This is a "Journal" response.
I usually do not do this.
But a silly "Off Topic" letter required an
application of common sense.

> I guess that's my queue to jump in...

I think you really meant "cue!"
(I KNOW, you are not versed in the performing arts!)

> As long as I can remember, a designer's resume
> was the only document that represented his/her
> level of expertise.

It still is! Nothing has changed.

> Now, I have been doing this a long time, since 1973,
> so I have seen a number of résumé's come across my desk
> for evaluation and recommendation.

So your a newbe?  I have been engaged in design and
the art of packaging since 1961, and in electronics
since 1958.

I have found that only an individuals ability to do
a job counts for anything.

> I have watched people with fine résumé's get hired
> and fired in the matter of a few weeks because the
> interview or resume' did not reveal a deep lack of
> knowledge or work ethic in an individual that only
> showed up in the work environment. I watched people
> actually lie to the interviewer and we only really
> found out that they were lying after they had been
> there for awhile fumbling or making inexperienced
> mistakes. So, we started testing applicants.
> We never had a problem after that. The potential
> candidates were asked to perform what they said
> they could perform, and if they wanted the job
> they showed us what they could do.

Your assumption that it is a lie is presumptuous,
it may Have been an optimistic self appraisal,
of just "I did contribute" so the case is stated
too broadly.
I have actually caught an applicant in a lie,
he claimed to have been principle on a project
I finished over two years before he was hired.
Such cases are rare!

You demand FREE work as an entry fee?
Such a practice is mean spirited and unethical!
A true professional never works FREE!

I have seen people with a Masters Degree and a 4.0 grade
point average who couldn't do the work. Managers with
a P.E. who had to be led through a project, then THEY
signed off the drawings to take full credit for the design.
   (IMHO: P.E. often means "Pitiful Excuse")

> The C.I.D. certificate is not given out for money,
> or bribery, or some sort of subterfuge,
> but is ...earned... by showing the designer community
> that you know what you know.

Or that you rely on external symbols of accomplishment,
rather than actually keeping up to date and continuing
to learn to pursue your chosen profession.

I have never found that a PAPER improves quality
or quantity of an individuals work.

> The hiring mangers know this too now, and are using
> the CID as a hiring criteria in many cases.

So your saying they have quit trying to select quality
in favor of an arbitrary requirement, like what school
you attended or the day of the week you were born?

> The CID does mean something, and it has earned the
> respect of the companies that have paid for the
> designers they have to take the test and get the
> certification too. The designers who were brave enough
> to step up and be tested have earned the right to wear
> their CID mark with real pride. You will notice they
> have it following their signatures and on their business cards.

So does every other fool that thinks a test sets them above,
or somehow guarantees some special treatment or denotes a
quality that only they (by virtue of a test?) bestows.

Letters following a name mean they can't spell it out,
have a weak personal self image and rely on external symbols
to prop them up.

I generally ignore the attempt to aggrandize or otherwise
attempt to use such weak talisman to promote themselves.
A company which relies on such symbols is often the first
to go in real competition.

> I equate this certification with the P.E. certificate that is
awarded
> Professional Engineers. They go through a similar process to get
their
> certification and it is recognized as an indication of their level
of
> knowledge in engineering.

I agree with you on this.
A P.E. is not only a test, it is a political tool to
bestow a favored status upon those that support a system
of favoritism and exclusivity!  It has little to do with
ability, nothing to do with ethics!

> The C.I.D. is the ONLY certificate a PCB designer can get that sets
them
> apart from the 'Wannabee' designers, drafters, and techs... and it
is
> respected by companies and designers in the industry who know what
it takes
> to pass the exam. That is why it is a highly prized and respected
> certificate and the Designers Council, made up of PCB designers and
> Engineers, is committed to always keep it that way.

> That does not mean that anyone who does not have the certificate is
not
> qualified... They just have not been tested and certified.
Certainly if they
> were certified there would be no question as to their knowledge
level. And
> once tested they can compare that level with others who were brave
enough to
> have stepped forward and put their reputation on the line by
testing and
> certification.

Hiding behind a test result is not BRAVE.
Doing the work on a daily basis IS!

> The successful designers studied hard and even though the
information may
> seem to be simple and 'common knowledge' to many, you would be
surprised how
> many had difficulty with simple questions... The ones who did not
pass
> either did not study or just had no knowledge of the subject. After
going
> back and studying, they usually passed the second time they tested.
> When I took the exam I was so keyed up and wanted to make sure I
had it all
> down before the exam, that there was a great deal of concern in my
demeanor
> and stress over the exam. I was not alone in this feeling, there
were
> designers who would not test at all who walked out because they
realized
> they were not ready for the test... there were those who cried
tears over
> the stress of getting tested, its not a 'walk in the park'. If I
remember
> correctly I missed 6 out of the 104 questions... so don't discount
the
> validity of the test or its difficulty, but realize that you can
pass it
> with study and hard work. It is truly a measure of the designers
experience
> level and their knowledge level and can be a very good thing to
have on your
> resume'.

Only 104 questions?  Gee, much too easy.  What a load!
Since you have slipped into the personal anecdotal mode,
I will not comment on that.  It's not relevant anyway.
Those with photographic memories would consider missing
6/104 a failing grade!  I learned long ago (About 1965)
that I could do almost anything where there was a good
written history of how it is done.  The challenge is to
apply it and move on to contribute more than is already
part of history!

Each individual must decide for themselves how to best
advance their skills, and what tools to use to accomplish
that task!  Peddling a "Certificate" or "degree" or some
other substitute for experience helps no one.  Each individual
has an inherent potential, and yes, limitations.  Only that
person can select for themselves the manner that will allow
them to best progress toward their particular goals.

Roger Gathright  (NO SILLY LETTERS)

My credentials are MUCH too long to put in a few letters!

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