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Subject:
From:
"Whittaker, Dewey (EHCOE)" <[log in to unmask]>
Reply To:
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>, Whittaker, Dewey (EHCOE)
Date:
Mon, 18 Jul 2011 08:35:13 -0700
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Bob,

Since you injected humor in this thread, I want to clear something up. A
few people thought I was pro Lead-free, because I said there were a
thousand grand successes. 

*         Thousand= 1,000

*         Thousand= a "grand"

*         1,000 x $1,000 = $1,000,000

*         A lot of Millionaires came to be

 

This charade by the EU was based on political expediency and not
technical merit; however, we as an Industry RoHS to the occasion in
spite of potentially un-REACHable goals. Old products became very
lucrative when painted green. In England many cottage Industries sprang
up, but we can't just blame the Thatchers.

Dewey

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bob Landman
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2011 7:39 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Lead Free solder has performed well...

 

Bev, 

 

I know you and I think you're a brilliant guy but please qualify your
statement with the fact that your company makes THROW AWAY products!
What's the lifetime of a 'crack'berry, 2-3 years?

 

Sure, RIM can use Pb-free processes (and no-clean) but I CANNOT!  And
that's why I and Gordon Davy and Denny Fritz and I searched for a
process to stop tin whiskers.  But we have no solution for all the other
problems lead-free causes.  Wish we did!!

 

Nor can biomed, aerospace, telecom or many other critical life
sustaining industries tolerate lead-free processes and continue to have
the same reliablity.

 

I have no knowledge of whether or not Ron Lasky has made a fortune on
this fiasco, but he's not making things better for those of us in the
high rel industries when he makes outrageous statements such as what was
said here.

 

Sincerely,

 

Bob Landman

H&L Instruments, LLC

LDF Coatings, LLC

  

 

-----Original Message-----

From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bev Christian

Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2011 9:24 PM

To: [log in to unmask]

Subject: Re: [TN] Lead Free solder has performed well...

 

Richard,

I consider both you and Ron Lasky friends.  I disagree with both him
saying it is a "grand success" (without qualification, more on that in a
bit) and you saying his opinion is motivated by greed.

 

I think I know Ron well enough to know it is not greed. I mean he is not
getting THAT much $ from Indium. :) All kidding aside, it would be
against his moral principles. I think you are too harsh in your comment.

 

For companies like I work for and many others in the commercial sector,
it has been a grand success, but, as you say, at a cost to the
environment and it has involved succeeding in a grand and fun and
challenging scientific and engineering endeavor.  That surmounting of
the struggle by those you named and many others is the "grand success". 

 

Finally, I think George Wenger said it best, I think this is close to a
direct quote: "One of the best things mankind has done environmentally
is ban tetraethyl lead. One of the worst things we have done is ban
tin/lead solder."

 

With that I close.

 

Bev

 

-----Original Message-----

From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Stadem, Richard D.

Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2011 4:40 PM

To: [log in to unmask]

Subject: Re: [TN] Lead Free solder has performed well...

 

I have to agree with George Wenger, Scott Post and many others. 

 

Irresponsible statements like "lead-free solder is a grand success"
should NOT be ignored. Those who make such statements in the face of all
of the contrary evidence should be noted, and treated as motivated only
by greed.

Lead-free soldering certainly has been known for many "thousand$" of
successes.

 

I have learned that it is not even worth the bother to refute such
statements with those who make them. It may be a "grand success" for
PhDs who contract to solder paste companies, but it certainly has not
been a "grand success" to literally thousands of companies dealing with
the reliability elephant sitting in the room getting larger by the day,
and the associated fallout as a result. 

 

It certainly has not been a success to the environment, because it
created many negative environmental impacts where there were none in the
first place. As a result of the tin mining issues, as well as billions
of additional kilowatt hours needed yearly to reflow the same products,
and the loss of reliability that goes hand-in-hand with the elimination
of lead in the solder joint, well, it certainly cannot be called
anything close to a "grand success". 

 

And it certainly was very poorly planned and implemented. RoHS
requirements for lead-free solder were rammed through without any due
diligence on the part of the solder companies whatsoever. Ironically,
we, an industry that prides itself for its reliability assurance and
quality standards and for developing tools such as FMEA, 5 Whys, and
other mistake-proofing methods can only shake our heads in dismay and
embarrassment from these self-appointed "solder experts" who
irresponsibly supported these changes forced upon us by the EU, and are
now standing at the pulpit and make such

claims as if they were directly responsible for this "Grand $ucce$$".


 

Indeed, if lead-free solder was a "grand success", it was only so
because of the humongous collective effort and the collaboration by the
process engineers and scientists and the true reliability experts within
the industry such as Werner Engelmaier, Craig Hillman, Dave Hillman,
George Wenger, and so many others who were able to identify and respond
to all of the issues, which extend well beyond just tin whiskers. 

 

They were able to identify issues such as pad cratering, head-on-pillow,
shrinkage cracks, the exacerbation of Black Pad and Brittle nickel due
to the lack of lead and higher reflow and rework temperatures, copper
dissolution and de-wetting, non-homogeneous mixed-alloy BGA solder
joints, PWB issues and component reliability issues from reflow at
higher lead-free temperatures, and literally hundreds of other problems
that popped up as a result of lead-free solder and RoHS requirements in
general. 

 

If an engineer forced through changes like this in a process where I
work, without having done the due diligence and thorough qualification
required, he would have been fired.

 

Had not some of true experts been here to identify and solve these
issues that resulted from RoHS lead-free requirements, it would have
been much more of a fiasco and clusterfooey than it actually was and
still is. Can you imagine what something like this would have been like
without the benefit of these people and the Technet Forum?

 

Those in the Forum are the people I will listen to when they declare
anything as being a "grand success", not them other smart folks who
don't know a Metcal iron from a Hakko wand.

 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wenger, George M.

Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2011 12:59 PM

To: [log in to unmask]

Subject: Re: [TN] Lead Free solder has performed well...

 

It seems premature to state "lead-free solder is a grand success" with
only

five years (July 2006 to July 2011) experience.   

 

Regards,

George

George M. Wenger

Senior Principal Reliability / FMA Engineer Andrew Corporation -
Wireless Network Solutions 40 Technology Drive, Warren, NJ 07059

(908) 546-4531 Office (732) 309-8964 Mobile

E-mail: [log in to unmask]

 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Eric Christison

Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2011 12:20 PM

To: [log in to unmask]

Subject: [TN] Lead Free solder has performed well...

 

http://www.designnews.com/author.asp?section_id=1389&doc_id=231199&f_src
=des

ignnews_gnews

 

"Dr. Ronald Lasky, Dartmouth professor of engineering and a frequent
blogger on solder, claims the transition to lead-free was a grand
success. "A lot of people claim that lead-free solder is not as reliable
as lead-based solder," Lasky told me. "We're now five years into the
implementation of RoHS, and we've made $3 trillion work of electronic. 

We haven't really noticed any big change in reliability.""

 

I thought some of you may be interested in the above article.

 

Regards,

 

 

--

Eric Christison

Consumer&  Micro group

Imaging Division

 

STMicroelectronics (R&D) Ltd

33 Pinkhill

Edinburgh EH12 7BF

United Kingdom

 

Tel:  +44 (0)131 336 6165

Fax:  + 44 (0)131 336 6001

 

The contents of the email are ST confidential.

 

 

 

 

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