Just a cautious word of advice... Please, before you go accusing the Executive Board... be informed about the IPC and who runs it and just how the Designers Council fits into the overall organization. http://www.ipc.org/contentpage.asp?Pageid=2.1# Most of us have opinions about the organization and those working in its interests and MOST of us don't really know much about them or it at all. I urge you to check into it before casting dispersions about the folks I know are very giving and helpful and aren't making a penny off their contributions. Not to say that there aren't some who aren't so engaged and deserve the criticism... be that as it may... Not everyone is a mercenary or 'in it for the money'.... besides, designers aren't walking around with large bags of money to spend... especially on specs. Best regards, Bill Brooks - KG6VVP PCB Design Engineer, C.I.D.+, C.I.I. Tel: (760)597-1500 Ext 3772 Fax: (760)597-1510 _______________________________________ Member of the San Diego Chapter of the IPC Designers Council Communications Officer, Web Manager http://dcchapters.ipc.org/SanDiego/ http://pcbwizards.com -----Original Message----- From: Alcorn, Brent [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2005 8:19 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [DC] Propaganda Rant Hi Chris, Well put, and I too disagree with their approach. Brent Sr. P.C. Designer Analogic Corporation PS. Makes me wonder if I really want to be certified by this entity?? -----Original Message----- From: DesignerCouncil [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Chris Ball Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2005 10:32 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: [DC] Propaganda Rant Since it's been quiet lately.... <RANT> When I was a kid growing up in the USA, the USSR was the bad guy. The thing I remember most (besides Kruschev with a hole in his shoe) was that their government was always spewing complete bull$h!t to their people. And the government's version was the only version the media dispersed. That wasn't really the worst aspect of their regime, but that's what I remember most vividly. It seems to me that America is sliding down the same path these days. You look the camera in the eye and spew. Your story doesn't even have to be very plausible. This technique seems to be working for our current regime and for several ex-CEO's. I concede that our current leaders are not the first to employ the tactic (I would argue that the gravity of the subject matter is vastly different, but that's a whole 'nuther thing). And now it seems to propagating into the general population. IPC-7351 is different than any IPC spec has ever been. If you purchase it, you receive a piece of software from an outside company as part of your purchase. If you use this software, you find that more goodies are available to you from the authors for a price. I'm not saying whether that's a good thing or a bad thing, just that it's true. Now it sounds as though the next highly anticipated spec, IPC-2152, will be similar in that it will be linked with an outside company's product(s). When posts on this forum appeared questioning the way things were being done, in both cases, responses quickly appeared informing us that these guys put up a lot of their own money and time just to get this done. These postings implied that people out there are making great personal sacrifices to improve things for us designers, with little or no thought of personal gain. No backroom deals or insider trading, nothing sneaky here. The point being obscured by this propaganda is that IPC specifications are now endorsing and bundling specific commercial products. It appears to be a trend. Is this acceptable to the general population of specification consumers, or does it seem a little shady? Are there any other examples of standards organizations integrating a limited subset of a commercial software application (with hooks to other for-purchase features) into their published specifications? -Chris (el-CID) P.S. If I decided to open a restaurant, I'd put a lot of my own time and money into it. I'd hope my customers really loved the food, left happy, and came back often; that dining at my establishment affected their lives in a positive way. I'd care deeply about people who eat, and honestly have their best interests at heart. But it would all be driven by self-interest. I wouldn't do it if I didn't think I could at least make a living at it. I don't think anyone would. I wouldn't appreciate being represented as some sort of culinary martyr in the food forums. And if I was in cahoots with the food critics and travel guides, and on the premier gourmet publication's board of directors, that'd be great for me. </RANT> This e-mail message is intended only for the use of the intended recipient(s). The information contained therein may be confidential or privileged, and its disclosure or reproduction is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please return it immediately to its sender at the above address and destroy it. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------- DesignerCouncil Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8d To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF DesignerCouncil. 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