Dear Steve, This is exactly what I was asking about a while ago. About 15 or so years ago, my then-shop forman was very smug about how he'd replaced our huge water wash line with a dishwasher that was cheaper to buy, cheaper to run and took up a fraction of the space. The dishwasher was fed from the DI Water generator, and it wasn't long before we noticed that the dishwasher seals were breaking up and we were getting more contamination being put back onto the boards than the machine ever removed. Eventually the entire machine just broke down as all the perishable bits perished, and that type of machine fell into disrepute a s board cleaner. These days, the dishwashers are still available, but with DI Water-resistant seals making them a little more expensive than your standard domestic item from Comet.. I'm chasing one down from AAT (Austin American Technology) right now having decided, like you, that the generally-available batch cleaners are themselves no more than too-extremely expensive dishwashers, even if they don't look like them at first glance. AAT's offerings look exactly like domestic dishwashers, but are purpose built for PCBA cleaning. Thanks to Iain Braddock for the initial lead on these machines - hope you're situation's better these days, Iain. Still thinking of you, bud. rgds Peter Steve Gregory <[log in to unmask]> 10/07/2002 09:08 AM Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]> Please respond to "TechNet E-Mail Forum."; Please respond to SteveZeva To: [log in to unmask] cc: (bcc: DUNCAN Peter/Asst Prin Engr/ST Aero/ST Group) Subject: [TN] Water soluble batch washers... Hi all, This is a little bit off-the-wall, and maybe sounds a bit cheap, but I'm going to ask anyway... We have a inline water soluble cleaner (an Electrovert H-500) that is located at one end of the plant. Problem is, that at the other end of the plant there is hand soldering (rework and touch-up) being done. As probably many of you have learned, operators don't want to make the trip all the way down to the other end of the plant to get their boards cleaned until they have a rack of boards that will make the trip worthwhile... which is understandable from a purely logistics point of view. But that sometimes results in the flux residues being left on the boards longer than what is desired. So the idea was brought up to get a couple of small batch cleaners closer to the area so that it would be so much of a trek to get the boards cleaned in a timely manner. Sounds like a good idea. My question is, most of the batch cleaners I've seen are glorified dishwashers. When you price these units you find that they are much, much more expensive than a dishwasher, but the operating systems are basically the same. I did a search for commercial dishwashers and can find nice beefy stainless constructed ones that have heated wash and rinse cycles, decent powered pumps, that are a third of the price that some of "specifically designed for printed circuit cleaning" washers cost. The wash nozzles are basically the same, rotating wands. Rack systems are the same, roll-in, roll-out racks that look very similar to what I've seen in every dishwasher I've ever had in my home. So my question is, has anybody ever had a real dishwasher in use to clean water soluble residues? We will supply DI water to them straight from the resin beds, and will be able to set appropiate cycle times to ensure thorough cleaning. From my take on things, this should work pretty good without having to spend a bunch of money on a machine that can be had for much cheaper and not actually called "A printed circuit assembly batch aqueous cleaner"... Any comments? -Steve Gregory- --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8d To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-509-9700 ext.5315 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- [This e-mail is confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete it and notify us immediately; you should not copy or use it for any purpose, nor disclose its contents to any other person. Thank you.] --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8d To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL) To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-509-9700 ext.5315 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------