Doug
"Put some on your hands and you will still smell it 3-4 hours later."
For me, that in itself is a warning signal. Pure fragrance is ephemeral.
Something must be holding it and letting it out slowly. Traditionally,
in the perfume business, animal musk is a popular product for that
purpose but it is far too expensive for ordinary cosmetics like
sanitisers and heavy MW glycols and similar are often used.
Of course, relative safety from transferred products is as long as a
piece of string. One could even say, "it depends"!
Brian
Douglas Pauls wrote:
> Ohhhhh, alright.
>
> So, my young co-op student, Mike, and I are putting together the
> evaluation plan. We included the Techspray material because we have this
> already in house and Hillman qualified it about 10 years ago. The Jergens
> hand lotion is fairly popular in this area and has some aloe vera in it.
> We wanted a non-aloe-vera hand lotion - a real "girly girl" lotion that
> would have the heavier scents and oils in them that might possibly
> transfer to the electronics. One of the comments we have received off an
> on through the years is that the operators don't like the smell of the
> Techspray material. And it is not so much a case of not liking the smell
> as preferring a lotion with a nicer fragrance.
>
> So, I task Mike with finding a suitable Girly Girl kind of lotion. Mike
> heads down to one of our local Bath and Body Works stores. Now, Mike,
> like me, is a masculine, manly sort of man, and we take to such stores
> like a fish takes to the Sahara Desert. The objective is to dash in, pick
> something quick, dash out. Mike goes over the the older sales lady and
> describes what he is looking for. The sales lady is actually a retired
> industrial engineer from one of the chemical processing companies here in
> Cedar Rapids. So they start talking about the Design of Experiments
> (DOE), sample sizes, methods of measurement, etc. Not really the kind of
> conversation you would expect to hear in your local Bath and Body works.
> So they wanted to pick a "worst case", a lotion that would stay with you
> for a while and maintained the fragrances for quite a time. Exactly. So,
> they settled on the Midnight Pomegranite, Mike bought a bottle, and then
> dashed out.
>
> Now, I must say it has a very pleasant fragrence. You open up the bottle
> and you smell it. Even Dead-Nose Hillman could smell this stuff. Put
> some on your hands and you will still smell it 3-4 hours later.
>
> Doug Pauls
>
>
>
> Randall L Bock <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
> 08/21/2009 01:24 PM
> Please respond to
> TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to
> Randall L Bock <[log in to unmask]>
>
>
> To
> [log in to unmask]
> cc
>
> Subject
> Re: [TN] Contamination by Hand Sanitizers & Lotions
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Your gona leave us hanging on the Bath and Body Works Midnight Pomegranite
> !!!
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Douglas Pauls
> Sent: Friday, August 21, 2009 2:18 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Contamination by Hand Sanitizers & Lotions
>
> Well, I can briefly discussed what we have done so far. These are the
> materials we have been looking at:
>
> Purell hand sanitizer
> Sams Club hand sanitizer
> Germ-X Gnarley Green hand sanitizer (just because I want to use Gnarley in
>
> a technical report)
> Jergen's Hand Lotion
> Bath and Body Works Midnight Pomegranite (funny background story as to
> why)
> Techspray's lotion (our current approved standard)
>
> We have done a chemical analysis on the materials.
> Did an ionic transfer study using ceramic plates. Nothing much transfers
> on the sanitizers, and no measurable ionics on lotions.
> Did some SIR work - still have to analyze the data but at first glance
> nothing leaps out at me
> Presently (today) doing solderability impacts
> Dielectric Withstanding Voltage tests pending
> Effects on adhesive bonding pending
>
> Based on what I have seen so far, I don't really have too much of a
> concern on the hand sanitizers. The vast majority evaporates, not much,
> if any gets transferred to the assembly, and we clean in house anyway
> prior to conformal coating. The jury is still out on the hand lotions. If
>
> you are a no-clean house, you might have more of a concern than I have.
>
> Chemically, if you forced me to pick one, go with the Purell. The Sams
> Club stuff is cheaper, but has some noticable residues and the Purell
> seems cleaner.
>
> Remember, free advice is worth everything you pay for it, but I think you
> are OK if they are allowed in house. Last summer, when Cedar Rapids went
> through its major flooding, we were asked to curtail water usage as much
> as possible to save the one remaining city well that had not flooded. We
> used primarily hand sanitizers for 3-4 weeks rather than soap and water
> and we had no incidences during that time of contamination we could trace
> to these materials.
>
> Doug Pauls
>
>
>
> Roger Mack <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
> 08/21/2009 11:20 AM
> Please respond to
> TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to
> [log in to unmask]
>
>
> To
> [log in to unmask]
> cc
>
> Subject
> Re: [TN] Contamination by Hand Sanitizers & Lotions
>
>
>
>
>
>
> If there is any chance of getting results sooner I would be interested.
> Based on the earlier technet conversations we have not been supplying
> operators with sanitizers and encouraging hand washing. However, just like
>
>
> ESD lotion, whether you supply the floor or not, you have to be on the
> watch for unapproved materials from home being used.
>
> Just this week the request for sanitizers has come up again with back to
> school and flue season only 2 weeks away. The recent flues going around do
>
>
> cause some panic and it would be great to have some data to back up any
> position we take on sanitizer use.
>
>
> Roger Mack P.Eng.
> Manufacturing Specialist
> Parker Hannifin Corporation
> Electronic Controls Division
> 1305 Clarence Avenue
> Winnipeg, MB R3T 1T4 Canada
> direct 204 453 3339 x373
> www.vansco.ca
> www.parker.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Douglas Pauls <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
> 2009-08-21 10:45
> Please respond to
> TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to
> [log in to unmask]
>
>
> To
> [log in to unmask]
> cc
>
> Subject
> Re: [TN] Contamination by Hand Sanitizers & Lotions
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Good morning all,
>
> Being blessed with an abundance of bright young co-op students, we are
> doing a study of the topic here at Rockwell Collins. The study will
> finish in a few weeks and I plan on publishing the results, probably at
> Apex.
>
> Doug Pauls
> Rockwell Collins
>
>
>
> Brian Ellis <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent by: TechNet <[log in to unmask]>
> 08/21/2009 01:17 AM
> Please respond to
> TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>; Please respond to
> Brian Ellis <[log in to unmask]>
>
>
> To
> [log in to unmask]
> cc
>
> Subject
> Re: [TN] Contamination by Hand Sanitizers & Lotions
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Apart from the thread on this subject here a month or two back, the only
> mention in literature that I know of is in my book, which discusses in a
> diagrammatic form not only the effect of lotions before and after
> soldering. Sanitisers didn't exist in those days, but their effect is
> similar to lotions, although their oily components are lower.
>
> As an addendum to my post in the earlier thread, I was back in hospital
> for another operation last week and found that they had placed
> squirt-bottles of sanitisers every 5 m along all the corridors,
> presumably as an anti-H1N1 measure. This allowed me to have better
> access to the stuff and I found that the hand was persistently
> contaminated. I was able to repeat my mirror test 2 or 3 hours after
> deliberately using the sanitiser correctly, being careful not to handle
> anything in the meanwhile. As one of the components is a high molecular
> weight polymerised glycol, it is a reasonable assumption that this is
> the persistent substance. As it is hygroscopic, it is also a reasonable
> assumption that it's not going to improve sensitive electronics if
> transferred from the hand to an assembly. If such transfer occurs before
> soldering, then the heat may cause further polymerisation, rendering the
> hygroscopic residues more difficult, maybe impossible, to remove.
>
> Brian
>
> Diljit Matharu wrote:
>> Can someone direct me to resources which talk about PCBAs contamination
> by the use of hand sanitizers & lotions.
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>>
>>
>> Diljit S. Matharu
>> Quality Leader - B C
>> Creation Technologies
>>
>> Office: 604.430.4336 x 3395 | Mobile: 778.240.8144
>> 8977 Fraserton Court | Burnaby, BC, Canada | V5J 5G1
>> [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> | www.creationtech.com<http://www.creationtech.com/>
>> [cid:[log in to unmask]]Working together to build the future
>>
>>
>>
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