Nick,
Wow, now you've opened a can of worms.  I was just hoping for someone to tell me how to measure the diameter of a cone :)  We certainly need to incorporate several manufacturing vs. acceptability realities.  I think the definition of microvia is an excellent place to start.  Does 6013 intend to define a build as HDI?  Or, simply take it feature-by-feature.  Also, where does this leave 6012,6018?  Can we get a team to sync these things simultaneously?  6012D?
I'll be in Phoenix.  But, you guys only have a 2 hour slot on Monday in Vegas (with all kinds of conflicts). ???
Chris

-----Original Message-----
From: IPC-600-6012 [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Nick Koop
Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 4:27 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [IPC-600-6012] Microvias

This is certainly a topic that needs to be addressed on several fronts.  To add to Mike's comments below, a PIN has been approved for Rev C of 6013, where among other things, the intention is to incorporate HDI performance requirements into 6013, rendering 6016 obsolete for flex.  There are unresolved issues especially revolving around plating coverage when it comes to microvias.  The plating requirements may not be compatible with the image and etch needs of other HDI features.  Much work needs to be done to cover these topics in a thoughtful manner.

Nick

Nick Koop
Manager of Technology
Minco Products, Inc
Ph 763 586-2846
Mobile 763 245-4825

>>> "Green, Mike" <[log in to unmask]> 1/14/2009 2:22 PM >>>
In talking with Chris an issue is;  Can a laser-drilled hole that is
.008 at the top be classified as a microvia for wrap dimension requirements?  Have we clearly identified what less than a .006 hole is?

Here is a starting point for discussion:

From IPC-6012 revision B Amendment 1 Table 3-2, Footnote 3.
Blind microvias are vias that <0.15 mm [0.006 in] in diameter and formed either through laser or mechanical drilling, wet/dry etching, photo imaging or conductive ink-formation followed by a plating operation. All performance characteristics for plated holes, as defined in this document, shall be met. The values given for blind and buried microvias in Table 3-2 are not applicable for stacked microvias. As of the publication of this specification, there is little known about this structure and the reliability results are not consistent with buried and blind microvias. Stacked microvias may also require different inspection criteria.


From IPC-T-50 Revision H
Microvia (Build-Up Via) 22.1595
A blind or subsequently buried hole that is < 0.15 mm [< 0.006 in] in diameter and formed either through laser or mechanical drilling, wet/dry etching, photo imaging, or conductive ink-formation followed by a plating operation.


Mike Green
Electronic Packaging Design
LMCO-Sunnyvale
408-743-1635
One Corporation, One Team
"Those who have nothing to follow must lead."  M. Green, 2008 -----Original Message-----
From: IPC-600-6012 [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Chris Mahanna
Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 11:52 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [IPC-600-6012] Microvias

Good afternoon everyone,

I have a customer request to ping this group for a possible redefine of microvia.  I know that we talked about in Vegas last year.  As I remember it, we decided that other items were more pressing, but there was not real objection to the idea.
At issue is wrap (of course) on your typical 8-10 mil (entry side) ablated hole.

My suggestion is something like: aspect <1.0 and drill/ablation less than 8 mils deep.
Thoughts?

Thanks,
Chris


Chris Mahanna
Robisan Laboratory Inc.
6502 E 21st Street
Indianapolis, Indiana 46219
317.353.6249