Gary, here a slide presentation from our counterfeit training/workshop by that link I sent you, Jon -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Gary Camac Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2008 1:25 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN] What's under the blacktop John, Ya, I thought of the sand paper thing. I am thinking of using our PWB cross-sectioning equipment to polish off the applied surface. The current layer on these ICs has been laser marked. I have been able to find a component on one of our technicians test PWAs that I am certain was a factory part. It is marked with ink. So, I am thinking of trying to polish my way down to the ink layer. The layer I am trying to hit is about as thin as my chance of success. These are brokered components, end-of-life kind of thing, buyer beware, what you see is all you can get...et. al. We have seen isolated soldering problems and a some dead ICs. Thanks for the input, Gary Camac -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John Burke Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2008 12:30 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN] What's under the blacktop It depends, If the device was marked with ink it was almost certainly removed abrasively before black top and re-marking. If the device was laser marked there is some hope as normally these are double black topped to fill in the impression left by the laser before re-marking. In this case a VERY fine grade of abrasive paper should reveal the original marking. Did you ask the vendor?? There are many reasons for re-marking most of them not bad (and some very bad) John Burke (408) 515 4992 -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Gary Camac Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2008 9:33 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: [TN] What's under the blacktop Good morning, We have some ICs that appear to have been blacktopped. (Steve G. - thanks for the excellent link in July). Now the question is why - what is covered up? Our concern is that commercial grade is being identified as industrial. Is there a method for looking under the blacktop to determine what was there before the cover-up? Thanks, Gary Gary Camac Senior Manufacturing Engineer DICKEY-john Corp. 5200 Dickey John Road Auburn, IL 62616-0010 Telephone 217-438-2288 --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- __________ NOD32 3429 (20080909) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- This communication is intended only for use by the addressee(s) named herein and may contain business confidential and/or legally privileged information. 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