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Subject:
From:
Douglas Pauls <[log in to unmask]>
Reply To:
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Date:
Wed, 28 Mar 2012 14:02:24 -0500
Content-Type:
text/plain
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text/plain (684 lines)
Ever heard of Rum and Coke?  Seven and Seven?  Or my personal favorite, 
blackberry brandy and Squirt?

Doug Pauls



From:   "Stadem, Richard D." <[log in to unmask]>
To:     TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>, 
"[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
Date:   03/28/2012 01:49 PM
Subject:        RE: [TN] Rework Concern and Question



What can be adult-rated about soda pop, anyhow?

-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Douglas Pauls
Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2012 1:46 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question

Must be one of those fine points of REACH buried in the admini-babble of
the legislation.

Doug Pauls



From:   "Peter Swanson" <[log in to unmask]>
To:     "TechNet E-Mail Forum" <[log in to unmask]>,
<[log in to unmask]>
Cc:     <[log in to unmask]>
Date:   03/28/2012 11:26 AM
Subject:        Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question



Rumour has it that US recipe Mt Dew is banned in UK and locally available
product is therefore adulterated.

Sent from my iPhone
Peter Swanson
Office: +44 1865 842842
Mobile: + 44 7785 908556

On 28 Mar 2012, at 18:20, "Douglas Pauls" <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:

> Ooooooooooooooo, and there is one in Oxfordshire.  I owe  you one Ian.
> Thanks
>
> Doug Pauls
>
>
>
> From:   "Fox, Ian" <[log in to unmask]>
> To:     TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>,
> "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
> Date:   03/28/2012 10:40 AM
> Subject:        RE: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
>
>
> Doug, you are looking in the wrong places. Next time try Asda (owned by
> walmart) they do mt. dew. I hate to see a man suffer.............
>
> Regards
> Ian
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Douglas Pauls
> Sent: 28 March 2012 14:09
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> Ohhhhh, I can tell you from experience there is no Mt Dew or Diet Mt.
Dew
> in the UK.  I go into withdrawal every time I go there.  Last time I
came
> back through the Detroit Airport, the lady in the convenience shop said
> she had never seen someone so happy to find a bottle of Diet Mt. Dew.
"Did
>
> you just get back from the UK?"   Hilarious.
>
> Doug Pauls
>
>
>
> From:   Joyce Koo <[log in to unmask]>
> To:     <[log in to unmask]>
> Date:   03/28/2012 07:57 AM
> Subject:        Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
> Sent by:        TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
>
>
>
> Depend upon which country, cross the boarder you don't have that much
real
> "stuff" in it.  (not sure about UK.  It might be the same, since we both

> got Queen on our coins).
>
> Joyce Koo
> Materials Researcher - Materials Interconnect Lab Research In Motion
> Limited
> Office: (519) 888-7465 79945
> Mobile: (226) 220-4760
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wenger, George M.
> Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2012 8:53 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> Mountain Dew also works for some people I know (one in particular)
>
> Regards,
> George
> George M. Wenger
> Senior Principal Reliability / FMA Engineer Andrew Corporation -
Wireless
> Network Solutions 40 Technology Drive, Warren, NJ 07059
> (908) 546-4531 Office (732) 309-8964 Mobile
> E-mail: [log in to unmask]
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Stewart McCracken
> Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2012 8:42 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> Oops, just noticed a couple of good typo's in my previous post!
> Should be keV and not kV throughout and Sn La1 peak is at 3.44keV not
> 1.74kV!
> Other than that - perfect, the lesson here - more coffee before morning
> e-mails....
>
> (and its probably still an escape peak rather than a real Si peak!)
>
> Stewart
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Stewart McCracken
> Sent: 28 March 2012 09:43
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> Hi Folks,
>
> Following some of the previous posts, I believe that the "Si" peak which

> is being "detected" during EDX, is not a Si peak at all!
> There is a very good chance that what the system is showing is an
artefact
> of the EDX system know as an "escape peak". In this case, a small
"false"
> peak occurs at 1.74kV below strongest peak (which in this case will be
Sn
> La1 at 1.74kV), giving you what appears as a peak at around 1.7kV which
is
> around the same as the Si Ka peak 1.74kV).
> Bottom line is that the "Si" peak which is being described is most
likely
> an EDX artefact and not a Si peak at all!
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Stewart
>
>
> Stewart McCracken
> MCS Ltd.
> Centre House
> Midlothian Innovation Centre
> Roslin
> Midlothian
> EH25 9RE
> U.K.
>
> t. +44 (0)131 440 9090
> m. +44(0)7711 541735
> e. [log in to unmask]
> w. www.themcsgroup.co.uk
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Mike Fenner
> Sent: 28 March 2012 00:30
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> I sincerely doubt any Si in the solder, Probably the Si you are seeing
is
> from silica filler in the device body or something like that.
> So what is happening to stop solder re-melting?
> Possibly if the device leads are copper then with extended heating the
Cu
> can dissolve into the near pure Sn solder and drive the liquidus up -
and
> the longer you heat the greater the Cu dissolution and the higher the
MP.
> You are probably dissolving out the PCB pad/through hole barrel as well.
> The Cu/Sn phase diagram looks like a tick or check mark. The short Sn
down
> stroke side is from 232 to low point of 227 and the Cu up stroke side is

> near vertical to MP of Cu somewhere over 1000C, so you get a very rapid
> temp increase for small compositional change.
>
> Suggest try come in with a hot iron (more than 700) to melt out the
> existing composition quickly or flush with more solder to add tin to the

> mix and depress MP.  Or both.
>
>
> Regards
>
> Mike Fenner
> Bonding Services & Products
> T: +44 [0] 1865 522 663 E: [log in to unmask]
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Stadem, Richard D.
> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2012 10:01 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> I think, but am not sure, that you are attempting to remove a new
> component whose leads are FINISHED (not soldered) with SAC305 solder,
and
> that is why you measure Sn98 on the parts straight out of the tape (I am

> going to disregard the SEM analysis of 2% silicon for a moment).
>
> Secondly, the new parts were probably soldered to the PWB with SAC305
> solder as well, and that is why when you attempt to unsolder them or
bring
> them into liquidus, you are having more difficulty than you did with the

> old parts.
>
> Not only were the old parts finished with Sn63 solder, but they were
also
> soldered in place with Sn63 solder.
> The new parts are meant to be RoHS compliant, and apparently they are,
> with a Sn level of 98%, and no Pb in sight on the SEM diagram. If that
> were the only change, you should notice no difference in the ability to
> remove the part if they were, in fact, soldered to the PWB with Sn63;
the
> plating change alone would not make any noticeable difference.
>
> Soldering them to the PWB with lead-free SAC305 alloy would make a huge
> difference in your ability to unsolder and remove the part, no matter
what
> finish was used to plate the part.
>
> Silicon will not break down and become part of an alloy under 1000 deg.
C.
> The 2% SEM pickup is probably silicon chips or dust from the component
> body.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wenger, George M.
> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2012 3:25 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> Dave Hillman,
>
> With your metallurgical background you might be a better person than I
to
> make a comment.  I'm not sure I've even had or seen an occasion where
> something dissolved in the bulk solder and increased the
> melting/solidification temperature.  Yes I've seen the leading edge of
> solder as it flows and wets a surface dissolve metallization and freeze
> because the local meting temperature changed but I've never seen that
> happen to the bulk of a solder joint
>
> Regards,
> George
> George M. Wenger
> Senior Principal Reliability / FMA Engineer Andrew Corporation -
Wireless
> Network Solutions 40 Technology Drive, Warren, NJ 07059
> (908) 546-4531 Office (732) 309-8964 Mobile
> E-mail: [log in to unmask]
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leland Woodall [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2012 4:14 PM
> To: TechNet E-Mail Forum; Wenger, George M.
> Subject: RE: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> George,
>
> It's been a long day, and maybe I'm not making myself too clear.
>
> We're not being able to achieve a liquidus state with a 700 degree F
> soldering iron.  We're not trying to melt the lead, just the solder
that's
>
> holding it to the PCB.  We're not accomplishing that with the new
> component, so I'm thinking something has mixed with the solder joint and

> has raised the resultant reflow temperature.
>
> Leland
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wenger, George M.
> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2012 4:10 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> Leland,
>
> Am I missing something?  I don't think it really matter that the lead
base
>
> material or lead surface finish is.  What matters is the solder used to
> attach the lead to the board.  When you desolder a lead you don't melt
the
>
> lead you melt the solder.
>
> Regards,
> George
> George M. Wenger
> Senior Principal Reliability / FMA Engineer Andrew Corporation -
Wireless
> Network Solutions
> 40 Technology Drive, Warren, NJ 07059
> (908) 546-4531 Office (732) 309-8964 Mobile
> E-mail: [log in to unmask]
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of David D. Hillman
> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2012 4:05 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> Hi Leland - I recommend you find out the lead base metal composition. If

> you shot an SEM-EDS of the lead toe, you could be getting the Si from
the
> base metal composition and not part of the solder alloy composition.
>
> Dave Hillman
> Rockwell Collins
> [log in to unmask]
>
>
>
> Leland Woodall <[log in to unmask]> Sent by: TechNet
> <[log in to unmask]>
> 03/27/2012 02:52 PM
> Please respond to
> TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to Leland Woodall

> <[log in to unmask]>
>
>
> To
> <[log in to unmask]>
> cc
>
> Subject
> Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Vladimir,
>
> We analyzed raw components straight out of the tape and reel packaging.
> The site selection was on the bottom side of the leads at the toe.
>
> Leland
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of vladimir Igoshev
> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2012 3:12 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> Sorry Ben, it doesn't.
> Leland,
>
> What you are saying sounds strange. What does it mean: "We've analyzed
the
>
> lead material beneath the SEM and it returns 98% tin and 2% silicone"?
Did
>
> you analyzed leads or solder? Where the analysis was taken from? Did you

> analyzed leads with pads ripped off?
>
> Regards,
>
> Vladimir
>
> SENTEC Testing Laboratory Inc.
> 11 Canadian Road, Unit 7.
> Scarborough, ON M1R 5G1
> Tel: (416) 899-1882
> Fax: (905) 882-8812
> www.sentec.ca
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "Gumpert, Ben" <[log in to unmask]>
> Sender: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
> Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2012 18:58:21
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Reply-To: TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>,
>        "Gumpert, Ben"
>        <[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Re: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> Leland,
>
> I won't claim to be an expert, but this website seems to imply something

> along those lines.
> http://resource.npl.co.uk/mtdata/phdiagrams/sisn.htm
>
> Ben
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Leland Woodall
> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2012 2:18 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: EXTERNAL: [TN] Rework Concern and Question
>
> Folks,
>
> We've ran across a strange incident and I'd like a little advice from
the
> group.
>
> We recently underwent a component vendor change, and part of the first
> group of boards were misbuilt due to incorrect polarity (the part
marking
> was misinterpreted by the vision operator).
>
> Anyway, an attempt to remove the part by our Repair group resulted in
> lifted pads on 10 of the first 12 boards.  We've analyzed the lead
> material beneath the SEM and it returns 98% tin and 2% silicone.  The
old
> style component comes off quite easily (within 3 seconds), and an
analysis
>
> of its leads shows to be 100% tin.  It's a 6 pin diode with very little
> mass.
>
> What's going on here?  Does a 2% silicone mix raise the melting point of

> solder by 200 degrees C?
>
> Please help me understand.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Leland
>
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