I went shovel shopping last week -- there were three A beautiful resin handled, tempered steel, rolled edges with tack welds and reinforcement at the stress points and seams for $39 A hardwood handled, hickory, one of similar quality for $29 And an unpriced chineese model -- inferior wood handle, much more roughly shaped, with a wide grain -- stamped steel, no welds, no reinforcement... -- did a price check to compare -- it was $6.99 -- if I used a shovel every day I would invest, but for digging rocks now and then from my road -- I couldn't justify the $20-$30 difference... -- I am ashamed, but that is the current reality I fear soon there will be less shovel selection, I am a more discerning shopper than most, and a professional 'quality guy' and still -- price influences me Ian -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bev Christian Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:53 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN] RoHS compliant laptop with early failure George, As usual, I am in total agreement with you. Bev -----Original Message----- From: Wenger, George M. [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:51 AM To: TechNet E-Mail Forum; Bev Christian Subject: RE: [TN] RoHS compliant laptop with early failure Bev, To add to your comment, I'm more convinced than ever that "quality is dead". Given three factors 1). Quality, 2). Cost 3). Delivery. Customers can choose any two but not three. Even companies like my old company (Lucent Technologies / Bell Laboratories) that changed from being technology driven to supply change driven are now more worried about cost and delivery. They may still be concerned about quality but when their customers want the products "NOW" and they want them for "AS CHEAP AS POSSIBLE" then quality has to suffer. Regards, George George M. Wenger Senior Principle FMA / Reliability Engineer Wireless network Solutions Andrew Corporation, 40 Technology Drive, Warren, NJ 07059 (908) 546-4531 [log in to unmask] -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bev Christian Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:34 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN] RoHS compliant laptop with early failure A man I respect in the industry on these matters said (and this applies to more than electronics), that "quality is dead". Remember the mantra is "smaller, cheaper, faster" or some such. In the late nineties they said "quality is of course assumed", but I think that has gone out the window now, in the general sense. Bev RIM The opinions expressed herein are my own and do not necessarily represent those of the company that I work for. (And I am making no inferences one way or the other about our own products.) -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wolfe, Robert Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:27 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN] RoHS compliant laptop with early failure Joe, Just a thought without any real data (but sure has me wondering slightly). EVERY single piece of electronic equipment I've purchased within the last year has either failed almost out of the box or soon after. This includes 2 notebook computers, a PA Amp, 3 cell phones, a wireless phone, an all-in-one printer. Now yes like many have stated here with out data there is no case and there are many reasons that could be the problem, and may not have anything to do with RoHS. But from a John Q. Public buyer standpoint was I jinxed this last year were the odds not all in my favor, could be but certainly has me wondering why 100% of what I bought electronically never had problems till this past year everything had a problem (100%)??? >From my point of view I was starting to think maybe don't buy any electronics for awhile? Especially since the practice of many companies is, even if your unit failed in only 3 months, you might get a refurbished unit that is much older back. Yes they guarantee it is in perfect working order again, but just my opinion, if the unit breaks in the first 90 days you should get a brand new replacement. Bob -----Original Message----- From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of David Hudson Sent: Monday, May 28, 2007 1:02 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN] RoHS compliant laptop with early failure I would suggest that it belies your undoubted professional expertise to make the assumption that this failure has anything to do with RoHS-compliance or lead-free. Frankly, it smacks of hysteria. Surely you can think of at least a dozen other potential failure modes, all equally likely? Let's see some evidence in this case before you throw your toys out of the playpen. Dave -- ++++++++++++++++++++ David Hudson On 26/05/07, Joe Fjelstad <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > Greetings folks, > > I don't know, (nor will I likely ever know) what the problem is but my > brand new RoHS compliant laptop has the distinction of being the > shortest lived > one I ever owned. > > It is a trusted brand name supplier from Japan and I have always been > pleased with their bullet proof reliability. My earlier version is still > working > very well, just a little slow. The new one was a high-end small, > lightweight model that touted reliability in ads. On this one, > however, 4 weeks after > purchase and with very little use, the CD just stopped working for no > apparent reason. > > I would really be curious to know what went wrong but I am going to be > returning it to the store and will now be looking for something cheaper > and > hopefully non RoHS compliant. I cannot afford to pay big bucks for > unreliable products. > > (I almost wonder if someone out there is getting back at me for protesting > lead-free too much.. ;-) > > Wishing better luck to the rest of you. > Joe > > > > ************************************** See what's free at > http://www.aol.com. > > --------------------------------------------------- > Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To > unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in > the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt > or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to > [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing > per day of all the posts: send e-mail to > [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest > Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives > Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at > [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 > ----------------------------------------------------- > --------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0 To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=4.3.16 for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815 ----------------------------------------------------- DISCLAIMER: Important Notice ************************************************* This e-mail may contain information that is confidential, privileged or otherwise protected from disclosure. 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