Agree. In addition, the electrical design and scheme how to drive LED got a lot to do with it. you can pulse modulate them to achieve desirable brightness at high frequency to adjust heat output. There are many LED display array in the aircraft with years of service to maintain night vision compatibility (not talking about the bill board size, those are less than 1mm LED in ultra high densities). We are talking about 20k or so LEDs in array format. If you get a good quality LED (not save fraction of few cents each), user (designer) quality at system level got a lot to do with reliability (just like violin player, beginner wouldn't cut it).
My 2 cents.
Joyce Koo
Materials Researcher - Materials Interconnect Lab
Research In Motion Limited
Office: (519) 888-7465 79945
Mobile: (226) 220-4760
-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Garcia, Rigo (GSFC-300.0)[ARES CORP]
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 8:51 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] what is the reliability of CFLs and LEDs as incandescent light bulb replacements?
My two cents...
I used to work for a LED company and can testify that ...if you use them correctly...LEDs will run basically forever. Temperature kills them, so, bad designs with poor heat sinking will just be a waste of money. The one problem LEDs have been fighting for the longest time is to be more efficient that CFLs. The last time I checked they were NOT significantly better. Given that they need expensive parts to manage the electric current and temperature they have always focused on high-end markets were their higher cost is offset by the cost to replace the "light bulbs".
My personal opinion is that they will never kick in (I have been waiting for more than 10 years) unless they turn electricity into light at a significantly better rate than CFLs.
About CFLs I embraced them about 10 years ago. In California the power companies provided instant rebates that lowered the price of the CFL down to about $1 dollar each. By doing that, I have lowered my electric bill to approx. 50% (about $50 a month) of what it would be using incandescent. Reliability has been pretty high and I always try to get the ones with the light temperature (color) that is pleasant to me. Probably about 3 or 4 of them have died on me on these 10 years under normal use. The only thing that is giving me problems right now is that the house I am living in right now has dimmable controls on two lights...these little guys KILLS CFLs like there is no tomorrow. I have had to replace about 6 of them in the last year. I got to change the switches to non-dimmable ones.
Other than that CFLs have worked for me like a charm.
Rigo
Sr. Quality Engineer
NASA, Goddard Space Flight Center
Workmanship Standards, Code 300
Phone. (301) 286-6129
Fax. (301) 286-6576
-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Steven Creswick
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 4:26 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] what is the reliability of CFLs and LEDs as incandescent light bulb replacements?
Brian,
Wow! The only 'early ones' that I could get were made to the West of the US [across a large pond], and they were not cheap!
I remember in one purchase, I had 50% mortality just getting them home. The store asked me what I had done with them? ... took them out of box and screwed into socket. Didn't work!!! Here I am! Had to expend an Additional significant amount of fuel and time to return them. Suggested that they take the rest of the shipment and put them back into the shipping container and send them back to point of origin. My 'environmental savings' had long since been flushed away.
I prefer the cool white [daylight] bulbs vs the dim 'warm' ones myself...
I remain cautious about putting them in enclosed fixtures and/or continuous use applications. Certain brands are on my do-not-use, or use-with-caution list.
I still remain skeptical about how much additional Hg was released into the environment by less than intelligent, frustrated consumers in the maddening rush to 'save the environment.'
Even though prices of CFL's have come down and reliability has gone up, they are still not particularly cost effective for many of my 'typical' home-use applications. Your situation, on-the-island, could be different, however. IMHO, 'Feel good' still remains a large factor in many cases. LED luminaries are just way too expensive yet!
Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Brian Ellis
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 2:42 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] what is the reliability of CFLs and LEDs as incandescent light bulb replacements?
I agree that early CFLs were terrible for domestic use. Several years ago, being a professional environmentalist, I changed nearly every bulb in the house. I was disappointed because of 50 Hz flicker (well, 100 Hz really!), poor lifetime, cold light, long start-up time, poor reliability and high cost (about the equivalent of $10 each). They were all made in the USA (I was told the European ones weren't available). I think I must have taken 20 back for guarantee replacement.
Little-by-little, they were replaced by European and Chinese ones with warm phosphors, faster start-up, high-frequency (flicker-free) "ballasts" with minimal mercury and 1/3 of the price. These seem to be lasting their advertised lifetime -- can't really say, as I've replaced only one in ~5 years. I'm now entirely satisfied. I'm also amazed at the great variety of shapes, styles and sizes that are sold now, including traditional bulb-shaped ones. I recently installed a new light and went to Leroy-Merlin for a decorative CFL; it took me half-an-hour to find what I was looking for, such was the choice. I would guess they must have had 200 or more different types of CFL on their shelves, which occupied a whole aisle.
Brian
On 29/08/2012 00:29, Bob Landman wrote:
> A very interesting discussion about what's inside these new devices. Have any of you torn one of them apart to see how well they are made? You'll be amazed at the poor quality of the components in a lamp that's supposed to have a 10 year life.
>
> -Bob Landman
>
> IFTLE 98 Lester the Lightbulb vs CFL and LED : the Saga Continues By
> Dr Phil Garrou
>
> In IFTLE 63 [ see IFTLE 63, "Bidding Adieu to Lester Lightbulb http://www.electroiq.com/blogs/insights_from_leading_edge/2011/08/iftle-63-bidding-adieu-to-lester-lightbulb.html] back in Aug 2011 IFTLE attempted to make the case that our little 25 cent friend Lester the incandescent bulb had gotten a bump rap as he awaited extinction on death row.
>
> It's not that the claims of the newer technologies (CFL and LED) using less power than incandescent bulbs are invalid, but rather what appears to be the bold faced lie that their much greater cost is compensated by their decades long lifetimes that upsets all Lester supporters.
>
> http://www.electroiq.com/blogs/insights_from_leading_edge/2012/04/iftl
> e-98-lester-the-lightbulb-vs-cfl-and-led-the-saga-continues.html
>
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