Interesting site with links on the subject is here:
http://www.american.edu/projects/mandala/TED/tin.htm
John
-----Original Message-----
From: Leadfree [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Robin Ingenthron
Sent: Monday, February 07, 2005 7:23 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [LF] "Tin is consided the most political of all metals" -
Wac hovia Economics Grp NTC
My company is trying to raise funds to get www.mineralpolicy.org (recently
renamed Earthworks) to chime in on the environmental wisdom of LF. They've
always had a pretty level-headed if policywonkish reputation in DC. After
USGS I consider them to be the best source of information on mining policy
and environmental costs.
I have been told by someone who was there within the past year that
Indonesia is ocean dredging for tin in areas with coral reefs.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Genny Gibbard" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Monday, February 07, 2005 9:57 AM
Subject: Re: [LF] "Tin is consided the most political of all metals" - Wac
hovia Economics Grp NTC
> I'm not stating for one side or the other, as I haven't done any research,
> but the newest date on Brian's material was 1990. It is possible things
> have changed in the last 15 years, I don't know. I assume that is what
> Kay
> was referring to, when mentioning it was out of date.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roger Stoops [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: February 7, 2005 8:22 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [LF] "Tin is consided the most political of all metals" -
> Wachovia Economics Grp NTC
>
>
> Apologies, but a question from the peanut gallery:
>
> Which part is out of date, and what references do you have?
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leadfree [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Kay Nimmo
> Sent: Monday, February 07, 2005 7:22 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [LF] "Tin is consided the most political of all metals" -
> Wachovia Economics Grp NTC
>
>
> Your information is rather out of date.
> Kay
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brian Ellis [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: 07 February 2005 12:11
> To: (Leadfree Electronics Assembly Forum); Kay Nimmo
> Subject: Re: [LF] "Tin is consided the most political of all metals" -
> Wachovia Economics Grp NTC
>
>
> Sorry, I quote from http://www.earthsci.org/mindep/depfile/tin.htm
>
> "Only about 20 percent of the world's tin deposits occur as primary
> hard-rock veins or lodes."
>
> "About 80 percent of the world's tin deposits occur not as primary
> lodes, but as unconsolidated secondary or placer deposits in river beds
> and valleys or on the sea floor."
>
> "Brazil
> In 1990 Brazil was the world's largest producer of tin-in-ore. Almost
> 90% of the country's production is obtained from the Pitinga mine about
> 300 km northeast of Manaus in the Mapuere region of the state of
> Amazonas. "The high grade alluvial deposits at Pitinga were discovered
> at the end
> of the 1970s in the course of a five-year exploration programme. These
> deposits are shallow with a maximum working depth for dredging of six
> metres."
>
> "Malaysia
> Malaysia's principal tin deposits occur in a strip of land about 400 km
> long and 60 km wide between the towns of Georgetown and Melaka, along
> the western coast of Peninsular Malaysia.
> "Most Malaysian tin comes from two states, Perak and Selangor, which
> together account for about 90 percent of the country's tin mining
> output; tin has been produced in Malaysia for more than 2,000 years.
> "The principal methods of mining are by gravel pump and dredging which
> account for about 80 percent of total mine output. However during the
> 1980s there was a substantial fall in the number of gravel pump
> producers, as it became uneconomic to produce tin in such small mining
> units in view of the low world price. "
>
> "Total mined production of tin in 1990 (as ores and concentrates) was
> 211,000 tonnes, with the major producing nations being Brazil, China,
> Indonesia, Malaysia, Bolivia and Thailand."
>
> So this site does not consider Malaysia to be "very minor", as you do.
> In fact, it is classed as a "major producing nation", accounting for
> about 10% of the global production. The largest is Brazil, also
> exploiting alluvial deposits. Unfortunately, these are very thin, so the
>
> area devastated is even larger per tonne Sn than in the Far East.
>
> Alluvial land dredging can be carried out only by deforestation of vast
> areas and primary rain forest cannot be re-established, as you state. At
>
> the best, a secondary jungle will start growing after 20-50 years, but
> this is low-growing bushy growth with sparse trees, very distant from
> the magnificent primary growth in Brazil and the Far East. As for
> rehabilitating it for farmland, this requires massive amounts of
> imported fertilizers (requiring petroleum for its manufacture) and humus
>
> and a lot of hard work.
>
> When I was in Ipoh, I saw how the Malaysians did it on the cheap. They
> tethered a goat in the middle of the field, with a cane shelter from the
>
> sun, with freedom over a radius of about 2 m. Each day, they used their
> bicycle to wheel a huge bale of grass to feed the goat on this yellow
> desert. Little by little, grass started to grow over the 2 m radius, so
> they lengthened the tether, still bringing in grass. After three years,
> they had a radius of 10 m growing grass, so they replaced the goat with
> a cow, which accelerated the growth rate. After five or six years, they
> were able to plough the field and sow their first crop, usually chili
> peppers. However, the field would support only one twelve-week crop per
> two years, with grazing the rest of the time to add humus.
>
> I maintain that tin mining is very destructive to the environment,
> despite your misleading claims.
>
> Brian
>
>
> Kay Nimmo wrote:
>> Malaysia is a very minor producer.
>> Indonesian deposits are obtained from sea dredging and from land
>> dredging - land which is returned to the original state or developed
> for
>> farmland for the local community (whichever they prefer).
>> The major producer in Latin America uses hard rock mining in the
> Andes.
>> The major producer in the EU is a secondary recyling plant.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Leadfree [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Brian Ellis
>> Sent: 07 February 2005 08:14
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [LF] "Tin is consided the most political of all metals" -
>
>> Wachovia Economics Grp NTC
>>
>>
>> And this is the biggest reason why LF should never have been thought
>> about. The major producers are Malaysia, Indonesia and tropical Latin
>> America. The tin ore is in alluvial deposits laid down geologically a
>> long time ago. To exploit it, the tropical rain forest is removed and
>> the deposits are washed away with high pressure water and collected in
>
>> settling tamks: the bottom layer is gold (small quantities, but
>> worthwhile, tin ore and then the sandy soil). Unimaginably vast areas
>> of tropical rain forest are devastated so that we can solder. The
>> whole of Malaysia's capital, Kuala Lumpur is built on such devastation
>
>> and that represents only a tiny percentage of the area between it and
>> Ipoh, several hundred km to the North.
>>
>> As LF solder has 50% more tin and solder is a major tin consumer, this
>
>> legislation is causing a significant increase in the rate of
>> destruction of that unique biotope, the tropical rain forest. What we
>> need is a tin-free solder to save our forests! Is it any coincidence
>> that the vested interests of the tin industry have helped to promote
>> LF?
>>
>> Brian
>>
>> Joe Fjelstad wrote:
>>
>>>FYI&C...
>>>
>>>Tin: Rising Prices and Import Volumes
>>>
>>>According to the U.S. Geological Survey, there has been no tin mined
>>>or produced in the United States since 1993. Last year, the volume of
>>>tin imports increased 37 percent, while the price soared 66 percent
>>>(bottom graph [not shown]). The global supply of tin is relatively
>>>inelastic, and is focused in Asia and other parts of the third world.
>>>Tin is considered the most political of all metals for this reason.
>>>
>>>Source: Wachovia Economics Group
>>>Report date: December 24, 2004
>>>
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