Phil,
That is awesome. There is absolutley nothing better than a healthy heaping
lunch of ground up plastic, lead and fire retardants!
I love it. Does a body good!
On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 8:11 AM, Phil Nutting <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:
> And after they ban plastic baby bottles and then glass baby bottles (they
> can break and have sharp edges) they will turn their attention to the
> original equipment, mother's breasts, and find that they cause serious
> damage to those little dears that depend on nature's baby nectar by causing
> some emotional issue or worse yet mother's milk is poisonous.
>
> And when we have had to return to the caves, the EU will find the mold in
> caves is bad for us.
>
> WAKE UP and get a dose of reality EU!
>
> As a late friend of mine stated about the governments getting involved in
> his well being... "Stop protecting me from myself!".
>
> I feel better now. I'm off for a snack of ground up plastic, lead and fire
> retardants. Yum.
>
> Phil
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Brian Ellis
> Sent: Wednesday, June 11, 2008 3:23 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] Flame retardants ignite controversy - Posted without
> comment
>
> Worse, Joe: I was watching a consumer's programme on Swiss TV last
> night. Apparently, a prof. at Columbia university has discovered that
> some babies' feeding bottles in polycarbonate transfer infinitesimal
> quantities of bisphenol A to the contents. This is claimed to cause
> hormonal development problems to the baby, creating overgrowth and
> obesity to the infant, as "proved" in rodents (no mention of dosology or
> metabolic paths, necessary in serious toxicity or epidemiological studies).
>
> As a result, polycarbonate bottles are now being forbidden in Canada.
>
> The programme anchor, who is an anti-everything by nature, then bought n
> bottles in Switzerland and had a German lab (more serious than a local
> one, of course) determine which ones were in PC, which in other unnamed
> plastics and which in glass. The majority were in PC. However, she
> reported no figures of BPA leaching, so all the PC ones were condemned
> without trial. She recommended that mothers use only glass (why not,
> anyway???). BTW, no thought about the titties that actually go in the
> childrens' mouths and what they may be made of!
>
> She then interviewed a so-called expert, a professor in some obscure
> university, I think in France or Belgium, who claimed that BPA was one
> of the worst chemicals in existence, carcinogenic to umpteen organs,
> mutagenic, teratogenic, endocrine upsetter, neurotoxic, reproductive
> toxic and causes nearly every other disease known to man, including
> Alzheimer's and Parkinson's (yes, he recited this list except the every
> other disease bit which I added). No mention of dosages, though. Now for
> the bad news: this guy claims to have the ear of the EU and wants BPA
> and products made with it banned throughout the Union.
>
> That means all polycarbonates, epoxies and some copolymers are currently
> under scrutiny. No DVDs or CDs, no FR-4 or epoxy adhesives, no PC
> monitor cases, no plastic glazing or greenhouses, no cars, no aircraft,
> no polycarbonate capacitors, no FR-4 of any flavour etc... Back to our
> caves, guys!
>
> Now, a wee bittie of simplistic chemistry. To make FR-4, a mixture of
> BPA and its brominated homologue TBBPA is reacted with epichlorohydrin
> in the presence of sodium hydroxide to form the basic prepolymer, which
> is treated in various ways to eliminate most of the sodium chloride
> which is formed. Theoretically, there is no free BPA/TBBPA left if the
> proportions are stoichiometrically correct. This prepolymer is then
> reacted with a crosslinking agent which joins up the linear liquid
> prepolymer, via the epoxy groups in the molecules into a
> three-dimensional polymer. In the case of polycarbonate, it is formed
> by a similar condensation reaction with BPA, often admixed with TBBPA.
> If there is any free BPA or TBBPA, it is because either a) there is an
> excess beyond the stoichiometrical ratio or b) the polymerisation
> reaction is incomplete. b) is easy to control but a) less so but a) can
> be stopped by adding a very small excess of its reactant,
> epichlorohydrin in the case of epoxies, so that it is all reacted. As
> the latter is volatile, any excess will be eliminated during the curing
> process or any subsequent heating. I maintain that it is not necessary
> for polycarbonate or epoxy resins to have excessive quantities that can
> leach out, but it will require better process control, but it is much
> easier to prevent the problem by banning BPA and its brominated derivative!
>
> For those who understand French, you can see the report at
>
> http://www.tsr.ch/tsr/index.html?siteSect=500000&bcid=590635#bcid=590635;vid=9199328
> (if the URL is split, don't forget to join the lines)
> Also
> http://www.tsr.ch/tsr/index.html?siteSect=311201&sid=9198628&page=1#title
> for a summary
>
> I hope this is nothing more than a storm in a baby's bottle!
>
> A bon entendeur, salut!
>
> Brian
>
> Joe Fjelstad wrote:
> >
> > for your consideration...
> > Joe
> >
> http://www.edn.com/blog/570000257/post/1740027974.html?nid=3357&rid=208605613
> > Tuesday, June 10, 2008
> >
> > Flame retardants ignite controversy
> >
> > Jun 10 2008 7:31AM
> > Accurate figures are difficult to obtain, but it has been estimated that
> > fires kill around 10,000 people a year globally, in which the cause is
> > attributed to faulty electrical wiring in buildings and in electrical
> equipment. Flame
> > retardants have been used very effectively in a wide variety of
> electrical
> > equipment to prevent fires, reduce their seriousness and also to delay
> onset to
> > allow people more time to evacuate. In fact, research has shown that
> when
> > flame retardants are used as additives to plastics, the amount of time
> to
> > escape is increased by 15 times. Since they were introduced, thousands
> of lives
> > have been saved, and so there is no doubt about their value.
> > Many types of plastics burn very easily. It has been estimated that the
> > plastics in a typical TV set are equivalent to 1.5 gallons of gas, not
> something
> > consumers want in their living rooms! However, only around 12% of
> plastics
> > contain flame retardants. Some types are inherently resistant to fire,
> such as
> > rigid PVC, and so do not need flame retardant additives. Some equipment
> is
> > not at risk such as battery powered products like mobile phones because
> of the
> > low voltages used, and therefore flame retarded plastics are not needed.
> > Mobile phone battery chargers, however, do need to have flame retardants
> as they
> > are powered at standard voltages, and so arcing and high temperatures
> can
> > occur if there is a defect.
> > But BFRs (brominated flame retardants) are now at the center of
> considerable
> > debate. The review of the ROHS directive, undertaken by the German
> > organization Oko on behalf of the European Commission, is looking at a
> significant
> > number of them, along with 46 other chemical compounds, and may well
> recommend
> > the restriction of some, or all of them.
> > So, why will they be banned when many have already been tested, and it
> was
> > concluded that they pose no threat to human health and the environment?
> > Well, Oko is recommending a ban on all organobromine and organochlorine
> > compounds, including brominated flame retardants because of â backyard
> recyclingâ
> > of WEEE (Waste Electrical and Electronic Equipment) in countries that do
> not
> > have the know-how, or facilities, to dismantle safely.
> > The toxic fumes created by backyard and roadside fires are having a
> > significant affect on human health, even causing death.
> > While the Basel Convention should stop the shipping of WEEE to such
> > countries, a lot of the scrap still comes from the likes of the United
> States, which
> > has not yet ratified it.
> > Flame retardants seem a classic example of a need for a risk-benefit
> balance
> > based on assessments that the ROHS directive and REACH regulations were
> > designed to resolve. Itâ s a trade-off between safe furniture, fabrics,
> and
> > electronics or the fatalities caused in the poorer villages of China,
> India, and
> > Africa.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > **************Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best
> > 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg00050000000102<http://citysbest.aol.com/?ncid=aolacg00050000000102>
> )
> >
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