Another note on this subject. If you are requiring boards built to IPC-6012 how are you confirming inspection to Table 4-3??? As with MIL-PRF-55110 DSCC monitors this activity and with 6012 it is up to the buyer to monitor. I wonder if buyers are aware of this requirement. Thoughts? Rick Howieson GTC >-----Original Message----- >From: Bogdan Gabi [SMTP:[log in to unmask]] >Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2000 12:39 AM >To: [log in to unmask] >Subject: Re: [TN] Quality Control > >Hi, Mirka! >Congratulations for your new job! >This subject was discussed in previous postings in the TechNet, you can >search the archives. >If you want my personal opinion, as I stated before, testing should be done >by the assembly manufacturer, but the level is dependent on the experience >they have with their approved suppliers. We approve suppliers by board and >technology, and perform skip lot after approval.This is in order to be sure >that their performance is on a constant level. If there are changes in the >master drawing, the circuit is considered as a new circuit. >In my experience I witnessed sometimes drops in quality, when bigger >companies swallowed smaller ones, and most of the people in the former >engineering and quality control departments changed jobs. One of our ways to >maintain the quality level is the constant cooperation with the >manufacturer. >Best regards, >Gaby > >> ---------- >> From: Mirka Halas[SMTP:[log in to unmask]] >> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.;Mirka Halas >> Sent: ?ιεν ωπι 17 ιεμι 2000? 23:16 >> To: [log in to unmask] >> Subject: [TN] Quality Control >> >> Hello Technetters, >> I changed jobs recently . In my previous position we >> assembled all our boards at house. We received the finished boards from >> board house and did >> QA on all boards received, which sometimes uncovered problems. >> In the new company the boards are ordered by the assembly house. >> I questioned the assembly house about the QA of the boards, and it seems >> like they just look >> at the boards. I am not very happy with this situation... >> According to the IPC specs the board house should inspect the boards, >> but from my >> previous job I know, that sometimes their inspection may not be >> sufficient. >> Could you let me know what is your experience and how do you handle >> this situation. >> >> Thanks a lot >> Mirka >> >> >> >> -- >> | Mirka Halas TSI TelSys Incorporated | >> | Senior PCB Designer 7100 Columbia Gateway Dr. | >> | [log in to unmask] Columbia, Maryland 21046 | >> | http://www.tsi-telsys.com (410) 872-3900: Main | >> | (410) 872-3922: Direct (410) 872-3901: FAX | >> -=+=-*********************************************************-=+=- >> >> ############################################################## >> TechNet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8c >> ############################################################## >> To subscribe/unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with >> following text in >> the body: >> To subscribe: SUBSCRIBE TECHNET <your full name> >> To unsubscribe: SIGNOFF TECHNET >> ############################################################## >> Please visit IPC web site (http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm) for >> additional >> information. >> If you need assistance - contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or >> 847-509-9700 ext.5315 >> ############################################################## >> ><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> ><HTML> ><HEAD> ><META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=iso-8859-8"> ><META NAME="Generator" CONTENT="MS Exchange Server version 5.5.2650.12"> ><TITLE>RE: [TN] Quality Control</TITLE> ></HEAD> ><BODY> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT COLOR="#0000FF" SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Hi, Mirka!</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT COLOR="#0000FF" SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Congratulations for >your new job!</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT COLOR="#0000FF" SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">This subject was >discussed in previous postings in the TechNet, you can search the >archives.</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT COLOR="#0000FF" SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">If you want my >personal opinion, as I stated before, testing should be done by the assembly >manufacturer, but the level is dependent on the experience they have with >their approved suppliers. We approve suppliers by board and technology, and >perform skip lot after approval.This is in order to be sure that their >performance is on a constant level. If there are changes in the master >drawing, the circuit is considered as a new circuit.</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT COLOR="#0000FF" SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">In my experience I >witnessed sometimes drops in quality, when bigger companies swallowed smaller >ones, and most of the people in the former engineering and quality control >departments changed jobs. One of our ways to maintain the quality level is >the constant cooperation with the manufacturer.</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT COLOR="#0000FF" SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Best regards, ></FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT COLOR="#0000FF" SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Gaby</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=RIGHT><FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">----------</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=RIGHT><B><FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">From</FONT></B><B><FONT >SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">:</FONT></B> <FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans >Serif">Mirka Halas</FONT><FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">[</FONT><FONT >SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">SMTP:[log in to unmask]</FONT><FONT SIZE=1 >FACE="MS Sans Serif">]</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=RIGHT><B><FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">Reply >To</FONT></B><B><FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">:</FONT></B> > <FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">TechNet >E-Mail Forum.;Mirka Halas</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=RIGHT><B><FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">Sent</FONT></B><B><FONT >SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">:</FONT></B> <FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans >Serif">‏ιεν ωπι 17 ιεμι 2000‏ 23:16</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=RIGHT><B><FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">To</FONT></B><B><FONT >SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">:</FONT></B> <FONT SIZE=1 >FACE="MS Sans Serif">[log in to unmask]</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=RIGHT><B><FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans >Serif">Subject</FONT></B><B><FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">:</FONT></B> > <FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans >Serif">[</FONT><FONT SIZE=1 FACE="MS Sans Serif">TN] Quality >Control</FONT></P> ><UL> ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Hello Technetters,</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 >FACE="Arial"> &nbs >p; I changed jobs recently . In my >previous position we</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">assembled all our boards at house. We >received the finished boards from</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">board house and did</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">QA on all boards received, which >sometimes uncovered problems.</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">In the new company the boards are >ordered by the assembly house.</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">I questioned the assembly house about >the QA of the boards, and it seems</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">like they just look</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">at the boards. I am not very happy >with this situation...</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">According to the IPC specs the board >house should inspect the boards,</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">but from my</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">previous job I know, that sometimes >their inspection may not be</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">sufficient.</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Could you let me know what is your >experience and how do you handle</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">this situation.</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Thanks a lot</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Mirka</FONT></P> ><BR> ><BR> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">--</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">| Mirka >Halas >   >; TSI TelSys Incorporated |</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">| Senior PCB >Designer &nb >sp; 7100 Columbia Gateway Dr. >|</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">| >[log in to unmask] &n >bsp; Columbia, Maryland 21046 >|</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">|</FONT><U> <FONT COLOR="#0000FF" >SIZE=2 FACE="Arial"><A HREF="http://www.tsi-telsys.com" >TARGET="_blank">http://www.tsi-telsys.com</A></FONT></U><FONT SIZE=2 >FACE="Arial"> &nbs >p; (410) 872-3900: Main >|</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">| (410) 872-3922: >Direct   >; (410) 872-3901: >FAX |</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 >FACE="Arial"> -=+=-***************************************************** >****-=+=-</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 >FACE="Arial">##############################################################</ >FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">TechNet Mail List provided as a free >service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8c</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 >FACE="Arial">##############################################################</ >FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">To subscribe/unsubscribe, send a >message to [log in to unmask] with following text in</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">the body:</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">To subscribe: SUBSCRIBE >TECHNET <your full name></FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">To unsubscribe: SIGNOFF >TECHNET</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 >FACE="Arial">##############################################################</ >FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">Please visit IPC web site >(</FONT><U><FONT COLOR="#0000FF" SIZE=2 FACE="Arial"><A >HREF="http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm" >TARGET="_blank">http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm</A></FONT></U><FONT SIZE=2 >FACE="Arial">) for additional</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">information.</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">If you need assistance - contact >Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 FACE="Arial">847-509-9700 ext.5315</FONT></P> > ><P ALIGN=LEFT><FONT SIZE=2 >FACE="Arial">##############################################################</ >FONT></P> ></UL> ></BODY> ></HTML> ############################################################## TechNet Mail List provided as a free service by IPC using LISTSERV 1.8c ############################################################## To subscribe/unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in the body: To subscribe: SUBSCRIBE TECHNET <your full name> To unsubscribe: SIGNOFF TECHNET ############################################################## Please visit IPC web site (http://www.ipc.org/html/forum.htm) for additional information. 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