Dear Keach, Could you be so kind and disconnect Mr Jong untill he is back from his vacations??? Edward > -----Original Message----- > From: jong s kadesch [SMTP:[log in to unmask]] > Sent: ב דצמבר 17 2001 16:58 > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: [TN] Jong on Vacation (was Re: TechNet Digest - 13 Dec 2001 > (#2001-776)) > > At 12:00 AM 12/14/01 -0600, you wrote: > > Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2001 00:00:04 -0600 > Reply-To: TechNet <[log in to unmask]> > Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]> > From: Automatic digest processor <[log in to unmask]> > Subject: TechNet Digest - 13 Dec 2001 (#2001-776) > To: Recipients of TechNet digests <[log in to unmask]> > > There are 8 messages totalling 516 lines in this issue. > > Topics of the day: > > 1. porosity of gold plating on nickel (2) > 2. Inefficient solder on Toshiba micro BGA (2) > 3. .050 PWB (2) > 4. PCB Density Study/Design Quoting > 5. photoplotters > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV > 1.8d > To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following > text in > the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet > To temporarily halt delivery of Technet send the following message: > SET Technet NOMAIL > Search previous postings at: www.ipc.org <http://www.ipc.org/> > > On-Line Resources & Databases > E-mail Archives > Please visit IPC web site ( <http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm>) for > additional > information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or > 847-509-9700 ext.5315 > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 15:30:15 -0500 > From: "Vandendolder, Ron" <[log in to unmask]> > Subject: Re: porosity of gold plating on nickel > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Kris, > > Although not quantitative, I was impressed with some SEM's (Scanning > Electron Microscope) > pictures taken of some gold plated Duroid boards that were not > performing as > expected. The pictures showed globular deposits of gold on the top > surface. > Where the globular deposits didn't > touch, nickel was clearly showing. > > Ron VandenDolder > Product Development Group > Telaxis Communications > SouthDeerfield, MA > 413-665-8551 > > -----Original Message----- > From: Kris Keating [ <mailto:[log in to unmask]>] > Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 2:31 PM > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: [TN] porosity of gold plating on nickel > > > Does anyone know of a fairly simple method of determining porosity > of gold > plating over nickel on a PCB? > > > Kristopher J. Keating > Technical Service Engineer > Circuit-Wise, Inc. > 400 Sackett Point Rd. > North Haven, CT 06473 > Tel. (203) 281-6511 > Fax (203) 287-8409 > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > ----- > Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV > 1.8d > To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following > text in > the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet > To temporarily halt delivery of Technet send the following message: > SET > Technet NOMAIL > Search previous postings at: www.ipc.org <http://www.ipc.org/> > > On-Line Resources & Databases > > E-mail Archives > Please visit IPC web site ( <http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm>) for > additional > information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or > 847-509-9700 > ext.5315 > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > ----- > Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 13:44:57 -0700 > From: Steve Abrahamson <[log in to unmask]> > Subject: Re: Inefficient solder on Toshiba micro BGA > > Hey Stacy, > > It sounds as though on paper, your process is OK. Just to fill you > in on > aspect ratio, that is aperture width/stencil thickness. This is a > good rule > of thumb for rectangular apertures such as for fine pitch > components. For > small circular or square apertures most people use the area aspect > ratio > which is aperture area/wall area. The area aspect ratio should be > above > ..66. Thus on a .005" thick stencil with a .0135" square aperture > you are > looking at (.0135*.0135)/((.0135*.005)*4) = .675. > Actually the area aspect ratio for a .0135" round aperture is the > same as > that for a square aperture, yet release on the square aperture has > generally > been proven to be better (don't forget a .002" or .003" radius on > the > corners). > > Anyway my point was going to be that I had the exact same apertures > ordered > on one particular project, and the apertures all clogged up (luckily > we > caught them at the visual step). It seems the apertures were > severely > undersized (more like .0122" x .0122"). So are your apertures > really > ..0135"? > > As Kathy mentioned, kneed or condition your paste. The paste may > take a few > prints to fully mix and provide the thixotropic characteristics that > you > want. We use a dummy board for the first print, and then print our > first > production board. > > Personally I think you could get away with a .015" aperture if you > are > dealing with a .0315" pitch product. Even if they undercut your > stencil, > you should be fine. > > Good luck.... > > Steve A > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: My Nguyen [SMTP:[log in to unmask]] > > Sent: Tuesday,December 11,2001 11:43 AM > > To: [log in to unmask] > > Subject: [TN] Inefficient solder on Toshiba micro BGA > > > > Hello all, > > > > Problem description: > > > > Been happening on Rambus - part number tc59rm81xmb. > > Ball diametter: 0.5 mm; ball pitch: 0.8 mm, ball > > height: 0.4 mm. Pad size: 0.3 mm (11.5 mils) > > 5-10% of the time (we run huge amount of them) failure > > modules came from opening soder join or no solder join > > at all. As we inspect the screen printing process (we > > use 5 mils stencil - Dek screenprinting, cleaning > > rate: 2 per print, cleaning cycle Wet-Vacuum/Dry), we > > found un-event solder deposit. Some pad even has very > > little solder or no solder at all. > > > > Stencil is electro-polish; Diamond shape aperture, > > 13.5 mils open used trapezoid shape. > > > > We afraid that if we open the apperture bigger, then > > we may have bridging or solder ball. If we reduce the > > stencil to 4 mils to reduce the blockage or > > resistance, then we may have in-efficient solder or > > many other problem relating thin stencil (damage, > > short-life, etc) > > > > What would be your solution? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Stacy > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of > > your unique holiday gifts! Buy at <http://shopping.yahoo.com/> > > or bid at <http://auctions.yahoo.com/> > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------- > > Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV > 1.8d > > To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following > text in > > the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet > > To temporarily halt delivery of Technet send the following > message: SET > > Technet NOMAIL > > Search previous postings at: www.ipc.org <http://www.ipc.org/> > > On-Line Resources & Databases > > > E-mail Archives > > Please visit IPC web site ( <http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm>) > for > > additional > > information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or > 847-509-9700 > > ext.5315 > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------- > Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 12:49:52 -0800 > From: Mark Mazzoli <[log in to unmask]> > Subject: Re: porosity of gold plating on nickel > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > > Hi Kris, > Try IPC TM-650 2.3.24.2 Nitric Vapor Test. That's the easiest one > I'm > aware of. > Here's a link: <http://www.ipc.org/html/2.3.24.2.pdf> > > Mark Mazzoli > > > > > > > At 02:30 PM 12/13/01 -0500, you wrote: > > Does anyone know of a fairly simple method of determining > porosity of gold > plating over nickel on a PCB? > > > Kristopher J. Keating > Technical Service Engineer > Circuit-Wise, Inc. > 400 Sackett Point Rd. > North Haven, CT 06473 > Tel. (203) 281-6511 > Fax (203) 287-8409 > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using > LISTSERV 1.8d > To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with > following text in > the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet > To temporarily halt delivery of Technet send the following > message: SET > Technet NOMAIL > Search previous postings at: www.ipc.org > <http://www.ipc.org/> > On-Line Resources & Databases > > E-mail Archives > Please visit IPC web site ( > <http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm>) for additional > information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or > 847-509-9700 > ext.5315 > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > > > > > Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 13:44:57 -0700 > From: Steve Abrahamson <[log in to unmask]> > Subject: Re: Inefficient solder on Toshiba micro BGA > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > Hey Stacy, > > It sounds as though on paper, your process is OK. Just to fill you > in on > aspect ratio, that is aperture width/stencil thickness. This is a > good rule > of thumb for rectangular apertures such as for fine pitch > components. For > small circular or square apertures most people use the area aspect > ratio > which is aperture area/wall area. The area aspect ratio should be > above > 66. Thus on a .005" thick stencil with a .0135" square aperture you > are > looking at (.0135*.0135)/((.0135*.005)*4) = .675. > Actually the area aspect ratio for a .0135" round aperture is the > same as > that for a square aperture, yet release on the square aperture has > generally > been proven to be better (don't forget a .002" or .003" radius on > the > corners). > > Anyway my point was going to be that I had the exact same apertures > ordered > on one particular project, and the apertures all clogged up (luckily > we > caught them at the visual step). It seems the apertures were > severely > undersized (more like .0122" x .0122"). So are your apertures > really > 0135"? > > As Kathy mentioned, kneed or condition your paste. The paste may > take a few > prints to fully mix and provide the thixotropic characteristics that > you > want. We use a dummy board for the first print, and then print our > first > production board. > > Personally I think you could get away with a .015" aperture if you > are > dealing with a .0315" pitch product. Even if they undercut your > stencil, > you should be fine. > > Good luck.... > > Steve A > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: My Nguyen [SMTP:[log in to unmask]] > > Sent: Tuesday,December 11,2001 11:43 AM > > To: [log in to unmask] > > Subject: [TN] Inefficient solder on Toshiba micro BGA > > > > Hello all, > > > > Problem description: > > > > Been happening on Rambus - part number tc59rm81xmb. > > Ball diametter: 0.5 mm; ball pitch: 0.8 mm, ball > > height: 0.4 mm. Pad size: 0.3 mm (11.5 mils) > > 5-10% of the time (we run huge amount of them) failure > > modules came from opening soder join or no solder join > > at all. As we inspect the screen printing process (we > > use 5 mils stencil - Dek screenprinting, cleaning > > rate: 2 per print, cleaning cycle Wet-Vacuum/Dry), we > > found un-event solder deposit. Some pad even has very > > little solder or no solder at all. > > > > Stencil is electro-polish; Diamond shape aperture, > > 13.5 mils open used trapezoid shape. > > > > We afraid that if we open the apperture bigger, then > > we may have bridging or solder ball. If we reduce the > > stencil to 4 mils to reduce the blockage or > > resistance, then we may have in-efficient solder or > > many other problem relating thin stencil (damage, > > short-life, etc) > > > > What would be your solution? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Stacy > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of > > your unique holiday gifts! Buy at <http://shopping.yahoo.com/> > > or bid at <http://auctions.yahoo.com/> > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------- > > Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV > 1.8d > > To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following > text in > > the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet > > To temporarily halt delivery of Technet send the following > message: SET > > Technet NOMAIL > > Search previous postings at: www.ipc.org <http://www.ipc.org/> > > On-Line Resources & Databases > > > E-mail Archives > > Please visit IPC web site ( <http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm>) > for > > additional > > information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or > 847-509-9700 > > ext.5315 > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------- > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV > 1.8d > To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following > text in > the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet > To temporarily halt delivery of Technet send the following message: > SET Technet NOMAIL > Search previous postings at: www.ipc.org <http://www.ipc.org/> > > On-Line Resources & Databases > E-mail Archives > Please visit IPC web site ( <http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm>) for > additional > information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or > 847-509-9700 ext.5315 > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 16:10:13 -0500 > From: Tony Steinke <[log in to unmask]> > Subject: Re: .050 PWB > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > Darrel, > I don't mean to sound sarcastic, but almost all board shops should > be able > to manufacture you construction with their eyes closed. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Darrel Therriault <[log in to unmask]> > To: <[log in to unmask]> > Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 1:41 PM > Subject: [TN] .050 PWB > > > > Technet..... > > > > PWB designer and fab folks........We are considering building an > .050" > > PWB with 2 oz Cu, 6-8 layers. > > > > Any heartburn or horror stories with this design or is this within > > normal capability from the design and fab perspective?? > > > > DT > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Darrel Therriault > > VP, Mfg. Operations > > INCEP Technologies, Inc > > (858)547-9925 223 > > [log in to unmask] > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > > Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV > 1.8d > > To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following > text in > > the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet > > To temporarily halt delivery of Technet send the following > message: SET > Technet NOMAIL > > Search previous postings at: www.ipc.org <http://www.ipc.org/> > > On-Line Resources & Databases > > E-mail Archives > > Please visit IPC web site ( <http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm>) > for > additional > > information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or > 847-509-9700 > ext.5315 > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 16:10:06 -0500 > From: Hinners Hans M Civ WRALC/LUGE <[log in to unmask]> > Subject: Re: .050 PWB > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Tony's right unless > you do something "unadvisable" such as an unbalanced construction, > isolated > traces without thieving . . . > > Hans > Integrity First - Service Before Self - Excellence in All We Do > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Hans M. Hinners > Electronics Engineer > Warner Robins - Air Logistics Center (WR-ALC/LUGE) > 226 Cochran Street > Robins AFB GA 31098-1622 > > <mailto:[log in to unmask]> > > Com: (478) 926 - 5224 > Fax: (478) 926 - 4911 > DSN Prefix: 468 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tony Steinke [ <mailto:[log in to unmask]>] > Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 4:10 PM > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: [TN] .050 PWB > > > Darrel, > I don't mean to sound sarcastic, but almost all board shops should > be able > to manufacture you construction with their eyes closed. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Darrel Therriault <[log in to unmask]> > To: <[log in to unmask]> > Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 1:41 PM > Subject: [TN] .050 PWB > > > > Technet..... > > > > PWB designer and fab folks........We are considering building an > .050" > > PWB with 2 oz Cu, 6-8 layers. > > > > Any heartburn or horror stories with this design or is this within > > normal capability from the design and fab perspective?? > > > > DT > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Darrel Therriault > > VP, Mfg. Operations > > INCEP Technologies, Inc > > (858)547-9925 223 > > [log in to unmask] > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > > Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV > 1.8d > > To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following > text in > > the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet > > To temporarily halt delivery of Technet send the following > message: SET > Technet NOMAIL > > Search previous postings at: www.ipc.org <http://www.ipc.org/> > > On-Line Resources & Databases > > E-mail Archives > > Please visit IPC web site ( <http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm>) > for > additional > > information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or > 847-509-9700 > ext.5315 > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > ----- > Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV > 1.8d > To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following > text in > the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet > To temporarily halt delivery of Technet send the following message: > SET > Technet NOMAIL > Search previous postings at: www.ipc.org <http://www.ipc.org/> > > On-Line Resources & Databases > > E-mail Archives > Please visit IPC web site ( <http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm>) for > additional > information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or > 847-509-9700 > ext.5315 > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > ----- > Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 16:25:07 -0600 > From: Mike Clemente <[log in to unmask]> > Subject: PCB Density Study/Design Quoting > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Hello everyone, > > I need to find an accurate PCB density study method and also an > efficient method of quoting PCB designs. > > Has anyone used the density study in IPC-2221? Is it accurate for > Thru-hole and SMT? Are there other methods out there for density study? > > Also, does anyone have any specifics or know where to obtain > information on Quoting PCB design from Schematic to Layout, to Manufacture > and Assembly of PCB? > > Thanks, > > Mike Clemente, C.I.D. > Sr. PCB Design Specialist > dZinit Applied Technologies > Tel: 847-545-8170 > Fax: 847-545-8175 > Email: [log in to unmask] > Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 15:27:57 -0800 > From: Karla Thompson <[log in to unmask]> > Subject: photoplotters > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > I'm in the process of looking at Photoplotters and would appreciate > any > input any of you may have. We currently have a 5-6 year old Barco > Crescent > 30. I'm looking at EIE, Orbotech, and Barco/Mania. If any of you > have any > comments on those, or any others (?) I'd appreciate it. > > > Karla Thompson > CAM Technician > Electronic Controls Design, Inc > Tel: (503) 829-9108 > email: [log in to unmask] > > Hi, > > I will be back on 12/17/01. > > Regards, > Jong --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Technet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8d To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet To temporarily halt delivery of Technet send the following message: SET Technet NOMAIL Search previous postings at: www.ipc.org > On-Line Resources & Databases > E-mail Archives Please visit IPC web site (http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm) for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-509-9700 ext.5315 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------