Only 36°? Why not wait until summer? My weather station tells me the
shade temp is currently at 33.8°C and rising at 1.1°/hour and it is
still May. The peak I've hit here is 47.2°C but it peaks over 40° every
summer, reaching >45° on average 1 in 3 years. Actually, assuming the
electronics are built and housed correctly, I'm much more worried about
the battery at that temp, but it has an 8-year guarantee, so who cares?
Most of the electronics are in the passenger compartment of course and
the aircon (electric, not off the motor) is viciously effective. On the
trial run I had last year, it seemed to freeze the goolies off me in the
first 5 seconds before the clima control clicked in.
Perhaps laptop batteries aligned up in your sunny (or should that be
Sony) carpark would make a resounding series of explosions that all 237
of the would be blown to bits!
Brian
Hernefjord Ingemar wrote:
> sounds more like a computer on wheels than being a car. Tell us what
> will happen when your car has been parked in the MED sunshine at +36
> Centigrades for some hours, and the car is so hot that you can't touch
> it with your hand, which means that some of the electronics has passed
> +60 Centigrades. And you start the car, causing 237 microprocessors to
> work and needing cooling air, and the cooling air is at +60 before you
> get forced air at higher speed. You are right. If we placed 237 laptops
> in the sunshine on the hot parking place, I wonder if not the first
> fault will come even before 15 minutes. Your technophilosophic
> considerations are very interesting.
> Good Luck with your first quarter of an hour in the new vehicle.
> Inge
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Brian Ellis
> Sent: den 30 maj 2007 09:21
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] NTC RoHS compliant laptop with early failure
>
> After many, many, many months of waiting, I shall take delivery of a
> hybrid car tomorrow. It is absolutely stuffed with electronics (at the
> last count, believe it or not, 237 microprocessors in it to control
> everything down to the way it responds to how you breathe (almost!).
> Being made in Japan, I imagine that it is all lead-free.
>
> If a laptop with three microprocessors (CPU, GPU and HDDPU) fails after,
> say, 24 hours of use, this means that my brand new car should fail after
> 24*3/237 hours = 18 minutes. That means I cannot make it into any of the
> surrounding towns without having to call for help. Now, dare I suggest
> that a car suffers more climatic, vibration and shock extremes than a
> laptop? Hopefully, it will not break down every 15 (or even 30) minutes
> so what's the difference? May I suggest that there are several factors:
> - the car is designed for the intended purpose: the laptop is designed
> for minimal cost in a highly competitive market
> - the car designers are aware that if the drivers get killed, they
> cannot expect them to replace their car after n years: the laptop
> designer of brand X is not worried if, next time round, he buys brand Y
> because he knows tha the user of Brand Z will buy brand X next time
> round, so the future of brands X, Y and Z are all cyclically assured,
> deaths of the users being unlikely
> - cooling of laptops is hairy: fans reduce battery life and their grill
> is often blocked by the clothing on the lap of the unfortunate owner.
> Critical electronics in cars are always positioned where cooling is
> adequate: thermal design is a known factor (in laptops, the cooling fan
> is placed where there is a little space left over, in the hopes that 5%
> of the air may reach hot components, if you are lucky)
> - etc.?
>
> If you don't hear from me tomorrow, it may be because I'm waiting at the
> side of the road for help during my 40 minute drive back from the
> showroom.
>
> Brian
>
> Ian Hanna wrote:
>> I went shovel shopping last week -- there were three
>>
>> A beautiful resin handled, tempered steel, rolled edges with tack
>> welds and reinforcement at the stress points and seams for $39 A
>> hardwood handled, hickory, one of similar quality for $29 And an
>> unpriced chineese model -- inferior wood handle, much more roughly
>> shaped, with a wide grain -- stamped steel, no welds, no
>> reinforcement...
>>
>> -- did a price check to compare -- it was $6.99 -- if I used a shovel
>
>> every day I would invest, but for digging rocks now and then from my
>> road -- I couldn't justify the $20-$30 difference...
>>
>> -- I am ashamed, but that is the current reality
>>
>> I fear soon there will be less shovel selection, I am a more
>> discerning shopper than most, and a professional 'quality guy' and
>> still -- price influences me
>>
>> Ian
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bev Christian
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:53 AM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [TN] RoHS compliant laptop with early failure
>>
>> George,
>> As usual, I am in total agreement with you.
>> Bev
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Wenger, George M. [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:51 AM
>> To: TechNet E-Mail Forum; Bev Christian
>> Subject: RE: [TN] RoHS compliant laptop with early failure
>>
>> Bev,
>>
>> To add to your comment, I'm more convinced than ever that "quality is
>> dead". Given three factors 1). Quality, 2). Cost 3). Delivery.
>> Customers can choose any two but not three. Even companies like my
>> old company (Lucent Technologies / Bell Laboratories) that changed
>> from being technology driven to supply change driven are now more
>> worried about cost and delivery. They may still be concerned about
>> quality but when their customers want the products "NOW" and they want
>
>> them for "AS CHEAP AS POSSIBLE" then quality has to suffer.
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>> George
>> George M. Wenger
>> Senior Principle FMA / Reliability Engineer Wireless network Solutions
>
>> Andrew Corporation, 40 Technology Drive, Warren, NJ 07059 (908)
>> 546-4531 [log in to unmask]
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bev Christian
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:34 AM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [TN] RoHS compliant laptop with early failure
>>
>> A man I respect in the industry on these matters said (and this
>> applies to more than electronics), that "quality is dead". Remember
>> the mantra is "smaller, cheaper, faster" or some such. In the late
>> nineties they said "quality is of course assumed", but I think that
>> has gone out the window now, in the general sense.
>> Bev
>> RIM
>>
>> The opinions expressed herein are my own and do not necessarily
>> represent those of the company that I work for. (And I am making no
>> inferences one way or the other about our own products.)
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wolfe, Robert
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:27 AM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [TN] RoHS compliant laptop with early failure
>>
>> Joe,
>> Just a thought without any real data (but sure has me wondering
>> slightly).
>> EVERY single piece of electronic equipment I've purchased within the
>> last year has either failed almost out of the box or soon after.
>> This includes 2 notebook computers, a PA Amp, 3 cell phones, a
>> wireless phone, an all-in-one printer.
>> Now yes like many have stated here with out data there is no case and
>> there are many reasons that could be the problem, and may not have
>> anything to do with RoHS.
>> But from a John Q. Public buyer standpoint was I jinxed this last year
>
>> were the odds not all in my favor, could be but certainly has me
>> wondering why 100% of what I bought electronically never had problems
>> till this past year everything had a problem (100%)???
>> >From my point of view I was starting to think maybe don't buy any
>> electronics for awhile?
>> Especially since the practice of many companies is, even if your unit
>> failed in only 3 months, you might get a refurbished unit that is much
>
>> older back.
>> Yes they guarantee it is in perfect working order again, but just my
>> opinion, if the unit breaks in the first 90 days you should get a
>> brand new replacement.
>> Bob
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of David Hudson
>> Sent: Monday, May 28, 2007 1:02 PM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [TN] RoHS compliant laptop with early failure
>>
>> I would suggest that it belies your undoubted professional expertise
>> to make the assumption that this failure has anything to do with
>> RoHS-compliance or lead-free. Frankly, it smacks of hysteria. Surely
>> you can think of at least a dozen other potential failure modes, all
>> equally likely? Let's see some evidence in this case before you throw
>> your toys out of the playpen.
>>
>> Dave
>
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