The TOSCA act (US toxic substances control ) is up for renewal this
year. I will be one of the people (I am a member of PERM and am in
the Communications, Advocacy and Supplier task teams) who will be
trying very hard to make sure US legislation does not echo RoHS until
we have a certified equal or better replacement for lead and flame
retardant chemicals needed in pcb mfg.
Bob Landman
H&L Instruments,LLC
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 26, 2010, at 9:27 AM, "James, Chris" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> Yes reversing US legislation might be the only way left to leverage a
> stand against RoHS, so go Yankees show us how we should have made a
> stand and save old Europe once more :)
>
> .......... otherwise having a leadfree airliner full of "EU lefties"
> crash on Brussels might work also........ not that I advocate the loss
> of life.
>
> I don't think the majority of us in the mfr sector in the EU have or
> had
> our heads in the sand, or even try to sugar coat the situation, these
> disparaging remarks just go to detract from the reality of the
> situation.
>
> Plenty of people lobbied against it albeit too late, but for many
> visibility of the issue was too late also (it was originally slated
> for
> 2004 but was delayed because of the total lack of awareness). Others
> had
> ignored it thinking it would go away, the US possibly thought it would
> not affect them, even our own US staff thought that. If anyone did
> have
> their heads in the sand it was those outside the EU and who could have
> possibly waded into the political arena......... and then there were
> probably those with other motives not wanting to rock the boat.
>
> Certainly for us as an SME it was like pushing water uphill with a
> rake
> in 2003 and 2004 and at some stage you just have to accept and get
> ready
> for the inevitable if you want to stay in the world's biggest market
> place.
>
> So go on, get your own legislation reversed, lobby for economic
> sanctions against the EU on this unfair legislation, because that
> would
> be the only possible chance now of making the lefties sit up and
> think.
>
> C
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leadfree [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Michael Gambie
> Sent: 26 January 2010 14:00
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [LF] [tinwhiskers] FW: [SMART] Very useful RoHS review
> conference report
>
> So you are saying that for all the articles and white papers that have
> been presented we appear to be stuck with the legislation? Further
> that
> you are unable to do anything about the American legislation either?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leadfree [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Stadem,
> Richard D.
> Sent: 26 January 2010 13:25
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [LF] [tinwhiskers] FW: [SMART] Very useful RoHS review
> conference report
>
> Well, think about that for a moment. When forced to build electronic
> devices with inferior reliability, where do you think they go?
> Recycling can be enforced without reducing the lead in solder.
> Reduction
> of lead and other chemicals that enhance reliability is what keeps
> those
> products away from either the recycling bin or the landfill. It
> doesn't
> take too much of a light bulb to figure that one out.
>
> The terms "RoHS" and "reduction of waste" are incongruous.
>
> As far as staying quiet, do we need to shoot the EU lefties before
> they
> hear us? There have been reams and reams of papers printed and
> presented
> detailing why RoHS is the biggest boo-boo of the century. This email
> string contains but a fraction of the thousands of articles and white
> papers that have been presented, to no avail.
> Bob just provided you and impressive list. Don't you think that at
> least
> a little bit of that is/was known to the EU loonies before or during
> the
> legislation of RoHS?
>
> Pull your head out of the sand. They made a grave mistake; face it for
> what it is and quit trying to sugarcoat it.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leadfree [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of James, Chris
> Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 3:13 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [LF] [tinwhiskers] FW: [SMART] Very useful RoHS review
> conference report
>
> Bob - an impressive list, so why aren't world manufacturing leaders
> and
> organisations pressuring politicians to act on it........ why are
> other
> national enterprises staying quiet..........
>
> On one point you are wrong - the EU won't be filling their landfill
> with
> waste electronics because that was the point of the WEEE directive, to
> enforce recycling. RohS and WEEE started life as a single piece of
> legislation, the Restriction element not so much being to keep
> substances out of landfill but to keep them out of the recycling
> process.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bob Landman [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: 25 January 2010 18:09
> To: '(Leadfree Electronics Assembly Forum)'; James, Chris
> Cc: tin whiskers forum
> Subject: RE: [LF] [tinwhiskers] FW: [SMART] Very useful RoHS review
> conference report
>
>
> Here's a partial list of problems ignored by the EU and major
> manufacturers as they have switched to lead-free manufacturing to
> comply
> with the EU lead ban.
>
> PREFACE:
>
> The waivers for defense and high rel products are essentially useless
> (unless one sends parts to a replater to dip them in molten lead) as
> the
> major component vendors have rushed to embrace lead-free
> manufacturing.
> They have, in many cases, mixed their lead and lead-free parts by
> using
> the same part numbers for both. They have refused to make available
> to
> RoHS exempt industries lead bearing platings on components.
>
> 1) Microsoft's XBOX as has been widely discussed on this and other
> forums
>
> 2) increased number of failures in recently purchased PC products
>
> 3) subject matter experts of published environmental tests show
> increased amounts of failures in lead-free manufacturing (mechanical
> connection failures) including parts popping off boards, voids in BGA
> balls, etc... Manufacturers continue to state lead-free
> manufacturing is
> "ok", "no problems found"
>
> 4) Conformal coatings mitigate the growth of tin whiskers (and not
> using lead in solder guarantees that whiskers will grow) yet
> commercial
> product manufacturers (including a major telecom product provider who
> shall remain nameless) told me and several others on a teleconference
> that I attended on behalf of the Dept of Homeland Security, that "the
> selling price of the products cannot bear the cost adder of conformal
> coating".
>
> 5) Swatch watch company gets a waiver to use lead as millions of
> their
> watches fail due to tin whisker shorts on crystal oscillator
>
> 6) FDA forced Medtronic to recall their implanted cardiac
> defibrilators
> (from patients bodies) when whiskers shorted the devices.
> http://www.fda.gov/ora/inspect_ref/itg/itg42.html
>
> 7) a major Ethernet switch maker has senior field service personnel
> who
> have not been told of the potential for tin whisker growth so when
> failures happen, boards are simply replaced. Reason given is that
> "customers pay for service contracts so who cares what the reason is
> that they fail so long as we repair them quickly".
>
> 8) a major contract assembler states at a recent IEEE Reliability
> Society meeting that they see no problems with lead-free manufacturing
> yet an aside from one of their customers was said to me that "of
> course
> they don't see the problems, we see them AFTER we ship the product."
>
> 9) all the whisker failures reported here
> http://nepp.nasa.gov/WHISKER/failures/index.htm plus I am advised by
> NASA that they have confidentiality agreements with many others who
> call
> in to report problems which prevents them from listing the failures
>
> 10) I was recently at a national meeting on lead-free manufacturing
> where it was admitted that on many warplane systems there are lead-
> free
> manufacturing problems but the manufacturers refuse to go public with
> the information.
>
> 11) Anonymous (Terrestrial Application) - Field Failures First
> Observed
> Circa 2003
> http://nepp.nasa.gov/WHISKER/anecdote/2003ckt_breaker/index.html
>
> 12) over 15,000 papers have been published on the subject of tin
> whiskers http://www.dbicorporation.com/rohsbib.htm yet to this day,
> no-one can state why they grow or how without lead to stop them, how
> quickly they grow, how long they will grow.
>
> 13) white paper by the AIA outlining the problems
> http://www.aia-aerospace.org/assets/wp_leadfree_0208.pdf
>
> 14) As was recently posted here by Denny Fritz:
>
> A large amount of information has been accumulated in the
> Aerospace/Defense community about lead based versus lead-free
> solders/solder joints. A good place to start to tap this knowledge
> has
> recently been gathered at the Defense Acquisition University web site:
>
> https://acc.dau.mil/leadfree
>
> I will point out the second item on the list - the Lead-free
> Electronics
> "Manhattan Project" to compile the "best practices" for use of lead
> based or lead-free solder in harsh environements. 15 leading
> metallurgical scientists in the US met for two weeks to compile this
> 350
> page baseline. Since then, the same 15 met again in August to
> outline
> the required research to close the knowledge gaps between leaded and
> lead-free solder, particularly in harsh environments.
>
> 15) The AIA and others are proposing to the US Dept of Defense a $95M
> project which will take three years and which will hopefully come up
> with solutions to the present problems with lead-free manufacturing.
>
> The bottom line is, that util the problems outlined above are
> solved, if
> the EU does not want people to die from an increased amount of
> failures
> in transportation, electric power, medical devices, not to mention the
> waste and expense of filling landfills to overflowing with an
> increasing
> number of failed electronic products, the EU should immediately
> retract
> the RoHS ban on lead in manufacturing electronic assemblies and
> components and instead specify that at least 5% lead should be in all
> tin coatings and solders.
>
> Bob Landman
> H&L Instruments, LLC
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leadfree [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of James, Chris
> Sent: Monday, January 25, 2010 11:19 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [LF] [tinwhiskers] FW: [SMART] Very useful RoHS review
> conference report
>
> What evidence do you have to be able to assert this defamatory
> statement:
>
> "Knowing the EU and how the major manufacturers suck up as they do not
> seem to be concerned about products surviving past their warranty
> period, I highly doubt this report is factual."
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leadfree [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Whittaker, Dewey
> (EHCOE)
> Sent: 25 January 2010 16:10
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [LF] [tinwhiskers] FW: [SMART] Very useful RoHS review
> conference report
>
> I am not aware that any of the so-called halogen-free laminate
> materials
> will meet the Class 3 or 3/A requirements of IPC-6012 when
> pre-conditioned per IPC-TM-650, Method 2.6.7 (Thermal Stress Testing
> per
> 3.6.1.3 of the Rev C going to ballot), let alone some of the other
> idiosyncrasies that are currently being addressed.
> Dewey
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leadfree [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bob Landman
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 3:55 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [LF] [tinwhiskers] FW: [SMART] Very useful RoHS review
> conference report
>
> According to this EU article, manufacturers have successfully
> transitioned from halogenated and pthalate containing pc boards
> without
> any difficulty.
>
> Is this true?
>
> Are the new boards flame retardant?
>
> Do they survive multiple passes at lead-free soldering temperatures?
>
> What about delamination?
>
> What about pad cratering?
>
> Other issues?
>
> Knowing the EU and how the major manufacturers suck up as they do not
> seem to be concerned about products surviving past their warranty
> period, I highly doubt this report is factual.
>
> I would appreciate comments from those who have more than one year of
> experience with these new board materials.
>
> Do they pass the UL flame and smoke tests?
>
> What other tests are they certified to pass?
>
> Have the tests been altered so these new board materials can pass?
>
> What are the life cycle testing -55C to +125C - results?
>
> -40C to +85C life cycle testing results?
>
> Shock?
>
> Vibration?
>
> How many layers? (at least 24?)
>
> Will the Airbus avionics be using these new board materials and if so
> when?
>
> Bob Landman
> H&L Instruments, LLC
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jan 22, 2010, at 12:28 PM, "John Burke" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>>
>> FYI see link for report in email below
>>
>> John Burke
>> (408) 515 4992
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: SMART Group smart-e-link [mailto:SMART-E-
>> [log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Nigel Burtt
>> Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 1:43 AM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: [SMART] Very useful RoHS review conference report
>>
>> "Greening Consumer Electronics - from Hazardous Material to
>> Sustainable Solutions Conference" in the European Parliament held on
>> 18 November
>> 2009
>>
>> Leading companies within the electronics sector sent strong message
>> to
>
>> EU regulators at ChemSec Conference: Moving away from Brominated
>> Flame
>
>> Retardants and PVC is possible, feasible and is already happening!
>> The
>
>> question is not whether electrical and electronic equipment industry
>> can phase out these chemicals, but when, says Jill Evans, Member of
>> the European Parliament. (Rapporteur leading the drafting of recast
>> amendments to
>> RoHS)
>>
>>
>> Full report including presentations and video
>>
>> http://www.chemsec.org/rohs/conference
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Nigel
>>
>
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