Bill,
Yes, the ".ddb" file is just a database file ("holder" if you must) containing the
individual files, but the point is that you need to have Protel 99 SE (P99SE) to
properly export the individual files (".pcb", ".sch", etc.) to stand alone files
that Protel 2004 (DXP04) can read, and that is the whole point, that if you need to
get a customers files into or out of a ".ddb" file format from or to individual
files, you need P99SE, which is why Altium should give him a free copy of the older
product, especially since he has bought several seats of DXP04, which cannot either
the read ".ddb" database, or extract anything from it. Please remember we are
looking for a reason to get Altium to give him a copy of P99SE, which they should do
anyway, even without a valid excuse, and not how to decode the ".ddb" database.
JaMi
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brooks,Bill" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Friday, February 04, 2005 3:38 PM
Subject: Re: [DC] RF design
> The PROTEL 99SE ddb file is really an MS ACCESS data base file if I remember
> correctly... it acts like a holder for the pcb and sch files and any other
> files generated. They have an option to just store the native files in the
> windows folder system too, that choice gets made when you make the ddb file.
> The PCB and SCH files can be exported from a ddb file and imported into
> DXP04 independent from the ddb file. DXP will convert any entities that need
> converting to make it compatible with the new format. Some of the Altium
> folks are members of the designers council, so they will hear no matter...
> I think that's actually a plus, because at least they monitor what is said
> by their customers... whether they choose to act on it or not.
>
> I know Cadence and Mentor also have members in the DC as well... there may
> be others too... They do care what we think... and that's cool. Keep the
> lines of communication open and you have a much better chance of succeeding
> in getting your issues dealt with.
>
> Best regards,
>
>
> Bill Brooks - KG6VVP
> PCB Design Engineer , C.I.D.+, C.I.I.
> Tel: (760)597-1500 Ext 3772 Fax: (760)597-1510
> e-mail:[log in to unmask]
> http://www.dtwc.com
> http://pcbwizards.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Harter, Robert [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Friday, February 04, 2005 2:21 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [DC] RF design
>
> JaMi,
>
> Thanks for the heads up on the spiral inductor generator and no I didn't
> get a copy of 99SE but I will try to next week since I got my company to
> purchase 3 full versions of DXP and 4 seats of Circuit Studio when we
> switched over. James responded to my inquiry and said that he didn't
> believe the 2 were compatible since based on different file types, to
> dll or not dll that was the question.
>
> Will definitely keep your name out of the conversation then at least
> until I get what I want from them. You'll have to fill me in sometime
> on your revolt because I think they may be due for another with all the
> bugs in 03 and 04 versions.
>
> Bob Harter, Jr.
> PCB Designer
> Paratek Microwave, Inc.
> 6935 G Oakland Mills Rd.
> Columbia, MD 21045
> PH# (443)259-0140 x278
> CP# (443)739-8407
> WWW.PARATEK.COM
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DesignerCouncil [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of JaMi
> Smith
> Sent: Friday, February 04, 2005 16:23
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [DC] RF design
>
> Bob,
>
> I am not quite sure how well the Spiral Inductor tool for PCAD mentioned
> below will
> work for DXP04, but there already is a Spiral Inductor generator tool
> for Protel 99
> SE, which has been around for years, and which can be had from the
> Protel Yahoo
> Forum site, and I am pretty sure that it can also be used with DXP04, or
> at least
> the spirals can be imported to DXP04.
>
> If you were smart when you bought DXP04 you should have gotten a copy of
> Protel 99
> SE thrown in for free, since there are many that still feel that both
> DXP3 and DXP04
> are still not up to the task in some areas, and still use P99SE for many
> things.
>
> If you did not get P99SE in the bargain, then maybe you can talk your
> Altium sales
> rep into a copy, just because you are a DXP04 Licensee. They will tell
> you that they
> do not support it any longer, but just tell them that's ok, and you
> still want a
> copy (you may have to do a little pleading or ranting and raving, but
> they should
> still give you a copy (if all else fails, tell them you have a customer
> who has some
> old P99SE files in the ".ddb" format, and you need to be able to go back
> and forth
> between that format (without the fear of losing things in the DXP
> conversion), to be
> able to get things into and out of DXP04))). You can even now to this
> day get better
> support out of the Techserve PEDA Forum List for P99SE than anyone ever
> got out of
> Altium themselves, and P99SE, despite some of it's faults, is still a
> damn good
> tool, especially for manual routing, and believe it or not, when it
> comes to
> autorouting, people still export out of DXP3 and DXP04 back into P99SE
> for
> autorouting, since DXP3 and DXP04 still can not really autoroute yet.
> There are of
> course better autorouters available than even P99SE, if you have the
> money for them
> (as I said above, you should be able to get P99SE for free). Some of
> these are
> discussed in the PEDA and DXP Forum Lists.
>
> If you need more help in getting the Spiral Generator from the Yahoo
> Protel site,
> let me know.
>
> I would be interested how the two Spiral Generators (PCAD and P99SE)
> compare, and
> whether they will both work directly with DXP04 (which I also own).
>
> JaMi
>
> PS. Don't mention my name to anyone at Altium, as I am their worst
> nightmare (among
> other things, I lead a successful customer revolt against them a few
> years back),
> and they are liable to hang up the phone on you.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Harter, Robert" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Friday, February 04, 2005 7:24 AM
> Subject: Re: [DC] RF design
>
> . . .
>
> <snip>
> . . .
>
> I was wondering though if your spiral inductor tool could be adapted to
> use with Protel since P-CAD and Protel are becoming more and more
> similar platforms for design.
>
> Bob Harter, Jr.
> PCB Designer
> Paratek Microwave, Inc.
> 6935 G Oakland Mills Rd.
> Columbia, MD 21045
> PH# (443)259-0140 x278
> CP# (443)739-8407
> WWW.PARATEK.COM
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DesignerCouncil [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
> James Jackson
> Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2005 15:13
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [DC] RF design
>
> I have a small program that I wrote that interfaces to P-CAD that
> generates
> spiral inductors in PCB, based on several requirements as input by the
> designer.
>
> Trace width, Trace spacing, Number of Turns, Layer and Outer Spiral
> Radius
> (or Diameter)
>
> Other things the designer can set up are the shape- like Circular,
> Square,
> Octagonal or Heganonal Spiral and Direction of the Spiral (Clockwise or
> counterclockwise).
>
> I then place the Spiral into the PCB design.
>
> I also calculate what the Inductance will be of this spiral... which
> comes
> pretty close to what the designer usually has already calculated.
>
> I wrote the program thinking that it might be used by designers doing RF
> -
> or other work that may require spiral inductors on PCBs.
>
> I got no interest in it, and so figured that designers weren't using
> P-CAD
> for their RF layout tool, or perhaps they are generating the spiral
> inductors using some other methods.
>
> Regards,
>
> James Jackson
> Oztronics
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "George Patrick" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2005 1:30 PM
> Subject: Re: [DC] RF design
>
>
> > I agree, 100%.
> >
> > That said, there are some packages that make it easier than others.
> >
> > I have seen demos for Intercept Pantheon that seem to make RF design
> easier
> > than most general purpose layout packages. As an example, you can
> plug
> your
> > calculated physical values in and it draws your inductor or capacitor
> > automatically, then backannotates it into the schematic.
> >
> > DISCLAIMER: I have never driven it personally so I can't recommend
> it.
> It
> > just appeared to have some nice features. We ALL know how demos make
> > EVERYTHING look easy :)
> >
> >
> > --
> > George Patrick
> > Tektronix, Inc.
> > Central Engineering, PCB Design Group
> > P.O. Box 500, M/S 39-512
> > Beaverton, OR 97077-0001
> > Phone: 503-627-5272 Fax: 503-627-5587
> > http://www.tektronix.com http://www.pcb-designer.com
> >
> > It's my opinion, not Tektronix'
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: DesignerCouncil [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
> JaMi
> > Smith
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2005 10:27
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: Re: [DC] RF design
> >
> >
> > Ed,
> >
> > When it comes to doing an RF board design, it's not the software that
> > counts, it's
> > the person driving the software.
> >
> > If you understand RF, you can use anything, but if you don't
> understand
> RF,
> > no
> > software will be able to help you.
> >
> > JaMi
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "E.J. (Ed) Murphy CID President Ottawa IPC DC Chapter"
> > <[log in to unmask]>
> > To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2005 4:42 AM
> > Subject: [DC] RF design
> >
> >
> > > Hello everyone
> > >
> > > I was wondering if I could inquire of any RF board designers out
> there
> as
> > to
> > > what software tools do a better job of handling RF designs. We are
> > probably
> > > looking at a mid range price tool... PADS, PCAD etc... but just
> wanted
> to
> > > get an idea of what is the tool of choice.
> > >
> > > Thanx
> > >
> > > Ed Murphy
> > > 80 Russett Drive
> > > Arnprior ON K7S 3G8
> > > 613-623-7750
> > > [log in to unmask]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > > Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.4 - Release Date:
> 01/02/2005
> > >
> > >
> >
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