Yes, exactly. We can show you bulletproof, but there is always a tradeoff for other requirements such as dielectric, impedance, RoHS compliant, RF-suitable, shock, vibration or ?
-----Original Message-----
From: DesignerCouncil [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Brooks, William
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2015 4:56 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [DC] Question of the Week - Laminates and Temperature
Better at what Jack?
Better is relative... how much better and in what way better would give someone a specific thing to comment on...
How about better at thermal transfer of energy thru the board in the z-axis vertically or how about horizontally in x or y... ? How much better would you need.. which characteristic would you give up in exchange for it? Flatness? Rigidity? Tensile strength? Flexibility?
There are so many avenues to go down... which direction do you want to wander?
:)
William Brooks, CID+
Printed Circuit Designer
2747 Loker Ave West
Carlsbad, CA 92010-6603
760-930-7212
Fax: 760.918.8332
Mobile: 760.216.0170
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
-----Original Message-----
From: DesignerCouncil [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Jack Olson
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2015 2:26 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [DC] Question of the Week - Laminates and Temperature
Well, I think IPC-D-275 went obsolete in 1996?
but I hope you're enjoying your flashbacks!
For the other question that was asked, sorry if I wasn't clear.
We have already been using /126 for several years, I was just wondering what a good step towards BETTER thermal characteristics would be BEYOND /126 (like what might be used in an automotive engine compartment.) Maybe /126 IS used there, I wouldn't know, but I don't know how to ask any clearer, sorry I just want a better idea of how a designer should know when to look for something better
I'm not sure I even have an IPC-D-279, I'll look...
but I sure would feel more comfortable reading something that was written in THIS millennium (for the record, I don't think IPC-4101/126 even EXISTED back then)
but thanks for taking the time to answer, Jack
On Thu, Mar 26, 2015 at 6:38 PM, Dean Stadem <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:
> Jack, get a copy of IPC-D-279 and check out section 4.0. Also please
> read through IPC-D-275.
> The IPC put all of that information there just for you, Jack, because
> they just knew that someday you would realize you were not happy with
> plain old
> FR-4 anymore.
> Just for you, completely detailed and all laid out. No need to go
> anywhere else. Not even Barnes and Noble. Nope, nossir, it's all right there.
> Everything you ever wanted to know about PWB substrate materials.
> Everything.
> Suffer from insomnia? Well, here is a sure cure.
> But speaking from experience, nothing could be better for a fellow
> Viking such as yourself than to curl up in the fish house on a cold
> March night with a little battery-operated LED lamp and soak in
> IPC-D-279 while listening for that little "jingle, tink" from the reel on the wall!
> There are also a number of reference documents listed in one or both
> of those two standards, in case you just can't wait for the next edition.
> Sorry, but they would not let me put the ads for the X-ray glasses and
> opportunities for further education from the Close Cover Before
> Striking Institute of Advanced Electronics Design in the back pages.
> As the Marvel editors used to say...'Nuff said.
> Dean
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DesignerCouncil [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
> Jack Olson
> Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2015 11:35 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [DC] Question of the Week - Laminates and Temperature
>
> Ok, let me say right here, I really was NOT going to try and make up a
> "Question of the Week" just for something to do. If you guys WANT to
> discuss different topics on a regular basis, I'm all for it. but I
> honestly need to ask about this (I'm not just "stirring the pot").
> So I'm showing my ignorance by asking this, but I'm not sure where to
> go for help...
>
> During the transition to meeting RoHS requirements and designing for
> RoHS compatibility we have begun specifying a higher quality of
> material than we used to, conforming to IPC-4101/126
>
> What I would like to understand is:
> How to know when I should be looking for a EVEN BETTER material
> (related to high-temperature applications and long-term thermal
> cycling). What IS the next step up? What would be used in an
> automotive engine compartment, for example?
>
> I am usually designing products like displays that are in a more
> benign environment, but where can I learn more about this?
>
> Jack
>
>
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