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February 2006

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Subject:
From:
"Stadem, Richard D." <[log in to unmask]>
Reply To:
TechNet E-Mail Forum <[log in to unmask]>, Stadem, Richard D.
Date:
Thu, 23 Feb 2006 15:00:30 -0600
Content-Type:
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Steve, 
Those are the worst fab board quality pictures I have ever seen. I hope
nothing like that ever happens to me. Thanks for sharing the pics.
And thanks for sharing the information, all. 
Scott, I would not be surprised if you never got a call from the vendor.
The reason for rejection must be pretty obvious.
Good luck in your search for a new vendor.

-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Scott Decker
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 2:44 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] Board etching question for you board shops out there.

All,
   First, thanks for all the info on what could be or may have caused
the problem(s). Let me address those of you that replied also.

First, Steve. Your pictures are close and some places look almost like
what you show. These boards have ragged rough edges and even your via
and pad edges are better than mine.

Franklin, Your explanations seem to sound the best so far as far as they
make since to me. That said, that doesn't mean much since I'm the one
asking. :-) But it seems like the logical and from what I see, might
just be the cause?

Dwight, Hummm, perhaps, but here it hasn't been THAT cool so I would
hope the mice are still outside! :-)

Steve, I would say between you and Franklin, you two are on the mark. I
can't say I notice it more or less on the edges or not, but there is, in
some cases a better edge on one side of traces and the rough edge on the
other sides. (Same side of board, not front and back)

Richard, The board is not a "High Tech" board, it's 5/5 on a 1/2oz base
plated up to 1oz and almost every board shop I've used before can do
this in the dark. That being said, I think this shop needs to get a new
light bulb in the shop. :-)

Chuck, I think you hit it closer, at least with your description of the
traces and such. I did notice on the cross sections that the outer
layers had huge undercuts and the trace ends I could see were scooped
pretty good. Again, I'm not saying that's good or bad per sea, but it
was enough that I noticed it compared to other board vendors' plugs.

Ralph, it's all over the place, both sides...

 Thanks to all of you for your help and information. I think I have
enough information to at least make me sound like I know what I'm
talking about for that phone call I'll be getting about "why are you
rejecting our boards". Anyway, thanks again to all.

PS. Michael K, Nope, not that board. This was a re-order for an older
one a few years ago. The one you're thinking of is due in today or
tomorrow. Different vendor...

Later...

-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Gregory [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 1:10 PM
To: TechNet E-Mail Forum; Scott Decker
Subject: RE: [TN] Board etching question for you board shops out there.

Hi Scott!

Do your boards look like any of these pictures?

http://www.stevezeva.homestead.com/files/Mousebites1.jpg

http://www.stevezeva.homestead.com/files/Mousebites2.jpg

http://www.stevezeva.homestead.com/files/Mousebites3.jpg

http://www.stevezeva.homestead.com/files/Mousebites4.jpg

http://www.stevezeva.homestead.com/AnnularRing.jpg

http://www.stevezeva.homestead.com/AnnularRing2.jpg

http://www.stevezeva.homestead.com/AnnularRing3.jpg

-Steve Gregory-

-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Scott Decker
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 1:34 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [TN] Board etching question for you board shops out there.

All you board gurus out there, I have a question for you.
   What are the reason(s) I see traces that look like a mouse has
nibbled on the copper to etch it, as opposed to acid etching the copper?
I'm looking at some boards that look like the resist was put on by a
drunk with an old marker pen! The vias are not even round and the SMD
lands have ragged edges also. This shop is off my list from here on out
and going to be rebuilding some boards due to minimum trace problems
too, but can anyone tell me what causes the ragged edges like that? I
understand that specs are looking at averages, which means a high and
low end of the spectrum. I think I know who put the low numbers into the
pot. :-( Thanks for any info.

Scott Decker
AKA: Padmasterson
Broad Reach Engineering CAE
Ph. 480-377-0400 Ext. 34
FAX. 480-968-4597
Tempe, AZ.


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