TECHNET Archives

January 2011

TechNet@IPC.ORG

Options: Use Monospaced Font
Show Text Part by Default
Show All Mail Headers

Message: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Topic: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Author: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]

Print Reply
Subject:
From:
"David D. Hillman" <[log in to unmask]>
Reply To:
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask]
Date:
Fri, 28 Jan 2011 13:04:15 -0600
Content-Type:
text/plain
Parts/Attachments:
text/plain (283 lines)
Hi Paul - excellent example!

Dave



Paul Edwards <[log in to unmask]> 
Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
01/28/2011 12:30 PM
Please respond to
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to
Paul Edwards <[log in to unmask]>


To
[log in to unmask]
cc

Subject
Re: [TN] Tantalum Capacitors and double sided reflow






Dave,

Fine job of explanation of the issues...

I would like to add something...

Like others here I have reflowed 100s of 1000s of Tants in double-sided 
reflow without having known issues.  However I had particular controller 
design we were running with 4 Tants per in a single pass reflow. These 
PCAs were 100% tested and out of a lot of ~600 PCAs 2-4 Tants would 
magically explode with all the known fireworks...After a lot of F/A 
including profiling, I decided to estimate the defect density based on the 
manufacturers curves for failures due to voltage stress. The design was 
running 75% of rated max working voltage on the cap. When I checked the 
voltage on the curve, the defect density for the number Tants we actually 
placed was the same as the number we were losing in test. With such a 
small number of defects, it was hard decrease the tolerance band around 
the defect density curve. So we used the curve to determine what working 
voltage would give 0 defects in the lot sizes we were running and changed 
to that Tant.  Surprise no more exploding caps.  The point of this example 
is that the reflow process sometimes has nothing to do with device 
failures, especially in the case of Tants...

Paul

Paul Edwards
Process/Quality Engineering
Surface Art Engineering


-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of David D. Hillman
Sent: Friday, January 28, 2011 7:08 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Tantalum Capacitors and double sided reflow

Hi Phil - the issue/concern with Ta capacitors comes from the metallurgy 
and internal construction of the component. Typical capacitors are 
constructed utilizing two electrodes separated by a dielectric. The 
electrodes can be separated into an anode and cathode. The medium used as 
a dielectric can be many types of material, potentially ranging from air 
to metal. The Ta capacitors are designed with a Ta anode, a solid MnO2 
cathode, and a Tantalum Pentoxide (Ta2O5) dielectric. The advantage of Ta 
capacitors is their high volumetric efficiency, basic reliability, and 
process compatibility compared to other capacitors of similar size. Their 
highly stable capacitance and frequency characteristics and typically very 

low Equivalent Series Resistance (ESR) make them attractive when used for 
filtering in power supply designs. A final advantage of Ta capacitors is 
the self-healing property they possess. For any random defect site within 
the dielectric (Ta2O5), the current through this defect area causes 
localized over-heating.  The result of this localized heating depends in 
large part on how rapidly it occurs.   If the temperature rise due to the 
defect current flow is relatively gradual (over a few tens of 
microseconds, which is typical for a current limiting situation), then the 

MnO2 becomes resistive and the Tantalum is said to have healed itself. If, 

on the other hand, the heating is rapid (over a few microseconds, which is 

typical of an unlimited power on situation with no series resistance) the 
defect site itself may become very hot before the neighboring MnO2 becomes 

resistive. This results in a self feeding ignition failure as the hot spot 

pulls in additional Oxygen from the MnO2 layer - your basic "metal fire". 
For a more complete details on this failure phenomena, Kemet has an 
excellent detailed summary of this in their publication: Kemet Electronics 

Corporation Tantalum Applications Notes, Surge Step Stress Testing in 
Tantalum Capacitors (note - I am not an EE but I did stay at a Holiday Inn 

last night...........).

Ok, so why does all of that matter? The thermal excursions of industry 
standard soldering processes - reflow, vapor phase, manual - can 
cause/create dielectric defects. The Ta capacitor component suppliers 
screen/test the Ta capacitors to make sure there is as much thermal 
excursion robustness in the components as possible but statistics isn't 
their friend when there are millions of devices produced. We conducted 
testing here at Rockwell Collins to measure and quantify the "typical" 
impact our various soldering processes had on the Ta capacitors. We have 
put into place specific rules for Ta capacitors based on those testing 
results. My guess is that the comment you have heard "....can't be 
reflowed twice..." is based on someone taking a conservative approach on 
the issue. I do know that many product designers de-rate Ta capacitors to 
achieve the same effect.

Dave Hillman
Rockwell Collins
[log in to unmask]





Phil Bavaro <[log in to unmask]> 
Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
01/27/2011 03:25 PM
Please respond to
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to
[log in to unmask]


To
[log in to unmask]
cc

Subject
[TN] Tantalum Capacitors and double sided reflow






I recently heard from a customer who is concerned about our designs
having tantalum caps on the second side of double sided Sn63Pb37 circuit
card assemblies.

 

This is news to me but maybe something has happened in the world that I
missed.....wouldn't be the first time.

 

In a nutshell, I am hearing that tantalums cannot be reflowed
twice....yet I read in Kemet literature that the reliability specs are
based on three time reflows for resistance to soldering heat.

 

And I have reflowed tantalums at lead free temperatures as well without
seeing failures.

 

Any help would be appreciated.

 

Phil

 

 


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This message and any attachments are solely for the use of the addressee 
and may contain L-3 proprietary information that may also be defined as 
USG export controlled technical data. If you are not the intended 
recipient, any disclosure, use or distribution of its content is 
prohibited. Please notify the sender by reply e-mail and immediately 
delete this message and any attachments.




______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] 
______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------
Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0
To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in
the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet
To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL)
To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest
Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives
Please visit IPC web site 
http://www.ipc.org/ContentPage.aspx?Pageid=E-mail-Forums for additional 
information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 
ext.2815
-----------------------------------------------------



______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] 
______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------
Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0
To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in
the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet
To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL)
To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest
Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives
Please visit IPC web site 
http://www.ipc.org/ContentPage.aspx?Pageid=E-mail-Forums for additional 
information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 
ext.2815
-----------------------------------------------------


 =============================================================================

This email and any attachments thereto may contain private, confidential, 
and
privileged material for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any 
review, copying,
or distribution of this email (or any attachments thereto) by others is 
strictly prohibited.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact 
[log in to unmask]
immediately and permanently delete the original and any copies of this 
email and
any attachments thereto. 

 =============================================================================


______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] 
______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------
Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0
To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in
the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet
To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL)
To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to 
[log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest
Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives
Please visit IPC web site 
http://www.ipc.org/ContentPage.aspx?Pageid=E-mail-Forums for additional 
information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 
ext.2815
-----------------------------------------------------



______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
For more information please contact helpdesk at x2960 or [log in to unmask] 
______________________________________________________________________

---------------------------------------------------
Technet Mail List provided as a service by IPC using LISTSERV 15.0
To unsubscribe, send a message to [log in to unmask] with following text in
the BODY (NOT the subject field): SIGNOFF Technet
To temporarily halt or (re-start) delivery of Technet send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet NOMAIL or (MAIL)
To receive ONE mailing per day of all the posts: send e-mail to [log in to unmask]: SET Technet Digest
Search the archives of previous posts at: http://listserv.ipc.org/archives
Please visit IPC web site http://www.ipc.org/ContentPage.aspx?Pageid=E-mail-Forums for additional information, or contact Keach Sasamori at [log in to unmask] or 847-615-7100 ext.2815
-----------------------------------------------------

ATOM RSS1 RSS2