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Subject:
From:
Brian Ellis <[log in to unmask]>
Reply To:
TechNet E-Mail Forum.
Date:
Fri, 2 Jun 2000 17:26:21 +0300
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At 10 000 metres, even a Canada Goose would be frozen stiff :-) They use frozen
(thawed) chickens for jet engines as well. They come out as chickenburgers, piping hot
:-)

Brian

Bev Christian wrote:

> Cara,
> Just for your edification, the CSA Lab in Toronto has a chicken gun for
> firing frozen chickens at airplane windscreens to mimic larger, unfrozen :)
> birds flying into planes in the sky.  They do testing for companies from all
> over the world.  Don't ask me about the physics of comparing a small frozen
> chicken to, say, a big mushy, live Canada Goose!
>
> Visual inspection you should be able to do yourself.  You may want to use
> X-rays or pry/cut some parts off boards to look for solder balls under some
> components.
>
> "I'm still not clear on if I can have my production boards tested in a lab
> or if I need to use the IPC boards."
> Well it depends on what you are trying to do.
> 1) You could stick completed circuit packs into an Omegameter or equivalent
> to get an idea (usually known as a process indicator) of the total,
> composite amount of ionic/ionizable stuff on your boards.  If you use a
> water wash flux the telecommunication industry (and others) require a value
> of 1.5 SOD or less.  That industry takes this as a hard fail.  If it is a
> no-clean flux there are no hard and fast rules, as the values obtained will
> be a result of weak organic acids (acceptable, up to an undetermined point)
> and any halides, etc, that are there.  There is no easy answer here.  You
> would have to run many boards and set your own green, yellow, red light
> standards.  Even pure WOA past a certain point are a problem if they are
> going to gum up edge connectors and make for electrical opens.
> 2) If you really want to know what that Omegameter number is due to, then
> you are going to need ion chromatography.  Celestica, Nortel Networks, EMPF
> (Philadelphia) and CSL (the Terry and Doug Show, Kokomo) can do that.  I am
> sure there are others.  They can send you an off-line note or others can
> speak up for them.
> 3) Well you could put your boards in a humidity chamber under load and wait
> for failure and/or examine for dendritic growth, but this is sort of like
> looking for a needle in a haystack.  You're going to have to "know" where
> the flux residues are going to congregate, where the most significant
> voltage differences are, the spacings and how are you going to relate this
> to the expected life of your product?  Good luck on that!  No, I highly
> recommend that you go with industry standard coupons so your results can be
> compared with stated pass/fail results.  Also, the coupons can be relatively
> easily examined, even the one where there are parts on the board.  I cannot
> remember the number for that board, but Doug can speak up, as he uses these
> a lot.
>
> regards,
>         Bev Christian
>         Director of Electronics Manufacturing
>         XLTEK
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Cara.Startek [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Friday, June 02, 2000 9:31 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] IPC test labs
>
> Hello all (specifically SIRGuru),
>
> Thanks for the advice.  I am actually looking to verify the performance and
> gauge the impact of introducing a new flux to our wave solder system.
>
> I was indeed seeking labs that run certified IPC lab testing.  I simply want
> to determine if the fluxes work on our boards with no problems.  This is not
> really that simple, compare to hurling a dead chicken 56feet (16.8m) from a
> hill top into a full moon...!?!  :-)  I have obtained Bellcore and IPC
> qualification data from all of the fluxes that I am interested in.  I have
> narrowed my pool of fluxes through specifying VOC free, halide free
> ,no-clean or water wash and low residue.
>
> The first phase of the testing is to determine if solder balls, bridging,
> other defects are reduced using the new fluxes, compared to the current
> flux.  Any fluxes that do not perform well will be eliminated.  The next
> phase we plan on using IPC standard boards and/or our own boards.  These
> boards will be tested in a lab (specifically to determine if there is any
> corrosion) and in our test department.  I'm still not clear on if I can have
> my production boards tested in a lab or if I need to use the IPC boards.
> Again any fluxes that do not perform well in this phase will be eliminated.
> The final phase will be to run the remaining fluxes for a least a week and
> test and monitor any problems that arise.  If anyone can offer any further
> insight into this plan it is more than welcome.
>
> Crossing the boarder causes no problem, converting the Canadian dollar
> does...  :-)
>
> Your input is very helpful.
>
> Regards,
>
> Cara Startek
> Process Engineering
> http://www.leitch.com
>
>         -----Original Message-----
>         From:   Douglas Pauls [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
>         Sent:   Thursday, June 01, 2000 5:31 PM
>         To:     [log in to unmask]
>         Subject:        Re: [TN] IPC test labs
>
>         In a message dated 06/01/2000 11:59:09 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
>         [log in to unmask] writes:
>
>         >
>         >  Background:  I am currently conducting a flux evaluation for a
> Wave Solder
>         >  process.  I am testing many fluxes and would like to send the
> test boards
>         >  out to an IPC certified lab to have SIR and corrosion tests
> performed.
>
>         Cara, IPC does not certify laboratories. They have a lab qual
> document
>         (QL-653), but most commercial labs will be certified to either
> ISO9002 or
>         AL2A protocols.  Now, if you are talking about laboratories that are
>         "capable" of running the IPC tests, there are several good ones
> around.  I
>         know of a good one in Central Indiana (grin), but hesitate to
> mention the
>         name for fear of setting of the guardians of non-commercialism.
>
>         More importantly, what are the goals of your testing?  What test
> vehicle do
>         you want to use.  If you are looking for the characteristics of the
> flux,
>         then much of the data is probably already available from your
> vendor.  Ask
>         them for their J-STD-004 qualification data and that should have
> SIR, copper
>         mirror, halide content, etc.  Ask for the Bellcore Chapter 13 data
> if you are
>         in the telecom business (as Bev Christian indicated).  If you are
> testing
>         multiple fluxes, then having them furnish the data may allow you to
> do
>         comparisons without spending any cash.  On the other hand, you can
> rest
>         assured that the test samples for J-STD-004 qualifications are
> processed
>         under optimal optimal conditions.
>
>         If you are looking for how well you can use the flux, then you may
> want to
>         use a different test vehicle or different test approaches.  If you
> want to
>         try it on actual hardware, then you should use some form of burn-in
> testing,
>         rather than SIR testing.
>
>         >
>         >  Question #1:  Is it possible to have these tests performed on
> general
>         >  boards, or do they have to be IPC standard boards?  If they must
> be IPC
>         >  standard, where can I obtain the boards?
>
>         Depends on the test goals and what you are trying to do.  Different
> boards
>         for different goals.  Are you trying to convince a customer?  What
> do THEY
>         need to see?
>
>         At the risk of setting off the flamethrowers, we carry most of the
> standard
>         IPC boards in a variety of laminates and metal finishes.
>
>         >
>         >  Question #2:  Are there any labs in Ontario (Canada) that perform
> these
>         >  tests?  I have been looking on the net and all of the suitable
> labs are in
>         >  the US.
>
>         Does crossing the border create a problem?
>
>         Doug Pauls
>         Technical Director
>         CSL
>
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