And Bev's analysis was so complete, he included the contribution from the cattle herd flatulence that was grazing on Nortel grounds, it was truly a astounding calculation. Dave Hillman Rockwell Collins [log in to unmask] "Douglas O. Pauls" <[log in to unmask]> Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]> 08/26/2008 03:58 PM Please respond to TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to [log in to unmask] To [log in to unmask] cc Subject Re: [TN] NTC And what a trip that was. Bev, you have to now tell the story of how you calculated the Nortel contribution to global warming, so that people understand why you are an authority on flatulence. Doug Pauls Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]> Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]> 08/26/2008 03:52 PM Please respond to TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to Bev Christian <[log in to unmask]> To [log in to unmask] cc Subject Re: [TN] NTC Paul, Actually people expel hydrogen sulfide, not sulfur dioxide. I read it in a book about the subject written by a medical doctor. I regaled Doug Pauls and Dave Hillman with hilarious trivia from the book as we drove down highway one from SF to LA. At room temperature I would expect no reaction between methane and silver. I am not so sure about possible reactions at elevated temperatures. I am not a catalyst chemist. Bev -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Paul Reid Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 3:02 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: [TN] Remembering the Guys from Myth Busters, key note speakers at IPC LA...are those flatulent people who express sulfur dioxide in their gaseous eruptions (from eating deviled eggs) belonging to the order of the red flame or the order of the blue flame? I believe, that day in LA, that Bev enlightened us as to the major component of the gases expressed by flatulent new born babies (H2). How he would know such a thing was never explained however. Paul Reid -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Douglas O. Pauls Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:23 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: [TN] Well, I guess that depends on what the previous meal was. I don't know if methane has the same harmful effect on immersion silver as sulfur. I suppose I could go knock back a dozen or so deviled eggs and let you know...... And Dewey, that was a horrid pun, even for you. Well done. Doug Pauls Inge <[log in to unmask]> Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]> 08/26/2008 10:12 PM Please respond to TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to Inge <[log in to unmask]> To [log in to unmask] cc Subject [TN] So a TV living with a gaseous family is at risk? Inge ----- Original Message ----- From: "Woolley, Mark D. (Mark)" <[log in to unmask]> To: <[log in to unmask]> Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 7:37 AM Subject: [TN] Any environment that contains sulfur, like hydrogen sulfide or sulfur dioxide should preclude the use of IAg. The sulfur will react with the silver and "grow" sulfides which can be electrically conductive resulting is shorts between vias. This can occur even when the concentrations are within OSHA limits for human exposure. Silver sulfides can be semiconductors or conductors depending on the chemical composition. They are black in color instead of silver, any exposed silver will be affected. Mark Woolley Failure Analyst -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of James Verrette Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 8:25 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: [TN] What characteristics of the end use environment would cause IAg to not be an appropriate finish and why? Jim Verrette Senior Electrical Engineer ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 08:24:35 -0500 From: "Stadem, Richard D." <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: ENIG White paper Dave, You write as if you are not at all familiar with IAg, which is totally understandable. However, IAg has been around in full production mode for many years now, and is rapidly becoming the most-used finish in the market. Do not confuse it with immersion tin finish, which has little or no shelf life. IAg-finished circuit boards have a recommended shelf or storage life of about 1 year. However, if packaged properly in a hermetically sealed bag with silver saver paper liners, and stored away from sulfates, it is possible to use boards up to 5 years old or even longer with no issues whatsoever. All you need to do is call out the packaging on the fabrication drawing per IPC 4553. I have soldered IAg boards that sat around exposed to the elements for more than 4 years in previous lives, and they soldered up just fine, no change in the DPMO. Some of the bare boards we use here at GD are 34" by 40", 48 layers, 1/2" thick, cost is about $48,000 each. Their finish is IAg. =20 I have had a lot of experience with IAg over the past 10 years or so, having seen at least 150,000 IAg boards assembled and soldered with every type of component you can think of, and I have never experienced any issues with them. I have experienced many, many issues with ENIG, however, and that is the finish that would keep me up at night waiting for the bomb to go off. There are many reliability issues associated with ENIG such as black pad, brittle nickel, etc., etc, but just think about the fact that you are soldering to nickel, which has a dissolution rate about 50 times slower than copper. Should you ever have a solderability issue with IAg, you can have the fabricator rework the finish. If you have an issue with ENIG, the only thing you can do is rework your scrap account. However, you need to take the end-use environment into consideration when you select a circuit board finish. ENIG (unfortunately) may be your best choice. I would fully qualify just one assembly at a time, and I would fully qualify it. For Space use, I would not suggest IAg. -----Original Message----- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------------------------- This transmission (including any attachments) may contain confidential information, privileged material (including material protected by the solicitor-client or other applicable privileges), or constitute non-public information. 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