As a raw board manufacturer, we often supply what we call, "workpanels" with x-outs allowed. here's our experience. - X-out 's allow our customers lower prices, as it saves scrap - X-outs are more important from a financial standpoint on very complex boards where a low yield is driven by technology limits (as opposed to process control problems. - X-outs are difficult to control in our line for proper scrap marking (partially good panel (pgp) dots to punch, x's to mark on pieces etc). - X-outs at our assembly sites are not a problem, as they are programmed in to look for good panel dots. Jim Herard KBL, Product Quality Engineering IBM Microelectronics Endicott t/l 857-7026 ---------------------- Forwarded by Jim Herard/Endicott/IBM on 08-26-97 06:16 PM --------------------------- [log in to unmask] 08-21-97 11:43 PM Please respond to [log in to unmask] @ internet To: [log in to unmask] @ internet cc: Subject: [TECHNET] DES, FAB: X-Outs I have reviewed the archives on this subject and found only 4 responses that are directly related to X-Outs with only one providing any response to questions. This subject is raising it ugly head again in our company and I would like to get some more input from other Design, Manufacturing & Fabrication professionals as to their individual x-out policies. I realize that accepting x-out puts a burden on the warehouse people keeping up with the sorting and allocating of boards to the line. Also the manufacturing departments for keeping track of the correct program to run depending on which x-out they are running. But if all of this is set down in an acceptable policy and everyone from the fabricator through to production follows the procedure wouldn't the out come give the bottom line of the company a boost. Since the other end of the spectrum is to not allow x-outs and have vendors start raising prices. We all know this is what will happen even if we stand on the statement that we will not pay for vendors poor quality. At some point the vendor has to make up for those boards on the panels that were good and went into the garbage anyway. There are situations where a vendor may only x-out the obvious bad boards and may still have marginally acceptable parts not x'd out. In these cases shouldn't it be the responsibility of the incoming inspection department to catch these as bad boards and make a qualified rejection based on their findings. Well I'll get down off my soapbox for now. As you can see this is a touchy subject not only here but I suspect at other companies as well. All responses will be greatly appreciated since I don't think this subject has garnered the attention is deserves in the past. Thank again. Steve Collins PCB Design Supervisor ANTEC International [log in to unmask]