TECHNET Archives

December 2012

TechNet@IPC.ORG

Options: Use Monospaced Font
Show Text Part by Default
Show All Mail Headers

Message: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Topic: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Author: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]

Print Reply
Subject:
From:
Joyce Koo <[log in to unmask]>
Reply To:
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>, Joyce Koo <[log in to unmask]>
Date:
Tue, 1 Jan 2013 01:15:17 +0000
Content-Type:
text/plain
Parts/Attachments:
text/plain (107 lines)
I didn't know that.  Thx.  I assume you do bake out after? Just curious, any MEMS device using such a routine screen? Thx. 
--------------------------
Sent using BlackBerry


----- Original Message -----
From: Wenger, George M. [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Monday, December 31, 2012 06:18 PM
To: TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Joyce Koo
Subject: RE: [TN] Susceptibility of electronics to C-SAM

Joyce,

I happen to agree with Steve and Richard's response and disagree with your response.  In the RF power amplifier world there are many power transistor packages that are soldered to boards and heat sinks whose solder joints are extremely difficult to inspect even with high kV transmission x-ray systems.  We routinely use C-SAM as an inspect/screening tool for volume production as well as NPI pilot development.  If circuit packs are not aqueous cleanable then C-SAM would be a problem.  However, when circuit packs are capable of being aqueous cleaned putting them in water for a couple of minutes to do C-SAM isn't an issue.

We routinely have done C-SAM imaging on lots of telecommunication circuit packs using transducers from 15MHz to 100MHz and haven't experienced any adverse effects.

Steve's comment about a quick call to Sonoscan by Richard's customer might go a long way to resolving their concern.  I can't speak for Sonoscan but from what I know there are many companies who by their C-SAM equipment as a screening tool and not as an FA tool.

Regards,
George
George M. Wenger
Senior Principal Reliability / FMA Engineer
Andrew Corporation - Wireless Network Solutions
40 Technology Drive, Warren, NJ 07059
(908) 546-4531 Office (732) 309-8964 Mobile
E-mail: [log in to unmask]

-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Joyce Koo
Sent: Monday, December 31, 2012 3:25 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Susceptibility of electronics to C-SAM

C-SAM is FA tool, not screening tool.  Parts got wet and defined delam or not during the test.  You can not re-use the part.  Although it is called non-destructive, but definitely, not a screening tool on my book.  If you are looking for wire open or short (assume you have done X-ray, found nothing), dry "squid" may be better.  Again. Not screening tool, but a FA tool. If they don't like ultrasound, and have deep pocket $.
--------------------------
Sent using BlackBerry


----- Original Message -----
From: Steven Creswick [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Monday, December 31, 2012 02:21 PM
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [TN] Susceptibility of electronics to C-SAM

Richard,

If there is no cavity around the wires, there should be no issue - period!
I suggest that they are drawing inappropriate conclusions.

I absolutely agree that ultrasonic cleaning of sealed, cavity style components can be catastrophic, but you appear to be speaking of a PEMs device.


Now then, if there were an air gap in your package, the u/s signal would be blocked, and you would see nothing on your acoustic image... unless, you could turn it over and scan from the other side.  Therefore, I doubt that you have a cavity style device - but you could surprise us  :-)

I had an acoustic microscope from 'the other guys', and would use transducers of quite tightly fixed frequency, depending on what was being scanned.  Higher frequency for thin parts, greater resolution.  Lower freq for penetration, but not necessary fantastic resolution.  I forget what my low freq transducer was 30, or 80 MHz ....  The highs were in the hundreds of MHz.  A quickie call to Sonoscan could tell you what frequency they would use for your device and one could calculate the wavelength and make a reasonable guess if this would set up harmonics in the wires.  My guess is the freqs are way too high, but one could check.

Maybe you will convince them easily and the New Year will start out well!

Best regards,


Steve Creswick
Sr Associate - Balanced Enterprise Solutions http://www.linkedin.com/in/stevencreswick
                         616 834 1883



-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Stadem, Richard D.
Sent: Monday, December 31, 2012 1:48 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Susceptibility of electronics to C-SAM

I have a good understanding of the effects of damage that can be caused by cavitation when cleaning electronics using ultrasonic wash with the wrong sweep frequency, but does anyone know if ultrasonic energy from C-SAM analysis can cause damage to electronics? I recently had a customer object when I suggested using Sonoscan to inspect some components for die bond issues, and he said that he had heard ultrasonics could damage electronics.
I explained to him that while that was possibly true of ultrasonic cleaning (if not done properly), I had never heard of C-SAM harming electronics.
Anyone have any experience with damage caused by C-SAM inspection?

This message and/or attachments may include information subject to GDC4S S.P. 1.8.6 and GD Corporate Policy 07-105 and are intended to be accessed only by authorized recipients. Use, storage and transmission are governed by General Dynamics and its policies. Contractual restrictions apply to third parties. Recipients should refer to the policies or contract to determine proper handling. Unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not an intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the original message.




______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the Symantec Email Security.cloud service.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] ______________________________________________________________________


______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the Symantec Email Security.cloud service.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] ______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------------------------
This transmission (including any attachments) may contain confidential information, privileged material (including material protected by the solicitor-client or other applicable privileges), or constitute non-public information. Any use of this information by anyone other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, please immediately reply to the sender and delete this information from your system. Use, dissemination, distribution, or reproduction of this transmission by unintended recipients is not authorized and may be unlawful.

______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the Symantec Email Security.cloud service.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] ______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------------------------
This transmission (including any attachments) may contain confidential information, privileged material (including material protected by the solicitor-client or other applicable privileges), or constitute non-public information. Any use of this information by anyone other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, please immediately reply to the sender and delete this information from your system. Use, dissemination, distribution, or reproduction of this transmission by unintended recipients is not authorized and may be unlawful.

______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the Symantec Email Security.cloud service.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] 
______________________________________________________________________

ATOM RSS1 RSS2