Another option is to try something like the Dun & Bradstreet debt
collection service
http://smallbusiness.dnb.com/collect-debt/browse-products.asp . For a fee
they will send letters that threaten to add a "placed for collections" in
the companies D&B credit file.
Most companies (myself included) get a DUNS # at some point and are listed
in their database. You still may not get paid, but at least you feel like
you did something. Most people that go into the design service business,
either full or part time, soon find out that there is a lot more to it than
"just doing the layout". You become the manager, accountant, IT dept, head
of sales and marketing, etc. If your like me accounting is at the bottom of
my list of "things I like to do". I love sending the invoices, but having to
make calls and send emails to try and collect money that they already agreed
to give me is an annoyance I'd like to do without. It also takes away from
the time that I can spend bringing in new revenue.
I do business with several companies that range from one person to Fortune
50 corporations. I have noticed that large companies always pay, but on
their own terms. You can put anything on your quote; NET 30, Due upon
receipt, NET 45, but they will generally come back and dictate the terms and
it is usually something like 3% 15 net 90. The choice to pay in 15 or 90
days is made by someone in accounts payable someplace, not the engineers
that I deal with during the project. I have a new local customer that is a
one man show and he has handed my the last two checks before I sent him an
invoice, so you never know.
International customers (Mexico and China), can also be a challenge. One
large customer in China always pays, but their PO states the terms as NET 45
(I quote NET 30), and for the last two years they average about NET 100 for
actual payment. When the open invoices get up to around 60 days old, I
continue to quote the work, but refuse to start anything until they pay up.
Complaints to the engineers and project managers in the US did nothing,
since they are out of the loop, but once their projects are getting delayed
becomes someone didn't pay the bill they start to escalate things and within
a couple days the payment arrives. I place a 30% adder on top of the total
design price (at the suggestion of their engineer), just for the
aggravation.
It is, unfortunately, a cost of doing business. For new customers I do not
take on a second project until I have been paid for the first and I always
send the database to the customer. If I get stiffed, it is my time lost. For
the customer that stiffed me, word gets around. For a "small guy" it is
necessary to take a few risks from time to time, but do some research first
and try to minimize them.
I am very fortunate to say that in almost five years of full time contract
design service I have been paid for every job so far. I am knocking on my
wooden desk as I say that....
Scott D. Riley
Technical Design Service
607-658-9322 - Office
607-785-1696 - FAX
www.techdesignservice.com
-----Original Message-----
From: DesignerCouncil [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John C
Laur
Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 10:21 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [DC] Designer beware
How about the BBB. http://www.bbb.org/
John Laur
Engineering Analyst Sr, HW
Information Platforms Business (IPB)
Rockwell Automation / Allen-Bradley
1201 South Second Street
Milwaukee, WI. 53204-2496 USA
1.414.382.2393 Phone
Barbara Burcham <[log in to unmask]>
Sent by: DesignerCouncil <[log in to unmask]>
09/15/2005 09:13 AM
Please respond to "(Designers Council Forum)"; Please respond to Barbara
Burcham
To: [log in to unmask]
cc:
Subject: Re: [DC] Designer beware
Might also get around that the company of origin does not pay it's debt.
They might find it more difficult to acquire services from other vendors.
Might serve as a warning to other companies trying to pull the same scam,
that they might stay away from you and that would be a good thing
Barbara Burcham, C.I.D.
Sr. PCB Designer
Fairfield, Ind., Inc.
[log in to unmask]
281-275-7687
281-275-7550 fax
-----Original Message-----
From: Matthew Lamkin [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 8:30 AM
To: (Designers Council Forum); Barbara Burcham
Subject: RE: [DC] Designer beware
Problem with that is that it might get around & you will then not be trusted
to keep designs secure/private from your paying customers.
Can you patent the design if they have not done?
After all, you got the original work lol
-----Original Message-----
From: DesignerCouncil [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Barbara
Burcham
Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 2:18 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [DC] Designer beware
Sell those databases to the company of origin's competition! Until they are
paid for, they are yours. Any one signing contracts that says you cannot do
this?
Barbara Burcham, C.I.D.
Sr. PCB Designer
Fairfield, Ind., Inc.
[log in to unmask]
281-275-7687
281-275-7550 fax
-----Original Message-----
From: DesignerCouncil [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Richard
Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 1:17 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [DC] Designer beware
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mario Irigoyen" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 10:44 AM
Subject: [DC] Designer beware
> Hello everyone,
>
> I really hate using this forum for this purpose but I just don't want
to
> see any other designer getting screwed the way I did.
> I provided PCB design services for a company in Jan 2003. They did not
> pay me for the work then and have still not paid me, with interest
> accruing monthly. I've heard promise after promise but still no money.
> Now they need some revisions to the board and have asked me to provide
> additional services for a "promise to pay" some time in the near
future.
> I have taken the stand "pay me for what I've already done and I'll do
> the new work with a promise to pay".
>
> I believe they are now shopping for someone else to do the work. I
have
> the original database (and won't give it up) so the job will need to
be
> recreated from scratch.
>
> Here is the information I can provide:
> The company is/was Products Research, Inc. formerly based in Addison,
IL
> but was forced out of their office due to lack of finances. The board
> is a 6-layer (4 sig, 2 plane) mixed tech (SMT&TH) with SM on both
> sides, called the Advantage 2.
> Contacts: Jack Paul and/or Dick Kaman
>
> If any of you have been contacted for this job BEWARE. If you would
like
> to speak to me about this please call the number below.
>
> Also, please don't respond to this email. I'm sending out for
> informational purposes only.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Mario Irigoyen
> 630-853-9657 Cell
> [log in to unmask]
>
>
Mario,
Sorry to hear about your problem.
I've had the same thing happen, and still haven't worked out a method that
I'm 100% satisfied with. It's good that you posted your information here,
not only for yourself but for others as well. Gook luck with getting paid.
Richard
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