Thanks, John, but... I'd appreciate it if you stopped trying to expose all the other process indicators we may or may not have already identified and are working on...All I asked about were the solder balls! 8-) I believe we are planning to reduce the stencil for the next build, to correct the solder ball problem, as Richard suggested. We are mainly trying to figure out if and when to rework these boards with solder balls that are being built with the existing stencil. And despite the grief our X-ray causes when it reveals stuff like this, yes, we are getting MUCH enjoyment out of our new toy...er, I mean tool. Thanks for everyone's help on this Monday. Much appreciated. -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John Burke Sent: July 21, 2008 2:10 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN] Solder balls Genny, Looks to me that the via holes for the thermal management have sucked all of the solder from under the QFN leaving at best 50% of the thermal pad cross section connected? - this could be an issue. However - back to the solder balls. I have noticed a couple of things about this assembly. The first and most obvious is of course the solder ball issue. More telling is actually the extent of the voiding in the joints, together thet might be pointing to a profiling issue? I also noticed that there is very little solder build up on what would be a toe fillet in a QFP on the right and top side of the package (I also notice also that the two outside joints at the top are showing heavy metal loading at the toe , as well as the top and bottom joints on the right side - although less so - is this a touch up with a soldering iron?) this leads me to suspect that the QFN is probably not co-planar with the board but has the top right corner raised somewhat from the board, so the package may have had some rocking movement while being reflowed as the solder melted and moved around? Just my thoughts, fortunately you are able to actually look at it!! John John Burke (408) 515 4992 -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Genny Sent: Monday, July 21, 2008 11:56 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN] Solder balls The solder balls are near the arrows. Faint grey round objects. This device does have a heat slug, and there are plated thru holes under it for heat transfer. And yes, our X-ray does allow oblique viewing. What are you suggesting we look for? -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Mike Sewell Sent: July 21, 2008 12:53 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN] Solder balls Genny, Does your new X-Ray allow for oblique viewing? Your solderballs will stay round - vias will appear as columns. If not you can always prop up the board on one side but magnification/focus will change and the image won't be as "pretty". Mike -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Igoshev, Vladimir Sent: Monday, July 21, 2008 1:21 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN] Solder balls Hi Genny, Here is a dummy question: Why are you talking about QFN and solder balls? I guess what you see are kind of PTH for heat transfer, but not solder balls. Vladimir -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Steve Gregory Sent: Monday, July 21, 2008 1:54 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN] Solder balls Hi Genny! Sorry it's taken me a bit to get your picture posted, but I just got back from 2-weeks vacation and a week in Colorado going to a IPC-771/7721 instructor certification class, so I've been catching up on things this morning. But here is your picture: http://stevezeva.homestead.com/files/solderballs-QFN.jpg Myself, I wouldn't worry about them tiny solderballs. They probably aren't going anywhere, and besides if they did, they're so small what problem could it cause? Steve -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Genny Sent: Monday, July 21, 2008 10:52 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: [TN] Solder balls Have you ever gotten a much better analytical tool available to you, and have it cause major panic due to what you can see now that you never saw before? We got a major fancy dancy brand new X-Ray. Now we see things like the attached picture. Steve, could I trouble you to post it for me? <<solderballs-QFN.jpg>> Our old X-Ray would have never seen this. Would you fail these solder balls? It is a QFN, 0.5mm pitch, 0.3mm pad width with a heat slug. I think trying to replace this device by hand would cause more trouble than we see right now. Genny --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 -----------------------------------------------------