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Subject:
From:
Brian Ellis <[log in to unmask]>
Reply To:
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>, Brian Ellis <[log in to unmask]>
Date:
Wed, 3 Jun 2009 10:47:34 +0300
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Firstly, 'FireWire' is a trade mark of one maker's iteration of the 
generic IEEE-1394, along with i-Link and Lynx (possibly others). It 
became popular with the mini-DV camcorders, with which USB-2 could not 
cut the ice (a few makers tried and fell flat on their face). Having 
used it since 1996, I know there is no comparison for "on the fly" 
semi-lossless video capture, even to an external HDD on the same adapter 
(absolutely impossible with USB-2).

You extol the virtues of USB-3 yet admit that USB does not usually 
achieve better than half the rated data transfer speed, whereas 
IEEE-1394 is usable to its full rating. And you did not comment on the 
fact that multiple USB devices on the same bus slow transfers down even 
more.

Yes, of course I have USB devices on my computers but I also have 
IEEE-1394 on two PCs (not MACs) used for video work, along with 2 
prosumer 3-CCD camcorders, a 500 Gbyte external HDD and an A/D and D/A 
video converter (incidentally, the marketed USB-2 video converters also 
frequently cause problems of dropped frames). I also have Ethernet 100 
as a small network for transfer of data between my computers and to a 
couple of printers. Each method of data transfer is optimised for the 
kind of work it has to do. USB works fine for my mouse, webcam and 
scanner and horrendously slow memory sticks but I would not dream of 
using it for networking or video work. A chacun son métier!

Incidentally, as someone has pointed out, what motive do you have for 
publicising USB here, as it is irrelevant to this netlist?

Brian

Liu, Edwin wrote:
>  If you didn��t know, both interfaces USB and FireWire are preparing to release new iterations of their interfaces; Firewire will go ��3200�� and USB will move from 2.0 to 3.0. That begs a few questions: what��s so special about the new interfaces and which one is better?
> 
> So, its fairly common knowledge that the majority of computer users are much more acquainted with USB than they are FireWire. Somewhere along technology adoption train, someone decided the world needed USB more than FireWire.
> 
> And here we are. However, its very important that the masses know the distinction between USB and FireWire, and why USB might not be the only good method for data transfer.
> 
> What is USB all about? USB, or Universal Serial Bus, is in everything, and you��ll never be short of a data transfer interface. The current USB 2.0 claims to transfer data at 480 Mbps. Those are the perks.
> 
> On the flip side, there��s FireWire. Many common computer users might never see a FireWire cable; professionals and Mac owners tend to be more familiar with the technology. Right now, there are two versions of FireWire in use; FireWire 400 and 800. If you��re catching on to the number scheme by now, you might guess that FireWire 400 transfers at 400 Mbps and 800 transfers at 800 Mbps. 
> 
> Where��s the difference, aside from speed? FireWire delivers about 97% of the performance it claims, where USB tends to deliver substantially less��maybe half of what it promises. This is mainly because FireWire operates largely on its own, using very little processor power. It runs on a peer 2 peer setup rather than the master to slave setup of USB.
> 
> USB speeds depend largely on the hardware and software configurations of the computer transferring the information. The end result is substantially lower speeds than promised on the part of USB than those promised by FireWire.
> 
> FireWire also is capable of transferring more data simply because the cables can handle a larger data load. Not to mention FireWire cables can reach up to 100 meter lengths, where USB cables are drastically smaller, according to ArsTechnica  .
> 
> You might wonder, if that is the case, why isn��t everyone using FireWire? It is really only because it isn��t widely adopted. As of now, most computers aside from Macs don��t have FireWire incorporated. 
> 
> Looking to the future, The IEEE 1394 Trade Association recently announced the next iteration of FireWire, called S3200, is supposed to debut sometime next year. USB 3.0 is also supposed to surface sometime next year. 
> 
> Here��s the twist: USB 3.0 promises a data transfer rate of 4.8 Gbps, where FireWire 3200 promises to deliver 3.2 Gbps. Though one might hope that USB has worked out the discretionary issues with promised speed compared to delivered speed, no assurances have been made; FireWire 3200, on the flip side, promises to deliver 97% of the total advertised rate.
> 
> Additionally, it is worth noting that FireWire 3200 will be based off of the hardware technology currently used by FireWire 800, so users currently equipped with that technology won��t have to change a thing to utilize FireWire 3200; USB 3.0 adopters will need to switch hardware.
> 
> Which one is right for you? If you need the full promised data transfer rate, you��re probably better off siding with FireWire in this battle; if you aren��t a data junkie, stick with USB. 
> 
> 
> Thank you
>  
> Edwin 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Hernefjord Ingemar
> Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 7:48 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] The USB 3.0 technology
> 
> Brian, don't you see? The many USB connector and cable manufacturers want produce and make profit. 'Everything' is USB-connected, while it seems as 1394 use to be printers and some video stuff. I think that FireWire 800 is superior to any USB. A small detail, not important, but still to be considered: FireWire is much easier to plugin than USB. I've been crawling on the floor with a lamp, to see why on earth the USB plug doesn't fit.
> Inge 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Brian Ellis
> Sent: tisdag 2 juni 2009 12:08
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] The USB 3.0 technology
> 
> Vapourware? What's wrong with IEEE-1394, already capable of up to 3200 Mbit/s and able to transmit uncompressed HD video at this speed? USB suffers from loss of speed as soon as you have more than 1 item of hardware connected to a bus, because of serial handshaking with each device. With USB-2, if you have just a keyboard and a mouse connected, you don't have enough speed left to transfer even DV (SD video compressed ~10 x) on the fly. With IEEE-1394, you have none of these problems.
> 
> Brian
> 
> Liu, Edwin wrote:
>> The USB 3.0 Promoter Group announced on November 17, 2008, that 
>> version 1.0 of the specification has been completed.
>>  
>> A new major feature is the SuperSpeed bus, which provides a fourth 
>> transfer mode at 5 Gbit/s. The raw throughput is 500 MByte/s, and the 
>> specification considers it reasonable to achieve 400 MByte/s or more 
>> after protocol overhead.
>>
>> Consumer products
>> <BLOCKED::http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Product_(business)>  are 
>> expected to become available in 2010.Commercial controllers are 
>> expected to enter into volume production no later than the first 
>> quarter of 2010. NEC <BLOCKED::http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NEC>  is 
>> aiming to produce its first USB controller in June 2009, initially 
>> priced at USD <BLOCKED::http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USD>  15.00
>>
>> Windows 7 <BLOCKED::http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_7>  drivers 
>> are under development but no public releases have been made available 
>> as of May 2009. The Linux Kernel 
>> <BLOCKED::http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_Kernel>  supports USB 3.0 
>> as of version 2.6.30.
>>
>> Is there someone developing the new product that is applied the USB 
>> 3.0 technology?I think it will be has big market in future as it has 
>> the best performance.
>>  
>>  
>> Thank you
>>  
>> Edwin
>>  
>>
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