I already realized that! The CB-100 material is negligible, with respect to
the copper, especially if you use 2 mils of plating. What I really need is
a via fill material that can be successfully applied and plated over on top.
I know that virtually any material can be plated, but I'd like success
stories.
-----Original Message-----
From: Mcmaster, Michael [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2002 12:51 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [TN] VIAS PLATED CLOSED
One thing I'd like to warn against is expecting a big increase in
thermal
conduction of the hole by filling with CB-100. Do the math
comparing the
thermal conductivity of CB-100 and copper and the relative cross
sectional
areas of the two materials. For a 20 mil drilled hole with 1 mil of
copper,
the CB-100 has 4x the cross-sectional area but only increases the
heat
transfer by ~4%. And this assumes the via is 100% filled. But if
you just
double the copper thickness in the barrel you get an almost 100%
increase.
If you need the via fill for other reasons, for instance to avoid
solder
loss down the barrel, then you should use it. But for improved heat
conduction, I don't see the value. We've used the technique of
increasing
the copper thickness in thermal vias on many designs, some of which
also
have the vias filled.
Just don't take adding the extra plating to the extreme and try to
plate
them closed. I agree with everyone else that's a bad idea.
> ----------
> From: <Peter George Duncan>[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Reply To: TechNet E-Mail Forum.
> Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2002 4:21 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] VIAS PLATED CLOSED
>
> Hi, James,
>
> Hearing of what you're trying to do, I furrow my brow in anxiety.
If
> you're
> plating the entire hole closed, what surface copper weight are you
> expecting as a result, especially with 21 mil diameter holes? My
estimate
> is about 8 oz. What trace widths and spacings are involved? If
they're
> fairly fine, the undercut from the etching process will probably
sever
> them
> from the board, or make them extremely weak. It is possible to
grind
> excess
> copper of the board surface, but this is a brutal and risky
process as
> well, since if the board isn't dead flat, you can take off traces
and pads
> adn go through to the substrate material.
>
> If it's only the thermal holes you're trying to plate shut, how
are you
> going to prevent the other holes in the board from being filled as
well
> without a lot of selective masking? Also, I suspect that the holes
will
> close at the top and bottom first, leaving a void in the centre
that will
> contain plating solutions and cause all kinds of corrosive and
expansion
> problems.
>
> This is not a good idea!!! My strong recommendation is that you
use silver
> loaded epoxy to fill the thermal via holes prior to final plating.
It's
> thermal conductivity is not as good as that of copper, but is
relatively a
> lot less hassle and will be a lot cheaper than all that plating.
There are
> a number of epoxies available, though Dupont's CB100 is one that
is
> commonly cited. It has a thermal conductivity value of 5.23 W/mK,
so is
> pretty good for this type of material. Other makes are similar.
>
> Let us know how it goes. Good luck!!
>
> Peter
>
>
>
>
> "Marsico, James"
> <James.Marsico@D To:
[log in to unmask]
> P.AIL.COM> cc: (bcc: DUNCAN
> Peter/Asst Prin Engr/ST
> Sent by: TechNet Aero/ST Group)
> <[log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [TN]
VIAS
> PLATED CLOSED
> >
>
>
> 01/11/02 08:09
> PM
> Please respond
> to "TechNet
> E-Mail Forum."
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi, Peter, thanks for the response.
>
> Let me try to explain further. We're using ceramic leadless chip
carriers
> which give off a lot of heat. In an effort to dissipate the heat
to the
> ground planes, we're placing thermal vias underneath. We wanted
the
> thermal
> vias to be plated closed, resulting in a solid plug of copper,
which we
> then
> can deposit solder paste on top which would contact the bottom of
the
> ceramic package. The heat path would be from the component
through the
> solder bumps on the thermal vias through the solid copper via.
Our board
> supplier claims that he can plate the vias closed, but when I
asked about
> voids and entrapped plating chemicals, he said he was never asked
that
> before and would have to look into it. I'm getting concerned with
this
> design, thinking that an epoxy-filled via which is plated over on
top
> would
> be better. I now need recommendations for a THERMALLY conductive
> adhesive,
> it doesn't have to be electrically conductive but I don't really
care.
>
> Thanks again,
>
> Jim Marsico
> Senior Engineer
> Production Engineering
> EDO Electronics Systems Group
> [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> 631-595-5879
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: <Peter George Duncan>
[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 9:28 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [TN] VIAS PLATED CLOSED
>
> Hi, James,
>
> I'm trying to picture your "thermal reasons" and how
plating over
> the holes
> will help, reliably. I haven't encountered a process for
plating
> over
> holes, and 21 mils seems quite a canyon to bridge. I'ld be
very
> interested
> to know how this is done.
>
> I'm very involved with conduction-cooled MLB's 60 mils
thk, that
> require a
> lot of thermal management. 'Thermal' via holes are punched
through
> the
> board and plated to internal thermal planes. To improve
the
> conductive
> cross-sectional area of these holes, I had them filled
with
> silver-loaded
> epoxy, which was then Cu-plated over. This process also
served the
> secondary purpose of filling holes that otherwise, as you
suggest,
> would
> contain entrapped plating solutions.
>
> Depending on your substrate material and operating
environment, I
> could
> imagine a plated 'cap' splitting over time through temp
cycling
> and
> mechanical stresses, assuming it survives the hot assembly
> processes
> with
> the expansion of entrapped gasses. Not serious, thermally,
> perhaps,
> but it
> would allow the outside atmosphere to circulate inside the
holes
> as
> well,
> which might not be so good inteh long run.
>
> Peter
>
>
>
>
> "Marsico, James"
> <James.Marsico@D To:
> [log in to unmask]
> P.AIL.COM> cc: (bcc:
DUNCAN
> Peter/Asst Prin Engr/ST
> Sent by: TechNet Aero/ST Group)
> <[log in to unmask] Subject:
[TN] VIAS
> PLATED CLOSED
> >
>
>
> 01/11/02 05:55
> AM
> Please respond
> to "TechNet
> E-Mail Forum."
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Good day technet:
>
> We're considering designing a multilayer polyimide PWB
with a
> number
> of
> vias
> (approximately .021" diameter holes, .062" thick PWB) that
are
> plated shut,
> for thermal reasons. Can anyone comment on pitfalls
regarding the
> fab
> process? How about voids in the solid copper via?
Entrapped
> plating
> solution?
>
> All comments are appreciated. Thanks in advance...
>
> Jim Marsico
> Senior Engineer
> Production Engineering
> EDO Electronics Systems Group
> [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> 631-595-5879
>
>
>
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