As a supplier who long ago believed in asking manufacturing questions of the
print, I can tell you it was not (and still not) received with a positive
response. The issue that drives the conversation in initial quoting I have
found is bottom line cost and NOT cost of ownership. It takes more effort to
determine that issue and the work required to do so is not of interest I
have found many times.
Part of the effort required (in my view) to build successful boards for
clients we hope to serve is to review the design as it impacts the
fabricator, the assembly resource AND the service resource in the field.
This of course takes time and, sometimes will add to the cost at the fab
level while decreasing the cost at the assembly stage and so on.
I have expressed an attitude of co-operative engineering via a mutual DFM
strategy when offering services and this is how I believe PCB manufacturing
can be cost effectively maintained here in the States. Otherwise, as stated
in an earlier post, off-shore it goes.



-----Original Message-----
From: TechNet [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wolfgang E. Erat
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 12:03 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] SMOBC question...

good question, simple answer, (I think ?!?)
Vendors have plenty of questions, always, and that is where the fun begins.
there is usually only one dedicated type on the vendors side who talks to
the almighty customer, this dedicated person may not necessarily be an
engineer.
on the customers side, the purchasing clan is almighty, they usually get
irritated when a vendor asks too many questions .. " how come you are the
only vendor asking all these questions .. do you really know how to make
boards .. well .. at the risk of sounding cynical .. that is about how it
works.
And after all of that, we ask ourselves why work goes to china.



----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack C. Olson" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 11:34 AM
Subject: Re: [TN] SMOBC question...


> Why are vendors so reluctant to ask the customer what is the intention
> behind their vague notes?
>
> As a board designer, I wish vendors would just ask me what I meant,
> instead of trying to get a consensus on a forum.
>
> Jack (the "lone voice crying in the wilderness" guy)
>
>
> ----- Message from Stephen Gregory <[log in to unmask]> on Tue,
> 17 May 2005 08:03:12 -0500 -----
> Subject:
> Re: SMOBC question...
> Hi Jeffery,
>
> The board that I'm talking about doesn't seem to be that old
> design-wise. So do you think that maybe the note is just something
> kind of got "boiler-plated" from earlier designs?
>
> A description of the board is that it is a VME styled board, and
> everything
> on the board is SMT including headers, right angle push button switches,
> etc., the only through-hole is two press-fit right angle connectors. So
> the
> board is never going to see wave solder.
>
> The board is 15-layers and only .065" thick. Do you think that maybe the
> reason they have the note prohibiting HASL is because they don't want
> to thermally shock the board which may cause other problems?
>
> Kind regards,
>
> -Steve Gregory-
> Senior Process Engineer
> LaBarge Incorporated
> Tulsa, Oklahoma
> (918) 459-2285
> (918) 459-2350 FAXJack C. Olson
> 10G Circuit Board Designer
> (630) 754-2431
>
>
>
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