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July 2015

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Subject:
From:
Douglas Pauls <[log in to unmask]>
Reply To:
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>, Douglas Pauls <[log in to unmask]>
Date:
Wed, 1 Jul 2015 11:22:40 -0500
Content-Type:
text/plain
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text/plain (159 lines)
Not in the Coating Empire, so not my area to rule.  More John Perry's.  I
am still trying to get the term "de-Douged" into T-50.


Doug Pauls
Principal Materials and Process Engineer
Rockwell Collins

On Wed, Jul 1, 2015 at 11:13 AM, Stadem, Richard D. <
[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> My apologies, Joel.
> I had no idea that this particular segment of the industry has totally
> different meanings of those terms as related to embedded circuitry. I stand
> re-educated by both you and Dennis Fritz.
> Perhaps we need an IPC-T50-M document just for embedded circuits!
> Attention Doug Pauls!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joel Peiffer [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2015 4:31 PM
> To: Stadem, Richard D.; TechNet E-Mail Forum
> Subject: RE: RE: PCB Fabrication house with Embedded
> DiscreteComponentCapability
>
> Hi Richard,
>
> These may be terms that are utilized elsewhere in the electronics industry
> but for Embedded Components which we are discussing below, per IPC
> documentation, Formed components and Placed (or Inserted) components are
> classes of embedded components.  Check out the IPC documentation in
> IPC-2316 and elsewhere.  I have worked in the embedded components industry
> for 20 years and these are the terms that are used.
>
> Regards, Joel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stadem, Richard D. [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2015 3:32 PM
> To: TechNet E-Mail Forum; Joel Peiffer
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] RE: PCB Fabrication house with Embedded Discrete
> ComponentCapability
>
> No, the commonly understood terms within the industry are:
>
> 1) "Formed components" are those whose leads are formed prior to assembly.
> Examples are SMT QFPs and SOICs where the leads exit at the top of the body
> and are in frames, where prior to assembly the QFP requires excision from
> the frame and the leads are also formed into a gullwing shape. Another
> example is through-hole axial leads bent 90 degrees and trimmed, sometimes
> with a standoff bend, etc.
>
> 2) "Inserted components" are typically considered to be PTH components
> that are inserted into PTH holes and soldered, either by hand or by axial
> insertion machines along with selective or wave soldering.
>
> 3) "Embedded components" are those that are embedded into the PWB as part
> of the PWB fabrication process. Just about every smart phone and tablet
> utilizes embedded technology. There is more than one process for doing
> this; conductive-ink printed and subsequently laminated PWBs, or
> encapsulated, such as Joe (The Wizard) Fjelstad's  Verdant Occam process.
>
> dean
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Joel Peiffer
> Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2015 3:08 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] PCB Fabrication house with Embedded Discrete Component
> Capability
>
> "Inserted Components" are fully functional components such as caps,
> resistors, etc. that can be inserted into boards.  "Formed" components are
> components that made as part of the PCB fab process.  Both inserted and
> formed components (mostly caps and resistors) are fairly common these days
> for many products (for example, just about every smart phone and tablet
> utilizes formed technology).  Inserted components were probably first used
> in the 1980s or early 1990s.  Formed components were first used the 1960s.
>
> You need to define whether you mean inserted or formed as many PCB fabs
> utilize one technology but few offer both.
>
> Regards, Joel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wayne Thayer
> Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2015 12:02 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [TN] PCB Fabrication house with Embedded Discrete
> Component Capability
>
> Hi GA Tan-
>
> The question is what you mean by "discrete". For most people it means a
> passive which "stands on its own" as opposed to something done with special
> dielectrics and/or resistive metal layers to create passives within a
> circuit board.
>
> For the embedding of truly discrete components, this is Joe Fjelstad's
> special area. He had a shop build a demo circuit. His website covering the
> technology is www.verdantelectronics.com
>
> The tricky part is how to electrically connect to the passives. Probably a
> laser could be used to dig down to the part and then plate up a contact.
> But most end terminations are covered with Sn, which is particularly
> difficult to make contact to (other than with solder).
>
> For the other technique, using special foils and/or dielectrics, there are
> a few competing products. They all seem to substantially increase the
> number of steps required to make a board, and they are so
> volume-inefficient that there are only a small number of cases where they
> work out economically.
>
> Wayne Thayer
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Tan Geok Ang
> Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2015 10:13 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [TN] PCB Fabrication house with Embedded Discrete Component
> Capability
>
> Dear All,
>                I'm looking for PCB supplier who has the above capability
> for proto design. Any recommendation? Thank in advance.
>
> Regards
> GA Tan
>
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