><smaller>Hello Technetters:
I have a Hakuto cut sheet laminator (1500C) with a small (?) problem. I
periodically get wrinkled resist on the trailing edge of the panels. The
panels being laminated are 0.062" thick outer layers. The problem shows
up as the trailing edge of the dry film resist passes around the 1/4 moon
shaped film guide. The trailing edge of the resist should be smooth and
flush to the film guide. On one of our two machines, the center of the
trailing edge is "baggy" rather than flush against the film guide. The
problem occurs on the upper and lower sides. Generally, this does not
cause any defects because the resist smoothes out on the panel. But,
occasionally, the resist wrinkles, especially over holes, 0.150" dia and
larger. We see defects such as shorts and tent failures depending on the
severity of the wrinkles. The bagginess occurs every panel, the wrinkles
occur only very occasionally. This problem has been looked at by
equipment service rep, and we still have the problem.
We are operating the laminator with the following parameters: The panels
are preheated to 115-120 F. The lamination roll temperature is 115 C (but
we have tried lower temperature 105 C). The lamination roll pressure is
4.5 bar (but we have tried varying the pressure down to 3 bar). We are
using 2.0 mil thick Dynachem AT resist. Roll speed is 2.7 meter/min. The
18" x 24" panels are run with the 24" edge leading. We use recoated
lamination rolls, but the problem occurs even with new lamination rolls.
Any help with this problem is greatly appreciated.
</smaller>
<smaller>Bernie
</smaller>
</excerpt><<<<<<<<
Josh Moody
Materials Quality Engineer
Hewlett-Packard - Richardson (HPSD)
ph# (972) 497-4617
[log in to unmask]
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 09:26:35 EDT
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Oven Heat Loading Clarification
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Steve -
Thanks for the clarification (and likely vindication of your oven). Sounds
like your customer had a dubious experience with an earlier IR or
IR/Convection oven. These were very sensitive to loading and not nearly as
efficient as today's Convection Dominant ovens in terms of heat transfer
capability. Definitely do the tests and if you need guidance in test
specifics, contact me off the Technet.
As far as absolutely needing nitrogen - not likely. Unless you are using an
oxygen sensitive material in your assembly that requires a reduced oxygen -
inert atmosphere (a particular no-clean formulation or OSP) nitrogen is not an
absolute requirement. There has been quite a bit written about this as well
as posted to the Technet so I won;t bother re-iterating it now. I have an
article or two on it on my Website and Heller has a paper as well (See their
website).
So much for the customer always being right....
Regards,
Phil Zarrow
ITM, Inc.
Durham, NH USA
www.ITM-SMT.com
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 09:34:10 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"James W. High" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "James W. High" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Need source
X-To: DAVID MANDER <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Popular sources for alumina are:
1. Accumet Engineering Corporation
Hudson, MA
508-568-8311
2. CeramTec North America
Mansfield, MA
800-821-0155
At 03:36 PM 5/28/98 -0500, you wrote:
>Has anyone heard of a product called "Alumina"? I believe it may be
>a ceramic based substrate, aluminum clad. If anyone has heard of
>this product or knows a contact, I would appreciate it. You can
>respond to me directly at [log in to unmask]
>Thanks.
>
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>
>
>
_________________________________________________________________________
HIGH, JAMES W. [log in to unmask]
Mail Stop 390 Microelectronics & Tech Support Section
1 East Durand Street Fabrication Division
NASA Langley Research Center Building 1238, Room 155
Hampton, VA 23681-2199 Phone 757-864-5416
FAX 757-864-8092
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 08:29:52 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Charles Barker <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Oven Heat Loading Clarification
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Charles Barker@I-O INC
05/29/98 08:29 AM
Steve,
We are running two HVN102's without Nitrogen and an HVA70. We have never
run any type of "buffer" board thru any of the machines.
Has your customer been brainwashed by a prior supplier, perhaps?
I have come across people who were burned by an incidence where a supplier
let a process get out of control. The supplier then blamed the "chemistry,
process, etc." Those people now think that that "chemistry, process, etc."
is no good and should be forever banned.
You have to find a way to "brainflush" them. If they have a closed mind,
that can be quite a challenge!
Good luck.
Charlie B.
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to [log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Charles Barker/US/I-O INC)
Subject: [TN] Oven Heat Loading Clarification
All,
To clarify my earlier posting....
It isn't that our oven has ever exhibited heat loading
problems. In fact, I plan on some heat loading experiments
to prove this. I just have an external customer who likes
to help. The problem is they are 100% convinced of the
following:
1) We absolutely have to have nitrogen on our reflow oven.
2) We have to place buffer boards before and after each
production assembly or else our heaters won't handle the
load properly.
I do appreciate all the responses so far, although more
opinions are welcomed and encouraged.
Thank you all for your help.
Steve McBride
[log in to unmask]
(405) 624-5281
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 08:53:36 PM
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
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From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: ª½¾P·s§Q¾¹,
«í³Ó©÷(»´ä)¦³¤½¥q
HENG SHING CHEONG (HONG KONG) CO.LTD
(»´ä¿ì¨Æ³B):©ô¨¤³qµæµó1¸¹A«Â¹F°Ó·~¤j·H2210«Ç
¹q¸Ü:(852)-29524932,83331002
_________________________________________________________________
ª½¾P·s§Q¾¹,
·s¦¨¥\¥«³õ¦æ¾P
±z¬O§_¸g±`¬°¦p¦ó©Ý®i¦æ¾PºÞ¹D¶Ë¸£µ¬?
¥Zµn³ø¯È,Âø»x¼s§i©Î¶l±H¢Ò¢Û¬O§_¤w¸gµLªk¹F¦¨±z¹w´Áªº¼s§i®ÄªG?
»P¨ä±N®É¶¡©Mª÷¿ú¯Ó¶O¦b¦¨®Ä¤£¹üªºÂ¦³¦æ¾P¤è¦¡¤W,«Øij±z»°ºò¥t´M·s¦n
¤èªk¨Ó¨ú¥N²{¦æªº¼s§i¦æ¾P¤è¦¡.¦]¬°¥Ø«e¼s§i¸ê°T¥ÆÀݶDzμs§i¦æ¾P¤è¦¡
¯Ó¶O¤Ó¦h¤H¤Oª«¤O¦Ó¼s§i¶O¥Î©M¼s§i®Ä¯q©¹©¹¤£¦¨¥¿¤ñ¦]¦¹³\¦h¤j¤½¥q¸g¹L
¼f·Vµû¦ô«á³£¤w§ï±Ä³Ì¬°¸gÀÙ§Ö³t¥B®ÄªG§ó¦nªº"¢Ó¡Ð¢Û¢Ï¢×¢Ú¼s§i¦æ¾P¡¨¤]
´N¬O--- ºô»Úºô¸ô¢Ò¢Ûµo°e¼s§i "
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¥þ®M¦æ¾P¤u¨ã¥X°â,Åý§AÅܨ¦¨¬°SUPER SALES.
°ª³tµo¹q¶l³n¥ó.¨Ï¥Î²³æ(¦³¨Ï¥Î»¡©ú)
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(°e)¥xÆW¤¤Q¸U¥÷E-MAIL«H½c¦a§}.
(°e)¥@¬É¤G¦Ê¸U¥÷E-MAIL«H½c¦a§}.
*§ó¥i¥Ã»·§K¶O§ó·s(¬ù¨C¤ë¤Q¸U¥÷)*
*(¦A°e¥þ´ä98¦~¤u°Ó·~15¸U¥÷¶Ç¯u¸¹½X³s³n¥ó)*
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(¥þ®M¥u°â$1300)
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 08:41:09 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Nickel foil
X-To: John Waite <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
There's a Polyonics in New Hampshire at 603-352-1415.
-David
At 07:22 PM 5/28/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Talk to a company in Newburyport, Massachusetts, USA. Their name is
Polyonics. Fred Hoover is
>the president. I apologize that I do not have the number handy, but if
you can't get it, Email
>me and I will locate. Polyonics may be able to help or refer you to
someone who can. JOHN WAITE
>
>Colin wrote:
>
>> Fellow Technetters,
>>
>> I have had a request from one of my UK customers, where it would be
>> possible to source FULLY ANNEALED nickel foil.
>>
>> He is looking for 18uM thick foil, treated preferably on both sides, but
>> one will suffice, in panel sizes around 18" x 12" or 24" x 18".
>>
>> Any leads as to where I might get this material, either in Europe or
>> Stateside?
>>
>> Either reply via TechNet, or off-line.
>>
>> Thanks in advance.
>>
>> Colin McVean
>> Polyclad Technical Services UK
>>
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>
David Gonnerman
Director of Publications
Plan now to attend:
Surface Mount International (San Jose, CA; 8/23-8/27)
Electronics Assembly Expo (Providence, RI; 10/24-10/29)
SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
Enabling members to achieve success
in surface mount and companion technologies
through education, training and access to knowledge.
5200 Willson Road, Suite 215, Edina, MN 55424-1343
612-920-7682 F 612-926-1819
[log in to unmask] www.smta.org
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 08:52:05 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Gonnerman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Nitrogen reflow soldering
X-cc: [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Regarding that "Nitrogen Reflow Soldering: Testing at Canon Bretagne,
France" article in the SMTA's Tri-City Newsletter, you could contact Martin
Theriault (one of the authors) in Dallas at
[log in to unmask] The paper was originally presented at
this year's NEPCON West.
-David
David Gonnerman
Director of Publications
Plan now to attend:
Surface Mount International (San Jose, CA; 8/23-8/27)
Electronics Assembly Expo (Providence, RI; 10/24-10/29)
SURFACE MOUNT TECHNOLOGY ASSOCIATION
Enabling members to achieve success
in surface mount and companion technologies
through education, training and access to knowledge.
5200 Willson Road, Suite 215, Edina, MN 55424-1343
612-920-7682 F 612-926-1819
[log in to unmask] www.smta.org
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 10:01:41 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"James W. High" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "James W. High" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: SUPPLIER FOR SCREEN COATING CHEMICALS
X-To: "BPL-PCB, Doddaballapur" <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Two sources for screen making supplies are:
1. Majestec Corp.
800-431-2200
http://www.majestech.com/
2. Ulano
800-221-0616
http://www.ulano.com/
At 08:50 AM 5/28/98 +0500, you wrote:
>DEAR FRIENDS,
>
>I AM LOOKING FOR SOURCE FOR PURCHASING SCREEN COATING EMULSIONS, MESH
>CLOTHS, CLEANING CHEMICALS AND OTHER RELATED PRODUCTS OF SCREEN MAKING
>FACILITY USED
>FOR PWB MANUFACTURING.
>
>KINDLY SEND ADDRESS OR FAX NO. OF THE SUPPLIER.
>
>WITH ADVANCE THANKS
>
>K.CHANDRABOSE
>
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>################################################################
>
>
>
_________________________________________________________________________
HIGH, JAMES W. [log in to unmask]
Mail Stop 390 Microelectronics & Tech Support Section
1 East Durand Street Fabrication Division
NASA Langley Research Center Building 1238, Room 155
Hampton, VA 23681-2199 Phone 757-864-5416
FAX 757-864-8092
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 08:59:52 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Fwd: [TN] Holis Wave Soldering Machine
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Collin,
Without sounding like an advertisment, we supply parts and service for
Hollis, as well as other soldering and cleaning equipment as well.
Please feel free to contact me offline if you are interested in saving some
time and money in the future.
Regards,
Ed Popielarski
QTA Machine
Ph: (949) 581-6601
Fx: (949) 581-2448
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
YOU WROTE:
Hi Folks,
I am interested in spare parts for Hollis Wave Soldering Equipment,
the MKIII in particular.
Can anyone recommend or even supply a name - address of a supplier
retailer?
Help would be very much appreciated.
Best Regards,
Colin Leyden
Senior Engineer
Polaroid (UK) Ltd.
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 09:37:14 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Paul Wilson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Paul Wilson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: source of adhesive coper foil
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Technet:
Does anyone have a list of manufacturer's of adhesive copper tape capable=
of withstanding plating conditions?
Thank you,
Paul Wilson
Plant Chemist
Circuit Center, Inc.
937-435-2131
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 09:56:13 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Christopher Jorgensen <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Christopher Jorgensen <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: DST Foil
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Jens-
DSTF is Drum Side Treated Foil, which is also known as Reverse Treated Foil. DSTF is
foil that is treated on the shiny (drum) side, instead of the more typical matte
side. This technology was invented by Polyclad Laminates, Inc.
The shiny side is then laminated to the core prepreg, leaving the matte side exposed.
DSTF has many advantages:
Non-subtractive pre-cleaning, eliminating the need for microetching, pumice cleaning
or mechanical scrubbing
Improved resist adhesion for higher innerlayer yield
Ultra low profile for cleaner etching and improved board reliability
Erik Bergum, Polyclad, presented a technical paper at Expo '95, which further
explains the advantages of DSTF vs. standard foil.
The technical paper, entitled "Drum Side Treated Foil," is available through the IPC
for $10 for members, and $20 for nonmembers.
Regards-
Chris
Chris Jorgensen
Project Manager
IPC
2215 Sanders Rd.
Northbrook, IL 60062-6135
-p- 847-509-9700 x.328
-f- 847-509-9798
[log in to unmask]
http://www.ipc.org
>>> JB <[log in to unmask]> 05/28/98 08:22PM >>>
At 06:41 28.05.98 -0700, you wrote:
>Hello Techneters
>
>I wonder what are the advantages of DSTF which make this type of
>copper finish gaining so much popularity?
What is DSTF?
Jens
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 09:59:36 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
David Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: David Anderson <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: What wood would a woodpeck peck?
For thermosonic gold ball bonding, you should have pure, soft gold. The
problems that you are seeing are probably due to the materials added to
harden the gold. Thallium, lead, nickel, copper, chrome, or titanium can
all decrease bondability.
Talk to your board vendor, and see if they can plate pure soft gold for the
wire bonding.
There is an article in Volume 20, Number 3 IMAPS Journal regarding
thermosonic gold ball bonding to immersion gold, electroless nickel.
Perhaps this metallization is a possibility. It is more difficult than
bonding to soft pure gold, but it can be done.
Dave Anderson
Medtronic, Inc.
Opinions are my own, and do not necessarily reflect those of my employer.
>>> <[log in to unmask]> 05/29/98 08:08am >>>
Everybody, good day.
Does a woodpeck prefer hickory or limetree? And does a automatic wire
bonding machine prefer hard gold or soft gold? From the metaphor to the
problem: Our board supplier is a very good one, I think, but our special
headache is not his, at least not yet. We design with Teflon-on-Brass
plates (US-made). On the Teflon (in fact Teflon mixed with ceramic and
glass etc) there is a Copper layer. This copper layer is etched and
Nickel plated. Finally you put electrolytic Gold on. The process is
such, that both the Nickel and the Gold becomes too hard for gold ball
wire ultrasonic bonding. Wanted hardness is 100 HV. The hardness from
supplier X is 450HV. The question is: what is possible to do in the
board processing steps? I know that the chemistry of Nickel-and Gold
baths is a mysterious world, current density plays a role, heat
treatments also and a lot of other things. But we don't have the time to
experiment weeks and months. Is there someone with a woodpeck's
experience?
Ingemar Hernefjord
Ericsson Microwave Systems
Sweden
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 10:06:42 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Christopher Jorgensen <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Christopher Jorgensen <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Diameter of Holes in Reinforcement
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Hi TechNetters-
Can anyone help Mr. Dzigan wirh the following question?
As always, thanks for your participation.
Regards-
Chris
> In your document IPC-D-249, Paragraph 3.6.4.4. you state: "Interior holes
> in reinforcment shoud be at least 0.014" larger in diameter than the
> corresponding holes in flex circuit for registration allowance."
>
> We assume that when no diameter of hole is designated on rigid
> reinforcment, the above is valid.
>
> Our question is: Since no maximum diameter is stipulated, may the
> manufacturer of the board use any diameter he wishes (i.e. 10 times that
> size, 0.14" or more) or does the inference reflect 0.014" min. up to
normal
> registration allowance? If so, what would be normal registration
allowance?
>
> In other words: What should be the maximum reinforcement's holes size if
> no maximum is define on the circuit drawing?
>
> Hillel Dzigan - Quality Manager
> Eltek Ltd.
> Phone +972-3-939-5022, Fax +972-3-930-9581
> P.O. Box 159, Petach-Tikva 49101, ISRAEL
Chris Jorgensen
Project Manager
IPC
2215 Sanders Rd.
Northbrook, IL 60062-6135
-p- 847-509-9700 x.328
-f- 847-509-9798
[log in to unmask]
http://www.ipc.org
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 18:08:46 +0300
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Gabriela Bogdan <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Gabriela Bogdan <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ª½¾P·s§Q¾¹,
X-To: [log in to unmask]
MIME-Version: 1.0
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 08:44:35 PDT
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Glenn Pelkey <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Assy: Reliability, exposed copper, and moisture
MIME-Version: 1.0
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I just ran across an article that addresses reliability concerns if moisture
condensation occurs on IC pins with exposed copper. It doesn't go into great
detail, but did have this statement which concerned me,
"...sulfer concentrations as low as parts per trillion (PPT) in the
environment will cause copper sulfide to creep on exposed copper on the IC
pins."
If it's a concern on IC pins, it seems logical to me that any exposed copper
areas would be a concern. This is a different situation than just oxidation
and solderability preservation.
Has anybody heard of this situation or know the extent of this creep? Any
figures as to what the typical sulfur content is in the atmosphere?
Thanks in advance.
Glenn Pelkey, CQE, CRE
Maxtek Components Corp.
P.S. Here's the reference if you want to read the whole article:
"Colder Electronic Circuitry is Less Reliable"
Dan Shelikoff
Honeywell
www.iac.honeywell.com/Pub/Journal/journal_sep96/j99624a.htm
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 10:45:08 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jerry Cupples <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jerry Cupples <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Oven Heat Loading Clarification
X-To: [log in to unmask]
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
[log in to unmask] said:
>It isn't that our oven has ever exhibited heat loading
>problems. In fact, I plan on some heat loading experiments
>to prove this. I just have an external customer who likes
>to help. The problem is they are 100% convinced of the
>following:
>
>1) We absolutely have to have nitrogen on our reflow oven.
This is "absolutely" wrong, unless you have some unusual requirements.
>2) We have to place buffer boards before and after each
>production assembly or else our heaters won't handle the
>load properly.
And this is extremely dubious.
>I do appreciate all the responses so far, although more
>opinions are welcomed and encouraged.
If you look at the instructions of 10 year old lamp or panel emitter heated
furnaces, you would see suggestions regarding the use of dummy boards. This
is to break laminar air layers in the older style of furnace which did not
fan force the air. Especially the first few boards going into an idling
machine. Even in such older furnaces, most of the heat transfer to the work
is due to air (or N2), so when the air mixing is not good, neither is the
thermal gradient on the work.
Regarding N2 use, my experience is that it is of little benefit. In order
to gain the theoretical advantages, you must exclude oxygen to the ppm
level, and this becomes difficult, especially in the cooling. And the work
is unfortunately "contaminated" by oxides and gaseous O2 permeating the
materials before it reaches the furnace. Real life results I have seen were
not nearly so impressive as the lab photos.
And there are many more than two rules of thumb in my experiences regarding
SMT reflow, I'd suggest these in no particular order:
Buy a furnace with sufficient heated length to run at the conveyor rate
necessary to keep up with your placement line. Any longer is just that many
more steps to take a few thousand times in your life, and that many more
motors and bearings to break.
Make sure you have satisfactory exit transfer or built-in cooling to assure
safe handling of boards leaving the heated zone.
Don't pay for thermal transfer, zone isolation, and cooling schemes related
to N2 if you don't intend to use it.
Make sure you have the power distribution in your building to meet the
needs of phase and voltage selection. If possible, run multiphase high
voltage (480 or more) to improve effiency.
Find a furnace which is not too noisy. Stand by one running for an hour or
so to see how noisy it might be.
Compressed air is not cheap and easy to provide on a continuous basis, and
it tends to make some ugly noises.
Look hard at the mechanics of the conveyor drive, this is what will likely
break first.
The difference between car salespersons and SMT equipment salespersons is
that the car people realize when they are lying. ;-)
Your mileage may vary, void in New Jersey, use at your own risk, etc.
Jerry Cupples
Interphase Corporation
Dallas, TX USA
http://www.iphase.com
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 08:56:01 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Bill Davis <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Bill Davis <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Metallized teflon film
X-To: Phil Hersey <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Phil:
The only place I've heard of PTFE, PTA and like materials still being =
metallized is for the space program. I seem to remember that a year or =
two ago in NASA Tech Briefs there was an article which alluded to gold =
as the metallization in the PTFE. Hope this helps...
Dr. Bill
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Phil Hersey [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Thursday, May 28, 1998 1:16 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Metallized teflon film
>=20
> I understand that prior to polyimide, vacuum metallized Teflon film =
was used for flex PCB's.> =A0 Seems to me this would be an excellent RF =
board material in place of=A0 PTFE panel material (at 2 mil thickness a =
50ohm trace would be 6 mil wide).=A0 Has it disappeared totally and if =
so, why?
> =A0=A0=20
> =A0=A0=20
> Phil Hersey
> [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> (702) 884-5388x128=A0
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 13:03:03 -0700
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Edward J. Valentine" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Need source
X-To: DAVID MANDER <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
DAVID MANDER wrote:
>
> Has anyone heard of a product called "Alumina"? I believe it may be
> a ceramic based substrate, aluminum clad. If anyone has heard of
> this product or knows a contact, I would appreciate it. You can
> respond to me directly at [log in to unmask]
> Thanks.
>
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Alumina is the buzzword for Aluminum Oxide, AL2O3, used predominantly
for thick-film "hybrid" substrates. It is also generically called
"ceramic" as in ceramic substrates. Ed Valentine
--
ProTronics, Inc.
861 Old Knight Road
Knightdale, NC 27545
Phone: (919) 217-0007, Fax: (919) 217-0050
http://www.protronics-inc.com
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 13:10:21 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Brad Kendall <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: BGA Footprint
X-To: [log in to unmask]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
As far as getting the initial solder joint to work using this pad you may
be successful. You are obviously aware that you will get solder wicking
into the via and possibly starving your solder joint, but with a PBGA with
eutectic balls you should be fine. However, to rework the joint through a
12-16 mil via? If you apply heat to the via it will pull the solder away
from the part because solder flows toward the heat source. If you did
force enough solder through the via to heap up and touch the BGA, you have
not heated the BGA pad and thus you will not get a good solder joint to the
BGA.
I guess it is worth a try. But the rework part is questionable.
Brad Kendall
Hella Electronics Corp.
[log in to unmask] on 05/29/98 08:04:26 AM
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to
[log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Brad Kendall/Hella North America Inc.)
Subject: Re: [TN] BGA Footprint
Jeremy,
My guess is you will still get some solder wicking down the hole. Anyone
else try this yet? But I don't understand why you can't rework your BGAs,
not that you should have to rework many anyway. AirVac, SRT, Conceptronics
and others make very nice equipment for BGA rework.
regards,
Bev Christian
> ----------
> From: Jeremy POLLARD[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Friday, May 29, 1998 1:00 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] BGA Footprint
>
> Hello,
> am hoping that someone out there has experience with BGA footprints.
>
> We have completed Rev 1 of a double Eurocard PCB, 10 Layers with 7 x 356
> pin BGA devices on board. While everything went well with this run and we
> had no problems with ball connections, it is impossible to perform any
> rework or modifications if required.
> The footprint was the recommended pad with track out to a via or " Dog
> bone". On the next revision we would like to do the following, Elimnate
> the "dogbone", place a through hole in the actual pad for the ball and
> adjust the solder paste stencil so that the volume of paste deposited
> allows for the hole through the board.
> I would use a hole size of 0.3mm (12mil) to 0.4mm(16mil) certainly no
> larger.
> This approach should enable us to rework dodgy joints from the solder
side
> of the PCB
> It will also allow us access possibly to test the pins from the BGA.
>
> Has anyone done this ?
> Was it succesfull in a production environment ?
>
> Many thanks foryour help.
>
> regards
>
> jeremy
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 10:43:26 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Matthew Park <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Matthew Park <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: BGA Footprint
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Jeremy,
I see the wicking of solder thru via holes is problem, thus forms
insufficient solder joint fillets. To get around the problem with via
holes in SMT pads w/o introducing board cost increase/other
fabrication process complications, use a smallest possible via
hole size, which is 0.25mm (0.010") and mask bottom side via
hole pads with LPISM. This restricts the flow of solder thru via
holes and at the same time, allows flux and volatile gas to
escape thru them.
Mpark
NII-Norsat International Inc.
>>> Brad Kendall <[log in to unmask]> May 29,
1998 10:10 am >>>
As far as getting the initial solder joint to work using this pad you
may
be successful. You are obviously aware that you will get solder
wicking
into the via and possibly starving your solder joint, but with a
PBGA with
eutectic balls you should be fine. However, to rework the joint
through a
12-16 mil via? If you apply heat to the via it will pull the solder
away
from the part because solder flows toward the heat source. If
you did
force enough solder through the via to heap up and touch the
BGA, you have
not heated the BGA pad and thus you will not get a good solder
joint to the
BGA.
I guess it is worth a try. But the rework part is questionable.
Brad Kendall
Hella Electronics Corp.
[log in to unmask] on 05/29/98 08:04:26 AM
Please respond to [log in to unmask]; Please respond to
[log in to unmask]
To: [log in to unmask]
cc: (bcc: Brad Kendall/Hella North America Inc.)
Subject: Re: [TN] BGA Footprint
Jeremy,
My guess is you will still get some solder wicking down the hole.
Anyone
else try this yet? But I don't understand why you can't rework your
BGAs,
not that you should have to rework many anyway. AirVac, SRT,
Conceptronics
and others make very nice equipment for BGA rework.
regards,
Bev Christian
> ----------
> From: Jeremy
POLLARD[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Friday, May 29, 1998 1:00 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] BGA Footprint
>
> Hello,
> am hoping that someone out there has experience with BGA
footprints.
>
> We have completed Rev 1 of a double Eurocard PCB, 10
Layers with 7 x 356
> pin BGA devices on board. While everything went well with this
run and we
> had no problems with ball connections, it is impossible to
perform any
> rework or modifications if required.
> The footprint was the recommended pad with track out to a via
or " Dog
> bone". On the next revision we would like to do the following,
Elimnate
> the "dogbone", place a through hole in the actual pad for the
ball and
> adjust the solder paste stencil so that the volume of paste
deposited
> allows for the hole through the board.
> I would use a hole size of 0.3mm (12mil) to 0.4mm(16mil)
certainly no
> larger.
> This approach should enable us to rework dodgy joints from
the solder
side
> of the PCB
> It will also allow us access possibly to test the pins from the
BGA.
>
> Has anyone done this ?
> Was it succesfull in a production environment ?
>
> Many thanks foryour help.
>
> regards
>
> jeremy
>
>
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 13:38:04 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Kevin Minney <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Kevin Minney <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: ADVICE ON GOLD/JOINT EMBRITTLEMENT
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Dear Sir/Madam,
I wonder if you can help, please forgive me for emailing you directly I
was unsure as to whether
the Technet forum was open to the 'general public' for posting ..
I stumbled across an article that a Mr Bill Fabry had posted to the
Technet forum
regarding gold and embrittlement. I am working on the design of a single
board computer and have designed in a surface mount connector which I am
now told by the manufacturer (Samtec) that they can only supply with a
gold finish. Our main customer for this board is a defense contractor
and our own in-house rules (derived I assume from military standards) is
that all connectors with a gold lead finish must be solder dipped prior
to assembly onto the board. Our board is FR4 with tin/lead finish on the
pads. So far two sub contractors have failed to solder dip these
connectors, and even if they did succeed there would likely be a
co-planarity problem.
here is an extract of Bill's original posting to the Technet Forum ..
>>SNIP
From: "Bill Fabry" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]- Electroless Ni/Im
To: [log in to unmask], "Thad McMillan" <[log in to unmask]>
Reply to: RE>Re[2]: Electroless Ni/Immersion A
Thad:
Based on a reliability report generated by HP: If the gold content is
less
than 2% of the resultant solder joint volume, no appreciable solder
embrittlement will occur. Therefore, the VOLUME of gold on ANY pad must
be
less than 2% of the resultant solder joint VOLUME, or ~1% of the VOLUME
of
solder paste applied to that pad. (e.g. if 0.005" solder paste is
applied, gold
thickness should be < 50 micro-inches.)
>>SNIP
Could you please advise, or refer me to someone who is able to advise on
the following ..
Q/. could I apply your guidelines to my connector or is it specifically
only applicable to a gold finish on the board ?
Q/. Could you give me a contact where I could acquire this HP
reliability report ?
many thanks, in anticipation,
Kevin Minney
----------------------------------------CUSTOMER FIRST, QUALITY ALWAYS
KEVIN MINNEY DY 4 Systems Inc **** ***
senior designer 333 Palladium Dr M/S 317 *** * *** *** ***
Kanata, ON ** ** ** *** *** *
Tel: 613-599-9199 x208 Canada * *** * *** *** **
Fax: 613-599-7777 K2V 1A6 **** *** ***
Email: [log in to unmask] ***
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 13:56:53 -0400
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Hugh Scott Miller <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Far East Enterprises
Subject: What are CKW formatted files?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
One of my customers in Europe is constantly forwarding CKW-formatted
electronic manufacturing datafiles for production purposes. I have no
tools to process these types of files, and I'm not familiar with this
file protocol, I am hoping that some of the European members can shed
some light on this topic. What is CKW? Are there any tools that can be
used to interpret CKW? If so, what are they? Is CKW easily convertible
to Gerber or other more recognized format? Any assistance would be
greatly appreciated.
Best Regards
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 13:57:10 -0400
Reply-To: [log in to unmask]
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Hugh Scott Miller <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Far East Enterprises
Subject: Probimer 52-Thanks for your assistance
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
I would like to take my hat off to Mr. Michel Poulin of ViaSystems for
providing such a consise summary on Probimer 52. You have assisted me a
great deal, and thanks for your time.
Best Regards
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 13:54:51 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Carroll, George (MIS, GEFanuc, NA)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Carroll, George (MIS, GEFanuc, NA)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: source of adhesive coper foil
X-To: Paul Wilson <[log in to unmask]>
A long time ago - like about 1980, I used a copper tape with conductive
adhesive to create plating thieves in vast expanses of photoresist that had
been sparsely populated with isolated holes and pads. If well applied, the
tape adhesive would stand up to the plating chemistry and preplate
solutions. I do not remember the product name but it came from 3M. We ( I
was with Sperry Univac Defense Systems back then) used a hand cranked
clothes ringer to squeeze the tape but Western Magnum has more advanced
ways to apply mechanical pressure to the tape. I have found a couple of
rolls of similar tape here (at GE Fanuc) but I'm not sure if it has a
conductive adhesive. It is 3M Electrical tape and the bag says Tape No.
1181. Good luck!
George Carroll, Process Chemist
GE Fanuc Automation
[log in to unmask]
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Wilson [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Friday, May 29, 1998 9:37 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] source of adhesive coper foil
Technet:
Does anyone have a list of manufacturer's of adhesive copper tape
capable of withstanding plating conditions?
Thank you,
Paul Wilson
Plant Chemist
Circuit Center, Inc.
937-435-2131
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 13:09:07 -0500
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
"Hogue, Pat (AZ76)" <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: "Hogue, Pat (AZ76)" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: ADVICE ON GOLD/JOINT EMBRITTLEMENT
X-To: "Kevin Minney (IPM Return requested)" <[log in to unmask]>
I think the concern is intermetallic compound formation with attendant
brittle failure. You better do some home work. It might be possible to
qualify the joints, but I doubt anyone would want to risk it.
Pat Hogue
Materials and Processes
----------
From: Kevin Minney[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Kevin Minney
Sent: Friday, May 29, 1998 10:38 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] ADVICE ON GOLD/JOINT EMBRITTLEMENT
Dear Sir/Madam,
I wonder if you can help, please forgive me for emailing you directly I
was unsure as to whether
the Technet forum was open to the 'general public' for posting ..
I stumbled across an article that a Mr Bill Fabry had posted to the
Technet forum
regarding gold and embrittlement. I am working on the design of a single
board computer and have designed in a surface mount connector which I am
now told by the manufacturer (Samtec) that they can only supply with a
gold finish. Our main customer for this board is a defense contractor
and our own in-house rules (derived I assume from military standards) is
that all connectors with a gold lead finish must be solder dipped prior
to assembly onto the board. Our board is FR4 with tin/lead finish on the
pads. So far two sub contractors have failed to solder dip these
connectors, and even if they did succeed there would likely be a
co-planarity problem.
here is an extract of Bill's original posting to the Technet Forum ..
>>SNIP
From: "Bill Fabry" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]- Electroless Ni/Im
To: [log in to unmask], "Thad McMillan" <[log in to unmask]>
Reply to: RE>Re[2]: Electroless Ni/Immersion A
Thad:
Based on a reliability report generated by HP: If the gold content is
less
than 2% of the resultant solder joint volume, no appreciable solder
embrittlement will occur. Therefore, the VOLUME of gold on ANY pad must
be
less than 2% of the resultant solder joint VOLUME, or ~1% of the VOLUME
of
solder paste applied to that pad. (e.g. if 0.005" solder paste is
applied, gold
thickness should be < 50 micro-inches.)
>>SNIP
Could you please advise, or refer me to someone who is able to advise on
the following ..
Q/. could I apply your guidelines to my connector or is it specifically
only applicable to a gold finish on the board ?
Q/. Could you give me a contact where I could acquire this HP
reliability report ?
many thanks, in anticipation,
Kevin Minney
----------------------------------------CUSTOMER FIRST, QUALITY ALWAYS
KEVIN MINNEY DY 4 Systems Inc **** ***
senior designer 333 Palladium Dr M/S 317 *** * *** *** ***
Kanata, ON ** ** ** *** *** *
Tel: 613-599-9199 x208 Canada * *** * *** *** **
Fax: 613-599-7777 K2V 1A6 **** *** ***
Email: [log in to unmask] ***
################################################################
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################################################################
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################################################################
################################################################
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################################################################
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 20:25:36 +0200
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Matthias Mansfeld <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <[log in to unmask]>
From: Matthias Mansfeld <[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
Subject: Re: What are CKW formatted files?
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
On 29 May 98 at 13:56, Hugh Scott Miller wrote:
> One of my customers in Europe is constantly forwarding CKW-formatted
> electronic manufacturing datafiles for production purposes. I have
> no tools to process these types of files, and I'm not familiar with
> this file protocol, I am hoping that some of the European members
> can shed some light on this topic. What is CKW? Are there any
> tools that can be used to interpret CKW? If so, what are they? Is
> CKW easily convertible to Gerber or other more recognized format?
> Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.
Probably you mean CWK format. That is an archieve format from
GraphiCode CAM-Software. It is possible that the customer has the
shareware GC-Prevue, with which he can read in his gerber and drill
files and save all together as CWK. Then, any fab with the bigger
software GC-CAM can process these files, export gerber, panelize
etc.
For further informations, contact http://www.graphicode.com.
Best regards
Matthias Mansfeld
-----------------------------------------------
Matthias Mansfeld Elektronik
* Printed Circuit Board Design and Assembly
Am Langhoelzl 11, D-85540 Haar, GERMANY
Phone: +49-89-4620 0937, Fax: +49-89-4620 0938
E-Mail: [log in to unmask]
Internet: http://home.t-online.de/home/matthias.mansfeld
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 15:59:31 -0400
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Yves Trudell <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Yves Trudell <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: 25mil SMT connectors, 16mil TQFPs (14mm package), 0402 chips
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Hi, we are planning to start assembling PCBAs with the following
technologies:
* 25mil SMT connectors
* 16mil TQFPs (14mm package)
* 0402 chips
I'm interested in knowing what kind of placement/soldering defect levels are
associated with each of these packages. Any help would be appreciated.
Yves Trudell
Nortel, Wireless Networks Calgary
Quality System Engineering
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Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 14:28:28 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Ken Patel <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: CAD Questions: Basic
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Some basic questions to clarify any misunderstanding...
(1) What is CAD libraries?
(2) Can such libraries work with other CAD packages or how about the down
rev of the same CAD package. I mean how if transfer job from one place to
other assuming both has same CAD package but may not be at same revision -
can CAD libraries clash here?
re,
ken patel
______________________________________________________
Ken Patel Phone: (408) 490-6804
1708 McCarthy Blvd. Fax: (408) 490-6859
Milpitas, CA 95035 Beeper: (888) 769-1808
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=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 15:10:36 -0700
Reply-To: "TechNet E-Mail Forum." <[log in to unmask]>,
Jared Lang <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
From: Jared Lang <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Liquid Photoresist
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Don,
A while back I used the Kodak KPR photo resist. I don't know if they
still make it, but it was relatively cheap and had good results.
Hope this helps.
Jared Lang
> ----------
> From: Don Whittemore[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;[log in to unmask]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 27, 1998 6:21 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] Liquid Photoresist
>
> I am trying to find a POSITIVE working liquid photoresist to be used
> in dip
> applications. Any information or names of manufactures would be
> greatly
> appreciated.
>
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